Looking for a Input on a new boat

Looking to move my life (me and 2 mutts) onto a 60-70' vessel. Presently looking at Marlow/Outer Reef/Fleming. Love the Fleming but cost is much greater than the other 2. Wondering about build quality and rough water hanling and comfort. Plan to cruise from the east coast to Alaska and back and then tour the Caribbean for a few years.

Are you sure 70' feet is going to be large enough? Might want to bump up to the 90-100' range to be sure you have enough space for you and your two dogs. Better sea keeping qualities in the larger boat too.

I don't want to be over confident on my solo seamanship abilities so I will stick to the reasonable size limits. I presently have a 47' vessel and it is too small. And not for nothing,.... but it's my money. I earned it. And I intend to enjoy my years in retirement before my niece and nephews get to fight over whatever is left when I kick the bucket

Good for you loungeitude, usually the mental midgets respond with some garbage like above because they can't offer anything of use to the discussion. I also can not offer anything of value because I don't know those boats well but I surely won't disparage you for having the means and desire to buy what you want. Good luck.

I love the Flemings. There are a lot of articles and videos of a 65’, I think, that Tony Fleming owns. He has done a lot of long range cruising on it.

I was recently on a friends 75' steel yacht. For myself I can't see single handing a boat that size, but his is an older boat that was never setup to do that. If you are able to, that's great. He has a part time crew of three including a mechanic.

Only half jesting about going bigger, once you get much over 50-60 feet it's all very relative, especially if you are looking in the used market. A newer/new boat with all the latest technology assists with docking controls, cameras, multiple docking stations, thrusters, etc.. take a lot of that out of the equation. Nordhavn is very nice in that size range and some of the members here have experience with them.

Handling a larger vessel is much easier now that bow and stern thrusters and remote docking stations are common. Definitely going with twin engines for close quarter maneuverability They weigh a lot, and aren't as prone to windage as a lighter boat. I have the experience and a 100 ton license so I can get insurance to operate it myself. Nordhavn is awesome but draws too much water (6'-7') so I had to take that off the list.

Cost of a later model (2012+) Fleming 65 is over $3 million. Definitely a deterrent. But I agree.. They are beautiful, well made vessels. Other than the cost of buying one it would be my first choice

With the variety of missions you have in mind, have you considered a power cat?

Flemming ticks all my boxes. When I win the lottery (I've never played), if the after tax is over 20 million, I'll be in the market for one. In the meantime, I'll just get aroused every time I cruise by there brokerage in Stuart, FL.

Ted

One thing about the Fleming and Marlow (not sure about Outer Reef) is they have a certain amount of exterior woodwork, which impacts maintenance if that is a factor for you.
Passagemaker has some fairly recent reviews of both the Fleming and the Marlow Here:

https://www.passagemaker.com/cruiser-reviews

...plus some other models that seem really nice, for example the Scandinavians make such interesting products like the Steeler Yachts, Here.

Oh and one more possibility, an Elling 65, ocean rated and complete with a built-in dinghy garage in the transom
https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/2019/elling-e6-highline-3496325/?refSource=enhanced listing

I had a 1977 Hatteras MY. Great boat and I did spend time cruising alone but was also younger. I just last week helped a friend and his wife move their 40ft Mainship from San Francisco to San Diego. I consider myself pretty spry and while I might have been able to handle the docking by myself it would be challenging and maybe impossible if conditions had been rough.

I expect if you have the ability to afford a large boat you would consider hiring crew and/or having friends if you were making longer transits? Only so many hours one person can stay at the helm before catching some sleep! Good luck with your search.

Did you see this one?

http://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s9/54-canoe-stern-trawler-sparkman-stephens-45085.html

I asked the Captain who I recently hired what boat he'd buy if money wasn't an issue. He said an Ocean Alexander. Their 70e is pretty stunning. Not sure what your budget is, but might be worth checking. Also, the Nordhavn 59 Coastal Pilot is a semi displacement hull so doesn't draw as much water as their FD boats. Just some thoughts...

Such large boats restrict where one might dock, no? Can't see docking at Sam's Cafe in Tiburon or at Jack London Square in Oakland, either, to mention just a couple.

Not a big fan of cats. Been on a few. I have thought about the N59CP. Have to give it another look especially now they are going to make a version with an extended cabin. A lot of boats that members recommend have a really deep draft. I want to keep it around 5’. Asfor concerns about docking in bad conditions, I will often have friends and family visiting when I make a passage. Else I will plan to stay in until conditions improve. A decent amount of cruising in bad conditions results from poor planning or a rush to get somewhere. Those red flags were ingrained in my brain when I used to fly aircraft.

loungeitude said:

Not a big fan of cats. Been on a few. I have thought about the N59CP. Have to give it another look especially now they are going to make a version with an extended cabin. A lot of boats that members recommend have a really deep draft. I want to keep it around 5’. Asfor concerns about docking in bad conditions, I will often have friends and family visiting when I make a passage. Else I will plan to stay in until conditions improve. A decent amount of cruising in bad conditions results from poor planning or a rush to get somewhere. Those red flags were ingrained in my brain when I used to fly aircraft.

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Ocean Alexander 70e, not a cat, draft between 4'10" - 5'. Interior is gorgeous, as is engine room!

markpierce said:

Such large boats restrict where one might dock, no? Can't see docking at Sam's Cafe in Tiburon or at Jack London Square in Oakland, either, to mention just a couple.

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OP said he'd cruise from East Coast to Alaska, and Caribbean.

I did a delivery on a 70 foot Outer Reef a few years ago in what would best be described as challenging weather.
Our delivery started In Rothsyth Scotland in 6-8 foot seas with 25-30 knot of wind, not idea weather but the tide in the North Sea ranges in the 4 meter area so you get the wind over tide creating a very short nasty chop that lasted all the way down to the English channel.
The weather improved a bit once we got into the channel with winds of 10-15 knts and seas 4-6 on the bow.
Even with the less than ideal weather the boat surpassed my expectations with excellent sea keeping and a nice comfortable ride.

Going from 47’ to 60/70’ is a size jump that many insurers will not cover, especially on a solo owner/operator.

Our LOA is almost 60’, and I have soloed this boat several times in varying conditions- I can see where things could go very wrong very quickly.

Thanks Just Working. Very glad to hear that the ORY has good manners!

And I will look into the insurance issue. I maintain a 100 ton masters license and had been advised that is what the insurers are looking for.

loungeitude said:

Looking to move my life (me and 2 mutts) onto a 60-70' vessel. Presently looking at Marlow/Outer Reef/Fleming. Love the Fleming but cost is much greater than the other 2. Wondering about build quality and rough water hanling and comfort. Plan to cruise from the east coast to Alaska and back and then tour the Caribbean for a few years.

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Have also a look at Selene, very good value for money, I have my 78 ft with twin engines and bow/stern thrusters and if you have time and knowledge for maintenance and cleaning, it is very feasible to do single-handed cruising.
Enjoy your retirement as much as you can.

Loungeitude, I lived for several years on a 65’ Burger and solo’d the majority of time, except for longer passages of more than just a few days. Twin diesel and no thrusters. It was no issues at all to maintain, dock, maneuver, etc. Likely you will choose a bow thruster for your new boat, which I still think is optional, but certainly would come in handy under some conditions. Personally I’d skip the stern thruster. Just another system to go bad and I’ve been wacked by floating logs from astern several times when docked in the PNW. Since your vessel will probably be fly by wire, then a remote to carry around will ease your docking needs.

Pau Hana said:

Going from 47’ to 60/70’ is a size jump that many insurers will not cover, especially on a solo owner/operator.

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Thread drift warning:

I've never been asked whether I cruise solo. Pretty sure the very nice lady who is my contact point at my insurance broker, knows I solo and soloed the Loop. She knows I've had a master's license for 30+ years, maybe they offset. Is that a normal insurance question? Pretty sure I've never been asked about it.

I'm curious if other people have been asked whether they solo or intend to?

For all the boating value some of my cruising guests have been, I probably would have been better off solo.

Ted

O C Diver said:

I'm curious if other people have been asked whether they solo or intend to?

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When I bought my 65’ the insurance agent specifically told me they wouldn’t have insured me without my license, which was 100 ton at that time.

When I sold it I warned the buyer about insurance. But his ego was too big and he bragged to his insurer about being qualified to solo. The insurer rejected his policy and required him to have at least one extra hand onboard.

The OP has a 100ton so I doubt that will be an issue for a 65-70’.

I think that I be insurable. I have a 100 ton masters license.

And thanks Just Working for a report on the 70 ORY. It’s actually what I am scheduled to look at (there is a 2012 and a 2013 on the used market)

A friend of mine was unhappy when he sold his 65’ yacht and bought a 116’ yacht. He has a 6-pack license and I think he just figured he could be insured for this new boat. Nope. He had hire a captain as well. He charters it, so that isn’t too big an issue but it means that anytime he goes out with his family, he has to take his captain along as well well. That kind of annoys him.

Yeah, he has more money and ego than sense.

Fleming is an excellent boat but you mentioned reservations on the price. I find Outer Reef to be a real quality boat and a good boat for rough seas. I would not consider Marlow to even be in it's class. I'd also consider Selene and OA and Cheoy Lee, at least some models of each. I don't think you could go wrong with Outer Reef though.

sbman said:

Are you sure 70' feet is going to be large enough? Might want to bump up to the 90-100' range to be sure you have enough space for you and your two dogs. Better sea keeping qualities in the larger boat too.

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Jealous??

Comodave said:

I love the Flemings. There are a lot of articles and videos of a 65’, I think, that Tony Fleming owns. He has done a lot of long range cruising on it.

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I agree with the above but the Outer Reef's ER is superior to the Fleming. A good friend of mine skippered an Outer Reef 65 to Puerta Viarta and back and said it was a great boat. Got in to some big seas too! I'm a little familiar with both boats but at my age (78) the OR's ER would get my vote.