Inside Helm: Needed or Not? & Entry Door Beside Inside Helm:. Needed or Not?

Ahoy Y'all. Still trawler shopping for something in the 40'-44' range.

Question # 1: I've been pretty sure that one feature I definitely want is an inside helm. But I've seen a bunch of boats that were gorgeous, that we would have bought in a minute, except that they had no inside helm.

I would really value your opinions on how important (or unimportant), you have found it to have an inside helm.

Question # 2:. Of the boats we've found that had an inside helm, some had an entry door right next to the helm station. Others did not. Any thoughts about how important that side entrance is? Any thoughts on how hard it is to cut in a door if there isn't one there?

Please let me know what you think. All your comments about various brands of engines that you sent in reply to my previous post were a HUGE help!

An inside helm is pretty nice in rainy or cold weather.

I doubt you could cut a door where there isn't one. If you want a door, buy a boat with a door.

By inside helm, I assume you mean a downstairs helm. I think the answer lies in where you boat, how protected the flybridge/upstairs helm is and your own preferences/how you expect to use the boat. My brother has a Mainship 40, we live in a sub tropical climate and he never uses the downstairs helm. We chartered a trawler in the Chesapeake in late October and we were upstairs/outside as much as possible but there were time when the weather meant we drove from the downstairs helm.

Regarding an entry door righ next to the helm, I think it is handy but not an absolute necessity. However this again will be personal preference and dependency could be are you handling the boat by your self often. If this is a necessity I would opt for a boat that already had one, rather than modifying a boat to have one.

Don't sell yourself short. Boat's are too expensive to compromise on something that you feel is important to you. And they are not like houses where its location, location, location.

If it is for you then it won't go past you. Be patient, your boat will come along.

Running from below when it is raining or cold is a pleasure. I prefer to run from the flybridge due to all around visibility. But every time I have been forced below by weather I also say to the missus, "that was a really quiet and comfortable run, why don't we run from below more often?"

Her reply "you say that every time you run from below!"

And yes, having the door there is very useful.

I had the same question for my broker 25 years ago. His advice--inside helm yes, door no. He said the doors can leak and take up wall space that might be better used. I took his advice and learned that wall space is tight on a boat, even one over 40' (we put a tall trash can where the door would otherwise be, hidden from view by the helm bench.) As for leaks, I have no experience since I have no door but can say that driving from on top is much preferable to driving from inside, when we were younger," "tougher" even in the rain and wind. But more recently, being less "tough" we enclosed the flybridge making for an all weather helm area (and have said to ourselves many times "why did we wait so long to enclose this thing.)

I've been tossed around up on the flybridge in some nasty waves. When it's gets to rough I go to the downstairs helm. Having a downstairs helm is definitely a plus. I also have a helm door and love that too.
"ALEKA" 43 Albin trawler Portsmouth NH

captnscott said:

I've been tossed around up on the flybridge in some nasty waves. When it's gets to rough I go to the downstairs helm. Having a downstairs helm is definitely a plus. I also have a helm door and love that too. "ALEKA" 43 Albin trawler Portsmouth NH

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Agree. Flybridge is not a fun place to be during rough weather.
I consider a door mandatory. Easy to step out to set or retrieve anchor, quicker trip out to handle lines, nice breeze when you head for lower helm to get out of the sun, better visibility out stbd side, but they are more maintenance.

I had a 46’ trawler that both helm stations. We currently have a 41’ trawler that only has the flybridge helm. I bought it because I didn’t want to give up the room in the salon. We just put a hardtop on the flybridge so weather isn’t really an issue. It is striclty personal preference. I would buy a boat that is in better condition rather one that has or does not have a lower helm.

I normally run from the raised pilothouse, and really like that design. Visibility is good, doors both sides to access the Portuguese Bridge, which is also a feature I love. When in the river I briefly pop out both doors to check behind before turning. My nav set-up is better there too - 24" monitor, usually split screen with nav on one side and radar on the other.

My flybridge has a hardtop, so has good sun protection. I dislike plastic clears so it is open. The downside is that a lot of the time the wind strength or windchill can make it much less desirable than the pilothouse.

Look at as many different styles of boats as you can. If possible charter the one you like before buying. Boats are easy to buy but can take a really long time to sell, so its worth taking time and spending a few $$ before making the big commitment.

Wifey B: Would not purchase a cruising boat of any sort without an inside helm. I don't want to be limited. Neither snow nor rain nor heat nor gloom of night shall stay me from the swift completion of my appointed rounds.

The door. Strong strong desire to have it. However, many boats have controls now on the side deck, aft deck, portable, wherever, and that does make it more feasible to deal with no door.

We have both and in the three years or so that we have owned Malagari I could count on one hand the number of times I have driven from up top, The reality for us is the dog - too much trouble getting her up top so my wife and the dog stay down, with me in solitary splendour on the flybridge. Some might think of this as nirvana - I find its lonely.

As for the door - its just so handy being able to duck out and attend to the anchor - we have it down to a great routine - the door allows me to exit to the right from the wheel and go forward as my wife slides in from the left and takes over the helm. Coming alongside on the stbd side means I can help with the lines too. I can on port as well of course but it takes a smidge longer to get to them.

Inside Helm: Needed or Not? & Entry Door Beside Inside Helm:. Needed or Not?

I would say depends where you and how do you plan to use your boat. If you are to roam around a Carribean island well don’t think you will use lower helm much. If you plan to cruisein Alaska well better to have one. I am using my boat only from may to october in Canada and don’t use lower helm much. In fact I used it twice in 2 years, but each time I was very happy to have one instead of taking a shower in the cold rain or being forced to be out in an early morning during a cold autumn day.

And you could reverse the question, do I need a flybridge, my answer would be the same.

L

I only have an inside helm, I have two doors, I don’t have leaks because I have a 2’ covered walkway all the way around, in the summer when making fishing trips I have shorts and long sleeves on, cuz it’s cold up there.

I removed the lower steering station on a MK 1 Mainship 34 because there was no side door. Lower helm on it was useless. I now have a lower station with a side door. Seldom use it but it is functional and I can see its usefulness. Bridge steering is the preferred method, vision and all that. I could bail from the bridge about as fast as to deal with lines as from the lower helm.

You are in Fort Pierce, as am I. My canvas plan and the mild climate + the fact I do not, as a general rule, travel in nasty weather. I would not hesitate to have a boat with only bridge steering. The only functionally I can see is if you are going to do the great loop or spend a lot of time up north, and even then with a good canvas plan, pick your days and some woolies you should be OK.

I also wanted a lower helm with a FB and a helm door. With my wide side decks and stbd door, it's very simple to single hand my boat. It also helps in the fog and night runs to open the door for better listening and visibility. I would have been disappointed if I had accepted a boat without the lower helm and door.

I also appreciate the extra air circulation and enhanced traffic flow with my 3 doors open at anchor.

Lower helm

When we first purchased our boat I always ran I from the upper helm. The prime reason being visibility particularly for close quarters manoeuvring. Overtime though I find myself using the lower helm more. It’s out of the weather, wind and rain but also including the bright sun even though we have a Bimini.
The lower helm with a side door is much more convenient for docking singlehanded and for anchoring. Just my preferences.

My flybridge is canvas enclosed, it’s heated and I have heated seats. I never use the lower helm any more. Now before the enclosure and heated seats I was down below 20% of the time in the summer months and 100% of the time in winter months.

Where you go boating is a big factor, boats in use often reflect whether the area is warm enough for no lower helm. If I had to choose only one, I`d go lower helm, but having both is nice.
Definitely look for a helm door. I stand outside the cabin and reach in when reverse docking to operate the gears and line up with the dock finger. Plus you can help with docklines. Retrofit is not a good idea, unless you are desperately in love with a boat which has everything but that.

No upper helm
No side doors.
Never think about either.
We go out on the outside deck through the aft cabin door. Never has the lack of either feature been noticed or been a problem.

There’s a bunch of features I could do without on my car w/o missing them. There’s a lot of stuff not needed on most boats so I think you should buy the boat you want. That’s what it’s about .. the boat. Go for it.

tiltrider1 said:

My flybridge is canvas enclosed, it’s heated and I have heated seats. I never use the lower helm any more. Now before the enclosure and heated seats I was down below 20% of the time in the summer months and 100% of the time in winter months.

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Heated seats? You win! I would use heated seats just to watch the sunset in the winter from the flybridge!

A lower helm is great when it is too rough, cold, hot, wet, windy, or sunny up above. You may get a bit lonely when everyone deserts you and goes down where its more comfortable.

A side door would be nice if you often operate singlehanded. You can get by without it, but its a little more challenging.

Inside Helm: Needed or Not? & Entry Door Beside Inside Helm:. Needed or Not?

Know the difference between lower helm and pilot house. Some lower helm configs are good for only driving in emergencies, during single hand docking, or while you are getting caught in a quick shower. Lots of the 80’s Taiwanese vintage boats are like that. It is just a steering station with gauges. Moreover, some can have pretty limited visibility. A pilot house is a full on pilot station. Keep in mind that all lower helms make for a LOT of extra wires to follow and twice the stuff to break and more electronics to buy. But generally speaking, lower helms and pilothouses can be handy.

Doors are hit or miss. Some have them, other do not. Our pilothouse doesn’t and I wish it did. Our old boat had a door, but a crappy little station below. Now we have a full pilothouse and no door, so I will always dock, and almost always drive, from above. That is just how we roll. It isn’t but a few steps down to get to the aft cockpit anyway, so while Bess is handling lines on the bow, I can toss a stern line easily enough.

So of you think it is important, stick to your guns, but make sure you stand there for a few minutes when you are doing a walkthru to get a feel for what the reality of driving from there will be like.

Lots of good answers here, lots of good reasons...

Weather is big, and whether you have to single hand your boat is also big. If so the helm door is almost necessary, so what if it leaks a little Your ability to go forward to anchor or step out on the dock are greatly enhanced. For me, the lower windage of a boat with no fly bridge is a plus, as is a lower center of gravity.

For me also, I wanted to be able to stand up and walk out onto the back deck from the helm, so aft cabin vessels were out! Decide what is important to you, and do your best to hold out to get it! Buyers remorse isn't a condition a boat owner wants to suffer from...

SoWhat said:

Agree. Flybridge is not a fun place to be during rough weather.
I consider a door mandatory. Easy to step out to set or retrieve anchor, quicker trip out to handle lines, nice breeze when you head for lower helm to get out of the sun, better visibility out stbd side, but they are more maintenance.

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My last boat had a flybridge helm (eisenglas enclosed) but no lower helm (the cockpit controls don't count since there was virtually no visibility forward). Weather never bothered me (the eisenglass kept me dry and I dressed accordingly), but at night the two guys on watch were typicially the only guys up there.

In spec'ing my current boat, I seriously considered omitting the lower helm (the boat has a Portuguese bridge with wing stations, after all), but in the end went with a pilothouse helm and flybridge helm, but no eisenglas on the flybridge. I intended to be at the lower helm whenever weather was a factor. As it turns out, 90% of the driving is done from the lower helm. And more than half of the other 10% is done from the tower -- if the weather is nice, there is no better place to be as the view and entire experience up there is truly magical. I wouldn't have it any other way for an offshore cruising boat that gets a lot of night time use.

Our boat has two helms and I've only driven from the lower helm a handful of times in 7 + years we've owned it. Those few times (weather related) it was great to have and if you think you want it, don't buy a boat without it. You will end up selling it in a couple of years and buying one with dual helms.


If the boat you like doesn't have a side door, don't modify the boat to add one. We looked at one that had been modified and it was very obvious it had leaked for a long time.


I think a side door would be more important if you single handed your boat. Not so important if you have your wife/sig other along to help.

Brisyboy said:

The reality for us is the dog - too much trouble getting her up top so my wife and the dog stay down, with me in solitary splendour on the flybridge. Some might think of this as nirvana - I find its lonely.

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And I thought it was just us on our Ablin 35 Flybridge Sportfish with no lower station. The dog hated the bridge so my wife and the dog stayed below.

In the tug they sit behind me in the pilot house seat where both of them know exactly where I am at all times.

Lower, enclosed helm is a must as well as side door adjacent to helm for instant, direct deck access. (Have both port and starboard pilothouse doors.) This was one of my "must haves" for reasons already described.

You could probably live with a flybridge-only helm in a warm climate. In the PNW, to me that would be a dealbreaker. Nice and warm at the lower helm in bad weather, with less roll. A side door is handy, but not possible on sportfish designs like mine, and I don't really miss it.

I single hand my boat almost always and use the lower helm and side door next to it when getting on and off the dock. I prefer running from the fly bridge and when safe transit to or from the lower helm.

To me - having inside helm is a must. If you single then docking from upper station can be difficult as you have to jump quick to deck and cast a line. Side door next to helm help with docking too. As former truck driver, I always back up using side mirrors, so I installed mirror on rail and can back up from lower station.