Tipping etiquette...

gaston said:

Don't come here and start a revolution were doing ok without you

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Wifey B: I will if I want to.

In the diving forums many europeans complain about american divers in foreign countries because we tip. In europe there is limited tipping and that carries over when they travel. So what happens when americans and europeans are diving together? The americans get better service usually. A favorite saving I overheard was "Yes americans are demanding and picky, BUT we are willing to pay for what we want". In the words of the current ruling party, trickle down economics. If you can afford the boat and fuel, you can afford the tip.

psneeld said:

You can go to a doctors office and see diplomas from Harvard.....are they real? Journalism has shown us that some diplomas are fake....go figure.....

Worth is relative and always will be....unless you live in a totalitarian society that has a manual, capatilism pays what the market will tolerate.

When your toilet overflows and you cant fix it...guess what.

When the bad guys are at the front door or the border, the cop and the soldier are worth their weight in gold.

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I retired from the plumbing trade, my dad was a registered professional engineer, and also a registered plumber, and later in his career worked with the tools, as did I. We frequently would be on the receiving end of comments both good and bad regarding the trade. Dad had a favorite quote hanging in his (and later my) office..

When using the waterways in Europe it's not necessary to tip dock staff, lock keepers etc. Pump out stations are as rare as rocking horse manure and if you find one you do it yourself, likewise fuel, water.
The only time we tip is if for example a lock keeper, or team of lock keepers, have to manually operate locks, being Irish we tip with a bottle of wine which always seems to be appreciated.
If you go to Italy if a guy even touches your lines, or provides the most dubious of services they demand tips.
In general, like Australia we don't tip.

Cruising the AICW , and preferring to anchor out , we stop for fuel about 11AM, when most docks are empty.

We tip FIRST, and usually get permission to take on water , dump the trash , do the wash and walk to a local market.

All done , usually by 1300 , all set for another few days or a week.

guy with a boat said:

I can appreciate that you have your opinion and respect that. I am curious, though: why can the "tipping" jobs not be paid fairly when other service positions can be? We all encounter service providers every day that aren't in "tippable" jobs yet do fabulous work. If they don't do a good job, business goes elsewhere. If their employer can't get an effective employee for a low wage, he/she must increase the pay until competent employees are attracted. Why do you feel this system doesn't also apply to jobs which are tipped in the US?

Please understand I am not trying to change your mind or argue the point. I just want to better understand your position.

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First and foremost, some jobs have tipping built in, without tips they would be unfair wages. Shouldnt be any argument there.

But that is really a second topic to me.

Beyond mandatory tipping, tipping is just a form of gift giving or generosity.

In the USCG, you could save a mans family yet not receive a nickel. If you risked your own life to a high degree, the military gsve you a medal. It in turngave you everything from self satisfaction, to bragging rights to promotion points.

Outside, giving someone a tip, whether a plumber, doctor, engineer, scupltor....whatever....who has gone above and beyond the expected, why not tip? Can be anything from something token to riches depending on your status.

Other than mandatory tipping, showing generosity in an affluent society shouldnt be abnormal. In all likelyhood, doctors, engineers, lawyers would refuse many tips or they would suggest sending the office crew something nice. Everyone wins.

Tips to people outside of jobs that need them are more to make YOU feel good than the person receiving them. It is about satisfaction that you went out of your way to let the person that helped you know you appreciated their top service.

I am not saying tip everyone, but there is nothing wrong with tipping as it is only realy gift giving. Doing it because you WANT to, not because it is expected.

Tipping should be reserved for 3rd world country's

gaston said:

Tipping should be reserved for 3rd world country's

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Wifey B: He who doth protest too loudly. When they say it's not about the money, it's about the money.

Well thats a whole different, but related discussion.

Tolerance of customs, home and abroad.

While I like to fit in, and not be the ugly American, funny how some feel their customs are OK wherever, yet others can only have them when in their own country.

Life is too short.....back to tech stuff.

Want a tip? No running beside the pool...

gaston said:

In AUSTRALIA people are paid what their services are worth and there is no tipping

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What is typical pay (salary or wages) there for restaurant wait staff?

-Chris

ranger42c said:

What is typical pay (salary or wages) there for restaurant wait staff?

-Chris

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I believe it is $18+ per hour if memory serves me well.

FWIW - Up here in the NY area t is very customary to tip dockhands and folks at marinas. Similar to Ban B we tip extra when in doubt.
FWIW - you will likely get good service at docks if you are reasonably nice and do not tip, if you are reasonably nice and tip even better.
Then there are the few that are not reasonable, not nice, and do not tip - and then they wonder why they get a certain behavior back , a specific slip and other such responses. You would be surprised at how 'well' the reputation of some of these boats are known.

Tipping is great , icing on the cake!

As a kid I parked cars at a posh country club , could drive the hell out of MG , MB , Corvettes even RR for over an hour , and they handed cash for scrubbing half the tread off the tires!!

Only in America!

5 dollars a person no matter what they are doing. (I do my own pump outs)

FF said:

Only in America!

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Keep it there then and stop trying to introduce it to other countries.

I hate being hassled for "extra" in countries that had no tipping culture and until very recently, would follow me out of restaurants to return loose coin.
Now you get followed out of a restaurant because we haven't left a large tip.

Simi 60 said:

Keep it there then and stop trying to introduce it to other countries.

I hate being hassled for "extra" in countries that had no tipping culture and until very recently, would follow me out of restaurants to return loose coin.
Now you get followed out of a restaurant because we haven't left a large tip.

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I thought we were talking about dock hands?

FF said:

Tipping is great , icing on the cake!

As a kid I parked cars at a posh country club , could drive the hell out of MG , MB , Corvettes even RR for over an hour , and they handed cash for scrubbing half the tread off the tires!!

Only in America!

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I have always taken care of other peoples property better than if it were my own.

Americans are generally known as generous/excessive tippers, particularly outside the States.

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With ever-increasing, government-dictated minimum-wages in the USA, perhaps we need to re-examine our tipping habits. (Have noticed restaurant prices are increasing several times faster than general inflation.) It's common that restaurants show the amounts of possible tips based on 15, 18, and 20 percent of the bill, which includes up to nearly 10-percent sales tax.

markpierce said:

Americans are generally known as generous/excessive tippers, particularly outside the States.

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With ever-increasing, government-dictated minimum-wages in the USA, perhaps we need to re-examine our tipping habits. (Have noticed restaurant prices are increasing several times faster than general inflation.) It's common that restaurants show the amounts of possible tips based on 15, 18, and 20 percent of the bill, which includes up to nearly 10-percent sales tax.

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Most restaurants I'm familiar with including those where you pay on a tablet calculate based on the total before sales tax. Just because they list it below the sales tax inclusive number doesn't mean it's calculated that way. Sometimes have to look carefully.

Was surprised to see the bill from a local Asian-cuisine restaurant with multiple tip-calculations based as low as ten percent. ... Thinking of revising my tipping practice to equal the local sales tax, rounded up to the nearest dollar since restaurant prices are increasing ten to thirty times faster than my pension increases.

markpierce said:

Was surprised to see the bill from a local Asian-cuisine restaurant with multiple tip-calculations based as low as ten percent. ... Thinking of revising my tipping practice to equal the local sales tax, rounded up to the nearest dollar since restaurant prices are increasing ten to thirty times faster than my pension increases.

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So you'll penalize the waiter or waitress? I can't speak to the restaurant prices vs your pension as I don't know the prices in your area or anything about your pension.

Must be an east coast thing. In the west, we just do it because we are neighborly. You then pay it forward by helping out the next person.

markpierce said:

Was surprised to see the bill from a local Asian-cuisine restaurant with multiple tip-calculations based as low as ten percent. ... Thinking of revising my tipping practice to equal the local sales tax, rounded up to the nearest dollar since restaurant prices are increasing ten to thirty times faster than my pension increases.

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In restaurants, I have generally doubled the sales tax and rounded up. However, as the sales tax has increased, I am beginning to modify that a bit.

BandB said:

So you'll penalize the waiter or waitress? I can't speak to the restaurant prices vs your pension as I don't know the prices in your area or anything about your pension.

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No. How am I penalizing the servicer when not fully participating in increasing their compensation many times faster (ten to thirty times) more than mine (which is supposedly based on government-calculated consumers' rise in cost of living)? The list prices also include paying for their faster-rising basic wages.

dhays said:

In restaurants, I have generally doubled the sales tax and rounded up. However, as the sales tax has increased, I am beginning to modify that a bit.

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Sales-tax rates vary widely, from nothing to about ten percent!

markpierce said:

No. How am I penalizing the servicer when not fully participating in increasing their compensation many times faster (ten to thirty times) more than mine (which is supposedly based on government-calculated consumers' rise in cost of living)? The list prices also include paying for their faster-rising basic wages.

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California is a unique situation and that is where you are. It's one of the very few states that requires paying waiters and waitresses minimum wage. California, Minnesota, Nevada, Oregon, Washington, Montana and Alaska do so. In some other states there are numbers in between. For instance, Florida requires a minimum of $5.08 per hour. In 17 states, it's $2.13 an hour.

BandB said:

California is a unique situation and that is where you are. It's one of the very few states that requires paying waiters and waitresses minimum wage. California, Minnesota, Nevada, Oregon, Washington, Montana and Alaska do so. In some other states there are numbers in between. For instance, Florida requires a minimum of $5.08 per hour. In 17 states, it's $2.13 an hour.

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Mark's point is that the compensation that the employees have been receiving has, in some locations, gone up dramatically. WA just increased its minimum wage this last year and will continue increase yearly for a while. This increase in wage has resulted in increased menu prices.

If tipping food service workers is to compensate for artificially low wages as well as reward them for good service, there is a good argument for lowering a tip percentage in these circumstances.

gaston said:

Tipping should be reserved for 3rd world country's

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Mostly these days that is indeed already the case.

BTW how many tip the policeman that gives a traffic ticket?

ranger42c said:

What is typical pay (salary or wages) there for restaurant wait staff?

-Chris

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Can`t give a $ figure, but it`s a proper wage rate,either determined by negotiation or a wage fixing tribunal, not one that requires customer tipping to make it a reasonable amount. Plus there are loadings for weekends/public holidays, etc. 4 weeks annual holidays too.
Anyone working as a casual(not permanent)employee gets an extra 25% loading, to compensate for no holidays, sick pay, etc.
There are significant penalties for underpaying employees, eg the 7-11 underpayment scheme recently uncovered.
When in USA, Canada, other places, I tip as required.Seems to me that instead of increasing prices and paying staff properly out of the sales income, employers shift the obligation to pay their staff to their customers.
I often tip here in restaurants, but not at the level expected in USA.

BruceK said:

Seems to me that instead of increasing prices and paying staff properly out of the sales income, employers shift the obligation to pay their staff to their customers.
I often tip here in restaurants, but not at the level expected in USA.

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Its what I have witnessed in lands with no tipping culture.

American tourist and to some extent Ozzie CUB's come in, start splashing the cash thinking its helping the staff and or making themselves feel good and all that happens in many cases is the owner of the business stops paying or reduces wages.