SeaPiper 35 Trawler New Build Photos

[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]The first SeaPiper 35 has been delivered and the company has started to update the computer renderings on their website with photos of the actual boat. I have been corresponding with the company president Ritzo Muntinga for the past year and have been very impressed with the quality of the materials and the construction process of these unique little vessels. He has given me permission to post the photo link below so that anyone who is interested can see for themselves what I mean.

Of particular note and interest to me is that every new owner(s) will be issued a complete set of customized schematics for their boat. They remind me of the schematics I used to teach B-727 ground school and cover the electrical, plumbing, fuel and heating and cooling systems. This is a very professional touch and I am sure that most of us would love to have something similar for our boats.

I am posting this information because I think the SeaPiper 35 provides a traditional small trawler offering, not seen since the Willard 30, for customers looking for such a vessel. Obviously the SeaPiper is not for everyone, but if you are looking for a small capable and extremely fuel efficient (6+ MPG) trawler, it is certainly worthy of your consideration. Spending the summers exploring the Great Lakes and then having your boat shipped to Florida on a standard tractor trailer rig for the winter has a certain appeal to me. If I were not a full time live aboard, it would be something that I would look at closely.

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I predict that’s gonna be a very rolly boat when in anything over 2’ on the beam. Just my opinion from dealing with my own rolly boat.

Kind of wonder if Seapiper is going to be a one trick pony or if they plan to expand their lineup. From their blog it looks like they have much nicer and more modern production facilities than our friends over in Gainesville.

cardude01 said:

I predict that’s gonna be a very rolly boat when in anything over 2’ on the beam. Just my opinion from dealing with my own rolly boat.

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That is a concern of mine as well because of the narrow beam. However, the hull is ballasted and it has a very low CG. That being said, the price point of the SeaPiper allows for the addition of a SeaKeeper 3 gyro stabilization system without breaking the bank.

https://www.seakeeper.com/seakeeper_products/seakeeper-3/

The first two or three boats were ordered with a GENSET, but if the boat is ordered with the optional dual 175 amp alternator package from Beta, it really makes the GENSET somewhat of a mute point. Ritzo has said that he does not think the GENSET will be that popular of an option going forward and the space could be used to fit a SeaKeeper 3, which is DC powered and can easily be run off of the engine alternator(s).

Beta 85 | Betamarine US Ltd.

SeaPiper 35 Systems Schematics

I have attached a 12 page systems schematics file for a typical SeaPiper 35. These really have to be to be seen to be fully appreciated. Whether you do most of the work on your boat yourself or have the work done for you, having an accurate systems schematic will make the job easier. A lot of time and effort was expended putting these together and the end result is very impressive.

Seem pretty thorough. Always interesting to get a good visual of the complexity of even a 35 ft boat when outfitted with full amenities.

Island Bound said:

That is a concern of mine as well because of the narrow beam. However, the hull is ballasted and it has a very low CG. That being said, the price point of the SeaPiper allows for the addition of a SeaKeeper 3 gyro stabilization system without breaking the bank.

https://www.seakeeper.com/seakeeper_products/seakeeper-3/

The first two or three boats were ordered with a GENSET, but if the boat is ordered with the optional dual 175 amp alternator package from Beta, it really makes the GENSET somewhat of a mute point. Ritzo has said that he does not think the GENSET will be that popular of an option going forward and the space could be used to fit a SeaKeeper 3, which is DC powered and can easily be run off of the engine alternator(s).

Beta 85 | Betamarine US Ltd.

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This boat would be a good candidate for the Seakeeper imo. I was recently on an open console 35’ fishing boat with that gyro and boy was it impressive. I think it’s like $40k installed however. Paravanes would be a much cheaper option obviously if they could be installed on this boat, but more of a pain to operate.

PS - I'm pretty sure the photos in the linked files are taken in Long Beach/San Pedro with the gate and Cabrillio in the background.

Island Bound said:

I have attached a 12 page systems schematics file for a typical SeaPiper 35. These really have to be to be seen to be fully appreciated. Whether you do most of the work on your boat yourself or have the work done for you, having an accurate systems schematic will make the job easier. A lot of time and effort was expended putting these together and the end result is very impressive.

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You're acting as if the schematic is something unique. It's a standard expectation on any new boat. It should be no extra time and effort as it should be developed before the boat is built.

Island Bound said:

I have attached a 12 page systems schematics file for a typical SeaPiper 35. These really have to be to be seen to be fully appreciated. Whether you do most of the work on your boat yourself or have the work done for you, having an accurate systems schematic will make the job easier. A lot of time and effort was expended putting these together and the end result is very impressive.

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That schematic is about the nicest I have seen in a boat at that pricepoint...nicely done..

cardude01 said:

This boat would be a good candidate for the Seakeeper imo. I was recently on an open console 35’ fishing boat with that gyro and boy was it impressive. I think it’s like $40k installed however. Paravanes would be a much cheaper option obviously if they could be installed on this boat, but more of a pain to operate.

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The SeaKeeper 3 lists for $27K and the money saved by passing on the GENSET would take a big bite out of that purchase price. Just speaking for myself, I think it would be worthwhile upgrade, no matter how you planned on using the boat.

Island Bound said:

The SeaKeeper 3 lists for $27K and the money saved by passing on the GENSET would take a big bite out of that purchase price. Just speaking for myself, I think it would be worthwhile upgrade, no matter how you planned on using the boat.

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That DC operated SK3 would be a good addition. I am going to bet SK sells a lot of those in the future for boats in this size range, including day trip fishermen.

BandB said:

You're acting as if the schematic is something unique. It's a standard expectation on any new boat. It should be no extra time and effort as it should be developed before the boat is built.

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Your new boat experience must be different than mine. I purchased a 2007 dealer demo Ranger R-21EC Tug in Hawaii and the systems documentation that came with it was not even remotely comparable. There was a generic owner's manual with two or three very basic system line drawings. Our 2005 Great Harbor N37 has a "Owners Manual and Tips for Operation of Systems". While helpful, it does not contain any system schematics.

What SeaPiper has done is very commendable and the key takeaway is that the system schematics will be customized for every customer. If you add a Fusion stereo, AIS transmitter or television during the build process, it will be reflected in your schematic. On the first page of the document I attached, there is circuitry for the crab haul winch which can be seen in some of the exterior photos. This schematic was as you said, developed well before construction was underway. I expect that this is the exception and not the rule for most small boat builders.

Island Bound said:

The SeaKeeper 3 lists for $27K and the money saved by passing on the GENSET would take a big bite out of that purchase price. Just speaking for myself, I think it would be worthwhile upgrade, no matter how you planned on using the boat.

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The SK rep said it was about $40k installed in that 35 Contender.

Island Bound said:

Your new boat experience must be different than mine. I purchased a 2007 dealer demo Ranger R-21EC Tug in Hawaii and the systems documentation that came with it was not even remotely comparable. There was a generic owner's manual with two or three very basic system line drawings. Our 2005 Great Harbor N37 has a "Owners Manual and Tips for Operation of Systems". While helpful, it does not contain any system schematics.

.

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Did you ask Ranger if they had such? Great Harbour doesn't surprise me. The builders I've purchased from build boats from detailed plans and schematics. Nothing goes into a boat until it's on the plans. Now, many builders do not routinely provide them but upon request can supply them. The way Seapiper is doing it is the only right way and I imagine the drawing is coming before the install of equipment.

BandB said:

Did you ask Ranger if they had such? Great Harbour doesn't surprise me. The builders I've purchased from build boats from detailed plans and schematics. Nothing goes into a boat until it's on the plans. Now, many builders do not routinely provide them but upon request can supply them. The way Seapiper is doing it is the only right way and I imagine the drawing is coming before the install of equipment.

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It was Ranger who sent me the link for the Word document owner's manual.

Island Bound said:

It was Ranger who sent me the link for the Word document owner's manual.

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That's disappointing. Now, I do know one yacht builder that furnishes schematics but your boat will be quite different as they contract the wiring and plumbing out to many different people and they don't do a very good job of following the schematics so all end up different.

I have a complete set of schematics for my North Pacific 43. Most of the time, they are accurate. However, they don’t reflect the additions and changes that were made during commissioning here in the US or changes since. However, they were very helpful just last weekend.

BandB said:

That's disappointing. Now, I do know one yacht builder that furnishes schematics but your boat will be quite different as they contract the wiring and plumbing out to many different people and they don't do a very good job of following the schematics so all end up different.

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Perhaps you'd post those from your current vessel? Not to be disturbing, but I do think the schematics posted earlier are somewhat unusual in their detail for both the cost, and the size of the vessel.

MRRiley said:

Perhaps you'd post those from your current vessel? Not to be disturbing, but I do think the schematics posted earlier are somewhat unusual in their detail for both the cost, and the size of the vessel.

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Perhaps so for the cost and size.

I do think that should be an expectation on any new build, however, even if it's not something some builders provide. It's not just a reflection of thoroughness, it's a reflection of doing things the right way. You build by detailed plans and specifications as opposed to those who build a hull and then just start putting things in as they fit and without having a real plan in advance.

This is where I also have an issue with many who build in one place and commission in another and fail to put the commissioning in the original plans. They then don't have complete detailed plans and also all the commissioning isn't part of their balancing and stability and general performance criteria. The location of generators and water makers and batteries can make a lot of difference on a small or moderate sized boat. You have a naval architect lay everything out and then at the end you start placing things without any plan from or review by him. There have even been cases of builders still playing with ballast and a boat flipping into the water at launch.

That brings an additional question. For those who get original schematics, do you update as you make changes and additions along the way. I wonder if anyone here has bought a used boat that had original plans plus changes made to them. I doubt it, unfortunately.

While not relevant to this discussion, I can attest to seeing the same signature on drawings for the USS New Jersey, BB-62 from 1950 to 1985.

Pretty amazing these days, someone working for the same employer, the Naval Shipyard, for over 35 years.

Yes it was clear the signature was the same, while the fluidity was not surprising, comprised.

So, I suppose, the efforts to maintain drawings is limited to those with nearly unlimited budgets, its a worth while exercise.

MRRiley said:

While not relevant to this discussion, I can attest to seeing the same signature on drawings for the USS New Jersey, BB-62 from 1950 to 1985.

Pretty amazing these days, someone working for the same employer, the Naval Shipyard, for over 35 years.

Yes it was clear the signature was the same, while the fluidity was not surprising, comprised.

So, I suppose, the efforts to maintain drawings is limited to those with nearly unlimited budgets, its a worth while exercise.

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If you start with good drawings, it's not nearly as difficult to maintain as some would think. After the initial build, you only really make a change here and there and typically one at a time. If you build the discipline then you pull out the drawings and decide from them what to do. You draw the change out and then you go do it. The drawing is always before, not after. For architects and engineers it's the natural and normal way to work. My background is manufacturing and it's the norm in a good manufacturing operation so I guess I don't realize that it's not the norm everywhere.

Now, it's much easier than it was 30 or 40 years ago as CAD/CAM software is readily available at a reasonable cost.

SeaKeeper Recommends the SeaKeeper 2

An internal SeaKeeper evaluation has determined (see attachment) that due to the inherent stability already built into the SeaPiper 35, the SeaKeeper 2 is the most appropriate sized gyro stabilization system for a SeaPiper 35 installation. The MSRP for this model is $22.7K, $5K less than the SeaKeeper 3. Other benefits include a 12 minute reduction in spool-up time to stabilization, 25% less weight and an overall reduction in electrical power requirements throughout the operating range.

https://www.seakeeper.com/seakeeper_products/seakeeper-2/

SeaPiper has said that the installation costs would be minimal if done during the construction process.

Completely agree. The advent of computers, CAD etc has greatly improved the ability to both maintain and update drawings. In those days it was all by hand of course. We, as kids, were amazed, that the old guy sitting in the records storage vault had been doing it for as long as he had.

BandB said:

If you start with good drawings, it's not nearly as difficult to maintain as some would think. After the initial build, you only really make a change here and there and typically one at a time. If you build the discipline then you pull out the drawings and decide from them what to do. You draw the change out and then you go do it. The drawing is always before, not after. For architects and engineers it's the natural and normal way to work. My background is manufacturing and it's the norm in a good manufacturing operation so I guess I don't realize that it's not the norm everywhere.

Now, it's much easier than it was 30 or 40 years ago as CAD/CAM software is readily available at a reasonable cost.

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For those thinking she’ll be too rolly because of the 8’ beam look at how low and not massive the house is. Everything is relative and IMO a boat w this aspect ratio (long and narrow) will be more stable than a normal rather fat trawler w a high house and a wide beam. All other things being equal a longer boat (high aspect ratio) will be more stable.

I don’t see a stability problem at all.

But the aft house on a planing hull is unacceptable. And such an odd first boat configuration. If I was offering a new boat I’d start w a tried and proven boat. Many more potential customers. It’s kinda like offering a tripple screw boat.

Do I remember correctly ... it’s an IO boat?

But three 25hp inboard 3cyl diesels fwd w the house faised a bit and fwd would at least draw me.

I know it’s obvious the aft cabin is a cute boat draw. When one says “hey look at the new Sea Piper” everyone will relate to the it’s new element.

For those w real interest in the boat my opinion is that you won’t wait long for a traditional house/cabin configuration. If they survive the aft cabin roll-out and initial offering.

By the way I think it’s odd they call the SP a 35’ boat. She’s not even 34.

"By the way I think it’s odd they call the SP a 35’ boat. She’s not even 34."

The SeaPiper website lists a 35' LOA. That probably includes the swim platform. The beam is 8 '6" and the hull might be considered by some as a semi-displacement hull because you can push it, like many trawlers, a bit beyond the waterline length speed. As far as I am concerned, it is a full displacement hull with 2600 pounds of ballast. Fully loaded it will weigh close to 20,000 lbs. With the standard 85 HP inboard Beta engine, sea trials have shown a seven knot cruise speed burning 1 GPH. With 270 gallons of onboard fuel, that will take you a long way. Setting aside a 10% reserve, that gives the boat an 1800 SM range. You could do the Great Loop on three fill-ups.

The below link explains the origin of the design concept for the boat. I applaud SeaPiper for thinking outside the box.

http://www.seapiper.com/about/

If they did a "tried and true" design I don't think anyone would consider them. If I had a choice between 2 similar boats and one was from a company with a history and lots of boats built already....and a "new comer", to me, the established company would have a big advantage. By going to a new design, they will be the only option if this design apeals to you, so they will not have to go head to head with an established boat maker. If they end up with a super loyal customer base, like C-dory, or Ranger, a traditional boat might have some traction in the market...but that will be well down the road.

Island Bound said:

"By the way I think it’s odd they call the SP a 35’ boat. She’s not even 34."

The SeaPiper website lists a 35' LOA. That probably includes the swim platform. The beam is 8 '6" and the hull might be considered by some as a semi-displacement hull because you can push it, like many trawlers, a bit beyond the waterline length speed. As far as I am concerned, it is a full displacement hull with 2600 pounds of ballast. Fully loaded it will weigh close to 20,000 lbs. With the standard 85 HP inboard Beta engine, sea trials have shown a seven knot cruise speed burning 1 GPH. With a 270 gallon fuel tank, that will take you a long way on a tank of diesel. Setting aside a 10% reserve, that gives the boat an 1800 SM range. You could do the Great Loop on three fill-ups.

The below link explains the origin of the design concept for the boat. I applaud SeaPiper for thinking outside the box.

About - SeaPiper

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I applaud thinking outside the box. I can't imagine anyone doing the Great Loop on it though. Regardless of it's measurement at 35', it's a very small 35'. In cabin space it feels more like 26'. Outdoor space is nice. It has some uses, but I don't see the Loop as being a very good one.

BandB said:

I applaud thinking outside the box. I can't imagine anyone doing the Great Loop on it though. Regardless of it's measurement at 35', it's a very small 35'. In cabin space it feels more like 26'. Outdoor space is nice. It has some uses, but I don't see the Loop as being a very good one.

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People do the Loop in all kinds of vessels. We met a couple from Canada last year doing it on a pontoon houseboat. We know and have met people doing the loop on 25' and 27' Ranger Tugs. One of the advantages of the SeaPiper from my perspective is locking. With the large center cockpit, catching a bollard on the big commercial locks found on the river systems would be a breeze. Having a SeaKeeper gyro installed would also make the transit across the Gulf of Mexico or a side trip to the Bahamas much more manageable and enjoyable for the crew. Like I said in my first post, the SeaKeeper 35 is not for everyone, but it is a very capable and sturdy little vessel that would give the owner lots of cruising options.

Island Bound said:

...One of the advantages of the SeaPiper from my perspective is locking. With the large center cockpit, catching a bollard on the big commercial locks found on the river systems would be a breeze...

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Or docking single handed anywhere, especially with the optional helm in the centre cockpit. It makes me drool thinking of how close I could bring that boat to wildlife & rocks while photographing, with more freedom than leaning out the pilothouse door like I have to do now.

As far as handling larger waves goes I think it would be about 1/2 way between a regular pilothouse flybridge trawler and a fully loaded expedition sea kayak, which is about as sea worthy as a swimming duck.