Gravel barge just flipped in Seattle ship canal

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twistedtree

twistedtree

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Wow, a gravel barge just flipped in the Seattle ship canal. It was tied up at Ballard Sand and Gravel, actually three barges side by side. The middle one flipped and come down on top of the outermost barge. They were loading or unloading at the time, so presumably some excessive imbalance caused it. The two entangled barges are drifting free and appear to have come up against a pier. We are directly across the canal and heard it and have been watching since.

The police on scene reported to the CG over VHF that all people were accounted for, no injuries, and no fuel spills.
 

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Just a quick correction. It's Salmon Bay Sand and Gravel, not Ballard Sand and Gravel.
 
I am surprised that this would happen. I would think that there would be enough folks working on the barge to call out any problem with load distribution. But then I know nothing about the barges other than watching them go up and down the Sound in front of my house as a kid.
 
May not just flipped from the load...leaks and flooding could be a factor.
 
dhays said:
Good point. Do some barges have ballast tanks as well?
Click to expand...

Don't know of any, am much more familiar with very small barges.

Do believe some are required to have watertight compartments....can't say about hopper barges.
 
This is pure speculation, but here goes.....

Obviously the barge was overloaded on one side to have flipped. So the question seems to be how it got so overloaded without the crane operator realizing it. They load and unload the barges with a crane with a clamshell bucket, and it runs from 7:00 to 3:00 every day. I've been watching them for 2 years now. It's not like this is the first time the guy has done it.

So here's my theory. There were three barges lashed together, and the one in the middle flipped. My guess is that the loading was way out of balance, but because there were barges lashed on both side, they were carrying much of the weight. As a result, the imbalanced barge didn't show the list that would otherwise have been apparent were it not ballasted by the other barges. Then, the lines parted from the strain, it tipped abruptly, loads shifted, and over she went.

Others have brought up water infiltration, and that's certainly possible. I could see that seriously exacerbating the situation. But something allowed it to go from OK to upside down very abruptly, and the parting -lines theory is the only explanation I can come up with, even if flooding was a compounding problem.

Also mentioned was double hulls and internal flotation. I don't know with any certainty, but looking at both barges I would guess that there is internal flotation in the form of sealed compartments or something similar. The upright barge that is carrying much of the flipped barge has one corner, if not two, well under water. If there were no flotation the barge would have sunk, and it's still floating. Similarly, the flipped barge has one whole side under water. Without flotation is would surely have slid off the upright barge and sunk, but it remains in position. And last, when the tugs showed up to fetch the two barges which were adrift, they were able to maneuver them back into their original berth positions. I was a bit surprised that the flipped barge wasn't dragging on the bottom, but it appears not. Flotation seems the likely explanation.
 
When I worked at Western Towboat we towed those barges for Salmon Bay to the gravel pit in Steilacoom all the time. Its not unheard of to flip one from time to time. In this case not being there I have no idea, the barge could have been leaking and flipped or as above it could have been a loading issue. Time will tell. At least no one was hurt.
 
78puget-trawler said:
When I worked at Western Towboat we towed those barges for Salmon Bay to the gravel pit in Steilacoom all the time. Its not unheard of to flip one from time to time. In this case not being there I have no idea, the barge could have been leaking and flipped or as above it could have been a loading issue. Time will tell. At least no one was hurt.
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Those barges going to and from the sand and gravel quarry in University Place were the ones I grew up watching. Our beach used to be nice and sandy from the barges being washed down and all that sand flowing North with the current. When that practice stopped, the sandy beach slowly went away.

The site is now Chambers Bay Golf Course and the old pier was removed right before the US Open to make for better television.
 
Yeah, its the same place. They closed it all down for the golfers. I don't know where SB gets its sand now.
 
Wow-Peter-hadn't seen that yet. Like most here, have seen those barges up and down the Ship Canal all the time. I think the sand and gravel comes from over on the Kitsap Peninsula somewhere, I know there has been a lot of controversy over there the last few years about expanding gravel mine.

Guess that's a gravel bottom over there now!
 
All Barges have water tight compartments. It is the only way they float. And if one has an undetected leak.....
 
Pgitug said:
All Barges have water tight compartments. It is the only way they float. And if one has an undetected leak.....
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The space between the coaming of the barges shown and the outside of the hull are broken into water tight compartments with access through manholes on the deck. Furthermore the bow (rake) is also watertight.

The fact that most barges today do have water tight compartments is not the reason they float. It allows for containment of problems and ability to inspect, and recover as necessary isolate a leak. A barge or for that matter most any vessel floats because it weighs less than the water it is displacing. Historically there have been thousands of single skin non compartmentalized barges and boats that float.

I would refer you to Mr. Archimedes and his principle.
 
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ulysses said:
The space between the coaming of the barges shown and the outside of the hull are broken into water tight compartments with access through manholes on the deck. Furthermore the bow (rake) is also watertight.

The fact that most barges today do have water tight compartments is not the reason they float. It allows for containment of problems and ability to inspect, and recover as necessary isolate a leak. A barge or for that matter most any vessel floats because it weighs less than the water it is displacing. Historically there have been thousands of single skin non compartmentalized barges and boats that float.

I would refer you to Mr. Archimedes and his principle.
Click to expand...

Thus endeth today's science lesson.....:)
 
Pgitug said:
All Barges have water tight compartments. It is the only way they float. And if one has an undetected leak.....
Click to expand...

Yes, looking more closely at the overturned barge it is clear that the hull is a closed container and the cargo rides on top.

It's going to take one hell of a crane to get that thing lifted off the other barge and turned upright. If nothing else, it's a long reach. I didn't see it come and go, but apparently a barge and crane arrived yesterday, took one look, and left with it's tail between it's legs. Should make for interesting watching over the next few days or however long it takes.
 
I haven't been following this on the new but I am pretty certain with the number of really big crane barges nearby that flipping it over will be a matter of course. FOSS has a huge one and there are others around.
 
78puget-trawler said:
I haven't been following this on the new but I am pretty certain with the number of really big crane barges nearby that flipping it over will be a matter of course. FOSS has a huge one and there are others around.
Click to expand...

Being completely unfamiliar with them, I am always amazed at what the large equipment can accomplish.
 
ulysses said:
The space between the coaming of the barges shown and the outside of the hull are broken into water tight compartments with access through manholes on the deck. Furthermore the bow (rake) is also watertight.

The fact that most barges today do have water tight compartments is not the reason they float. It allows for containment of problems and ability to inspect, and recover as necessary isolate a leak. A barge or for that matter most any vessel floats because it weighs less than the water it is displacing. Historically there have been thousands of single skin non compartmentalized barges and boats that float.

I would refer you to Mr. Archimedes and his principle.
Click to expand...

They may be "watertight" by design, but I've never seen one that was. I can't speak to ocean going barges, but the ones on the Ohio River are less than. They do have separate compartments accessed by manholes, but I've never seen a seal/gasket in place on one of those manholes. A captain can plow the head of the tow and flood those compartments in no time which meant a 1000' walk with the pump and hose = :mad: deckhand. Additionally, freeboard on a loaded barge could be as little as a foot and a half. Taking wind swells abeam could also flood the compartments. If the gravel barge listed far enough to wash those manholes, there would be no way to respond quickly enough to stop it IMHO
 
Notland.... Ah someone else that has made that journey with a pump and hose. What you say is true but in this instance I do not see where the wind swells or "plow" would apply to a barge docked inside another barge. I would have to go with the broken lines / cables while unloading speculation as to flipping over. Typically you would think that they would unload or load from one end NOT the Sides. Could have been in inexperienced operator on the clam shell bucket.
 
ulysses said:
Notland.... Ah someone else that has made that journey with a pump and hose. What you say is true but in this instance I do not see where the wind swells or "plow" would apply to a barge docked inside another barge. I would have to go with the broken lines / cables while unloading speculation as to flipping over. Typically you would think that they would unload or load from one end NOT the Sides. Could have been in inexperienced operator on the clam shell bucket.
Click to expand...

I am having a hard time visualizing how they would load a barge that was in the middle of two other barges. The only loading operations I have watched, were single barges loaded alongside a pier. These were all loaded with conveyors so I don't know how they do with with a clamshell loader.
 
ulysses said:
Notland.... Ah someone else that has made that journey with a pump and hose. What you say is true but in this instance I do not see where the wind swells or "plow" would apply to a barge docked inside another barge. I would have to go with the broken lines / cables while unloading speculation as to flipping over. Typically you would think that they would unload or load from one end NOT the Sides. Could have been in inexperienced operator on the clam shell bucket.
Click to expand...
Merely an attempt to illustrate how quickly this situation occurs. I agree the wires would have to break, but the wires breaking in and of themselves would not make the barge roll. Improper loading coupled with compartment flooding is only my guess without having been there. I have never seen loading/unloading from the end of the barge. I suppose it is possible but seems logistically difficult in terms of "reach". OH River barges are 195' LOA so it would require big equipment.
 
I can not think of any barge that is NOT loaded and unloaded from one end to the other. There exists the very probable risk of "breaking the back" if not loaded /unloaded from one end or the other. You also do not want to load the two ends with nothing in the middle same outcome only you break the back the other way. I assume you worked on the Ohio but must have missed the loading and unloading operations so therefore were not a tankerman or on a fleet boat. You may also note if you visit a liquid dock that tank barges being unloaded will always "roll" the product back to the pump end of the barge and load the tanks closest to the pump first.

Any problem with "reach" of the unloading equipment is corrected by moving the barges up or down the dock if the equipment is not capable of moving on the dock itself.
 
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ulysses said:
I can not think of any barge that is NOT loaded and unloaded from one end to the other. There exists the very probable risk of "breaking the back" if not loaded /unloaded from one end or the other. You also do not want to load the two ends with nothing in the middle same outcome only you break the back the other way. I assume you worked on the Ohio but must have missed the loading and unloading operations so therefore were not a tankerman or on a fleet boat. You may also note if you visit a liquid dock that tank barges being unloaded will always "roll" the product back to the pump end of the barge and load the tanks closest to the pump first.

Any problem with "reach" of the unloading equipment is corrected by moving the barges up or down the dock if the equipment is not capable of moving on the dock itself.
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Haha! It's perspective, I suppose. When you said "loaded from the end" I visualized the barge being nosed into the bank, so to speak. You are correct, a barge is loaded from one end to another, parallel to the bank. :thumb: No, I was not a tankerman, we called them line boats, not fleet boats. :)
 
Freight barges, mostly containers, but also heavy equipment, trucks etc. are usually loaded and unloaded from the center of the barge. In AK, ramps are used to drive the wheeled stuff off, as well as large forklifts picking up containers. Sometimes depending on where one is, cranes are used to pick off the stuff stacked on top of containers which are often stacked 3 and 4 high. About the only time freight barges are loaded from the ends is when its a beach and ramp situation where no cranes can reach, or when using certain docks that are purposely set up for ramp work. The barge is loaded as it goes, one end to the other until the center section is reached which is usually left with just enough room to turn a forklift around to begin unloading at destination.
 
78puget-trawler said:
Freight barges, mostly containers, but also heavy equipment, trucks etc. are usually loaded and unloaded from the center of the barge. In AK, ramps are used to drive the wheeled stuff off, as well as large forklifts picking up containers. Sometimes depending on where one is, cranes are used to pick off the stuff stacked on top of containers which are often stacked 3 and 4 high. About the only time freight barges are loaded from the ends is when its a beach and ramp situation where no cranes can reach, or when using certain docks that are purposely set up for ramp work. The barge is loaded as it goes, one end to the other until the center section is reached which is usually left with just enough room to turn a forklift around to begin unloading at destination.[/QUOTE

Makes sense. I was talking about bulk material barges.
Click to expand...
 
Notlandlockedforlong said:
Haha! It's perspective, I suppose. When you said "loaded from the end" I visualized the barge being nosed into the bank, so to speak. You are correct, a barge is loaded from one end to another, parallel to the bank. :thumb: No, I was not a tankerman, we called them line boats, not fleet boats. :)
Click to expand...


I made the same mistake in visualizing it.
 
78puget,,, I appreciate your 2 cents worth except that I don't think you have a very good perspective either. I am not talking about where a ramp is or where the fork truck enters or exits a barge. I am speaking of the weights of the load. What you described as the fork truck coming in at the middle of a barge and loading one end to the middle and then continuing down the barge is placing the loads at one end and then working to the middle. The small amount of room to turn the fork truck around is not really important nor where the ramp is located. Primarily and as you described the process the weight of the load is distributed equally over the barge starting by placing the weight of the first portion of the load on one end.
To continue the science portion of this discussion, I might suggest John La Dage's "Stability and Trim for the Ship's Officer" as an excellent reference on loading and unloading a vessel without "breaking its back". Believe it or not there is a right and wrong way of loading and unloading barges whether the equipment you are using is a fork truck, overhead crane, pump and pipeline, or shovels and wheelbarrow and no matter where the equipment enters upon the vessel.
 
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Thank you for the physics lesson! I guess I don't know much about it other than what I did for a long time working on tugs and loading barges. There is nothing wrong with my perspective, it just might not be the same as yours. I wasn't talking about anything you said other than to address "any". And I don't care anyway, I am retired! Thanks.
 
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