Anchor Wars come to Georgia

This might be one of those if just passing through...easier to stop and get a pumpout, log it in a tiny nortebook with receipt stapled in rather that be stopped and questioned and held for further investigation.


Or just stay in marinas while in GA and be exempt.

The way I read the rules, once you buy the permit you have to comply and the assumption is that once the permit expires, so does the compliance obligation. So, the day I cross into Georgia, I go online and purchase the 7 day permit for $20 ($10 if 65 or older). If stopped, I have no log as I haven't pumped out since purchasing the permit. Once I leave the state and the permit expires, I have no obligation to comply any longer with permit requirements (pump out log).

I'm more interested to see where the approved anchorages are. Think it would be easier to prohibit some areas as opposed to approving everywhere else.

Ted

O C Diver said:

The way I read the rules, once you buy the permit you have to comply and the assumption is that once the permit expires, so does the compliance obligation. So, the day I cross into Georgia, I go online and purchase the 7 day permit for $20 ($10 if 65 or older). If stopped, I have no log as I haven't pumped out since purchasing the permit. Once I leave the state and the permit expires, I have no obligation to comply any longer with permit requirements (pump out log).

I'm more interested to see where the approved anchorages are. Think it would be easier to prohibit some areas as opposed to approving everywhere else.

Ted

Click to expand...

Ted, I read it differently.

I read it that, if anchoring in Georgia, you must have a pump out log going back 12 months. Period. Not in any way tied to the permit date.

Again, what you state might have been the intent, but it is not the way it is written.

In our area, there are about 25 boats that are called bouncers. They rotate among the free anchorages using the on line registration system. Many of them are less than retirement stage, don’t work, and their boats are trashed. I don’t have anything against them personally, except for the fact they tie up the anchorages and keep others out who work for a living. I also know quite a few of them are pumping their waste OB. There is talk of instituting a fee of around 5 bucks per night to use these anchorages. I am all for it.

menzies said:

Ted, I read it differently.

I read it that, if anchoring in Georgia, you must have a pump out log going back 12 months. Period. Not in any way tied to the permit date.

Again, what you state might have been the intent, but it is not the way it is written.

Click to expand...

I downloaded the pdf file version and read through it.
It appears to me that the section dealing with logging pump outs was in the repealed section. I see no mention of the logging requirement in the new law section. Is there another document you are referencing?

Ted

Fletcher500 said:

In our area, there are about 25 boats that are called bouncers. They rotate among the free anchorages using the on line registration system. Many of them are less than retirement stage, don’t work, and their boats are trashed. I don’t have anything against them personally, except for the fact they tie up the anchorages and keep others out who work for a living. I also know quite a few of them are pumping their waste OB. There is talk of instituting a fee of around 5 bucks per night to use these anchorages. I am all for it.

Click to expand...

Charge everyone to solve the problem with a few?

The pumping overboard is an issue, but I just can't see why we would want to prohibit their anchoring so long as they keep their vessels sea worthy and no pumping into the inland waters.

How about annual mandatory USCGA inspections with a month to fix issues. Then a fine. Stickers are easy enough to eyeball and the volunteer AUX are ways looking for boats to inspect.

O C Diver said:

I downloaded the pdf file version and read through it.
It appears to me that the section dealing with logging pump outs was in the repealed section. I see no mention of the logging requirement in the new law section. Is there another document you are referencing?

Ted

Click to expand...

On cell right now, will look again when I get on desk top. There are also threads on two other forums I am on so may have seen it there - that both the boaters and marinas had to keep logs that could be matched.

Also I believe I read that CURRENT law does not allow liveaboards anywhere on GA waters - only in eligible marinas. Their rationale for this new law is to allow liveaboards in designated anchorages!

We love gunkholing in Georgia, we always considered it a cruising destination. I'm waiting to see what the designated anchorages are. The places we liked to hang out would be expensive for them to patrol. I'd still pay the fees gladly for the privilege of cruising those beautiful environs. I may head down to the June 17 hearing if I can, but will definitely file a comment.

We will have no problem skipping GA with exception of Savannah. On our trip through, we did not see one sheriff, USCG, game warden, or other law enforcement vessel in the whole state except for those tied at Cumberland Island Govt dock and Kings Bay Navy Base.
When a small vessel near us got into a life threatening situation the "rescue boat" was Boat/US!
This is just another uneducated political swat at the squatter liveaboards and hit the ligit cruisers instead. Just like FL. Sanity will prevail with lots of money and effort.

psneeld said:

Are you going to check those marinas for whether their pumpouts were working on the random days you pick in 30 seconds?

Click to expand...

No, but neither will the water cops. I'd bet the really could not care less about enforcing the law about having your pumpout log.

In False Creek in Vancouver, derelict boats were a real problem. The solution is you have to obtain a permit good for two weeks, then you have to move your boat. The permit is free. This allows them to go after live aboards and derelict boats.

Derelict boats and trashed live aboards are a big problem in a lot of areas. I don't blame states and municipalities for trying to deal with it.

Ted, click on the "Current Version" here. And check out Section 1, h.

HB 201 2019-2020 Regular Session

Response to proposed rule change sent.

GFC said:

No, but neither will the water cops. I'd bet the really could not care less about enforcing the law about having your pumpout log.

Click to expand...

Maybe, maybe not. Neither one of us know what the administrative directives will be.


I tend to avoid the possibility that I might be in violation....not gamble on LE "not" doing their jobs.

caltexflanc said:

We love gunkholing in Georgia, we always considered it a cruising destination. I'm waiting to see what the designated anchorages are. The places we liked to hang out would be expensive for them to patrol. I'd still pay the fees gladly for the privilege of cruising those beautiful environs. I may head down to the June 17 hearing if I can, but will definitely file a comment.

Click to expand...

Mind putting in a good word about marine sanitation devices while you’re at it?

menzies said:

Ted, click on the "Current Version" here. And check out Section 1, h.

HB*201*2019-2020 Regular Session

Click to expand...

Ok, I read the current version and believe people are misinterpreting parts of it. If you read the section on "Terms" starting on line 27, all of these regulations are with regard to vessels and facilities within Georgia. The rule requires both the facility and the boat owner to maintain the records for a year. This clearly indicates that it only applies to pump outs within the state as the state legislature has no jurisdiction over facilities outside the state or out of state vessels being operated out of state. As far as I can see, if you don't pump out in Georgia, there's no requirement for a log.

Ted

dhays said:

Derelict boats and trashed live aboards are a big problem in a lot of areas. I don't blame states and municipalities for trying to deal with it.

Click to expand...

I did not see much of that in GA. Florida yes but Georgia? The derelict boats we saw were clearly beached from a hurricane and not being lived on at all.
Why ban anchoring when the problem supposedly is illegal waste pumpouts? Can you illegally pump out while NOT anchored? Yes. Their rulemaking is the equivalent of the nuclear option. Just blast everyone with a toilet.
Can Georgia require me to maintain a log of activities performed in another state or country? Don't think so.

Imp said:

Georgia doesn't seem to care about scaring away businesses or visitors these days. Disney has even threatened to remove all filming. I will be avoiding the Atlanta hub airport if their nonsense continues. As for the ICW, I prefer the outside, anyway, where I can avoid predatory dock fees, use autopilot & not worry about running aground.

Click to expand...

So, Disney is boycotting Georgia? Please tell us why and then we can shut er down!

angus99 said:

Mind putting in a good word about marine sanitation devices while you’re at it?

Click to expand...

If I go, sure. It makes no sense in coastal adjacent areas.

otis maximus said:

So, Disney is boycotting Georgia? Please tell us why and then we can shut er down!

Click to expand...

Has to do with Georgia's new abortion law.

Ted

O C Diver said:

Ok, I read the current version and believe people are misinterpreting parts of it. If you read the section on "Terms" starting on line 27, all of these regulations are with regard to vessels and facilities within Georgia. The rule requires both the facility and the boat owner to maintain the records for a year. This clearly indicates that it only applies to pump outs within the state as the state legislature has no jurisdiction over facilities outside the state or out of state vessels being operated out of state. As far as I can see, if you don't pump out in Georgia, there's no requirement for a log.

Ted

Click to expand...

Regard to vessels within GA. Is that registered in GA, or transiting GA?

Is it clear on out of state vessels being operated in state?

Hmmmm, how will a US GOVT documented boat be affected? Of course we will honor the regulations.
I think all of us have a sanitary tank that will allow us to 'stay' a week without the worry of a pump out.
If it is a problem, we can visit a fuel dock and use their pump out facilities.

O C Diver said:

Ok, I read the current version and believe people are misinterpreting parts of it. If you read the section on "Terms" starting on line 27, all of these regulations are with regard to vessels and facilities within Georgia. The rule requires both the facility and the boat owner to maintain the records for a year. This clearly indicates that it only applies to pump outs within the state as the state legislature has no jurisdiction over facilities outside the state or out of state vessels being operated out of state. As far as I can see, if you don't pump out in Georgia, there's no requirement for a log.

Click to expand...

What I find interesting is that from your description, it sounds as if the GA legislature assumes that all pump-out facilities are monitored by some type of employee. That certainly isn’t the case here where most of the pump-out faculties that I’m acquainted with are strictly a self-serve operation.

I agree with the intent. Georgia is not the first state attempting to curtail those who discharge overboard. The new regulation is clear that all Y devices that allow discharge overboard must be secured in GA estuarine areas. Secured can be by padlocking or removing the handle with valve (or sea cock) in closed position.

I can foresee periodic boardings to ensure compliance. This regulation applies to transients as well as residents. Not quite as draconian as some regs I have seen that mandate capping off overboard discharge hoses.

GA can only demand closed seacocks on vessels with only holding tanks as they aren't a NDZ state yet. If you have a type I or II MSD, you can pump to your heart's desire until they are approved for NDZs.


That's why I posted earlier whether the law conflicted with Federal regs.


Of course that also can be said of overly restrictive anchoring laws too.

So the ICW is 3,000 miles, only 100 of which are in Georgia. If 100 miles of unanchorable waterways is going to cause this much of a stir, you're doing it wrong.

It's kinda like Oklahoma, who wants to go there anyway?

menzies said:

Regard to vessels within GA. Is that registered in GA, or transiting GA?

Is it clear on out of state vessels being operated in state?

Click to expand...

It seems pretty clear that they can require you to comply with Georgia law regarding pump outs and record keeping within their state regardless of whether the boat is registered in Georgia or not. They may be able to require pump out record keeping of Georgia registered boats when they are out of state, I have no idea and don't care. The out of state register boat record keeping when out of Georgia is absurd.

The simple solution for Georgia is to not require the record keeping on vessels with 7 day permits or less. Clearly the problem boaters Georgia is trying to deal with in the law would be buying the long term permits (at a substantially reduced price) and staying in the same place. It would also seem that a dockage receipt within the last 5 to 7 days should be ample proof of pump out for transient boaters with a 7 day or less permit.

Ted

"Derelict boats and trashed live aboards are a big problem in a lot of areas. I don't blame states and municipalities for trying to deal with it."

So you would prefer them camping under bridges , or tenting down town ?

What you call a derelict , some will call Home Sweet Home.

dhays said:

Derelict boats and trashed live aboards are a big problem in a lot of areas. I don't blame states and municipalities for trying to deal with it.

Click to expand...

Not is GA at the moment, but this law could create the issue.

If you read the preamble in the original link it is currently illegal for liveaboards to anchor in GA. They must be in eligible marinas. So no sunken liveaboard boats.

The intent if this law is to allow anchored liveaboards - which will now cause the issue.