Mainship 40 Double Cabin

I am 74, new to boating and thing about purchasing a 1984 Mainship 40
Double Cabin. It is equipped with twin Crusader 350 engines. Initially, I plan to use the boat for local cruising,but eventually want to take extended trips down to Florida and the Carribean.

My question is whether or not this is too much boat for a newbie.

Additionally, does anyone know if this is a full or partial displacement hull?
How will it handle in open water?

All advice and opinions are welcomed.

I am biased but suggest you consider a smaller tug style trawler with a diesel engine. I think you will find it much easier to handle and lower cost to maintain. Two side doors from a safe and comfortable cockpit. A nordic tugs 32 can sleep 4 using the slide out couch. Trade off is it is not a private cabin and you only have one head. But rarely do most people have extended guest stays unless perhaps grandkids and they will love it!
Those Crusader gas engines will consume a lot of fuel and if they are original well past expected life.
I think the mainship would be considered semi displacement but the fuel burn to get it up to speed is going to be high as are the RPMs. It will probably not be the most comfortable ride in mid size swells especially following seas.

LateStarter said:

I am 74, new to boating and thing about purchasing a 1984 Mainship 40
Double Cabin.

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Oh, to be that young again--

Welcome aboard. I am of the school that you should buy the boat you really want. Then take the time and effort to learn how to run it safely. Maybe get a captain to teach you or hang around the marinas and make friends. Get them to teach you. Take a sit down boating course, not just one from the internet. That way you can ask questions specifically in regards to your boat. If you buy something you don’t really want, you will never be satisfied. If you buy a smaller boat first and then sell it to buy the one you wanted in the first place, you will get hammered financially. Get some formal training and as much informal training as you can get. Get a Vessel Safety Check and pick the examiners brain. Start with small cruises around your local area until you are comfortable with the boat. Good luck.

Welcome aboard TF and to the boating communuty.
So much depends on attitude and abilities more than age.
You didn't mention if you will have help with handling lines for docking, etc.
A good way to test whether any boat would work is to charter before buying. Most won't charter to an inexperienced skipper but will charter with a qualified captain. It could be a worthwhile way to confirm abilities, desires & comfort level.

I'm 64, and pondering my "retirement" boat. While right now I have no problem crawling around tight spots in dark places and navigating ladders in a boat underway, but I do think about how long I'm going to be able to do that in years to come.
Right now I have the Mainship 390 in my sights, stairs to the flybridge instead of a ladder with a lower helm as well, a door at the lower helm to the side decks, good and secure access all around the weather decks, a transom door to the swim platform, single level cockpit/salon/galley.
What level newbie are you? If you're a complete newbie with little to no time at the helm and limited mechanical skills, the 40DC may be a challenge. She's 35 years old and will need attention, mechanical skills will come in handy, even if you plan to pay for service, a tech is not always handy. Handling a boat that size can be learned, but as mentioned help for docking and anchoring will be nice.
If the 40DC fell into your lap, that's one thing, if you're shopping be sure you have looked around and thought it through before jumping in.

$0.02

Just saying..40 feet, 35 year old boat with gassers? A lot of weight and could be a lot of hours. For sure a lot of gas. If you keep it at hull speed it won't be too bad on gas but remember that at 1,500 to 2,000 hours those engines will be getting tired. Replacing will be around $5,000 each plus labor. I would downsize a bit and go with single diesel. Maybe a bow or stern thruster for a newbie.

pete

5 feet too big, look for diesel

lipets said:

5 feet too big, look for diesel

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??

Too big for what? Why?

-Chris

Bacchus said:

Welcome aboard TF and to the boating communuty.
So much depends on attitude and abilities more than age.
You didn't mention if you will have help with handling lines for docking, etc.
A good way to test whether any boat would work is to charter before buying. Most won't charter to an inexperienced skipper but will charter with a qualified captain. It could be a worthwhile way to confirm abilities, desires & comfort level.

Click to expand...

Most of the time I will single hand, and my biggest worry is getting into and out of a dock/berth/mooring ball without someone to handle the lines. I’ve watched a YouTube video by Slow Bells that showed using the engine controls in opposite directions ink der to turn it he boat, but I’m not sure that this will be of any help docking.

Keysdisease said:

I'm 64, and pondering my "retirement" boat. While right now I have no problem crawling around tight spots in dark places and navigating ladders in a boat underway, but I do think about how long I'm going to be able to do that in years to come.
Right now I have the Mainship 390 in my sights, stairs to the flybridge instead of a ladder with a lower helm as well, a door at the lower helm to the side decks, good and secure access all around the weather decks, a transom door to the swim platform, single level cockpit/salon/galley.
What level newbie are you? If you're a complete newbie with little to no time at the helm and limited mechanical skills, the 40DC may be a challenge. She's 35 years old and will need attention, mechanical skills will come in handy, even if you plan to pay for service, a tech is not always handy. Handling a boat that size can be learned, but as mentioned help for docking and anchoring will be nice.
If the 40DC fell into your lap, that's one thing, if you're shopping be sure you have looked around and thought it through before jumping in.

$0.02

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I’m not afraid to get my hands dirty doing work myself and plan to take hands on courses on electrical and engine maintenance. I live in central Pa. but will be keeping the boat in either Maryland or Delaware so that I have ocean and bay access. I was able to locate basic and advanced Diesel engine courses in Annapolis but no gas engine. I would prefer a diesel boat, but so far have not found one.
If I do end up with gas engines, I have been reading about how it o convert them to a closed cooling system to prolong the septic ngine’s life. Any thoughts?

Pete Meisinger said:

Just saying..40 feet, 35 year old boat with gassers? A lot of weight and could be a lot of hours. For sure a lot of gas. If you keep it at hull speed it won't be too bad on gas but remember that at 1,500 to 2,000 hours those engines will be getting tired. Replacing will be around $5,000 each plus labor. I would downsize a bit and go with single diesel. Maybe a bow or stern thruster for a newbie.

pete

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I’m worried about the hours on a gas engine. I’ve been looking into how many to convert the engines to a closed cooling system. It’s supposed to prolong their life. Any thoughts?

LateStarter said:

Most of the time I will single hand, and my biggest worry is getting into and out of a dock/berth/mooring ball without someone to handle the lines. I’ve watched a YouTube video by Slow Bells that showed using the engine controls in opposite directions ink der to turn it he boat, but I’m not sure that this will be of any help docking.

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My opinion, the newer Mainship 350/390s are a tad bit more "single-handing friendly". If you want to look at more Mainships. Or there are boatloads of other brands/models.

Our Mainship 34 Mk III -- same vintage as the original 40 -- had a ladder to/from the bridge, no side door at the lower helm... and both of those factors added just a little time getting from one place to another in a hurry.

The 350/390 has stairs and a door at the lower helm.

LateStarter said:

I live in central Pa. but will be keeping the boat in either Maryland or Delaware so that I have ocean and bay access. I was able to locate basic and advanced Diesel engine courses in Annapolis but no gas engine. I would prefer a diesel boat, but so far have not found one.

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I found the Annapolis courses very useful... although they use relatively tiny engines for hands-on. No turbos and aftercoolers, etc. I didn't find that to be a huge problem, though.

LateStarter said:

I’m worried about the hours on a gas engine. I’ve been looking into how many to convert the engines to a closed cooling system. It’s supposed to prolong their life. Any thoughts?

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There's a legitimate role for gas; just depends on whether your requirements and that role are in sync.

Just shop for freshwater cooled gassers. IOW, they already come that way... as opposed to raw water cooled.

-Chris

Anyone who has read any of my posts knows I love my 36 foot Albin with a single F.L. 120.
That is what I would recommend for the O.P. But that's not my reason for adding to this post..

So many people are afraid of docking, even willing to spend many thousands of dollars for twin engines, bow and stern thrusters or to give up on single handed boating altogether for fear of docking. Let me comment on this:

1. A bow (or stern) thruster is nice, but not absolutely needed. Even on a single engine boat!

2. Docking is EASY! Even alone, JUST DO IT!! Practice a bit and you will have it under control.

3. There is almost always someone on hand to catch a line or assist in docking. If there isn't anyone around then there isn't anyone to criticize your technique.

4. Docking is a VERY small part of boating. It consists of about 5 minutes in an 8 hour day of boating, lets not over emphasis the difficulty or stress of docking.

pete

Pete Meisinger said:

So many people are afraid of docking, even willing to spend many thousands of dollars for twin engines, bow and stern thrusters or to give up on single handed boating altogether for fear of docking. Let me comment on this:

1. A bow (or stern) thruster is nice, but not absolutely needed. Even on a single engine boat!

2. Docking is EASY! Even alone, JUST DO IT!! Practice a bit and you will have it under control.

3. There is almost always someone on hand to catch a line or assist in docking. If there isn't anyone around then there isn't anyone to criticize your technique.

4. Docking is a VERY small part of boating. It consists of about 5 minutes in an 8 hour day of boating, lets not over emphasis the difficulty or stress of docking.

pete

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Yes indeed. Read the section in Chapman's and it will tell you how to handle a single screw.
And remember that if you think you missed, you did. Pull out and start over.

ranger42c said:

??

Too big for what? Why?

-Chris

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it will be easier to handle a 35 ish boat than a 40 first time, that's all

LateStarter said:

If I do end up with gas engines, I have been reading about how it o convert them to a closed cooling system to prolong the septic ngine’s life. Any thoughts?

Click to expand...

What Chris said, almost every gas engine in larger boats are fresh water cooled (what you call closed cooling) through a heat exchanger, and every Mainship built in those days was fresh water cooled. Diesels just by nature last much longer than gassers. They are simpler and diesel does not explode.

This:

[/QUOTE]"I’ve watched a YouTube video by Slow Bells that showed using the engine controls in opposite directions ink der to turn it he boat, but I’m not sure that this will be of any help docking." [/QUOTE]

Kind of indicates a serious learning curve ahead of you and tends to make me agree with those that think 40ft may be on the large size for you as a beginner. Using the engine controls in a twin engine boat while docking is how its done, and with all due respect, if you didn't grasp that concept after watching the video, you really need some significant time on the wheel of a like sized boat before taking off as the operator. No disrespect intended, you asked, and based on your answers this is my humble opinion.

$0.02

We just met a guy over this last weekend who's very first ever boat purchase is a 45' motor yacht, actually about 50' OAL and not particularly well-suited to single-handing compared to some other designs...

And he's simply getting on with it, no big deal...

Not everyone can do that, of course. We've also met folks who can't easily dock a 12' center console.

-Chris

I vote with the single diesel crowd. My opion is the fuel consumption savings and the safety factor out weigh the the initial price difference of the vessel.
The size of the boat is going to have to be based on what you think you can handle and still be comfortable on. And I know first hand how a bow thruster can make a world of difference. I will be installing a stern thruster too and can't wait to see how easy that makes docking in transient docks.

OK, I am partial to diesels (especially the non-electronic diesels) and partial to single engine with a thruster. But read what David Pascoe opines in his "Mid size Power Boats" treatise. He states that they are an economic wash. As far as "is this boat too big" just find a captain and have him/her train you.
But...all said and done, welcome to the Forum, best wishes and you got a lot of folks pulling for you in the TF community. Keep us informed

LateStarter said:

I am 74, new to boating and thing about purchasing a 1984 Mainship 40
Double Cabin. It is equipped with twin Crusader 350 engines. Initially, I plan to use the boat for local cruising,but eventually want to take extended trips down to Florida and the Carribean.

My question is whether or not this is too much boat for a newbie.

Additionally, does anyone know if this is a full or partial displacement hull?
How will it handle in open water?

All advice and opinions are welcomed.

Click to expand...

Having refurbished a 1987 Hatteras 32 FlyBridge I offer the following.




I would run / not walk from the Crusader engines and gas system on the Mainship. For what you are planning to they are to dangerous and expensive. The gas bill will be horrendous.


Even if Mainship has an aluminum gas tank there are still all the other negatives.I am still wary.


When i refurbished my boat;

My gas tank was shot (Ethanol) Hatteras claimed they had ethanol resistant resin in 1986 but mine was a mess. I replaced Crusaders with Cummins Diesels. My deal is off shore / close shore fishing. I am 99% Complete and love the boat. The Diesels are awesome compared to Gas.

Docking may be only 5 minutes per 8 hours, but it can sometimes be stressful, especially when single handing, and for good reason.

It all depends on the situation. Which way is the wind going relative to the boat? Is it gusty or steady? Is the water movement in the same direction? How wide is the fairway to turn the final angle of approach? Do boats stick out really far? How wide is the slip? Is it a single or a double? Are the fingers full length or just stubs? Bow in or stern in? If you decide to back out, where will the wind and water leave you?

I, personally, am at the low end of the talent scale and can only pull it off because of practice. When I don't drive for a while and the wind or water whip up, I need a crew. Good days I'm fine. And I drive a twin screw.

Some friends, they are just natural. They wont drive a boat for 2-3 years, grab the controls of an unfamiliar 45' boat, and glide it right in.

The boat itself also matters. I used to think my 42' Californian handled great. But now having a 42' Hardin Europa with about the same LOA, beam, and draft, I'm in awe with how much more responsive itnfeels and steady it seems to steer. The wind seems to matter a lot less coming in andbthe rudders feels more responsice, especially at slow speeds. The rudders may just be bigger. I'm not sure why it feels like the wind matters a lot less coming in, but maybe because the cabin sits lower in the hull so it has less bondage, orbit may be that it has a full keel, or both.

Regardless, I dont think docking is anything to be afraid of. It gets much easier with practice. But, there are a lot of variables and, yes, it can be stressful, and, yes, you can cause a lot of expensive damage to your own boat and the boats of your neighbors. It happens many weekends at most marinas, I'd guess.

Mainship

I own a 42DC . It is a semi displacement hull. I find it easy to handle. I have been boating for over 50 years. It is powered with 350 engines. If I cruise at 18
miles an hour at 2800 RPM's I get good gas mileage. I love my Mainship. You will not be disappointed.

Hi Pete, I have to disagree with you on docking. I have been boating most of my life, and I'm old, and I still stress about docking, especially in wind or current. You get 15-30 tons of boat crashing into things (other boats, docks, pilings) and damage is going to be done, never mind that you will be embarrassed because someone always sees the bad landings.

A good friend bought a 36’ Hatteras with crusader gas engines. The boat was nice and fit his needs, but he ended up using it less and less and eventually selling it because if the cost if fuel. It drank gas like a rabid fan drinks beer at a tailgate party! I know the arguments about initial cost vs. operating cost etc., but psychologically, when you go to fill up again and again and are only getting < 1 mile/gallon, it starts to dissuade you from going out. There are enough boats with diesels around that you should be able to find one that meets your needs. Don't be afraid of lots if hours on a diesel, as long as it has been well maintained and you get it surveyed. In fact, substantial hours may actually be better than too few!

Agree. Age is only a number. Nobody knows anything until they learn. I had no idea what I was getting into with my first boat. You’ll learn. You’ll be creative and surprise yourself at the things you can do. Get the boat you want and learn it and on it. We all need to live our dream.

Initially, I plan to use the boat for local cruising,but eventually want to take extended trips down to Florida and the Carribean.

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. The Mainship 40 DC only has 300 gallons of fuel. If you run at planing speed (18 or so knots), you will not have a long range--(not knowing what you mean by Caribbean or the Bahamas, which are a bit different.)

The Double Cabin is not an easy boat to deal with in docking. If there is a low or floating dock, it is some distance down--from the deck of the boat--especially the aft deck. A boat with a walk around and lower freeboard/cockpit will be easier to handle.

Can't repeat it enough hire a captain to teach you how to run dock and do basic maintenance checks . That boat is a handful to dock single handed on a good day add 20 knots of wind and it will look like a fire drill in a marina with your neighbors trying to save their boats as you're crashing in to them . Totally irresponsible to be fooling around with a heavy 40'er near other people's boats start with a Sunfish until you understand wind and current .

Jim W. said:

Can't repeat it enough hire a captain to teach you how to run dock and do basic maintenance checks . t .

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Or get someone from the marina either one of the mechanics or another owner to show you the ropes.
This happens at our marina often. Most are more than willing to help.
And then there are those who absolutely refuse help or suggestions. Those are the ones who generally will never "get it".

I don't think that 40' is too much boat but a 1984, twin gas boat is going to be a major maintenance problem.
I am 75 and I handle my Mainship 390, single diesel, with bow thruster with no problem, either solo or with the Admiral who is a similar age.
We picked the Mainship because it was easily handled shorthanded. The secret is stairs, not a ladder to the flybridge and a door at the lower helm position that allows unobstructed access to the deck on the docking side.
If you have grandkids, you will definitely appreciate a second private cabin and the Mainship 350 Trawler and the 390 give you this feature.
Any trawler, semi-displacement hull is going to be a gas guzzler if you try to run it at speed. I cruise at 6.8 to 7 knots at 1700 rpm and burn just over 2 gallons per hour. That speed gives me excellent fuel efficiency, gets me to where I want to go (500-700 NM per year) and allows me to view the whales and other wildlife along the way.