Anyone apprehensive about taking a single screw trawler to Alaska in the IP?

Hi Travelers,

Now that we're trawler owners (used to be sailboat), we might get tired of going to the San Juans and want to venture farther north... maybe way farther north after I retire in a few years. With a sailboat, you have sails for power and a small engine and maybe a kicker on top of that. The trawler has just it's trusty Lehman 120. Was wondering how many of you would or would not attempt the inside passage with a single screw.

Dave

Hi Dave,

Our previous boat (not a trawler) had a single diesel I/O. We ventured as far as the Nawhitti Bar and the Broughton Archipelago. We had no reservations about doing so.

How did we mitigate risk? Everything was maintained at 100%. 625 feet of anchor rode aboard. Careful navigation and weather awareness. Spares aboard for owner-repairable casualties. Clean, fresh fuel only and lots of filters.

Best Wishes

Richard crossed the Atlantic round trip with your same engine so I would say the engine itself is not the main concern, but more how it was maintained, how it is now and what are your skills of seamanship.

L

IRENE said:

Hi Dave,

Our previous boat (not a trawler) had a single diesel I/O. We ventured as far as the Nawhitti Bar and the Broughton Archipelago. We had no reservations about doing so.

How did we mitigate risk? Everything was maintained at 100%. 625 feet of anchor rode aboard. Careful navigation and weather awareness. Spares aboard for owner-repairable casualties. Clean, fresh fuel only and lots of filters.

Best Wishes

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Jeff, did you get a new boat??

We left Anacortes Washington in late April 2016 and 2017 heading north as far as Glacier Bay area and returned early October both years with a single engine boat.

Commercial fishermen, tug boats and ships do the passage with a single engine.

I will bet that 90% of the boats that ply the IP are single engine.

David

Done the IP and across to Prince William Sound twice with singles, one gas and one diesel. #1 reason a diesel quits running is dirty fuel, just keep your filters clean and do your maintenance preventively, not retroactively...

If thats what you have and want to do it...go for it.

My take on singles is, as long as you have the money to be towed to help, fixed at high repair and storage rates, plenty to rent a place to stay at high prices till the boat is fixed, money for the car or travel elsewhere....go for it.

If on a strict budget, tbe problems with singles without a backup engine is there is no self rescue unless you have a big dingy with extrodinary range. So where you have issues, you are now stuck with where you are.

A friend of mine who annually runs his single-engine boat to SE Alaska has a saying.....he maintains his engine and other machinery like his life depends on it. Sort of sums things up when you don't have a second engine. It's also a good mindset when you have twins.

I would much rather trust one well run and well maintained engine than to trust two seldom run engines. It really seems the less an engine is run the more problems it has...

That's my take ...

I maintain mine as well as you can....15,000 miles before it standed me with a broken dampner plate

As I said, any one can fail at any time beyond the abilities or parts carried onboard.

Therefore, as long as the inconvenience of breaking down where you dont want to be and the costs involved dont bother you, no big deal.

Been doing it since 1986, no problems. The log infested waters of BC have taken their toll on many twins.

djmarchand said:

I will bet that 90% of the boats that ply the IP are single engine.

David

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A walk down the docks in Ketchikan or Juneau would show differently, maybe 30% tops for pleasure vessels venturing up from the lower 48. BTW, the AK waters are quite free of the logs in comparison to BC where active shore side logging is occurring big time.

But sure, a single engine vessel can make it quite fine to AK. I hear several did it in 2008.

Single Engine trips -- worried about only one engine ?

I have run single engine trawlers for 35 plus years.
I currently have a single engine Kadey-Krogen 42. ( - BTW -Great Boat.)

I maintain the single engine pro-actively & with the knowledge that it is my only engine. So no skimping. No putting anything off. Keep fuel clean. Carry plenty of filters, Have a filter vacuum gauge at the helm station, etc.

I also Carry good comprehensive spares package & tool kit for those things that I can repair.

That said. **** happens.

So I also have a great Heavy Duty outboard motor mounting bracket that is removable & stores easily in the lazzarette that is a special made O/B motor mount & it mounts nicely on the back of the swim step - right in the middle directly opposite the rear bulwark rear door to hold an out board motor.

This gives you / me a outboard motor or kicker of your size choice that you can use as a get home engine (& also use for your dinghy too if you want) as a great back up get home power plant that works great & does not break the bank.

I have never had to use it in duress, , but I have used it as a pro-active practice way to get home just to be sure it works as described with this back up motor, just to test it out for myself & it brought the boat back to home port from the Channel Islands National Island Park here in So-Cal back to my home harbor & it worked like a charm.

However, NOTE: I did not do any docking with it as it is not very maneuverable in tight quarters & shifting is not the easiest to do as must climb out on swim step to shift it, etc.
So if your really concerned, this is a perfect way to ease your mind & give you a good tested back up motor that works.

So I can personally recommend this as an alternative.

Good luck.

Alfa Mike

Many of our members have made ocean crossing with singles, I don’t want to names them as that is up to them but they are all boaters today so they made it probably with a few stories. You may wish to talk to them to get some ideas of do’s and dont’s Plus spares and tools.

I’ve always been a twin engine guy as I go far into the Bahamas but I have never lost an engine but did lose a generator because of not having a part on board (didn’t stop the trip but lost the comfort of AC.

I’ve not been to AK but I have been to Prince Rupert twice and also been back and forth across Hecate Strait, which is a bigger deal, IMO. You should have no reservations with a properly maintained Lehman.

Jim

I suggest you read Alaska Blues by Joe Upton, a highly readable account by a fisherman who makes the roundtrip each year in an old wooden boat no bigger than yours.

He does this in company with another boat, something you might want to consider. (I'm leaving about May 15th.)
...and, yes, I have done it before.

Dave_E said:

Hi Travelers,

Was wondering how many of you would or would not attempt the inside passage with a single screw.

Dave

Click to expand...

Dave


A far bigger set of issues than single vs twin for successfully transiting to and from AK involve:

• Preparedness of skipper and crew
• Maintenance and repair capability of crew
• Electrical system performance
• Clean fuel tanks
• Weather, tides and current understanding
• Charting equipment and navigation skills
• Radar familiarity and system capability
• Depth sounder backup
• Anchor(s) and windlass operation and pre-trip maintenance
• Potable water storage
• Fuel gauges and or sight tubes calibrated.
• Scads of spare parts, oil and filters

Fun discussions (especially for us TF old-timers) can be had on single vs twin discussions. However, there are IMHO far more critical things to concern a skipper for what could be a 3000 nm round trip with little cell phone coverage, no Boat Tow companies, and normally inclement weather.

Might I suggest this link for your perusal?

http://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s28/pairadice-asd-alaska-adventure-2017-a-31525.html

One of us is single with no get home, the other twins. And yet neither were immune to material failures other than engine’s.

Cheers

AlfaMike: How big was the ouboard that you used ? Did you use it on KK42 ? what kind of speed did it provide ?

I'd like to hear from the twin engine proponents. How many of you have needed the mechanical security of twins? That is, how many of you have had to 'get home' on one engine due to mechanical failure of the other engine or transmission?

Not belts and hoses. Not fuel problems. Not prop, shaft or rudder damage due to striking something. I'm interested solely in breakdowns due to mechanical problems.

And would the break downs have been repairable at sea? Provided you had the spares, tools and skills.

Many have made the point that maintenance, preparation and seamanship are more important than the number of engines. I agree with that but I want to hear from those who got home because they had more than one engine.

I lost my engine twice with my sail boat. The first time was a fuel clog and I solved it in an hour. Was sure nice having the sails up during that time as I was just out side the shipping lanes. Second time I got a heavy duty nylon strap bag wrapped around the prop. Got towed in that time.

With the power boat I had the fresh water cooling pump seize half way between LA and Santa Barbara. I limped it to port on one engine. To be fair, I had just acquired the boat and I fully expected something to break on that trip.

I don’t have an issue with single screw boats. Because of the age of my boat I will be caring a spare alternator, starter, freshwater cooling pump, raw water pump, dampener plate as well as hoses belts and fluids.

Still, something else will bite me but I always make it home in the end.

Anyone afraid to venture on a single-engine boat dare not fly on a single-engine plane. Having done both, I'm more comforted on the boat.

tiltrider1 said:

I lost my engine twice with my sail boat. ...

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Don't sailboaters tend to neglect their engines (iron jibs)?

Portage_Bay said:

I'd like to hear from the twin engine proponents. How many of you have needed the mechanical security of twins?

Click to expand...

Twice in two different vessels I've been grateful for twins due to unusual at sea breakdowns. On a more relevant note though, the most successful blue water recreational cruisers in terms of sales are Nordhavns. On the single main engine versions, a sizeable get home is provided.

A few other musings - No doubt that diesels made today are more prone to a failure due to emissions based sea water after coolers and engine electronics. I'd much rather have a mechanical and no after cooler well tended diesel than its 2018 mandated version. A twin install or get home engine largely provides "insurance" for these required additional sins of today.

As a guy (like several here) who has spent his boating career in Alaskan waters, there are allot of things to be aprehensive about, but the number of engines isn’t one of them.

Yes, your engine could go out, but there are a zillion other things on your boat that are much more likely to fail than your engine. Things that will flat ruin your trip.

Are you prepared to deal with “issues” yourself? Do you have the skills and the tools to fix things?

My opinion is to spare parts up as best you can, have the tools you need to fix anything, and enjoy.

Alaska is not as isolated as it used to be. Most communitits have regular FEDEX service, and Air cargo as well. All communities have USPS service.

The big difference between Alaska and the lower 48 is communications. Cell service is great near most commnities, but get any distance away and you’ll very possible not have cellular coverage. I know they are expensive but I really like Satellite communications. It sure gives a bit of peace of mind to be able to make a phone call.

Traveling parts or all of the Inside Passage every summer from 1993 through 2015, our small boats always had a single main engine and a kicker. The kicker saved us from crashing on the rocks or needing a tow several times, but most of them were due to vulnerabilities of the outboard or sterndrive setup of our boats. Prop damage, spun hub, kelp wrapped around the lower unit blocking water intake and causing overheat, etc.

Over 6,500 hours our sterndrive diesel also had belt (and one tensioner) failures. On each of the few belt failures (mostly only partial, creating noise I could notice) I was able to replace the belt while safely floating along, but if we had been close enough to the rocks we might not have been OK without the kicker. I checked the belts every spring before setting off for the north, but some failed anyway. More frequent checks or a more proactive belt replacement program might have avoided some of these.

Two 800-hour BC/Alaska summers now in our NT37, with a well maintained and very lightly stressed Cummins, single keel-protected prop and rudder, and no kicker. Many of the problems we had in our small boats would not happen in this one. And we do have a substantial dinghy.

So far so good, but I'm so accustomed to having backup propulsion that it makes me a little nervous. Low odds, but I can imagine some sort of failure in bouncy enough conditions that I would not be able to lower the dinghy from the cabin top, and would need a tow - possibly in a fairly remote location. I would hope not to be too near the rocks while waiting for the tow.

A friend experienced a transmission failure in their NT32, in bouncy conditions on Clarence Strait last summer. The Coast Guard came quickly, and they and another boat stood by in case they were needed. The NT32 was towing a sizable tender, and with some difficulty they managed to hook it up and tow the NT32 into port. They'd had other failures over the years in sterndrive boats, but were always able to find a tow quickly enough that they were safe (twice we were the tow).

Given all that, I'm considering adding an auxiliary outboard mounted to the swim step. Hate to do it - clutter.

I agree with Crusty.

Twins or singles don't matter. You Will break down at some point. It's part of cruising. This year the windlass god paid Pairadice and ASD a visit! The only difference is I can get there faster than Pairadice but burn more fuel.