Seattle Sewage Dump

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The government doesn't have to follow the same rules it makes for its citizens. The military base nearby has a sewage leak into the river every couple of years. I don't see them getting fined.
 
WesK said:
The government doesn't have to follow the same rules it makes for its citizens. The military base nearby has a sewage leak into the river every couple of years. I don't see them getting fined.
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Government is often exempt from their own rules nothing new there. Where I see the problem is in two types of government employees. One type is the extremist green save the planet type who don't even abide by the scientific findings of what is wrong and how to fix it. The second type is the person or persons who wish to advance their careers by pushing and implementing regulations that go beyond the known need but look very good on their CV.
 
porman said:
'Major emergency' dumps millions of gallons of raw sewage into Puget Sound | KOMO And there is a proposal in our state to make us have holding tanks for gray water from our sinks!
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I haven't seen the gray water proposal yet. Any links?

But yes, King county dumps raw sewage into the Sound a few times every year, by far exceeding anything that recreational boater would do in a year even if we did pump directly overboard.

However, the WA Dept of ecology is going to "save the sound" by banning lectrasans and purasans.
 
IMG_4250.JPG
 
dhays said:
I haven't seen the gray water proposal yet. Any links?

But yes, King county dumps raw sewage into the Sound a few times every year, by far exceeding anything that recreational boater would do in a year even if we did pump directly overboard.

However, the WA Dept of ecology is going to "save the sound" by banning lectrasans and purasans.
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Our club's RBAW representative told me about it at our last dinner meeting. Apparently it is in the discussion stage right now.
 
Just heard about this a while ago, I posted it on the other thread before seeing this one. Before they worry about the paltry amount that comes off boats, they should ensure that this never happens and secure the sewage from Vic BC. which is many tons more than boaters will ever dump.
 
porman said:
'Major emergency' dumps millions of gallons of raw sewage into Puget Sound | KOMO And there is a proposal in our state to make us have holding tanks for gray water from our sinks!
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Too many people who don't know the difference between gray water and black water, and think "gray water" is toilet waste are spreading that rumor. There is no proposal to hold gray water, but they are taking another run (the first try failed) at making Lake Union, Lake Washington and the Sound NDZs...at least they were. Trump has forbidden the EPA from creating any new regulations for the time being, so it's unlikely anything will happen soon.

I've always considered it the ultimate irony that the very DAY Rhode Island's statewide NDZ law went into effect, a massage sewage treatment plant spill in Providence closed all the beaches and shellfish beds in half of Narragansett Bay for a week!
 
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HeadMistress said:
Too many people who don't know the difference between gray water and black water, and think "gray water" is toilet waste are spreading that rumor. There is no proposal to hold gray water, but they are taking another run (the first try failed) at making Lake Union, Lake Washington and the Sound NDZs...at least they were. Trump has forbidden the EPA from creating any new regulations for the time being, so it's unlikely anything will happen soon.

I've always considered it the ultimate irony that the very DAY Rhode Island's statewide NDZ law went into effect, a massage sewage treatment plant spill in Providence closed all the beaches and shellfish beds in half of Narragansett Bay for a week!
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I never heard about the final EPA decision on the WA Dept of Ecology request for the NDZ?
 
HeadMistress said:
Too many people who don't know the difference between gray water and black water, and think "gray water" is toilet waste are spreading that rumor. There is no proposal to hold gray water, but they are taking another run (the first try failed) at making Lake Union, Lake Washington and the Sound NDZs...at least they were. Trump has forbidden the EPA from creating any new regulations for the time being, so it's unlikely anything will happen soon.

I've always considered it the ultimate irony that the very DAY Rhode Island's statewide NDZ law went into effect, a massage sewage treatment plant spill in Providence closed all the beaches and shellfish beds in half of Narragansett Bay for a week!
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As often the case: Govt is putting emphasis on the wrong syll-abbble!
 
dhays said:
I never heard about the final EPA decision on the WA Dept of Ecology request for the NDZ?
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The first attempt last year failed because the regulation over-reached in the requirements it put on the commercial and work boat industry--the cost to them would have been in the hundreds of thousands, which they can't afford to spend--but apparently didn't go far enough when it came to cruise ships and other large commercial ships. So the WA DoE did what determined zealots always do: they went back to the drawing board to rewrite it. The second attempt is either still in the public comment/discussion phase or may be stalled because of the freeze on any new EPA regs, 'cuz while states can request it, only the EPA can approve a new NDZ.
 
Trump issued an executive order that for every new federal regulation, two older ones must be revoked.
Did that to slow down the overreaching federal governments lackey's agendas on citizens and businesses.
 
HeadMistress said:
The first attempt last year failed because the regulation over-reached in the requirements it put on the commercial and work boat industry--the cost to them would have been in the hundreds of thousands, which they can't afford to spend--but apparently didn't go far enough when it came to cruise ships and other large commercial ships. So the WA DoE did what determined zealots always do: they went back to the drawing board to rewrite it. The second attempt is either still in the public comment/discussion phase or may be stalled because of the freeze on any new EPA regs, 'cuz while states can request it, only the EPA can approve a new NDZ.
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I thought DT put tunicate on EPA with design to eventually eliminate it or down size to point of non-use. As soooo often happens with zealots crookedly poised developments... they swing the pendulum too far in one direction or the other. IMO, EPA has its good and bad points. Too much ability for EPA's power of writing/producing laws and things get too constricted for all concerned. Too little EPA power and eco-protection needs can become way too overlooked.

In regard to land based sewage plant laws as compared to pleasure boating black and gray water instances... I think the EPA has its head up its own ASSSS. Pun intended!
 
Art said:
I thought DT put tunicate on EPA with design to eventually eliminate it or down size to point of non-use. As soooo often happens with zealots crookedly poised developments... they swing the pendulum too far in one direction or the other. IMO, EPA has its good and bad points. Too much ability for EPA's power of writing/producing laws and things get too constricted for all concerned. Too little EPA power and eco-protection needs can become way too overlooked.

In regard to land based sewage plant laws as compared to pleasure boating black and gray water instances... I think the EPA has its head up its own ASSSS. Pun intended!
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EPA has forced farmers who built ponds on their land to drain them, they have classified as wetlands areas that get wet from the rain that have standing water in ditches. Rules exist preventing people using water barrels to collect the rain that floods off their roofs.
They can cause you mischief and fine you lots of dollars.

Obama had recently sign some stream protection rule, a major revision that was bad for coal producers, and Trump has revoked.
http://fortune.com/2017/02/02/stream-protection-rule-repeal/
http://www.alternet.org/environment/one-his-last-environmental-actions-obama-takes-swipe-coal

Simply it was their continuing efforts to destroy the coal jobs.

Both senators representing West Virginia, the second highest coal-producing state after Wyoming, oppose the new rule. Shelley Moore Capito, a Republican, underscored a demand she made to President Obama to "not move forward with any more rules and regulations as you are going out the door." Joe Manchin, the state's senior senator and a Democrat, said, "I remain unconvinced that this jobs-killing regulation is necessary or substantiated, particularly when you consider state and federal regulations already in place."
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San Diego has a sewerage outfall off Point Loma that also has good wave sets for the surfer dudes. The surfer dudes say they get the GIs for three days after surfin' there but it's worth it. How's that for gnarly?:nonono:
 
sdowney717 said:
EPA has forced farmers who built ponds on their land to drain them, they have classified as wetlands areas that get wet from the rain that have standing water in ditches. Rules exist preventing people using water barrels to collect the rain that floods off their roofs.
They can cause you mischief and fine you lots of dollars.

Obama had recently sign some stream protection rule, a major revision that was bad for coal producers, and Trump has revoked.
Stream Protection: Senate Repeals Rule, Coal Miners Rejoice | Fortune.com
http://www.alternet.org/environment/one-his-last-environmental-actions-obama-takes-swipe-coal

Simply it was their continuing efforts to destroy the coal jobs.
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All in All: Just too many people doing too many things on this little planet. Earth's "flushing" system are getting overloaded on too many levels/accounts.

Drop human population down to 500 million to 1 billion and then hold it there. I'm confident that would correct climate and ecosystem items quite quickly. Problem is - How to do that and who will be the ones made to "resign"... as they like to say in big biz and govt. circles. I'll bet that some on top of the human-power-pyramid have plans... Oh Boy!!! :hide: :facepalm:
 
Whenever I hear folks talk of reducing the worlds population or wring their hands over the so called overpopulation problem, my first thought is always, are you and your family going to volunteer to start the mass suicide or murder to save the planet?
 
78puget-trawler said:
Whenever I hear folks talk of reducing the worlds population or wring their hands over the so called overpopulation problem, my first thought is always, are you and your family going to volunteer to start the mass suicide or murder to save the planet?
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The handy thing about humans is they come with a built in expiration date. No need to get rid of the ones that are here, they do that on their own. You just have to reduce the production to match the expiration rate.

Now the problem is that the areas of the world that have the least ability to support a large population also have the largest birth rate. Oddly enough, that won't change until economic stability and decreasing childhood mortality rates can bring about cultural changes necessary to reduce the birth rate. So, we have to save more kids before we are going to have fewer kids to feed.
 
Technology has enabled the earth to bear more food and fruit. Could not have today's population without farmers doing what they do.

If you believe in a Creator God who made our earth, then by necessity earth and people were created for a purpose, not chaos and death. So this world is just a temporary holding place making way at the end of your life for another place to go and live. I am a Christian so I believe that God is for me, and this world is not my 'eternal' home. People are more than just a body, they have a soul and a spirit inside that is the real 'you'.
 
78puget-trawler said:
Whenever I hear folks talk of reducing the worlds population or wring their hands over the so called overpopulation problem, my first thought is always, are you and your family going to volunteer to start the mass suicide or murder to save the planet?
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Almost all problems can be traced to overpopulation. If couples would limit themselves to one or two children and singles not wanting children would practice some birth control method, the population would slowly drop.
Why when we have millions out of work are we still allowing immigration? The west was settled over 100 years ago. City dwellers seem to think forests and other rural areas go on forever.
 
Lepke said:
Almost all problems can be traced to overpopulation. If couples would limit themselves to one or two children and singles not wanting children would practice some birth control method, the population would slowly drop.
Why when we have millions out of work are we still allowing immigration? The west was settled over 100 years ago. City dwellers seem to think forests and other rural areas go on forever.
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Nice scientific thinking. Now find me one major religion that will go along with population control. No I think it is the other way around all are in competition to out breed the other and force their mystical beliefs on others. My prediction; universal population control will not happen and any large scale attempts will not occur until it is absolutely urgent and way past an effective time to implement. I have a mug with short old well worn statements of general wisdom printed on it ,and one applies to this and many other modern human issues. "The Masses are asses" It is a little crude and insulting but on critical evaluation more often than not very true.
 
eyschulman said:
Nice scientific thinking. Now find me one major religion that will go along with population control. No I think it is the other way around all are in competition to out breed the other and force their mystical beliefs on others. My prediction; universal population control will not happen and any large scale attempts will not occur until it is absolutely urgent and way past an effective time to implement. I have a mug with short old well worn statements of general wisdom printed on it ,and one applies to this and many other modern human issues. "The Masses are asses" It is a little crude and insulting but on critical evaluation more often than not very true.
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:thumb:
 
But again, I always wonder what will "universal population control" look like? How would that work? I submit that it wont work, ever. As far as the planet goes, it can withstand more than the human race can dish out and even if that's not so, all of us and our great great grandkids will be long gone.
 
Art said:
Drop human population down to 500 million to 1 billion and then hold it there. I'm confident that would correct climate and ecosystem items quite quickly. Problem is - How to do that and who will be the ones made to "resign"... as they like to say in big biz and govt. circles. I'll bet that some on top of the human-power-pyramid have plans... Oh Boy!!! :hide: :facepalm:
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Come out from under the chair Art. As we say here, imho, "spot on" on the population issue, even if reversing its growth risks global economic downturn.
People like having kids, the world economy is addicted to growth and avoiding "recession". More people = more demand = more jobs = more fuel burning= more production= more land clearing for food growing = lots of stress on the planet. Today will set new temperature records in SE Australia.
Which probably = me cowering under the chair too.:hide:
 
Australia must be a case study in extremes as yesterday ABC Perth news was reporting record lows and torrential rain covering roads.
 
CPseudonym said:
Australia must be a case study in extremes as yesterday ABC Perth news was reporting record lows and torrential rain covering roads.
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Right on. Hot dry east, flooding west. Dorothea McKellar`s poem "My Country"calls Australia "a land of droughts and flooding rains". Weather moves east, in a few days we should see the western weather break the current heatwave.
 
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