This Would Ruin Your Day

Baker said:

Technically, no. It is required by federal law that a pilot report any arrest to the FAA. It is also required by our company that we report an arrest to them. In reality, it would lead to a very drawn out ordeal involving the substance abuse department of the company with treatment a possibility to maintain employment. I do not know anyone personally that has been through it. But that is probably close to how it would go. You would go through counseling with the company's experts and then they would recommend a course of action. I seriously doubt they would just send you on your merry way.



As criminal as this guy is, there is a very real chance he has not been reporting his arrests. The failure to report is a felony. But nothing seems beyond this guy! I would hate to fly with him as the rules certainly don't apply to him.

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Seems kind of crazy IMO to have pilots responsible for reporting reporting their own DUIs. Seems like the court system should report that info to the FAA?

I don't think all pilots with a DUI are going to voluntarily come forward and report. The dishonest ones, like this guy, with things to hide are not going to report.

Reports are that it was still there last night.

hmason said:

If you have cocktails after anchoring you'd best be darn sure you have the correct anchor and enough chain. Don't want to be accused of DUI (dragging under the influence).

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Well played sir, well played!!!:lol:

BandB said:

Keep in mind we're talking 0.15 three hours after the accident. Theoretically that translates to at least a .195 at the time of the accident, probably more like .24, so more in line with his previous BUI. For a 180 lb man .15 is 7 drinks, .20 is 9 or 10 drinks. He had definitely had many Long Island Ice Teas and they were probably each the equivalent of two to three drinks.

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Not necessarily, if drinking heavily one's BAC continues to rise for quite a few hours after one stops drinking.

Beer can range from 2% to 10+%. Read the label!

cardude01 said:

Seems kind of crazy IMO to have pilots responsible for reporting reporting their own DUIs. Seems like the court system should report that info to the FAA?

I don't think all pilots with a DUI are going to voluntarily come forward and report. The dishonest ones, like this guy, with things to hide are not going to report.

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It is under the threat of a felony. That is a pretty serious offense. Also, every time we get our medical certificate we sign a release allowing the FAA access to our driving record on the national driving register. They can ping it anytime they want and there is likely an auto notification in that regard. I do not know for sure. But I'd bet there is.

The effects of intoxication also vary by fatigue level, time of day, medications and physical condition among other things. The three or four beers I have playing poker with my buddies might hit me like a half quart of tequila at 2 a.m. after a crossing from the Bahamas.

Have we established that this is the same Thomas Henry Baker that swiped all those Ferraris? If so, what the hell's he doing on the street?

Greetings,
Sounds like our Mr. TH Baker should be involved in politics...

menzies said:

Is 0.15 "hammered?"

Over the limit, yes, not sure that is hammered?

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Unfortunately the stigma of alcohol and accidents has taken over reality.

Back in the fatigue thread I dared not post...but a lot of research has shown fatigue has more to do with many accidents than the alcohol.

In today's society it is not worth fighting the tide...time will ultimately tell.

But in multiple offender situations...I find it pretty hard to debate.

Baker said:

It is under the threat of a felony. .

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He just doesn't seem to be the type to be concerned about such things, although he did apparently return the money to the guy he sold the Ferrari he didn't own to when the guy determined it was stolen.

menzies said:

Is 0.15 "hammered?"

Over the limit, yes, not sure that is hammered?

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Unfortunately the stigma of alcohol and accidents has taken over reality.

Back in the fatigue thread I dared not post...but a lot of research has shown fatigue has more to do with many accidents than the alcohol.

In today's society it is not worth fighting the tide...time will ultimately tell.

"Officers arrested Baker after his blood alcohol content level tested almost twice the legal limit, with readings at .149 and .155."

psneeld said:

Unfortunately the stigma of alcohol and accidents has taken over reality.

Back in the fatigue thread I dared not post...but a lot of research has shown fatigue has more to do with many accidents than the alcohol.

In today's society it is not worth fighting the tide...time will ultimately tell.

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Thst is what I've read as well.

While drinking and driving is dumb, fatigue is proving to be just as bad if not worse in some cases.

And working while fatigued seems to still be something that is still just considered part of the job in may lines of work.

Capt.Bill11 said:

And working while fatigued seems to still be something that is still just considered part of the job in may lines of work.

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Biggest cause of loss of productivity in business. Huge issue in education as well. Kids today have no set time to go to bed and don't get the sleep they need. So fatigue is a huge issue.

Now that doesn't mean that DUI is any less of any issue. And it's increasing in other ways too as driving under the influence of marijuana is increasing rapidly with it's acceptance into the mainstream and legalization in some states.

The problem is when one causal factors of accidents out shadows another because of myth, politics, bad science, mirepresentative statistics, etc..etc....

Then enforcement and correction is possibly misguided.

"Honey - the good news is that there are some really good pictures of our boat online..."

Bottom line is don't drink and try to operate. Period.

Capt.Bill11 said:

And working while fatigued seems to still be something that is still just considered part of the job in may lines of work.

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Fatigue is tough to judge and tough to self diagnose. And you are correct, there will always be some fatigue to some degree. Just how much is too much??? We turn most of our lights on climbing or descending through 18000 feet. I call those light switches my "fatigue indicators". Because if I am getting tired, I usually forget to turn them off or on.

Luckily, every airline has to have a Fatigue Risk Management program. Ours is very good and I am never afraid to use it. Our company does some pretty "aggressive" scheduling with some trips ripe for fatigue issues. Anyway, I won't go on and on. But just to say it is at the very forefront in the airline safety consciousness.

Baker said:

Fatigue is tough to judge and tough to self diagnose. And you are correct, there will always be some fatigue to some degree. Just how much is too much??? We turn most of our lights on climbing or descending through 18000 feet. I call those light switches my "fatigue indicators". Because if I am getting tired, I usually forget to turn them off or on.

Luckily, every airline has to have a Fatigue Risk Management program. Ours is very good and I am never afraid to use it. Our company does some pretty "aggressive" scheduling with some trips ripe for fatigue issues. Anyway, I won't go on and on. But just to say it is at the very forefront in the airline safety consciousness.

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While true that a fatigued person is the worst judge of their own condition...much like a drunk....

The trick is to understand yourself and lay out irreversible checkpoints prior to entering the domain where you will be fatigued or drinking or whatever else will degrade your abilities. Hopefully your airline has it pretty well pegged....the USCG had a pretty good formal and informal culture of avoiding fatigue related incidents. Not when I started in 1980...but by the time I was in headquarters in the late 1990s, studying fatigue and flying....the info and policy changes were truly profound.

Know thyself...and plan your cruises around that. Some guys are good at staying up all night and cruising till dawn.

I know I fizzle by 2 or 3 Am...I would be a menace without some catnapping. So without the situation or crew...I just don't do it.

Know thyself...both in regular and not so regular abilities...set those limits and things get a lot safer.

We have a huge percentage of our employees who are young. While we actually have required sessions for all new employees regarding fatigue, partying and anything that impacts being ready for work and able to function at your best, much is aimed toward the younger employees. Most people have never been taught anything about sleep and the need for it. They're under the impression they can get along fine without it, until some of them actually do a test on more sleep and are amazed at the change in how they feel through the day.

Baker said:

BandB and I are on the same page. And what sort of self respecting grown man drinks Long Island Ice Tea????!!!!

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If you ever had a properly concocted Long Island Iced Tea you would understand how a self respecting man can order one. Have a couple of those and you will know the true definition of hammered. It's interesting to note that the Edgartown Yacht Club in Martha's Vineyard has had enough experience with the Tea, that they will no longer serve them.

menzies said:

Is 0.15 "hammered?"

Over the limit, yes, not sure that is hammered?

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I never drink to excess. The question comes, what is excessive?

Out of curiosity I bought a BAC meter. At home a couple of times I tried to see how much alcohol it would take to put me over the legal limit and for how long. I drank as I would normally, only would have more drinks than I would normally. I tested my BAC along the way. The times that I did this test, my BAC never got to .08%. Before I got there I felt enough of the affects of the alcohol that I knew I would never have taken another drink if I was on the boat or out socially.

It was obvious that before I got to .08% I was impaired and should not be trusted to operate a vehicle or make critical decisions quickly. Sure, I place a lot of value on being in control and expect good performance from myself, but I became convinced that a BAC of .05% would be a much better legal standard.

At .15% a person is seriously impaired whatever term you want to give it.

hmason said:

If you ever had a properly concocted Long Island Iced Tea you would understand how a self respecting man can order one. Have a couple of those and you will know the true definition of hammered. It's interesting to note that the Edgartown Yacht Club in Martha's Vineyard has had enough experience with the Tea, that they will no longer serve them.

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That is kinda my point. I know they are strong. But because of that, they are generally a college drink....a drink a college student would order because his sole purpose is getting hammered. There is nothing else that is redeeming about the concoction.

dhays said:

at .015% a person is seriously impaired whatever term you want to give it.

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0.15%

BandB said:

0.15%

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Thanks. Fixed.

Even sober I suck at typing and editing.

Wifey B: You know the inventor of Long Island Iced Tea is a dude named Butts. So knocks you on your butt. You're right, the whole idea behind it is to get as much alcohol in a smooth drink that one can drink quickly as possible. Now, this guy claims to have invented it and that all the other claims are myths. Still interesting he has his own website. Home The shame is how many people drink not to enjoy drinking but simply to get drunk.

In fighting with condo owners that think they own everything as far as they can see , and towns that get greedy , the concept the vessel is "navigating" while anchored is used.

So when both hooks are down in a snug harbor , can the locals smash aboard with an alcohol measuring machine ?

FF said:

In fighting with condo owners that think they own everything as far as they can see , and towns that get greedy , the concept the vessel is "navigating" while anchored is used.

So when both hooks are down in a snug harbor , can the locals smash aboard with an alcohol measuring machine ?

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I have never seen an answer to that.

After doing my own self test with a BAC meter, I know that I don't have to worry about it. My alcohol consumption habits never put me over the typical .08% legal limit, at anchor or not.

The boat is now sitting on it's side on the beach 8 days post grounding.

BandB said:

The boat is now sitting on it's side on the beach 8 days post grounding.

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Salvage.

It is accepted here that if a boat is anchored or moored,random breath testing is not available to authorities.
It is an unwise skipper who becomes inebriated while anchored. Who knows how and when an emergency may "emerge". Same goes for crew who could be needed.