Transatlantic cross in single thread Trawler

Was just looking online at some Selene trawlers in 40-50' range that have a 2500 mm range and are advertised as Transatlantic capable. But most of the ones I see are single screw.

There's no way in hell I'd go out into the middle of the ocean with a single engine! I'd be scared to even try with twin diesels.

I'm just wondering what the consensus is on that. Would you have to be a master mechanic with every imaginable spare part to even consider that? Or do people do this all the time?

Welcome to the forum.

People do it all the time in well maintained Nordhavns and Selene's. To Bermuda, then the Azores, then Europe.

Others take the Northern route, NE, Greenland, Iceland, Ireland/Scotland.

Most of these models have "get home" secondaries.

If I wanted to cross an ocean in anything less than about, oh say 500' or so it would have to have sails !
We have a 40ish foot Trawler that has a single engine and we like to think that if Europe is in the works, it will get there on a proper ship!
Having said that his, I've done 5 Newport to Bermuda races on 38' to 46' sailboats and I've been comfortable for the most part.
Always have a plan B
Bruce

Bigslick75093 said:

Was just looking online at some Selene trawlers in 40-50' range that have a 2500 mm range and are advertised as Transatlantic capable. But most of the ones I see are single screw.

There's no way in hell I'd go out into the middle of the ocean with a single engine! I'd be scared to even try with twin diesels.

I'm just wondering what the consensus is on that. Would you have to be a master mechanic with every imaginable spare part to even consider that? Or do people do this all the time?

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You may want to reach out to our friend Richard on Dauntless

L.

It's weird...even with twin screws, I only ever get nervous with engine issues when coming into the marina as I'm afraid to hit something Out in the middle of the ocean, I'm not sure it would bother me even on a single screw.

I'd have several spares for cooling pumps, fluids for several oil and coolant changes above and beyond what you would need for the trip, a plethora of fluids filters, air filters, a couple lift pumps or rebuild kits for said pumps, and a dozen or more feet of water line so you could reroute raw water cooling thru the engine if the engines cooling system fails. Maybe a spare section of exhaust hose or several rolls of duct tape to repair a burst exhaust run.

For me, the marine cooling stuff would give me worries more so then the engine itself. So keep whatever spares you think would allow you to keep it cool if something fails, with the emergency option of running thru raw sea water thru the block until you reached land.

To be honest, if you are thinking of a Selene in the 50 foot range AND plan to cross an ocean...a single engine repower should be a drop in the refit bucket. leave on your trip with a newly broken in engine and leave a lot of your worry on shore

My 2 cents, remember what you paid for them :lol:

There is a video on youtube about a group of Nordhavn owners doing the first route Menzies said. I believe the smallest Nordy was a 48 footer. All of them came through with flying colors!


Cheers.


H.

Reading posts 1 & 3 illustrates that more than anything, after establishing ocean crossing capability, it comes down to an alternative/back up form of propulsion, be it a get home auxiliary or sails. Or if a sailboat is the choice, a good motor.
Personally, I favour something with twins, about 900ft long and 90000 tonnes.

Aren't most merchant ships single engine?

Jeff F said:

Aren't most merchant ships single engine?

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What abut fishing boat (trawlers )?

L.

Jeff F said:

Aren't most merchant ships single engine?

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I was on a 660' gas tanker. Steam plant one screw. Spare 12" shaft on board hanging from the ER ceiling!

Well, I can say that there's an augment to know the "risk vs benefit" with any cursing venture. If it's a boat, plane, RV of just a car.

For the most part, single engine stuff statistically does pretty well, IF maintained well and has equipment that can get the job done.

My background is aviation and I've been thru the single vs. twin debate forever, and not a heck of a lot different with boats.

For me... I'm not crossing an ocean in a single or twin plane or boat... no matter what. Just not my thing. Not a safety thing.... just too boring.

Seevee said:

Well, I can say that there's an augment to know the "risk vs benefit" with any cursing venture. If it's a boat, plane, RV of just a car.

For the most part, single engine stuff statistically does pretty well, IF maintained well and has equipment that can get the job done.

My background is aviation and I've been thru the single vs. twin debate forever, and not a heck of a lot different with boats.

For me... I'm not crossing an ocean in a single or twin plane or boat... no matter what. Just not my thing. Not a safety thing.... just too boring.

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Was that bolded intentional???

Over the past 6 years,acquaintances Mark & Jennifer Ullman have put over 40,000 miles on their Nordhavn 46. Two transatlantics, recently 21+ days from Galapagos to Marquesas. Single engine...

Ski in NC said:

Was that bolded intentional???:roll eyes:

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got me.....

There are also plenty of single engine vessels that got into serious trouble or were lost when their power plant failed at inopportune moments.

Bigslick75093 said:

Was just looking online at some Selene trawlers in 40-50' range that have a 2500 mm range and are advertised as Transatlantic capable. But most of the ones I see are single screw.

There's no way in hell I'd go out into the middle of the ocean with a single engine! I'd be scared to even try with twin diesels.

I'm just wondering what the consensus is on that. Would you have to be a master mechanic with every imaginable spare part to even consider that? Or do people do this all the time?

Click to expand...

As you can see from the posts, there is no consensus.

It mostly depends on whether the person wants to do an ocean crossing or not, and how they weigh up the risks.

Given the opportunity, I'd love to do it in a boat I trusted. Single or twins, it wouldn't matter, as long as I knew the history of the engine(s).
Some sort of stabilization would be nice, though. Either sails, paravanes, or active fins.

Some suggested they would get too bored.
I'd get bored doing a crossing on a cruise ship, but never on a 40 foot boat when my life dependant on keeping things running sweet.

ssobol said:

There are also plenty of single engine vessels that got into serious trouble or were lost when their power plant failed at inopportune moments.

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You mean small boats in the middle of the ocean?

hfoster said:

There is a video on youtube about a group of Nordhavn owners doing the first route Menzies said. I believe the smallest Nordy was a 48 footer. All of them came through with flying colors!


Cheers.


H.

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I believe the 2004 Atlantic Rally included a 40 foot Nordhavn.

This thread made me think. I am aware of a good number of single engine sub 50 footers that have crossed an ocean. I am sure that it has been done by a twin engine boat. I think a Grand Banks went to Hawaii having removed one prop. Anyone know of twin engine ocean crossings in the sub 50 foot category?

Bay Pelican said:

This thread made me think. I am aware of a good number of single engine sub 50 footers that have crossed an ocean. I am sure that it has been done by a twin engine boat. I think a Grand Banks went to Hawaii having removed one prop. Anyone know of twin engine ocean crossings in the sub 50 foot category?

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Probably not, because generally they do not have the range to make a ocean crossing.

If we look at specific models there are actually very few production boats with twin engines in the sub 50' size that have the endurance.

Hatteras 48 LRC comes to mind, but even there I'm iffy on that boats capability for a pacific crossing.

AusCan said:

As you can see from the posts, there is no
Some suggested they would get too bored.
I'd get bored doing a crossing on a cruise ship, but never on a 40 foot boat when my life dependant on keeping things running sweet.

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Think about what you are saying.

If you would NOT get bored, you and/or your boat are not ready to cross an ocean.

Because the first rule is having the boat ready and prepared.

Therefore my main preparation is to make sure i have enough books to read, games to play and videos to watch.

Stress will kill you faster than the ocean.

I have seen a Selene 47 (est 2000 model) from Venezuela in Barcelona, presumably there on its own bottom. Selene 47 carries 900 gallons, range about 3,000nm.
I have also seen at least one krogen 42 (??) and a Nordhavn 46 docked in London, also presumably sailed there from USA and Canada.
And, of course there is always the example of Richard on Dauntless (Krogen 42) who has pretty much traversed the globe at this point!! We had the fun of watching him traverse the Panama Miraflores Lock earlier this year.
So, I think it is a practical proposition to cross oceans on 42-47ft single screw vessels (preferably with a secondary back-up wing engine) provided the owner preps the vessel properly, carries adequate spares (and knows the vessel well enough to use them), installs window covers (lexan), and plans weather windows and route carefully.
But it is a long way, at 7kt!! You need a large enough crew to manage the continuous 4-6hr watches 24x7 for 2-3 weeks, depending on route. In my mind, that equates to a minimum of 4 crew, who get on really well!!

ksanders said:

Probably not, because generally they do not have the range to make a ocean crossing.

If we look at specific models there are actually very few production boats with twin engines in the sub 50' size that have the endurance.

Hatteras 48 LRC comes to mind, but even there I'm iffy on that boats capability for a pacific crossing.

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Exactly.
I didn't end up with a Kadey Krogen because I liked the marketing.

I knew nothing when i started my boat education.
Had the data led me to a twin engine, I'd have a twin engine.
As a matter of physics, it's impossible to have two engines that are as efficient as one, at any given horsepower.

In the early days I did look at the Hatteras LRC. But besides the engine issue, it was never clear to me how efficient their hull was. I pegged its range at 2500nm, which is not enough in my mind.

After the fact, arriving in Castletownbere, Ireland, i was struck by how many fishing boats there were that had the exact same lines as the KK42.
From the bow rise, the height of the pilot house roof to the slight stern rise.

In all my travels, travails and follies, I've never had green water come over any part of the cap rail.

The storm windows i installed, 1/2" Lexan, have never been tested. I only left therm in place because they provide great insulation in cold or hot weather.

Wxx3 said:

Exactly.
I didn't end up with a Kadey Krogen because I liked the marketing.

I knew nothing when i started my boat education.
Had the data led me to a twin engine, I'd have a twin engine.
As a matter of physics, it's impossible to have two engines that are as efficient as one, at any given horsepower.

In the early days I did look at the Hatteras LRC. But besides the engine issue, it was never clear to me how efficient their hull was. I pegged its range at 2500nm, which is not enough in my mind.

After the fact, arriving in Castletownbere, Ireland, i was struck by how many fishing boats there were that had the exact same lines as the KK42.
From the bow rise, the height of the pilot house roof to the slight stern rise.

In all my travels, travails and follies, I've never had green water come over any part of the cap rail.

The storm windows i installed, 1/2" Lexan, have never been tested. I only left therm in place because they provide great insulation in cold or hot weather.

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Richard, as you have shown, the KK42 is a world capable boat, with the right captain.

Something you have also shown is that cruising the world in a power boat does not require a half million (or higher) entry fee to participate.

Just an ordinary guy, with a good boat, and the fortitude to actually do it.

I go with the old preppers adage, if you have two you have one, if you have one you have none. Served me well over the years.

With folding propellers I would think it would be easy to add an electric motor to drive your shaft via your genset as a get home option.

Here's the link for a single engine 53' Selene that's started on the West Coast of the US, did the Eastern Caribbean, South Pacific and are now in SE Asia. They chartered a bunch but but we pretty much newbies when they bought Mystic Moon.

Mystic Moon Voyages - ...Life is Good!

Bay Pelican said:

I believe the 2004 Atlantic Rally included a 40 foot Nordhavn.

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Marty, I believe you are right on that. I just remember they were worry about the little guy having enough fuel for one part of the trip.

In any case. I was a cool video.

Cheers.

H.

dvd said:

Over the past 6 years,acquaintances Mark & Jennifer Ullman have put over 40,000 miles on their Nordhavn 46. Two transatlantics, recently 21+ days from Galapagos to Marquesas. Single engine...

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Just curious, Do they have to change oil mid trip?

Bay Pelican said:

I believe the 2004 Atlantic Rally included a 40 foot Nordhavn.

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And it most definitely did not all go smoothly. Read the book, then evaluate. Now, they've solved the most frequent problem which was with their stabilizers. But there were many very experienced boaters plus an engineer available. Notice that they haven't repeated this.