My new Apartment Refrigerator

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I just defrosted my Nova-Kool, RFU8000 12vt. Put everything back in its "place", turned on the fridge and could not detect any movement in the DC amp meter needle. SHRUG
I still want to add some insulating boards to the sides if the box and increase the airflow across the coils.

I should point out, I have 2 solar panels incase A/C goes out for a bit as it did in Irma. We were without dock power for maybe 1.5 days. I could have started the gen but, the temp was okay and I didn't want to attract the folks from the neighboring condos. LOL
Last time I sent my boat to the yard, they pointed out, they are not responsible for the food in the fridge. No problem. The solar panels kept the batteries charge and the fridge running as necessary.
 
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When I installed my NovaKool 5.8 cu ft fridge, I spoke to their engineer about adding insulation and improving ventilation. I was advised to cut a 4 inch hole into the cabinet toward the top and remount the condenser fan there to exhaust the heat from the cabinet. I also have a large full-width opening underneath for circulation.

I asked where's the most effective place to add insulation. He said that adding to the top is most effective but sides help, too. I added 2-3 inches of rigid Styrofoam to the top only since the sides had no space available.

I'm considering adding a Stainless Lobster Fridge Optimizer to improve the performance further and provide auto defrosting.

stainless-lobster-fridge-optimizer.png


Here's a link to an earlier discussion on this modification by TF friend, Windmist (RIP).

http://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s31/fridge-optimizer-25330.html
 
I am not sure I want the fridge to auto defrost if I am not around.
There is no drain inside the box.

It really doesn't take long to defrost, with a hair dryer. The time consuming part is removing and putting the stuff back into the fridge.
 
O C Diver said:
A little background:

I had a Norcold DE/EV 0061 7.0 cuft AC/DC refrigerator. The gasket on the freezer door didn't seal completely necessitating that I defrost it every one to two weeks. The gasket isn't sold separately, but you can buy the whole door assembly for a princely sum. I had my suspicion that it was an energy hog, but never did an extensive consumption test. This is an older unit, and I'm led to believe the newer ones have Danfoss compressors, are more efficient. Also, I felt that if there were 4 of us cruising, the size was a little small.

So I started looking at other marine / RV refrigerators. They start around $1,500 for similar size and go up from there. No information is available for how good the insulation is or real power consumption numbers such as the standard USA Energyguide. Simply, you spend a lot of money and hope the salesman / brochure aren't lying too much.

Decided it was time to start looking at alternatives. There are quite a number of apartment refrigerators that start around $350 and have the USA Energyguide, so you have some idea of how efficient they are. While doing my research, I found that some units are FROST FREE. :dance:

Going with an apartment refrigerator adds several hurdles. Most RV / marine refrigerators front surface mount and are less than 24" wide. Most apartment refrigerators are free standing and are 24" wide or greater. Almost none of the apartment refrigerators are designed to be built into a cabinet. Then there is the power supply issue. Didn't find any apartment refrigerators that used 12 volts DC. Last issue is locking doors. Apparently apartment refrigerators aren't subject to pitching and rolling. :confused: Pulling out the Norcold and replacing it with an apartment unit wasn't going to be plug and play.

You probably guessed by the title of the thread that I found one and made it work, and you would be right. Did a lot of research and made a ridiculous amount of measurements. Looked at lots of units, formulated remodeling plans, and then started all over again. Here's what I bought:

Summit Appliances FF1119B

It's a 10.0 cuft FROST FREE refrigerator with a "Most Efficient" energy rating for 2017. Now the fun starts. Put a 10 cuft refrigerator in the same place where a 7 cuft unit was. :facepalm:

Here are the only 2 pics I have that show the Norcold. Notice the drawer underneath the fridge, about worthless.

View attachment 82440

View attachment 82441

Removal was pretty easy as I'd had it out during my refit project. Too get the new one in, the drawer had to go. New rails to set the unit on had to be fabricated (cut and mounted some 2 X 4s).The trickier part was cutting 3/8"+ off the teak trim on the left side of the cabinet and peeling some laminant off the inside to make it wide enough.

View attachment 82442

View attachment 82443

In this last pic you can see the Starboard stops at the end of the rails that limit backward travel. Also, you can see the airflow path in the front. Air goes under an original wood piece in the front, up over the bottom of the cabinet, between the rails, under the refrigerator and compressor, and then up the back across the condenser. Using rails instead of a solid piece of plywood was critical for airflow and cooling.

View attachment 82444

Next part is cooling a unit that isn't designed to be built in. The manufacturer is emphatic that this unit can't be built in! I like a challenge! Above the back of the refrigerator is the seat back in the pilothouse. An air conditioner vents through a slotted board atop the back of the seat. I opened the slots up for the AC and put a divider in so I could use some of the slots to vent the refrigerator.

View attachment 82445

In the space below the slotted board, I bored a hole to mount a 4"+ fan to provide ventilation.

AC Infinity Fan

This fan is very quiet (18 dBA) and uses 1.6 watts of electricity.

View attachment 82446

End of 1st post. I need to get to bed as I'm getting underway at 7am tomorrow, moving my trawler to FL. Will try to post the second half tomorrow evening.


Ted
Click to expand...
You be wise!!
 
Thank you for this wonderful and informative post. I have a 1983 Kenmore (Sears) 12.1 cu.ft. refrigerator freezer to replace. So far I have found nothing to slip in. But, I am not giving up. I do have a height limitation which is solid.
 
Ted
First - thank you for the post and detailed info. Very nice write-up. Second - what accessories do you typically run/operate while on inverter power? We run a 42' Chris Craft (I know, not a Trawler - don't hate). Similar galley set-up, a few lights, stereo, coffee in the a.m. and that's about it. I don't have an inverter, current battery bank is insufficient for any of that, so we run the generator full time while away from the dock.

Just wondering what is dependent on your 120v system that is satisfied by the 900ah battery bank.

Thanks and travel safely.

Mike
 
"insufficient" is a variable. How many amps is your house battery bank and do you have room to expand it? Or perhaps, add a couple of solar panels?

I have an electric stove 120vt so I either use shore power or run the generator.
My 1500 watt inverter will support my microwave. I can switch the inverter over to support a couple if 120vt outlets. Via load management, you can support a number of things ie coffee pot. Just keep an eye on the house battery amp meter.
Of course, you cannot hope to support the hot water heater. LOL
 
Grey Goose said:
Ted
First - thank you for the post and detailed info. Very nice write-up. Second - what accessories do you typically run/operate while on inverter power? We run a 42' Chris Craft (I know, not a Trawler - don't hate). Similar galley set-up, a few lights, stereo, coffee in the a.m. and that's about it. I don't have an inverter, current battery bank is insufficient for any of that, so we run the generator full time while away from the dock.

Just wondering what is dependent on your 120v system that is satisfied by the 900ah battery bank.

Thanks and travel safely.

Mike
Click to expand...

Hi Mike,
Welcome to the forum!
What you run or can run is dependent on bank size and how many amps you can produce underway or through solar and wind at anchor. Normally I have rhe refrigerator, microwave, a PC, laptop charging, bow thruster battery charger, coffee maker, and a couple of other small electronic devices. Less frequently I use, crockpot, rice cooker, electric blanket, vacuum cleaner, heat gun (for heat shrink material), TV, electric drill, and a Dremel tool.

If I wanted to do some more wiring and or add another inverter, I could run the following underway because of my 220 amp alternator: washer dryer, stove, pilot house air conditioner, and water heater. Between the alternator and the inverter underway, I basically have a 3KW generator. It's really about how much effort you want to go to for that power. Recently met an infrequent TF member with a large solar array, twin engines and 1300+ AH battery bank. While underway or ar anchor in the Bahamas, they use the stove through the inverter and also make hot water with it. Lots of possibilities, depending on what you want to do.

Ted
 
Ted, curious what you draw (amps) with just the fridge, fan and inverter on. My 12v danfoss unit draws about 3.5a while running.

I’d consider going apartment size if it’s anything close to that.
 
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Screaming....bear in mind that you need to also look at cycle times, not amp draw alone. So for example, a 12v Danfoss drawing 3.5A with a 50% cycle (typical) is no worse than a 7.5A draw under a typical 25% residential fridge cycle.
 
Screaming04 said:
Ted, curious what you draw (amps) with just the fridge, fan and inverter on. My 12v danfoss unit draws about 3.5a while running.

I’d consider going apartment size if it’s anything close to that.
Click to expand...

It looks like the draw for the inverter, refrigerator, and fan is around 11 amps. As mentioned by Aquabelle cycle times are shorter. One of the features I really like about the unit is the larger compressor. When adding warm items to the refrigerator or freezer, the compressor capacity and internal fans have the ability to cool them off in a very reasonable time period. While the smaller compressors seem efficient, it takes a looong time to cool off a new load of groceries.

Ted
 
The Summitt site lists that model as drawing 1.6 amps at 115 vac, or 184 watts. That would be 15.3 amps @ 12 vdc. A Vitrifrigo 8.1 cu in marine refrigerator is listed at 65 watts or 5.4 amps @ 12 vdc. Assuming a 20 minute run time per hour for each unit @ 12 vdc the Vitrifrigo would use 43 ah, the Summitt 122 ah over 24 hours. If the Summitt ran for 15 minutes per hour it would use 92 ah. Of course, the Summitt is appreciably larger and half the purchase price, but based on the manufacturers specs it doesn't appear to be as efficient as a marine model.
 
Rkfitz said:
The Summitt site lists that model as drawing 1.6 amps at 115 vac, or 184 watts. That would be 15.3 amps @ 12 vdc. A Vitrifrigo 8.1 cu in marine refrigerator is listed at 65 watts or 5.4 amps @ 12 vdc. Assuming a 20 minute run time per hour for each unit @ 12 vdc the Vitrifrigo would use 43 ah, the Summitt 122 ah over 24 hours. If the Summitt ran for 15 minutes per hour it would use 92 ah. Of course, the Summitt is appreciably larger and half the purchase price, but based on the manufacturers specs it doesn't appear to be as efficient as a marine model.
Click to expand...

First, that's not the running amperage, that's the maximum possible amperage or even the amperage draw on the defrost cycle. Secondly, how could you possibly assume the same duty cycle or run time without comparing size, insulation, and BTU rating of the compressor? Why don't you call up Vitrifrigo and ask them for their federal Energyguide annual power consumption sheet so you can compare it to the one posted in this thread for the Summit refrigerator?

Ted
 
sunchaser said:
Not for those of us that turn off our inverters when anchored for the night.
Click to expand...

Have not read all the posts, however, onboard after the last meal of the day, we shut off the fridge after the last meal for the night and limit (No) entry. It will carry over till morning gen set startup or engine start up. While we have a 1800 Watt inverter, we just have conditioned ourselves to limited use of it.

Same here at home, when a occasional power outage occurs, we limit our opening and closing of the fridge. Contents will remain cool and freezer will hold for a good day plus. (We have a 2000 Honda standby which we employ during daylight hours when the power demand on the Honda is weak) We cycle the freezers and the fridge during the day as stated.
As our mean ambient temperature is around 45 degrees F. our solution may not fit your folks in the warmer climes.
 
Al, if I lived where it was 45* avg, I'd just roll my fridge outside!

EDIT: :facepalm: We don't have bears here.
 
motion30 said:
Although defrost? How much power does that use?
Click to expand...
The refrigerator is frost free. The power consumption of the frost free feature is included by federal law in the Energyguide label.

Ted
 
sunchaser said:
Not for those of us that turn off our inverters when anchored for the night.
Click to expand...

Aquabelle said:
Get a better inverter....mine uses 0.7A/hour in standby mode overnight.
Click to expand...

I have no idea what ours draws and don't really care but our Victron 5000 inverter charger has run 24/7 for over two years at anchor.

It continually runs the 240v 550L/19cf fridge/freezer, 2 x 120L/4.5cf bar fridge and 1 x 100L/3.5cf deep freezer.
Plus intermittent use of 40 inch TV, PC, pumps lights etc
Batteries are at 85% SOC at 6am

This time of year our 2250w of solar has our 800ah @ 24v bank at 100% by 10am
Flick on the 240v hot water system and its done by midday, most of the time with +amps coming in while running.
Genset usage is rare.

Add: some days are better.
6:30am now and batteries are at 92% with 35 amps coming in.
 
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That's the beauty of having a properly designed and operating system, Simi! You seem to have a very balanced and capable system. Unfortunately, the rest of us have to make compromises to stay within the electron budget.

Thank God we're not sailors! They're the worst when it comes to consuming electrons! I felt guilty using an electric razor one morning when aboard visiting my blowboat friend.

:hide:
 
My comment was more about my amazement that people seem resigned to put up with inadequate battery banks and inverters while seemingly not blinking an eye at buying some new marine electronics or the latest IPhone or getting endless layers of varnish done.

As a % of boat ownership (boat, berth, maintenance, insurance, fuel) a decent inverter and battery bank is pretty small, especially when taking into account the savings using domestic gear over 12v and the increased comfort/live ability levels that gear provides.
Even ours, to run all we run only cost $6k in total (batteries and inverter charger
If we had zero solar it would probably be fully charged on 2 hour of genset a day.

We never had our system designed as such, I just used online calculators for an idea of what was needed and went bigger.
It seemed to be only hundreds of dollars between a barely adequate inverter and an oversized one.
 
Yea I agree, go one step bigger.
I have 3 4D (200 amp) house batteries and a 1500 inverter. I have no room for an additional 4D. IF I put in a larger inverter, I'd drain the house batteries faster. That presents another situation. LOL
This why I stress "load management". First thing I shut off is the hot water heater when I use the oven and a couple of electric burners. That usually cures the problem.
I guess I could buy a bigger boat so I can have more house batteries and a larger inverter. That presents a number of other problems that I choose not to tackle at my age of 75.
 
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Great thread with lots of good info. We replaced our old GE fridge with a Summit CP-961 semi-frost free about a year ago, and love it. We have a 660 Ah house bank and Magnum 3500 inverter. No SOC meter, but when we go to bed the bank shows 12.4V on the panel (fridge, anchor light, 2 iPhones and a couple of head flushes overnight). When we get up, coffee is already made, we toast bagels, and microwave the Admiral’s coffee (she likes scalding coffee)...the bank still reads 12.4V. With nothing but the fridge on, the draw is 11A, and it hardly ever seems to be running.
 
sunchaser said:
Not for those of us that turn off our inverters when anchored for the night.
Click to expand...


No problem turning off the inverter at night if you freeze two Qt. plastic bottles filled 80% with very salty water (takes several days to completely freeze) and leave one in the freezer and put the other in the fridge each night.
 
Ted,
Did you ever come up with Mod 2 of the door latch?
 
Crusty Chief said:
Ted,
Did you ever come up with Mod 2 of the door latch?
Click to expand...

V 2.0 wasn't an improvement.
I've decided to take a totally out of character approach. Until the door opens underway, I'm not going to do anything. I still have V 1.0 which would suffice if I choose to head out in stupid conditions. With about 75 days underway and a maximum of 4' seas on the bow, the door without latch hasn't opened yet. I probably underestimated the strength of the magnetic door seal.

Ted
 
Bill & Stella said:
No problem turning off the inverter at night if you freeze two Qt. plastic bottles filled 80% with very salty water (takes several days to completely freeze) and leave one in the freezer and put the other in the fridge each night.
Click to expand...
That`s really a makeshift DIY eutectic solution(pun intended). Where do you freeze the bottles? Onboard?
 
Wow!

wwestman said:
The main issue with propane frigs is flame. Every RV sitting on the side of the road on fire is caused by the propane frig, or so I have been told. The whole idea of having an open flame, not monitored, gives me the shakes. Can't pull over and jump out as easily as an RV.
Click to expand...

I am sure it happens, but in all my years I have never seen one on the road on fire. Sounds like an extremely low probability event. I would bet the insurance companies don’t care.

Gordon
 
Not always a choice

Simi 60 said:
My comment was more about my amazement that people seem resigned to put up with inadequate battery banks and inverters while seemingly not blinking an eye at buying some new marine electronics or the latest IPhone or getting endless layers of varnish done.
Click to expand...

If we all had 60 foot boats, we could all carry more batteries. I would hard pressed to find room for another battery box, and have to make do with 2 8Ds for a house bank. I find my u-line ice maker is my biggest consumer. We make a tub of ice, bag it and put it in our chest freezer so I can shut off the icemaker.

Gordon
 
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