Two anchors to play with.

I have been given two ARA anchors to play with.

Had them for two weeks or so and haven't even got-um wet.

One is an Excel and the other a Super SARCA. About 17lbs (the Excel) and about 23lbs for the SARCA. Over the years I've noticed I have had different notions about them and that certainly happened w these two .. mostly the Excel. And that is mostly because I've never liked the Delta and others like the delta. The Davis is, however, reported to be a very good anchor. But the Excel is in the same image so I didn't take much notice of the Excel. Especially since I've always had a soft spot for the SARCA. Claimed it as my favorite many times but w/o much reason for it to be my favorite as I'd never seen one except from a distance.

So to have them in my hands and scruitenized by eye my impression of them changed my take on them quite a bit.
Length to width (aspect ratio) is way different between the two .. SARCA being quite wide and short and Excel being very long and narrow. I can only speculate on the amount of force necessary to pull them through the seabed. It may vary re the type of seabed significantly too I think.
The shank is much like the flukes w the Excel being quite long and the SARCA unusually short.
The SARCA has the slot and the Excel does not.
Even the finish is different. Both galvanized but the Excel has a bit darker color and quite smooth. Whereas the SARCA is a more typical galvanized finish.
One feature that I didn't expect is the self launching balance .. or should I say .. imbalance. The anchors won't lay in the bow roller channel w/o immediately sliding fwd and down. I feel I better not try to mount them on the roller channel for fear of loosing them. However others will welcome this feature I'm sure.
I'll use the SARCA tripping slot the way it was designed.
Another very big difference is that the Excel is weighted at the tip of the fluke (actually to a point about 4-5" back) and the whole anchor is very nose heavy as designed. The SARCA has a supprising weight bias to the rear. I'm thinking that's unusual but all the pivoting shank anchors do also and I can think of no way to relate that to the SARCA other than that the similarity exists.
Also balance wise the Excel is pre-determined to roll over on it's side assumably as designed and does it very well. The ballast chamber isn't flat on the bottom and even on a hard surface the anchor wants to rotate.
Enter the SARCA. just the opposite. It has a wide footprint on the bottom and seems determined to sit flat on any reasonably flat surface. And as I recall on Steve's vids it didn't roll around at all even in Steve's violent reversals. Just rotated to the rode staying very flat and the diving sharply down.

I don't think I can even come close to pulling these anchors out once set. Would be difficult to rig to pull from the stern and unless I change my prop I'll only have 3-400lbs pull from the bow. My rode is almost all 5/8ths Nylon Brait and I don't want any of it wrapped around my prop. I may try a slow drift over the anchor to switch the pull to the stern. Doubt seriously if I'll come close to pulling one out unless I encounter a poor seafloor.

We're going on a road trip to Sointula in about a week .. camping. We like Port McNeil and plan to be in that area several days. May get one chance to get the boat out before we leave and if not it will be about tree wks before I try the two anchors. Have a new place picked out.

Sorry no pics .. the anchors are on the boat. But very few will not be familiar w the ARA anchors.

Nomad Willy said:

One feature that I didn't expect is the self launching balance .. or should I say .. imbalance. The anchors won't lay in the bow roller channel w/o immediately sliding fwd and down. I feel I better not try to mount them on the roller channel for fear of loosing them. However others will welcome this feature I'm sure.

Click to expand...

Our SuperMAX won't "self-launch"... which means I always have to go forward to start it forward and over the roller... even though we have helm control on the flybridge. OTOH, I have to go forward to undo the chain stopper anyway...

-Chris

Chris,
Even when I have an anchor on the bow roller I push it out 3" about horizontally so the fluke tip won't gouge the hull. But I always have a little rode on the channel of the bow roller that comes back around the brail and gets tied off.

I'll deal w these ARA anchors over the rail by hand on the port side. I have a bit of a harness rigged to keep me from falling overboard. I pick up the anchor w a boat hook and lift it up on deck. Anchors on deck is the usual for me.

Re the post I must have but up too many details. Many don't like details.

I look forward to reading your impressions. As you know, I’ve been pleased with my Excel. It definitely self-launches from the bow-roller. I have a line keeping the chain tight and the anchor sucked up tight to the roller. Otherwise it would move around. When the rode is released, it leaves the anchor roller quickly.

My Super Sarca self launches,it may depend on bowsprit design.
Looking forward to your experiences with these anchors. I have not blocked the slot on mine either(a bolt was supplied in case you want to) so it has functioned as originally designed for around 5 years since purchase.
Eric, how did you come by the anchors? Has someone at last recognized your anchor expertise?

ranger42c said:

Our SuperMAX won't "self-launch"... which means I always have to go forward to start it forward and over the roller... even though we have helm control on the flybridge. OTOH, I have to go forward to undo the chain stopper anyway...

-Chris

Click to expand...

Same here but with a Bruce knock-off. Despite having duplicate controls in the bridge, need to push off the anchor to get it going. Have always used pedal controls at the bow. Besides, need to wash down the chain and anchor when retrieved, as well as occasionally pulling off vegetation.

Nomad Willy said:

I have been given two ARA anchors to play with.

Had them for two weeks or so and haven't even got-um wet.

One is an Excel and the other a Super SARCA. About 17lbs (the Excel) and about 23lbs for the SARCA. Over the years I've noticed I have had different notions about them and that certainly happened w these two .. mostly the Excel. And that is mostly because I've never liked the Delta and others like the delta. The Davis is, however, reported to be a very good anchor. But the Excel is in the same image so I didn't take much notice of the Excel. Especially since I've always had a soft spot for the SARCA. Claimed it as my favourite many times but w/o much reason for it to be my favourite as I'd never seen one except from a distance.

Click to expand...

Eric, as you know, I am the first person to bring up the Super Sarca on here, mainly because I was so impressed by it. Still am/was, even after selling the boat. I think I miss that anchor most of all. Sounds a bit silly, doesn't it, to like the anchor more than the boat. But Lotus, nice though she was was just an old CHB 34, whereas that anchor back then was unique. It was just so decidedly purposely designed to do what it does, and in such a businesslike no-frills, (some might say agricultural) way. It just does the business. I loved it, and hated to part with it.

I am therefore just dying to hear your experiences with them both, especially the S-Sarca. So please get on with it and use the things, asap and don't keep me, and others no doubt, dangling too long eh..?

Eric, for the Super Sarca you need a shackle to fit the slot,as far as I know Sarca doesn`t supply one. The pin slides in the slot, use a good long shank ss shackle, be sure the jaws are wide enough. I used a 1/2" Ronstan with a rating, cost about $40, your anchor is smaller so probably smaller less pricy shackle. Or you`ll have one lying around.
Happy anchoring!

Nomad Willy (self) wrote;
“I'll deal w these ARA anchors over the rail by hand on the port side. I have a bit of a harness rigged to keep me from falling overboard. I pick up the anchor w a boat hook and lift it up on deck. Anchors on deck is the usual for me.

This picture explains what I’m talking about.
I stand to the left (port side) and hook a chain link w a boat hook very close to the anchor. Then pull it up w both hands, rotate and place on deck. The boat hook has a rubber tip that fits tight enough not to fall off but small enough to not pose a problem hooking up. You can see my old XYZ anchor where I place the anchors on deck.
I tried the body harness but not yet w an anchor on the boat hook.

You can see my modded Claw resting the waymost anchors rest. I have a 5/16” restrainer line w a clip on one end and a bowline on the other end for length adjustment.
All the 400’ of rode goes in the plastic box w the grey cover.

Re the comments;
Yes the self launch was a surprise to me but many (perhaps most) deploy their anchors from the helm. A bigger advantage when solo of course. Just another way no product is right/perfect for everybody.
As I’ve said if I had it to do over I’d have a combo-winch chain/line and likely 1/3rd of the rode would be chain .... 1/4”.

Bruce,
I forgot about the special shackle that’s ideal. I have 20 or so shackles but I don’t know if I have a long and straight one just the right width. If I get the pin dia right and the shackle width right I may be good to go ... what think?
The anchors are from Chris Eldridge at Ground Tackle Marine. His idea.

Peter,
Hang in there buddy. I’m much the same and have that problem w cars too. I’m moved by your loss and perhaps you can lead me above depression when the time comes for me. Could be soon but I keep goi’n .. somewhat. But I have the problem threefold w both anchors, cars and boat. The anchors I’ll need to take to the scrap bin and that could be a bit hard.
As to the dangl’in trawlerformers I may not get to it before we leave for Port NcNeil and Soentula. At least we’ll be in a car so won’t need to hole up for weather. 2-3 weeks.

Mark,
Sounds like you need to wash down all the time. But you’re being on/in a big river delta you’ve probably never known anything but mud. But most would rather wash mud than drag anchor and it sounds like you don’t do the dragging thing.

I have a Sarca Excel 22kg on my GB 32. Used it a lot last summer in the PNW. Works great...sets fast and then stays set. Bought it after I watched the anchor review videos by S/V Panope on Youtube. He rated it as one of the best!
Oldersalt

Nomad Willy said:

Bruce,
I forgot about the special shackle that’s ideal. I have 20 or so shackles but I don’t know if I have a long and straight one just the right width. If I get the pin dia right and the shackle width right I may be good to go ... what think?
The anchors are from Chris Eldridge at Ground Tackle Marine. His idea...

Click to expand...

I`m sure you`ll find something suitable in your stock on hand.
The shackle is an operating part, the only moving part in fact. I think Sarca don`t supply them because they don`t make them and won`t be seen as warranting them. It needs to slide nicely without jamming either in the slot or on the shank. And be strong, I rejected one made in a tarrif war country for a Ronstan. The chain sometimes jammed around the shackle,so I added an old type cast gal swivel(shock horror ) which cured it and so far hasn`t caused other problems.

Nomad Willy said:

...
Mark,
Sounds like you need to wash down all the time. But you’re being on/in a big river delta you’ve probably never known anything but mud. But most would rather wash mud than drag anchor and it sounds like you don’t do the dragging thing.

Click to expand...

Yes, have never dragged, and current and wind have set anchors without needing to reverse engine. Anchors have always set with a jerk. Strong tidal currents and winds have only sent anchors more secure.

Bruce.
Why wouldn’t a short shackle work that had straight “shackle arms” but of normal length?
A galvanized shackle of that description came w my XYZ anchor when it was new. For no connected reason I’m sure. And that anchor has a round shackle pin hole so the chain connection goes to the head of the shackle. I usually prefer that configuration ... not that I would want to build a case for it. But I won’t be using a swivel.

But if a swivel and/or a shackle was required for function I would think it would be included as part of the anchor and available as a part w a part #. I don’t know about SS shackles but I think many stronger galvanized shackles are well documented re quality and strength.

Nomad Willy said:

Bruce.
Why wouldn’t a short shackle work that had straight “shackle arms” but of normal length?
A galvanized shackle of that description came w my XYZ anchor when it was new.....I don’t know about SS shackles but I think many stronger galvanized shackles are well documented re quality and strength.

Click to expand...

Eric, as long as the shackle pin sits snugly in the slot, but not too snug, and the U-shaped end clears the end of the shank when at the rode end of the slot, so it can rotate around it, it is probably long enough. Rex favoured a stainless one for anchor sizes below about #7, because a galvanised one might not be 'slippery' enough for the tripping function to operate properly. In the larger sizes it does not matter. However, as you are more interested in the set and hold function that the foul trip function I'd say don't let that be a big issue. Just use what you have that fits the above description.

Oh yes that slippery SS.
Didn’t think of that. Got a sack full of shackles at home. One is even polished bronze. But it’s too small.

Here is that shackle from XYZ w the red head pin. It was claimed to be documented high strength. Not the greatest pic but you can see the straight shaclke ears. Not a hoop end.
With the XYZ's short shank I think Draggo the designer was looking for the least amount of resistance beneath the seafloor surface so it wouldn't hold back the anchor's penetration.

Finally making an effort w these anchors.

Went out to a local muddy bay near LaConner w two of my modded anchors and a ARA Excel plus a ARA SARCA.

Put my modded 24lb Claw on the bow being the heaviest.
Dropped down 15' or so w about 60' of line out. Hooked up OK and backed down some. After my last mud ball experience w this anchor I was not wanting heavily compacted mud. Got a load of mud that was probably lose to making the anchor inoperative. See 1st photo. Took about 6-7 minutes to brush off the mud. This mud was not as bad as the mud from a month ago but I've now got this anchor labelled as a mud hook.

Launched my Supreme and it hooked up and held 1400rpm.
Reset and was preparing to add some throttle when it broke out a bit and tried to reset. Did this several times. First time this anchor has failed and I'm at a loss to establish a good reason for it.

I had trouble lifting the 24lb Claw up over the port side w my boat hook. Tried not to but banged the anchor on the hull and the cap rail. Started to be not fun so we headed for the barn (covered moorage). If I had thought a bit more about options I probably would'a mounted the SARCA on deck and got her wet but didn't.
Have given it much more thought since (a week) and come up w a sceneraio that will probably work OK. At least for testing the SARCA and Excel ... in that order only.

The Sarca and the Excel clear my hull if I push down on the shank during the last bit of retrieval. The little hoop (brail?) does not clear for either anchor. Should get a higher one. The roll bar is at an opposite angle from the Rocna that is at the other extreme. The welds on these anchors are beautiful. The black thing at the end of the shank is a pair of wood blocks that limit anchor rolling back and forth. The slot must be sized to a specific anchor. My 33lb Claw in this case.
The SARCA looks like a full rigged ship compared to the Excel. For it’s weight the SARCA is large. The Excel by comparison is small. See it (last pic) next to my 12lb Supreme. The Excel is compact. This one is 21lbs and the SARCA is 23lbs. For my boat I consider any modern high performance anchor over 20lbs to be all one would ever need (anchor weight wise). My Claw is 10lbs heavier for that reason. A good anchor but not HP.

The photo below the 2nd Excel pic shows how the shank on my particular installation will allow the anchor to rotate back and forth. The wood blocks (black, noted in a post above) prevent that but must be sized to the anchor shank’s width.

Peter and Bruce I did find a SS shackle that could be a tad narrower but should work fine IMO. Notice the lack of a slot block.

Tied up this weekend w family affairs but now I think I can pull this testing gig off. The only way to do this properly is to go up the inside passage anchoring all the way. Good anchoring sites aren’t plentiful around here unless it’s a dedicated mud test. And for me to get to others is a bit problematic at 6 knots also. I have a recommendation for a spot on the west side of Camano Is. My other chosen site is in an active channel and has lots of boat wakes. Close though.

Launched my Supreme and it hooked up and held 1400rpm.
Reset and was preparing to add some throttle when it broke out a bit and tried to reset. Did this several times. First time this anchor has failed and I'm at a loss to establish a good reason for it.

Click to expand...

From what I can tell, you answered that question earlier in the same paragraph.

Eric,With 2 Sarcas to play with you`d be as happy as a dog with 2 tails. Though I think you prefer cats,and their tail indications are quite different.
Re the Supreme reset issue, it is odd, but I had a problem with the chain getting caught up on the sliding shackle. Resolved by adding a gal old figure 8 type swivel to better separate chain and shackle. Or it could be the issue caltexflanc raised.

BruceK said:

Eric,With 2 Sarcas to play with you`d be as happy as a dog with 2 tails. Though I think you prefer cats,and their tail indications are quite different.
Re the Supreme reset issue, it is odd, but I had a problem with the chain getting caught up on the sliding shackle. Resolved by adding a gal old figure 8 type swivel to better separate chain and shackle. Or it could be the issue caltexflanc raised.

Click to expand...

Whats a figure 8 type swivel? I have never heard that term

Sailor of Fortune said:

Whats a figure 8 type swivel? I have never heard that term

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My poor attempt at a description. The old gal type with a ring at each end to take a shackle, rather than the modern "anchor connector" type.

Great to hear you are finally getting to grips with those new anchors Eric. I'm a bit puzzled why you bothered testing the claw again though, instead of getting right on with the Excel or Sarca, because you're never going to want to use that Claw again after either of those. But I guess it was worth it to just prove it one more time..? Best of luck, and let's know how it goes.

Sailor of Fortune said:

Whats a figure 8 type swivel? I have never heard that term

Click to expand...

Sarca make a solid link that obviates the need for a swivel. I can highly recommend it.

I don’t know what caltex is talking about in post #19.
I would think if I got this anchor to set, even a small amount it should continue setting. I was assuming a somewhat consistent seafloor. But that could be assumed from what the Claw did. Don’t think there was a hard pan 3-4” below the surface. The Claw held too good for that to be the case. But I don’t want to spend time w the Supreme now.

But Peter the exciting part is using the modded anchors. They are personal as I dreamed up the mod and all the theory about how I think they should work. Then they frequently do differently and it’s an interesting puzzle. Perhaps what I thought was setting wasn’t. What if the anchor was up-side-down and the shank started to dig in and of course after a brief penetration would pop out and repeat. If the scope was long like 8-1 perhaps that could happen. Of course if I had a camera ....
But w the ARA anchors it should be a bit boring. May be interesting how much mud they do or don’t pull up but I really expect the ARA anchors to work perfectly. HaHa but of course there’s no such anchor so it could be a little exciting. But not much. Probably 95% just exercise.
But re the Supreme I know it will get up-side-down when I get sloppy about my whispering. But then all I hafta do is pull the anchor back up, check it out and put it back down carefully. Given a reasonable seafloor it should set positively. Like it has before. If I was drifting fwd instead of backward the shank could get pulled up and flip. That may get the anchor up-side-down. I shoulda just pulled it up and pay more attention to drift. Or set it the other direction.
But as I say I didn’t expect it to set every time like mechanical perfection. This anchor is not for the public. But when it does set oriented correctly it may or should penetrate deeply and perhaps hold better than any other anchor. It’s possible. My “whispering” isn’t even close to magic. I just carefully put the anchor down on the seafloor while drifting slowly backwards. The anchor can’t do anything other than line up pointing it’s fluke tip at the boat. Then giv’en some scope it should set. I developed this technique using the early XYZ anchor. Had to get everything just perfect to get that anchor to set. Once set I could hang on it for a full day w 50 knot wind. But that anchor’s in a landfill in Alaska. Had to fight w it almost every time. Not good enough.
So the modded Supreme was/is intended to replace the XYZ. But instead of not setting 85%of the time it would set 85% of the time. I probably just got my 15%.

I have a mod in mind for the Claw but it’s fall and I’m too busy this time of the year for such dark horses.
The picture is of the original XYZ anchor. The one I refer to above.

Eric, I think we all 'get it' that for you, the fun is all about the anchors, their construction, and why they did or did not work, and in what bottoms, they did or did not work in, or why this anchoring technique is better at setting this or that anchor than other methods. However, and its a big however, for most folk it is what they do 'after' they have set their anchor that's the fun thing.

So, they literally want an anchor that when it is dropped, pretty much sets each and every time, no matter what position they hold their tongue in when they are doing it, and that once down it sets itself, without any elaborate procedures and incantations necessary. In other words, rather like an old iconic Honda ad, "they just love something that works..!"

Sarca anchors pretty much fit the above description. If you find that it's true, and you find that boring, then most folk would say that is the greatest and bestest example of boring imaginal. Just sayin'

Nomad Willy said:

I don’t know what caltex is talking about in post #19.
I would think if I got this anchor to set, even a small amount it should continue setting. I was assuming a somewhat consistent seafloor. But that could be assumed from what the Claw did. Don’t think there was a hard pan 3-4” below the surface. The Claw held too good for that to be the case. But I don’t want to spend time w the Supreme now.

But Peter the exciting part is using the modded anchors. They are personal as I dreamed up the mod and all the theory about how I think they should work. Then they frequently do differently and it’s an interesting puzzle. Perhaps what I thought was setting wasn’t...

Click to expand...

So really a thread about home modified anchors. Lots of thread drift, or anchor drift. The title needs changing.

Peter that’s about the greatest post you’ve made.
I’m with it 110%.

As it started out I was too cheap to buy a windlass. Then the thought of hundreds of lbs of chain on the light end of the boat was a turn off.

It was more complicated than that of course but I do regret not getting what most of you would call a proper winch. But I did belly up to the bar and buy a Supreme anchor. I’d probably been fine and perhaps my interest in anchors would not have amounted to much. Well I didn’t ever drag across the bay and on the rocks. Had similar luck flying UL aircraft. Of course complacency could be a problem now that I’m not in Alaska anymore.

By the way the rotator cuff thing went well. Doctor patient matter of course.

Bruce,
“Playing with anchors”
Think the title covers it.

Perhaps you’d like “SARCA” or/and “Excel” to be in the title.
Why don’t you and Peter make up a new title (I trust your judgement) and insert the new title where appropriate. Thanks for the help.

I did consider the title w some thought. I was asked to “play” w the anchors.
And consider that an appalling number of TF thread titles say nothing at all about what the thread is about.

Aquabelle said:

Sarca make a solid link that obviates the need for a swivel. I can highly recommend it.

Click to expand...

Is that the "Fliplink"? Anchor Right Australia introduces, the innovative Flip Link - Anchor Right Australia
I wasn`t looking for a swivel as such, but it seemed a dual purpose way to overcome an issue and gain an advantage.