Setting a Second Anchor

Have you ever had a reason to set a second anchor and if so what was the reason and how did you set the anchor?

Setting a second anchor from a dinghy is a real chore especially when it's windy and probably those are the conditions that most folks would use a second anchor.*

And having set the second anchor, how do you retrieve it?

I usually only need a second when in a tight anchorage and the other boats are using two I let out plenty of scop on the bow anchor toss the second as far as I can then pull scope in on the bow usually works Some I set the 2nd anchor of the spring cleat

The only second anchor we've used is a stern anchor. We use a large Fortress for our stern anchor--- it resides in a mount on our swimstep. Since it's a Fortress it's relatively light so we deploy it using the dinghy. We retrieve it from the dinghy, too, unless the wind has shifted and caused it to set really hard. In these cases we carry the rode forward and cleat it off, retrieve the main anchor so the boat is now hanging on the Fortress and then break out the Fortress with the boat and retrieve it with the anchor windlass.

I have carried a second anchor of adequate size on my last three boats, since 1977. I have yet to use them at the same time, and the latest has never been wet, in 18 summers. I guess I have an adequate main anchor.

Tim, I have not had to set a second anchor. *There is a Bahamian style anchoring when in a narrow channel with tidal current. *The anchors are set at 180 degrees, so that when the tide turns the boat stays in the same place. *I have not seen it in action. *There is some fast tidal action across the shallow waters of the Bahama Banks.

I have read of setting two bow anchors about 30 degrees apart for storms. some prolems can be foreseen when the boat swings around on that rig.*

I have set a second anchor a couple of times the latest last weekend. We were in 15 to 20 kts of steady wind with a lee shore 50 yards from the boat. I paddled the dinghy with the 2nd anchor, a 23 Fortress, the entire length of the rode/chain, 200 ft at an approx 45 deg angle from the primary anchor. If you want a work out try paddling an inflatable against a 20 kt wind carrying* a rope and chain.*

I returned to the boat and pulled on the rode until the second anchor set and tied it off.*

To retrieve the second anchor I was able to pull the boat to the anchor the next morning since the wind and died.*

I guess the moral of this story is that I need to have more confidence**in my 35 lb Delta fast set primary anchor.*

The Fortress is a good second anchor because of it's portability. I carry it dis-assembled and assemble it when needed, so it fits in the swim platform box.*

Maybe this should start a second discussion concerning anchor alarms. I could not possibliy hear my chartplotter alarm located on the fly bridge while asleep in the aft cabin.*

Anybody have an anchor alarm they trust and has anyone been saved by one.*


-- Edited by timjet on Wednesday 21st of December 2011 08:08:03 PM

timjet wrote:
Anybody have an anchor alarm they trust and has anyone been saved by one.*

Click to expand...

Yes, and yes.* Our anchor alarm is my wife and she saved us from being blown ashore at 3:00am*one New Year's Day and having the boat pounded to pieces against a railroad trestle.* She is the reason we got rid of our Bruce anchor and bought one that works.

Love my Bruce.* Hasn't failed me, yet.* A*second anchor is a Fortress kept in the*stern lazarette.* Not used yet.


-- Edited by markpierce on Wednesday 21st of December 2011 08:51:55 PM

We use a Bruce w/all chain rode; usually 5 or 7:1 scope & a snubber bridle that gets it down about a foot below the waterline. The Fortress we carry for backup & as a "geez, its going to be bad" anchor has only been wet when we used it as a kedge to get off a log. As it is light, it would be handy for a stern anchor deployed by dinghy. If I used it as a second anchor, I think I'd dig out Chapman's and do some refreshing on the technique. We have a GPS mounted in the lower station that we set at night for dragging notification. I also understand that Jeff Siegel of Active Captain fame has developed an app for the iphone that will act as an anchor alarm. We've had some beeping moments that led to some bleeping conversations with the GPS unit (sorry) but the Bruce has held well so far.

timjet wrote:
*

Anybody have an anchor alarm they trust and has anyone been saved by one.*

*

Click to expand...

*Just read today that Active Captain has just had an anchor watch app approved for the I-Phone. *You could take it to your cabin. *It is supposed to have a very irratating alarm. *They are working on an app for the Droid.

Moonstruck wrote:
*Just read today that Active Captain has just had an anchor watch app approved for the I-Phone. *You could take it to your cabin. *It is supposed to have a very irratating alarm.

Click to expand...

*That would be a handy device as it would not draw down the boat's batteries.* An iPhone should go all night, I would think.* And the ability to put it right next to the berth is great.* I wonder if this app will work on an iPad?

markpierce wrote:
Love my Bruce.* Hasn't failed me, yet.

Click to expand...

*Nothing ever fails until it does

Don, I got the same e-mail. Waiting not so patiently for the adroid version.*

Active Captain has a ton of good infomation for cruisers.*

Have you ever had a reason to set a second anchor and if so what was the reason and how did you set the anchor?

Yes ,,we frequently use a Bahimian style setup in any tidal reversing area . or most frequently in the crowded NE to anchor in a mooring field.

Takes only a min or two as mostly we are in shallow (10) ft water.

After the bow anchor with its position / retreval ball is deployed , I take the stern anchor a 20H Danforth or 35 Danforth , drop it from the stern an d walk the coiled ride outside everything to the bow.

I give a good heave to start the set and toss any extra rode out to make 7-1 scope.

The line is then secured to a bow cleat. DONE.

In the AM as the tide will usually have one pointing in the same direction at 8AM as it was at 4PM , the line is simply walked aft , and the 20 or 35 retrived.

At that point the engine is started and "Away we go" with a srt bow anchor recovery.

AS the engine usually needs 2 or 3 min to stabilize , that is frequently enough time to get the bow anchor in its roller chock.

I set a second anchor when I am in a crowded anchorage and I am leaving the boat. Usually I do this*at Block Island. The anchorage is shallow in spots and there are a holes who can clip your anchor. The second is only in case that happens.

I set it with the dinghy close to the boat and drop some slack straight down to make up the scope I would need should someone trip my main anchor.

Moonstruck wrote:
*Just read today that Active Captain has just had an anchor watch app approved for the I-Phone. *You could take it to your cabin. *It is supposed to have a very irratating alarm. *They are working on an app for the Droid.

Click to expand...

*I got the same email but I'm skeptical, to say the least.* I can see how a smartphone GPS app could work in the main salon with glass on three sides of it but I simply don't see how it will work in our master stateroom where there's effectively no glass.* If its on the nightstand beside me its 4 or 5 feet from the nearest porthole.* If it has any GPS coverage at all the position error on the GPS fix will be so large as to render any anchor alarm function meaningless.* BICBW.

*



-- Edited by bobofthenorth on Thursday 22nd of December 2011 07:29:24 AM


-- Edited by bobofthenorth on Thursday 22nd of December 2011 07:29:44 AM

Moonstruck wrote:
*Just read today that Active Captain has just had an anchor watch app approved for the I-Phone. *You could take it to your cabin. *It is supposed to have a very irratating alarm.

Click to expand...

*You can also use a baby monitor set up at the helm to listen to your GPS/bridge alarms.

timjet wrote:
Maybe this should start a second discussion concerning anchor alarms. I could not possibliy hear my chartplotter alarm located on the fly bridge while asleep in the aft cabin.*

Anybody have an anchor alarm they trust and has anyone been saved by one.*

-- Edited by timjet on Wednesday 21st of December 2011 08:08:03 PM

Most chart plotters have a provision for a remote alarm.* Mine (Garmin 5208) does and I have installed one.* I did the same on my previous boat.

Have I been "saved" by it?* No.* The few times it has sounded were just because I had not set the radius large enough for the length of the rode I set.

I know of some people using a portable GPS in their sleeping area so they can hear the anchor drag alarm.

Click to expand...

*

bobofthenorth wrote:Moonstruck wrote:
*Just read today that Active Captain has just had an anchor watch app approved for the I-Phone. *You could take it to your cabin. *It is supposed to have a very irratating alarm. *They are working on an app for the Droid.

Click to expand...

*I got the same email but I'm skeptical, to say the least.* I can see how a smartphone GPS app could work in the main salon with glass on three sides of it but I simply don't see how it will work in our master stateroom where there's effectively no glass.* If its on the nightstand beside me its 4 or 5 feet from the nearest porthole.* If it has any GPS coverage at all the position error on the GPS fix will be so large as to render any anchor alarm function meaningless.* BICBW.

Radio signals should pass through fiberglass (or wood). I am assuming you're not in a metal boat.* I mounted my GPS antenna underneath the fiberglass helm.* It works just fine and gets all the sat signals full strength.

But - take your phone in there and try it.*

*

I downloaded the Active Captain alarm yesterday haven't tried it yet, they do caution that the phone must stay on for the app to be active and could wear down the batteries fast. They recommend having it plugged in to a charger while running that program overnight.
The name of the APP is "dragqueen" if you type, drag queen two words, when you search for it you will get very different hit than what you are looking for!
Steve W

I always thought the old time anchor alarm was cool.* Tie a sash weight to a length of light*line the same as your anchor*scope...drop the sash weight next to your anchor and pay out scope and alarm line.* Tie off anchor, tie anchor alarm to pin with enough slack to put pin through handle of frying pan.* Hang frying pan from handle...say in a hatch or similar spot...if the anchor drags...the pin is pulled from the frying pan and when it comes crashing down...you pi** the sheets and come on deck a flyin"... WIDE AWAKE ... *


-- Edited by psneeld on Thursday 22nd of December 2011 05:52:29 PM

psneeld wrote:
I always thought the old time anchor alarm was cool.* Tie a sash weight to a length of light*line the same as your anchor*scope...drop the sash weight next to your anchor and pay out scope and alarm line.* Tie off anchor, tie anchor alarm to pin with enough slack to put pin through handle of frying pan.* Hang frying pan from handle...say in a hatch or similar spot...if the anchor drags...the pin is pulled from the frying pan and when it comes crashing down...you pi** the sheets and come on deck a flyin"... WIDE AWAKE ... *

*

Click to expand...

*I remember that. *It was the analog system.

psneeld wrote:
I always thought the old time anchor alarm was cool.* Tie a sash weight to a length of light*line ....

Click to expand...

*I like that.* Simple, reliable, and totally independent of electricity.

bobofthenorth wrote:*I got the same email but I'm skeptical, to say the least.* I can see how a smartphone GPS app could work in the main salon with glass on three sides of it but I simply don't see how it will work in our master stateroom where there's effectively no glass.* If its on the nightstand beside me its 4 or 5 feet from the nearest porthole.* If it has any GPS coverage at all the position error on the GPS fix will be so large as to render any anchor alarm function meaningless.* BICBW.

Click to expand...

Being skeptical is good. * It's one of the reasons I made it free - it creates a pretty low threshold of pain to try it out with other backups to evaluate how well it works.

I used it pretty seriously for 2 months - every night except for 4 at marinas. *One of the things that I felt was really important was to give a continuous report of the GPS accuracy in feet (from HDOP for those into GPS technology). *In my pilothouse I get 16 feet of accuracy (iPhone 4S). *In my stateroom it shows 32-50 feet of accuracy. *Definitely less.

The iPhone 4 and 4S have a better GPS than the 3G/3GS. *I don't really consider the 3G models as acceptable. *The iPad has slightly less accuracy than the 4/4S - probably due to the larger screen/battery and interference. *It's still acceptable though.

An external GPS can be used by leaving it in the pilothouse. *That would solve a variety of issues and cause a minor powering issue for the GPS. *Additionally, the iPhone could be left in the pilothouse and remote speakers could be used in the stateroom.

DragQueen allows you to set a distance alarm and an accuracy alarm. *There's also an alarm delay (don't know why other alarms don't implement a delay). *The delay removes a great deal of false alarms without causing too much extra risk. *Most people increase the distance too much to avoid false alarms. *This gives a better real solution to the issue of GPS inaccuracy.

And yes, an Android version is coming. *It's already working on my Androids on the boat - same source code. *Then I'll be making the source free and without license so others can take and expand on it. *Programming this GPS type of thing is really quite simple. *I hope the code will entice others to create their own apps across platforms to give us all more tools.

And yes too - powering the iPhone/Android all night is a minor issue to deal with. *A future ActiveCaptain newsletter will provide some examples of what to do. *I use a New Trent product for external power and it is fantastic for overnight use. *It was one of the things I used every night while testing.





-- Edited by ActiveCaptain on Friday 23rd of December 2011 09:02:49 AM

Thanks, Jeff. *Any idea when the Droid version of Drag Queen may be ready?

I have Navionics on my Droid. *Does it work as an overlay on the chart?

I will have to be careful who hears about the apps on my Droid!

Moonstruck wrote:
Thanks, Jeff. *Any idea when the Droid version of Drag Queen may be ready?

I have Navionics on my Droid. *Does it work as an overlay on the chart?

Click to expand...

*I hope to have the Droid version out within a month - I'm swamped with other things. *It just needs to have the user-interface items adjusted for location when it starts up because of the different sized Android device displays. *The actual code works now.

There's no chart overlay. *That would be perhaps DragKing! *DQ is a simple alarm to act as a backup right next to your bed at night.

I have a Garmin networked system. I wired the depth sounder module to the key switch so I could leave the plotter on for the anchor drag feature while minimizing power consumption by leaving the depth sounder off.

I don't have (or want at this point) a "smart phone".

rwidman wrote:
I have a Garmin networked system. I wired the depth sounder module to the key switch so I could leave the plotter on for the anchor drag feature while minimizing power consumption by leaving the depth sounder off.

Click to expand...

*I would think the plotter would take more amps than the depth sounder, No?

timjet wrote:rwidman wrote:
I have a Garmin networked system. I wired the depth sounder module to the key switch so I could leave the plotter on for the anchor drag feature while minimizing power consumption by leaving the depth sounder off.

Click to expand...

*I would think the plotter would take more amps than the depth sounder, No?

Possibly, but turning off the depth finder saves power regardless.

*

ActiveCaptain wrote:Being skeptical is good. * It's one of the reasons I made it free - it creates a pretty low threshold of pain to try it out with other backups to evaluate how well it works.

Click to expand...

I used it pretty seriously for 2 months - every night except for 4 at marinas. *One of the things that I felt was really important was to give a continuous report of the GPS accuracy in feet (from HDOP for those into GPS technology). *In my pilothouse I get 16 feet of accuracy (iPhone 4S). *In my stateroom it shows 32-50 feet of accuracy. *Definitely less.

-- Edited by ActiveCaptain on Friday 23rd of December 2011 09:02:49 AM

Don't get me wrong - I certainly appreciate the effort that has gone into this and the free use is pretty generous.* Your experience with HDOP pretty well confirms what I had suspected.* I use an anchor alarm device that I don't think is available for sale yet, and it*may never be for that matter.* What I like about it is the external antenna which resolves my concern about signal attenuation in the stateroom.* Something I have noticed with it though is that there are some pretty wild position changes during the night as the satellite constellation changes.* This may be more of a concern for us northern boaters because the constellation is not usually optimised for us but I'd be interested to hear if you have seen any of that behaviour.