Hull Blisters in Vinylester

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seasalt007

seasalt007

Guru
Joined
Jun 27, 2014
Messages
628
Location
U.S.
Vessel Name
Aweigh
Vessel Make
Nordic Tug 42
I recently paid for a pre purchase survey on a 2008 U.S. built trawler that states in it's literature that it uses vinylester versus polyester resins in it's construction and coats that with an Interprotect 2000 barrier coat below the waterline.

I expected the bottom to be blister free since my last two boats...a 2000 42' Nordic Tug and a 2002 Albin 35 TESF both were constructed using vinylester resins and had no blisters.

When the 2008 was pulled I was shocked to see a multitude of quarter size blisters on both sides of the keel and on the sides of the bottom away from the keel. They were in a random pattern.

It was postulated by one of the brokers that they were paint blisters until the structural surveyor dug into a couple and confirmed they were under the gel coat.

Because of this issue and a couple more serious concerns, I rejected the boat. I am sad because it was my "bucket list" boat.

My question here is: Was I wrong to assume that a boat using vinlyester resins would be more resistant to blistering?
 
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I found this paper that discusses hull blistering in great detail.

http://www.zahnisers.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/Repair-Blisters.pdf

The paragraph below from page 9 seems to indicate that blistering in vinylester gelcote is extremely rare. The paper is a complex discussion but it begs the question of whether the boat I was planing to purchase did indeed use vinylester resin in its construction.

"In the case of a new boat, if the manufacturer has not applied a barrier or built the boat out of a non-blistering material such as vinylester resin, a barrier coat is highly recommended before the first immersion."
 
seasalt007 said:
I recently paid for a pre purchase survey on a 2008 U.S. built trawler that states in it's literature that it uses vinylester versus polyester resins in it's construction and coats that with an Interprotect 2000 barrier coat below the waterline.

I expected the bottom to be blister free since my last two boats...a 2000 42' Nordic Tug and a 2002 Albin 35 TESF both were constructed using vinylester resins and had no blisters.

When the 2008 was pulled I was shocked to see a multitude of quarter size blisters on both sides of the keel and on the sides of the bottom away from the keel. They were in a random pattern.

It was postulated by one of the brokers that they were paint blisters until the structural surveyor dug into a couple and confirmed they were under the gel coat.

Because of this issue and a couple more serious concerns, I rejected the boat. I am sad because it was my "bucket list" boat.

My question here is: Was I wrong to assume that a boat using vinlyester resins would be more resistant to blistering?
Click to expand...


I certainly wouldn't reject a boat just because of quarter sizes blister.

They could stay that size for years to come.

You weren't "wrong to assume that a boat using vinlyester resins would be more resistant to blistering?"

Just wrong to assume they might all be free of blisters. :D
 
A surveyor once told me he has never heard of a boat sinking because of blisters, get out and use the darn thing and enjoy it he told me.
 
Look closely to the design or build specs.

Vinylester is much more resistant to blistering...but many boats advertised as being built with vinylester are only built with the top layer or couple being vinylester, most of the layers are straight polyester.

Even vinylester and epoxy may develop blisters..especially with wet bilges where water is absorbed from the I side out.

Boats with epoxy or vinylester coverings, and wet insides may actually developed more and more severe blisters.
 
roguewave said:
A surveyor once told me he has never heard of a boat sinking because of blisters, get out and use the darn thing and enjoy it he told me.
Click to expand...

He probably is correct...but some boats are severely compromised by them....what do you want out of your boat's hull?

100 percent strength, or less than 50 percent? Mine was severely compromised till I fixed it...the surveyor had no clue...as many don't as I learn more and more.....
 
Capt.Bill11 said:
I certainly wouldn't reject a boat just because of quarter sizes blisters. :D
Click to expand...

That was only one of the reasons. The other ones were that the spec sheet said the boat was painted with Awlgirp when new. The surveyor noticed severe fading and blotchiness on the side we could not see when it was at the dock at the seller's home. When it was hauled and he said it was faded gelcoat. The other reason for rejection was that the engine had not been serviced at the appropriate hours of use. The seller could not remember last time the oil was changed let alone a service at the 1000 hour mark.

We are talking about a boat selling for a fraction beneath half a million bucks.
 
So other than you are ticked off, what you have mentioned seems less than fatal. My suggestion would be to figure out costs to have a first class yard fix bottom, properly service the boat and double it. Then make your offer. BTW what brand of boat?
 
psneeld said:
He probably is correct...but some boats are severely compromised by them....what do you want out of your boat's hull?

100 percent strength, or less than 50 percent? Mine was severely compromised till I fixed it...the surveyor had no clue...as many don't as I learn more and more.....
Click to expand...

I didn't buy the boat, just sharing his thoughts is all. I think the jest of his comment was...there will always be something, just get out there and enjoy the thing. Sometimes that is easier said than done
 
People who don't live with the purchase, guarantee the purchase or pay for the purchase love to say whatever they want. :eek:

Just like people who buy the boat and are so proud of it, they refuse to believe they might have bought a POS and didn't know it. :rofl:

I almost knew how bad my boat was...but without destructive testing prior to purchase, there was no way to know exactly how bad the bottom was. I gambled and lost to a point...luckily I performed the $30,000 bottom job myself for about $3000. :D
 
"My question here is: Was I wrong to assume that a boat using vinlyester resins would be more resistant to blistering?"

Poor workmanship can easily trump superior materials.
 
seasalt007 said:
That was only one of the reasons. The other ones were that the spec sheet said the boat was painted with Awlgirp when new. The surveyor noticed severe fading and blotchiness on the side we could not see when it was at the dock at the seller's home. When it was hauled and he said it was faded gelcoat.
Click to expand...

Frankly, I wouldn't count on a surveyor being able to tell the difference between old gelcoat and old Awlgrip.
 
Hmm, interesting topic. My survey was not completely clean. I didn't expect it to be. I have a few minor blisters and many other things that need attention immediately that I am working on.

Does anyone ever get a perfectly clean survey?

I adjusted the price accordingly and went back and forth with the seller until I was satisfied with the purchase price. Much to my liking, a lot of the issues the surveyor addressed have been easy fixes. Some, well not so much, but they will get done.

I did not let the boat go because of maintenance issues. I just adjusted the price according to cost of the items.

I am very pleased with my purchase as I work on her. Some may think she is a POS, but none the less I am proud of her and the work I put forth making her a beauty.

You will find your "bucket list" boat. Vessels come on the market all the time, but if you don't new build, expect something on the survey.
 
Donna said:
You will find your "bucket list" boat. Vessels come on the market all the time, but if you don't new build, expect something on the survey.
Click to expand...

Thanks Donna. I understand. Over the last 40 years I have bought and sold seven boats over 35' All have been surveyed and I have dealt with the issues.

So, my first rodeo this is not. I held a 100 license for 35 years.

This is the first time that I think I have been purposefully deceived about how the boat was built by a broker affiliated with the manufacturer.
 
seasalt007 said:
Thanks Donna. I understand. Over the last 40 years I have bought and sold seven boats over 35' All have been surveyed and I have dealt with the issues.

So, my first rodeo this is not. I held a 100 license for 35 years.

This is the first time that I think I have been purposefully deceived about how the boat was built by a broker affiliated with the manufacturer.
Click to expand...

Then that just stinks. Find another broker and interview them FIRST! I love my broker. Straight forward answers and disclosures. My brokers office is at my marina and have been extremely helpful even after purchase.

Good luck finding your dream boat! :)
 
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Donna said:
Then that just stinks. Find another broker and interview them FIRST! I love my broker. Straight forward answers and disclosures. My brokers office is at my marina and have been extremely helpful even after purchase.

Good luck finding your dream boat! :)
Click to expand...

It's not my broker that is the problem. He is great. It is the listing broker.
 
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Sorry Donna...was not referring to you and your boat.....

It was directed to roguewave's story and so many boaters who believed a previous owner's story or a relatively clean survey that wasn't even close.
 
FF said:
Poor workmanship can easily trump superior materials.
Click to expand...



So true, Fred, remember the warnings about Monday cars?
Most boats are built by hand, and as such are at the mercy of the competence of the labor force.
A few drops of water, sweat or anything oily could create the potential for a breach in the vinylester that could lead to blistering.
 
psneeld said:
Sorry Donna...was not referring to you and your boat.....

It was directed to roguewave's story and so many boaters who believed a previous owner's story or a relatively clean survey that wasn't even close.
Click to expand...

Oh no worries. I didn't think you were referring to me. I have a project boat that I can make my own. Of course if I had an extra hundred grand lying around I think I would have purchased one with no SO many projects! :eek:
 
Donna said:
Oh no worries. I didn't think you were referring to me. I have a project boat that I can make my own. Of course if I had an extra hundred grand lying around I think I would have purchased one with no SO many projects! :eek:
Click to expand...
you and me both....not sure any square inch or system hasn't been worked on in 5 years. :thumb:
 
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Donna said:
Hmm, interesting topic. My survey was not completely clean. I didn't expect it to be. I have a few minor blisters and many other things that need attention immediately that I am working on.

Does anyone ever get a perfectly clean survey?

I adjusted the price accordingly and went back and forth with the seller until I was satisfied with the purchase price. Much to my liking, a lot of the issues the surveyor addressed have been easy fixes. Some, well not so much, but they will get done.

I did not let the boat go because of maintenance issues. I just adjusted the price according to cost of the items.

I am very pleased with my purchase as I work on her. Some may think she is a POS, but none the less I am proud of her and the work I put forth making her a beauty.

You will find your "bucket list" boat. Vessels come on the market all the time, but if you don't new build, expect something on the survey.
Click to expand...
Hi Donna, I have to bug you about something...you said here twice that "I adjusted the price". Actually the seller did that for you.,LOL!
 
Yea but I asked and had a target price.
 
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