Boat Sounds UPGRADE

ALL RIGHT, So the boat sounds need upgrade / replacement speakers, what to do WHAT TO DO. After extensive research, scouring the internet outer net and two fishing nets. Here’s what I have done and currently in process.
Step 1 replace the broken 4” speakers on the fly bridge.
Step 2 replace the cheap rusted speakers on the Aft deck. AKA the lounge and liars den.
Step 3 ADD Amplifier and Sub-WOOFER. (Not a Cocker Spaniel with scuba tricks sorry.)
Step 4. back to being very busy doing nothing.
There’s got to be 8 more steps can’t think of what they should be. Maybe beer. Yea that’s it. BEER. X8=12 steps. Perfect.
Step 1 is complete. I removed the worn out 4” whatever they were. They stopped working. I thought it must have been a connection so I proceed to cut out all the connections and replace them. Its always a connection Right? Surprise still no discernable sound. ??? Oh yeah look at the speakers themselves dummy. BINGO they are dead. Tossed them out installed a pair of POLK audio MM651UM. Pricey but GREAT sounds. Must be the excellent connections. What else.
Cutting the fiberglass holes larger to accommodate the larger POLK’s was fun. I read on another thread about cutting fiberglass with the trusty old Jig saw. Used small width blade no idea how many teeth it had when I started. None when I finished. Looked like a saw made for wood. I looked for the Fiberglass or Formica blade but could not find one to fit my old saw. should have had at least 3 blades for each hole. FYI
Step 2 less easy to resolve. could not find out of the box speakers that would fit the location for less than --way more than I wanted to spend. Resolved to buy component speakers and some ready made boxes to fit the location . No satisfaction there SO.. OF COURSE I will just make some boxes. I have a saw after all.
Bought the POLK AUDIO db692 6x9 speakers they SAY they are marine rated. Probably should have gone with the MM691. Report back on that later.
See attached pictures of the boxes under construction

UUUH well if the first two pictures were rotated 90 degrees clockwise it would be easer to see.

Looking forward to seeing your progress.

Kevin

I put these in my salon and love 'em so much I added another set. Now I've got 4 smalls in the salon with a sub and another sub on the FB to compliment the 2 speakers up there. Gotta have good tunes!!



https://www.bose.com/en_us/products...oustimass-3-speaker-system.html#v=am3_v_black

At a previous marina we had a younger party boats that played hard rock late into the night. Speaking after many requests to turn it down after 10:00 to no avail. So I install two 100 wattsurround sound recievers. One to power 4 out side speakers and one for the interior. So when they did not turn down the volume, I played Christine and country that drowned out there music. They soon got the mrssage.

Also on the 4th of July the lake union was set to music, so we turned the volume up.

tallswede said:

Looking forward to seeing your progress.

Kevin

Click to expand...

Will post pics along the way.

Flywright, I looked at some of the Bose outdoor speakers for the ones I am building. I just cannot find enough detail in the specifications with Bose products. I do not know it they intentionally omit key specs or just think no one cares.

I have some older Bose in my house and they suit OK. They were free to me so I use them. Good looking setup you have there.

Are the ones you put on fly bridge protected from the weather? Just the Bose Sub with some other brand full range speakers on the bridge I presume?

Phil, We too have some late night rockers on our dock. Can't out gun them they have some SERIOUSLY loud systems. Usually turn it down at a reasonable (for some) time at night. I envy the crusing waters of your area. Beautiful vista in any direction..
Dave

Toolbuddie said:

Flywright, ... Are the ones you put on fly bridge protected from the weather? Just the Bose Sub with some other brand full range speakers on the bridge I presume?

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Yes, the Bose sub is inside the helm console and the other 2 marine speakers are ALPINE SPS-M600. I had a pair of Sony marine speakers there but they only lasted a couple years before they bit the dust. These have lasted 5 years and are still going strong.

I wired a switch at the lower helm to select the FB speakers from below. The FB has a wired remote to my Sony Xplod Marine stereo. I also have a wireless remote to control the stereo from the cockpit.

The stereo didn't come with an aux jack, but I added one so I can plug into my iPod or my tablet with internet streaming tunes. When I'm watching a movie, I can run my TV audio through the stereo for quality sound.

Two weeks ago I was anchored in a cove with fellow TFers Vern Vierra and Bob Mills. We had the place to ourselves until a 20-ish ft sailboat anchored 50 ft off my stern, then another boat and PWC rafted up to him. I mentioned I should play my stereo and Bob suggested polka music. I found the Andrews Sisters version of the Beer Polka (Roll Out the Barrels) which seemed very appropriate!!

I played that song on repeat from all speakers for their listening pleasure. I went over to Vern's boat and took his dog for a walk ashore about 1/4 mile away. I had to chuckle as I was walking the dog when I could hear the polka playing in the distance!!

When I returned to the boat, I noticed my stereo was silent, but there was another version of the same song playing from the raftup! My stereo had turned itself off (it does that sometimes...) and the raftup boats played the song as I entered the cove! Very funny! We later laughed together about the music battle!

Now THATS just too funny!!!
POLKA I will have to use that as test tune when it's all in, POLKA Dam funny!

I am also upgrading this winter with a surround sound for the TV and radio/CD. Interesting setup FW

Interesting as I'd like to know more. Being an audiophile I have worked in a few auto stereo shops and "built" my current home system....Combination of URC, Speakercraft and various subwoofers....and am.interested in boat retrofit....not really a fan of Bose or Sonos...

Ch

WHOA, sorry for the delay. Travel and other projects got in the way of loud fun. Steps 1 and 2 complete. Step 3 in progress.
Pic 1 is old rusty speakers removed
Pic 2 is the new rear deck speakers built and installed
Pic 3 is rain cover installed over rear deck speaker.
Pic 4 is Amp during temp hookup and testing.
Not pictured is the subwoofer in temp enclosure. Yes it will be installed.






OK so thePolk DB 692's are great. Sound extremely good to me. Reproduce the mid and high frequencies powerfully. Very good response in the low bass range as well. The enclosures were made from thin Plywood because of the space restraints. Medium Density fiberboard would be better from an acoustical standpoint. I added some insulation I had on hand and they are satisfactory but allow unwanted resonance from the enclosure. I will remove the insulation this winter and install dynamat or something similar to remove the resonance. I expect better sound after that modification.
The Pioneer Amp is more than adequate from a functional standpoint as I carefully selected it based on a number of requirements. Power not the primary concern but was on the list. I will post separate entry with the specifications of the components and why they were selected for this installation.
Polka music. Who would guess.
Dave

I took the quick and dirty route for upgrading my old Clarion stereo - because I dread the byzantine wiring and hole cutting that often attends these affairs.

I just bought a much newer model of Clarion stereo that has Bluetooth off Craigslist, swapped out the old for the newer in minutes, plugged in with the same harness and dimensions, and ten minutes later began enjoying a major audio upgrade for about $100.

Speaking of sound system, has anyone found a descent compact sub woofer? I have two 5" speakers in the pilot house that are good, but weak on base. I think a sub woofer would be a great improvement, but most are just too darn big. Or have really bad reviews like Pyle Audio.

Great thread. Thread highjack? If so I apologize in advance.


What is the TF's opinion on the Fusion 750 series?


I have 4 different zones that are currently controlled by old radio shack toggle switches. I am thinkingg of replacing the sundeck and FB with what FW (Al) has on his boat with the Bose system. In the salon I want to go with a home theater system.


Suggestion and or comments?

Tom, I'd be cautious about placing those Bose Acoustimass 3's outside. I don't think they'd last long. I have Alpine marine speakers outside on the FB. Mine are all in the salon except my FB subwoofer is inside the FB helm console.



The salon sound with 5 Bose speakers is so balanced it's impressive. When I stand at the acoustic center with a great song turned up like this
it blows me away! I think I can see ripples on the water! (jk)

So my FB and sundeck are enclosed so they would be out of the weather. Same opinion?

I wouldn't, Tom. IMO, the humidity would tear them up in no time. My Alpine speakers do pretty well up there where there's more noise while underway.

Even though my FB sub is inside the helm console cabinet, the speaker box is still showing the effects of the environment.

Thanks FW

twistedtree said:

Speaking of sound system, has anyone found a descent compact sub woofer? I have two 5" speakers in the pilot house that are good, but weak on base. I think a sub woofer would be a great improvement, but most are just too darn big. Or have really bad reviews like Pyle Audio.

Click to expand...

I installed a Cambridge Audio system with 5 little cube speakers and a small subwoofer, powered by a Denon receiver. It sounds spectacular. I installed the subwoofer under the salon settee and ran the wire in the engine room.

drb1025 said:

I installed a Cambridge Audio system with 5 little cube speakers and a small subwoofer, powered by a Denon receiver. It sounds spectacular. I installed the subwoofer under the salon settee and ran the wire in the engine room.

Click to expand...

That's similar to what I have in our salon, and it works great. I'm now trying to get something of similar performance in the pilot house.

The constraints are that I already have installed right and left speakers, and want to continue to use them. So any added sub woofer needs to be stand-alone, and self-powered. And the places where I can place a sub woofer are limited, so the smaller the better, without sacrificing sounds quality too much.

Peter, the Bose subwoofer linked above is a passive (non-powered) sub that comes with 2 other small speakers for $200.

https://www.bose.com/en_us/products...=am3_v_black?perfsourceid=MC113165&src=K22350

Flywright. Love your new avatar. Twistedtree, I tryed a powered sub recently and was dissappointed completely. I sent it back. If you decide to try one of those make sure of the return policy prior to ordering it. It may meet your satisfaction. I would suggest you hedge that bet. Ponder your needs and SHOP SHOP SHOP. read the how-to's on the websites that offer these products. I have learned a lot and avoided what I think would have been costly mistakes on my project.
Good luck.
Dave

Boat sounds upgrade, from the beginning.
When we purchased our current cruiser the sound system was barely adequate. It consisted of a Sony AM/FM player with a remote multi CD player. Sony Coaxial 6 1/2” speakers in the forward and aft staterooms as well as the Salon. 4”polyplanar on the fly bridge and pair of cheap plastic box speakers on the aft deck. Sad to say the least.
Primary problem # 1 The system had no means to adjust from the fly bridge where we spend the most time. Every adjustment required a trip down to the Salon. The fridge is there so one could always secure another beverage. Not always advisable but available just the same.
Primary problem # 2. The sounds outside were sad if not downright offensive. So I began to ponder.
What would the ideal system look like if I were to create it? That seems like the fundamental question for any project I seem to contemplate.
First off correct Primary problem # 1
Secondly correct Primary problem # 2 use of an exponent here seems prudent.
So to get full control of the head unit from the fly bridge is certainly possible. Products to do this are widely available from several manufacturers.
Criteria #1 for the head unit remote contol also includes some means to connect my music library to the new system. I currently use an old IPOD for the library. 3mm aux jack will be required.
I found several iterations of wireless remotes. Most are IR some were RF. neither I found would meet Criteria # 1. So maybe something with wires will be required.
Criteria # 2 for the new head unit would be the ability to easily expand the system to later include connection to amp or amps. Pre-amp outputs maybe a separate output for Sub woofers would be preferable over the speaker level connection to an amp as they present less options for later selections of amps and such.
Criteria # 3 for the head unit is silly but a requirement. It must fit the current cutout in the Salon. I like its location and all of the wires are already there.
Criteria # 4 the head unit cannot cost me more than my first car.
The search to fill criteria 1 through 3 was more of a search than I expected. At one point I was trying to settle for what was widely available but I new I would regret doing that after spending time and money without solving primary problems # 1 and 2. The search continued.
I stumbled upon a DUAL MXDMA80 head unit. It met all Criteria 1 through 4. Was on sale to include the remote unit with the 3 mm aux input jack. Pre-amp Outputs for Front and Rear stage and whizz bang pre-amp SUB output that is adjustable through the head unit. Like all standard head units the output power is limited to 17 Watts RMS (or less). No problem that is usually enough anyway. Well usually.
The head unit was installed and performed as expected. Happy for a while.
When the speakers died on the fly bridge the speakers on the aft deck had begun to rust.That rust was displeasing to the admiral.
The criteria for replacement speakers was specific for me. Full range coaxial for the flybridge with power handling capacity to be amplified later if I so desired. I wanted the best speaker with very low Hertz reproduction and very low free air resonance. Just in case I never install a Sub woofer, I want that bass!
That search produced the Polk MM651UM. 6 1/2” round coaxial with frequency response 40-25kHZ. 92db sensitivity rating 100 watts RMS. the 92db was important as this indicates the amount or volume output for a given input of 1 watt at 1000 hz measured at one meter. This is an excellent comparison figure especially when not adding an amp. It is a measure of efficiency. more or less.
Installed and CHECK. Fantastic response range as the spec sheet promised. This was a good selection from my stated criteria. Fly bridge is again inhabitable.
Next item was not so easy. Replace the simple box speakers on the aft deck. Search high and low in and out. I just could not find any one speaker to fit the space,match my audio spec requirements and the power handling capacity IF I proceed to the amplification stage of this project. I was looking closely and the Bose outdoor speakers models 151 and 251. These would fit the space but lacked the low end response I crave and must have. A dock mate has these and they do sound extremely good in the mid to upper frequency ranges. Bose does not seem to publish the specs of there products and that is a problem for me. Shorten the story to say I proceed to select the Polk db 692 6x9 tri-axial speakers and build the boxes shown earlier. The speakers themselves boast 30-22khz response range 93 db sensitivity with 150 watts RMS. The speakers themselves seem perfect the enclosures as previously stated will require sound absorbing material added inside. More on that later when the problem is solved and tested.
All was well for a while until one particular outing where we were participating in the sing-along at full volume. SOUNDS awesome. until the head unit shutdown. Overworked for sure. Cut out is a protection feature to prevent catastrophic failure. Enter the AMP stage of the upgrade.
Criteria for the amp is less complicated for me to define to myself and many options exist. I wanted an amp capable to be used as 3 or 4 channel bridgeable for possible addition of a Sub later if desired. Output should be at least 100 watts per channel used to power the full range speakers on the bridge and aft deck. 300 watts or greater bridged to power the sub. Output loads should be capable down to at least 2 Ohms. The options thin out here.
Selection is the Pioneer GM-D8604. Meets all of the criteria stated above. Good price so CHECK. installed and YES it does take the load from the head unit. I have connected the 4 outside speakers outlined above to the amp in parallel fed from the REAR channel of the head unit to the input channel A of the amp. This connection method allows me to adjust the volume of the outside speakers relative to the inside speakers via the FADER function. Works perfectly for us. I could have connected each of the 4 speakers to a separate channel but the sub was begging to be considered. The new speakers do reproduce that bass well, but what the hell. “I’m all about that bass, bout that bass”
Sub woofer selection was easy at this point. Criteria is again, must fit the available space, require no more than 300 watts to perform and Marine rated for sure.
Selection was the Polk MM1040 UM. This is a 10” sub Marine rated. 24-200hz, 350 watts RMS 91db sensitivity.
At this point I am unsure that I want to cut a 9” hole in the boat so I temp mounted it in a pre-built enclosure. Test run on a recent trip WOW Yes I can’t wait to cut another hole in the dam boat!! Boom de Boom Boom, no rattle. I hope. I will have to custom build another enclosure to fit in the space where I want it but too late to turn back now.
There are a couple of issues to resolve, I will define and outline the resolutions later.Happy Thanksgiving to those who may participate. and Cheers.
Dave.

Djones44 There is nothing dirty about a sweet drop and swap! you are happy with it and that is the BINGO.
Cheers.

Flywright I agree and have seen great indoor speakers short shanked by the outdoor environment. Salt would be an a killer. There a lot of options for outdoor sounds that should last a long time and sound great without breaking the bank. Boat bank.

drb1025 said:

I installed a Cambridge Audio system with 5 little cube speakers and a small subwoofer, powered by a Denon receiver. It sounds spectacular. I installed the subwoofer under the salon settee and ran the wire in the engine room. View attachment 58814View attachment 58815

Click to expand...

So with the hatch closed and cushion installed, you can still hear the bass sound?

Here is the Polk Sub woofer in the temp Sound Ordnance enclosure. I hope the one i make will sound as well as this one.