Bright Work Cost?

The bright work on our (new to us) boat needs some TLC. It will need to be taken down to bare wood and then varnished. There is not all that much bright work on our '98 GB52. The main areas are the transom (15'x4'), the cap rails (120') and 1" wide trim around the house (100'). I'm getting some quotes but have no basis to compare. What would be a reasonable quote?

I don’t know but have you asked in your quotes for a set number of coats and specified the product? One vender’s quote maybe be for 5 coats and another 10 coats. Not all varnishes are created equal. I’d also ask for references. Please keep us posted.

That might not sound like much to you but it is many, many hours of work. Better start saving now. Or else learn how to do it yourself. It's not rocket science.

At least 5 boating units and probably more like 10

pete

Pete Meisinger said:

At least 5 boating units and probably more like 10

pete

Click to expand...

More like $10 based on our experience with the same project on a much smaller GB....A good DIY job if you have the time as it is mostly labor.

Now I see why there's so much complaining about varnishing.
There's people that actually don't do it themselves.
Yup that would cost a bundle.

Rebecca Whitman says 8 coats minimum. Two more if your varnish is thin.
She wrote the book "Brightwork" "The Art of Finishing Wood". Generally considered the varnishing bible.

I’d be doing it myself cost of materials and tools. One of the few things I can do...but then the rest of the boat gets in the way!

Oh! And while we’re at it, who’s doing the cut polishing and waxing?

Chuckle!

Jim

In Seattle, I would expect to pay $80-110 an hour. I would consider taking the boat to Canada. The labor rate there will be closer to $50-60 US.

For our old 42, we were quoted $25k for everything. We got most of that for $13k in Sidney.

Nomad Willy said:

Now I see why there's so much complaining about varnishing.
There's people that actually don't do it themselves.
Yup that would cost a bundle.

Rebecca Whitman says 8 coats minimum. Two more if your varnish is thin.
She wrote the book "Brightwork" "The Art of Finishing Wood". Generally considered the varnishing bible.

Click to expand...

I have that book in the wheel house with me right this moment.

Do it yourself. If you have brightwork you gotta like varnishing!

I am tired of varnishing so I am working my way to painted teak. So far I love the look of it.

Varnish work is not as easy as painting latex paint folks. But depending on the condition of the wood as it relates to the grain, if the wood has been left to its own vices for a while can create double the amount of prep work before you begin to seal it.

And if you don't know how to use a hook scraper on small parts too, you can create a nightmare. And paint stripper can cause some serious damage on your painted or gelcoat surfaces.

So while your initial quote may be outlandish to someone not familiar with the going rate, hiring it out can actually end up being cheaper if this is your first rodeo, IMHO. But make sure to ask for references and then ask the boat owner was the job done in an expedited manner as weather permitted and even how long the job has held up. And ask what type of varnish was used.

There is some excellent sealers out there that can speed up the process before applying varnish. And by all means do not let anyone talk you into building up with epoxy either. And Epiphanes is twice as thick and a bit more expensive, but builds up faster in the process and holds up longer, especially in the northwest area of the country.. Make sure you get enough finish on your wood that it fills the grain.

This makes varnish last longer, as the varnish does not break down with the changes of temps and sun rays allowing the grain to crack the finish work that does not show a completely smooth surface.

I'd like to do it myself eventually but it would be nice to start of with a good baseline. The quote I'm getting here in Canada is about $7.5K US includes 10 coats of Awlwood & primer. 110 hours estimated.

I'm pretty handy but varnishing is not my forte. I refinished the teak board for the hailing port on the transom. It took me three days and the results were just barely acceptable. I had to fire myself.

I took the easy way out and moved to a boat with only about 2 sq ft of exterior wood (a frame on a hatch). That quote sounds about right in terms of time and cost/hour depending upon starting condition. On the other hand doing the math that is about $2k-$2.5k/week which is a pretty good annual wage. Just proves that you don't have to have a college education to make a decent living.

Awlwood is what I am using now. Expensive but reported to have long wear.

"I am tired of varnishing so I am working my way to painted teak. So far I love the look of it."

Folks that prefer to cruise rather than join "the coat a month" club can easily do so.

The trick is to varnish the existing bright work with a number of layers of varnish , use a paint primer and then 2 coats of your favorite brown paint.

Will look good with little effort for years , and if varnishing is the hobby of the next owner , stripping the wood to the old varnish is easy , as paint has not filled the pores of the wood.

Here in the northeast we have some very nice and industrious Jamaicans that will do (professional) quality work for $25.00 per hour and lunch now and then. You supply the material. I have been very satisfied.
Look around. Don’t be afraid to ask them for a business card if you see them working on someone else’s boat or yacht.

Mine was 30k for strip, sand, stain and awlwood finish. Seeing how many hours it took I understand why it cost so much...

tiltrider1 said:

Awlwood is what I am using now. Expensive but reported to have long wear.

Click to expand...

Wear and long life aren’t the same.
I varnished a cockpit coaming almost 20 years ago and it’s still in good condition. Just used some thinned precoats with turpentine and my usual high quality brand of high oil varnish.

Put that same varnish on the cap rail where we get aboard and it would suffer from foot scuffing and need to be recoated every year.

Most of the hard coatings are thin. But if you’re doing a wood floor you need a hard finish. But on a boat flexibility is more important than hardness. The most demanding spots are at joints like on a cap rail. When you see black at the joints (that’s typical) it means hull flexing has pulled the varnish film apart and then water enters and rot follows.

PO had the brightwork on my boat completely redone, including windows rebedded. I have the receipts and if I remember correctly it was something like $25-30K. The plus side of this is it was all in great condition when I bought the boat and have kept it up - which is much much easier than starting over.


Ken

gsholz said:

The bright work on our (new to us) boat needs some TLC. It will need to be taken down to bare wood and then varnished. There is not all that much bright work on our '98 GB52. The main areas are the transom (15'x4'), the cap rails (120') and 1" wide trim around the house (100'). I'm getting some quotes but have no basis to compare. What would be a reasonable quote?

Click to expand...

I'd say you're getting some realistic cost feedback. First and foremost, do it in a shed so when the crew shows up they can immediately get to work and not worry about the inevitable PNW rain. Last fall our Caprail (120') was stripped, SS welded rail removed (tough job) and polished, all Caprail areas recaulked and Awl wood system applied. Sidney BC and $C about 17K and around 150 hours. No DIY job can be done to this quality unless you're a skilled tradesman and with a free month or so. Looks fabulous and far better than a new boat factory job.

As with all things boating, budget to your dedicated boat throwaway $ and desires.

Scratchnsaw said:

Varnish work is not as easy as painting latex paint folks. But depending on the condition of the wood as it relates to the grain, if the wood has been left to its own vices for a while can create double the amount of prep work before you begin to seal it.

And if you don't know how to use a hook scraper on small parts too, you can create a nightmare. And paint stripper can cause some serious damage on your painted or gelcoat surfaces.

So while your initial quote may be outlandish to someone not familiar with the going rate, hiring it out can actually end up being cheaper if this is your first rodeo, IMHO. But make sure to ask for references and then ask the boat owner was the job done in an expedited manner as weather permitted and even how long the job has held up. And ask what type of varnish was used.

There is some excellent sealers out there that can speed up the process before applying varnish. And by all means do not let anyone talk you into building up with epoxy either. And Epiphanes is twice as thick and a bit more expensive, but builds up faster in the process and holds up longer, especially in the northwest area of the country.. Make sure you get enough finish on your wood that it fills the grain.

This makes varnish last longer, as the varnish does not break down with the changes of temps and sun rays allowing the grain to crack the finish work that does not show a completely smooth surface.

Click to expand...

All good and accurate advice.

I have 2 friends with new to them GB 42s. Each bought from meticulous former owners who paid to have their varnish done every year by good professionals. One has continued with the pro, the other has opted to do her own. The first won't tell me how much it costs, as the price is that high. He gets a very good job and his boat continues to look the best that I have seen.
Hers has not yet had its first full year of new ownership and she is just beginning. Over the winter a lot of holes have developed in the varnish, though last year it was perfect.
I do my own, with Epifanes. I can tell that hers is not Epifanes, nor is the first example, as the colour is different. Mine is holding up a lot better than hers, both having gone through the winter, and the only difference I know for sure is that I use Epifanes.
I spend 2 to 4 days on my varnish every year. I don't have to do every board on the boat every year, so I usually start with the holes, then do the worst board on the boat, working my way around until the reward is no longer able to justify the time spent. Some years that comes after only a couple of days, some it takes longer. My days are usually not as long as if I was paying or being paid.
If you are starting with grey, worn looking wood, initial preparation will take a while longer, as all of that grey will need to be removed and the wood sanded smooth to look like a new installation. If there are ridges in the wood, they will need to be sanded off. If that leaves the wood too small for the rail fittings, new rails will need to be fabricated, at another huge expense, so you may want to replace with Stainless.

Stuff like this is one of the reasons why we switched from our old Gulfstar to the Mainship, with zero exterior wood trim. I know that other people love teak and that's awesome, to each their own. But when I see it now, after 8 years of keeping up varnished teak in Florida on the old boat, it kind of makes me sick to my stomach. I don't miss it all, ever.

Brightwork

You didn’t mention your hand rail. Is that wood as well?
I have a GB 36 Classic. Transom, cap rail, hand rail and two eyelash trim pieces that run around the Command Bridge. Including Re bedding the hand rail stanchions, I was given a rough estimate of $10,000. I’m assuming this was an honest estimate because I know this person well and he offered to show me how best to do it myself or to have me help him to lower the cost.

$7,500 for 10 coats of Awlwood sounds very reasonable. Does that include stripping the existing varnish?
Best,
Maldwin

Cetol?

I didn't see any mentions of Cetol? Everyone I asked here in Maryland recommended the new Cetol Natural Teak. I have just started using it, but the color is almost identical to the Helmsman Spar Varnish I was using. It cost more but only require 3 coats and supposedly last at least twice as long. Anyone have any negative experiences with this before I go any further?

Thanks,
Ken

Greetings,
Welcome aboard. "Purists" will poo-poo Cetol in lieu of varnish but we've found for ease of application and renewal/repair, it is best for us. Should last well in Baltimore. Not so well in FL.

You might consider an overcoat or two of Cetol clear as well.

gsholz said:

The bright work on our (new to us) boat needs some TLC. It will need to be taken down to bare wood and then varnished. There is not all that much bright work on our '98 GB52. The main areas are the transom (15'x4'), the cap rails (120') and 1" wide trim around the house (100'). I'm getting some quotes but have no basis to compare. What would be a reasonable quote?

Click to expand...

I received several quotes on a 48 Kadey Krogen to strip down the cap rail and paint with Awlgrip product. Prices ranged from $18-20,000. Ninety percent was fro the prep work. End result, I am doing the job myself.

You sir are a boat yards dream customer!

gsholz said:

The bright work on our (new to us) boat needs some TLC. It will need to be taken down to bare wood and then varnished. There is not all that much bright work on our '98 GB52. The main areas are the transom (15'x4'), the cap rails (120') and 1" wide trim around the house (100'). I'm getting some quotes but have no basis to compare. What would be a reasonable quote?

Click to expand...

I have a 46 GB Europa with similar teak quantity...only shorter. Had it taken down to bare, sealed and the 10 coats of varnish. Cost about 12000 Canadian. I had two other estimates that were similar. Very happy with results. Avalon brightwork in Sydney. Donald
Good guy.