New Member - New Owner of a Cheer Man PT-42 Europa - Red Gypsy

As a new member of this forum and a new owner of PT-42 Europa Trawler, I wanted to see if any other other members have this boat. I will be bring her from Fort Lauderdale, Fla to East Greenwich, Rhode Island in early May. We are excited at the prospect of making this journey and have been hard at work making her ready.

Red Gypsy has twin Lehman SP225 engines and a WMD 8 Westerbeke Genset. I was wondering if anyone has created a speed/RPM* fuel burn table for this boat.

The prior owner provided a spreadsheet that shows a 5gph burn for both engines at 9 knots. Having looked at the generic fuel burn curve for the SP225 engines, it looks more like 4-5 Per engine per hour. Since this is a 100% difference, I was wondering if anyone has any experience they can share. The boat is between 28,000 lbs with a standard* Cheer man semi displacement hull.

I saw posting for the PT-38 and the two boats look very similar.*

I look forward to feedback from the forum community and look forward to being part of the Trawler crowd.

I will post pictures shortly



-- Edited by Coast Guard Dave on Monday 7th of February 2011 03:59:47 PM

Hi Dave,
Good luck with your new boat. I am an owner of a PT-38 Europa and my wife and I love her dearly. She is equipped with twin Perkins 135's and this summer we tracked a burn rate of about 3gph for both engines at 8.5knots.

Although, really not helpful to you.....I just like to brag about our "Lucky Find III"

Again, I wish you the best and I am sure you will love cruising in your "new to you" yacht.

-- Edited by albaris on Monday 7th of February 2011 03:59:14 PM

Al,

Thank you for your welcome. As I make my journey from Florida, I hope to post from time to time.
I look forward to learning more about your PT-38. I will look for
Original Manuals and will post if I find any. The former owner left many
Documents but they are on the boat.

I am on a plane and they are about to close the door. Thank you again for your fast reply and welcome and I look forward to
Writing with you again.

David

Congratulations Dave

A gentleman named Rick Hudson who's PT is in the same marina as us has tracked down 23 PT owners across North America. We welcome you to join the list, just send me an private message with you information and I will make sure you are added. I have some of the manuals and will share, just need your email. Check out our website to see what we have.

Dave,
Where in Lauderdale are you fitting her out?

She is docked at a private home on 21st in Fort Lauderdale. I am having her painted and new electronics installed before i bring her to NE. Where do you keep your boat? I may be n Florida in the next few weeks to check on the work. Please send me a private message with your contact information if you are in Florida and would like to see her when I a in Florida.

Regards

David

Dave,

Mines not a Europa and the boat was re-engined from the original Lehman's with 225HP John Deeres.* But, I think our hull are basically the same and my displacement is also 28, 000.*

I don't have a speed/burn graph.* However, so far I have found that I get 1½ nautical miles per gallon on trips at a rough average speed of 9.5 knots (about 1,500 RPM) ...or about 6.3 GPH.* That does include some generator time at anchorage and I also usually have a couple of 15-20 minute speed runs to blow out the cobwebs.* This is based on topping off my tanks afterwards.* So, anyway, 5GPH at a steady 9 knots doesn't sound out of the question.

BTW, not trying to be picky, but it's Cheer Men, not Man.




-- Edited by Tonic on Thursday 10th of February 2011 01:23:33 AM

Hi Dave, Welcome aboard!, I joined Trawler Forum last Jan. however have not been too active, sort of forgot about it, needless to say, it is a great source of information especially for older boats. As you might have already discovered, there are not alot of PTs around. It has been fun searching and you will likely come to love your PT as all PT owners do. My europa sedan is an 86, so yours is a later model and some changes were obviously made. Its the overall look and proportions that I love. As for the fuel consumption, we have a single SP225 turbo diesel and usually cruise @ 8 kts +/-.
I figure we burn approx. 2.5 ga. / hour. Fuel has never been an issue at this rate and that is why we specifically bought a single screw. She has vetus bow thruster and hydraulic stern thruster, so manuverabillity not a problem. Anyway, RED GYPSY looks great. Have fun!
Mike Martin
"CANTINA"
PT 41 Europa Sedan

Mike,

Thank you for taking the time to post your fuel burn information. My boat has twin SP225's so I assume the burn will be around 4.5 to 5.5 GPH at
8 Kts. I plan to create a table that I will share with the group. Also I will be happy to scan and post any manuals that I come upon. If you send me your email, I can forward a few documents that I have collected so far. If you have additional pictures of your PT, I woud love to see them.
I just had a radar mount made and I am installing a Raymarine RL80c Plus chart plotter at the lower helm and 70c Plus on the upper. Went with a 48mi pathfinder raydome. Also installed a new VHF radio with DSC and AIS. The Audo pilot and depth sounders were in good shape.

I look forward to learning about any tips you have that you think are unique to these boats.

Regards,

David

Hi Dave, My email is:* michaelmartinarchitect@cox.net
I will try to send more photos of my boat in the near future and hope to see more of yours as well. The 41s are scarce and I have not come across any 42s like yours either. I've been surfing the net and talking to other PT owners since sep. 2008 and just not many around. Lots of 38s out there and they are almost the same.
Talk again soon,
Mike Martin

Dave, Here are a couple* more shots of Cantina. I'm curious about the layout of your 42. I assume the PT did not change too drastically in a year. Thats Nina, my wife and McKenna, my daughter @ the wheel. Later.

Mike,

Great Pictures ! Here are some dated pictures of the interior. My wife has claimed ownership of the interior and will be spending time this year making some changes. I will be happy to send photos as this project evolves. Our goal, like yours is to keep the charm of the original interior while makeing some updates and color changes. I really like what you have done.* Was the helm seat added before you purchased the boat or did you added it. If you added it, what is the make, model, did you have to remove more then the original helm seat and storage to fit it in? Do you like it?* Regards,* David

Dave, I see your layout is very similar except for the nav station. Will come in handy for that cruise up the coast. Looks very nice inside, like new! The helm chair in mine was installed by me in 2008. I did not alter the space for the chair. There is about 2" behind the backrest to the cabinet so the chair can rotate. I can get by the chair to get*out through the door, but the footrest must be in the UP possition. I installed a teak footrest on the bulkhead beneath the wheel because it seams more stable to have your feet on a seperate footrest in heavy seas. I ordered it from Llebroc Industries. Many styles and options, colors, etc. Mine is the BANDERA II with COGNAC ultra leather with black stitching. The base is powder coated black and screwed to the cabin sole. I will eventually go back and "thru bolt" the base to the floor, as it is currently screwed. The chair seems solid but they are very well built and Heavy so it is better to be thru bolted. I love the chair, very comfortable and endless compliments. Rather pricey but lets face it, this is a boat.
Regards,
Mike

-- Edited by Cantina on Thursday 3rd of March 2011 11:58:48 AM

-- Edited by Cantina on Thursday 3rd of March 2011 11:59:53 AM

Mike,

I do like what you did to fit your helm seat into the space. I will look into it as an upgrade. I just had a radar mast made to cleanup the radar arch. I will send you a picture. I have also added AlgaeX to the fuel lines, added a second VHf, DSC, AIS radio as well as other upgrades. As mentioned, I will send photos when done.

Where do you keep your boat? What type of trips have you and your family made?

I just found out that I won the $5000.00 Namtuckett Boat Basin contest, so I think we will be going there this summer. It included 2 nights stay at the marina, dinner for 4, spa for 4 , passes for 4 to the museum and a days fishing or sailing charter. I never win anything so I was quite surprised and excited We were at this marina a few years ago and it was very nice. Our boat at the time a 36 foot Searay seemed like the smallest boat in the marina. Most of the other boats were large yachts or super yachts.

I found sources for oil filters for the Lehman SP225 that less costly then through American Diesel. They can be found on www.filterbarn.com and are Cummings. Fleet guard - oil filter. Part number. *LF3343.

I ordered the rest of the spair parts kit from American Diesel.

Dave, Congrats on your 5K winnings! Maybe its your lucky year. I moor Cantina in Newport Beach Harbor. We don't have much time for extended cruises, so we have been cruising to Catalina Island for 3 and*5 night trips where our yacht club has a landing. ( About 27 miles out from the mainland) Its great fun and alot of boating people we know. ( Balboa Yacht Club ). It does get rough in the channel some times and the boat has handled it well. The Cummins oil filter you mentioned is the same I use and paid $95 for it once. I have found online source as well but have to purchase 6 filters to get them for about $49 apiece. I will check out your source, thanks for the info. Love to see your new mast when its up. M

Mike,

Has Rick retuned? I would love to get on his PT list so I can connect to other PT owners if needed. I will be bringing "Red Gypsy" from Fort Lauderdale to Rhode Island towards the end of this month. My guess is that if the weather works for us, it sill take about 10 days.

I am still waiting for some work to be completed in Florida, before we take off. Most of it is cosmetic restoration - I hate hairline cracks so I am having them all ground out and the boat painted. The hull does not have this problem so it just needed a good compounding and polish.

Have you or any of the other members soda blasted the bottom of your boats or done more then straight annual bottom painting? Looking to get data points on others experience with condition, treatment and maintenance of bottoms on these vessels.

Mike,

I love what you did with the helm station. At some point, I may follow in your direction. As mentioned, my wife has taken ownership for the interior. This even includes TV selection! I will send pictures to you as the changes evolve. I really like what you have done with the salon in your boat.

I changed the 12v bulbs in the salon to LEDs. I have tried both soft and bright white. Still not happy. Thinking about replacing fixtures with some other type. I currently have 8 standard round two bulb cabin lights. What have you used? Are you happy with the amount and color of the light? I am looking for even lighting and enough intensity so you can see at night. May also augment with lamps. Let me know of you have any suggestions.

Thx
David

Dave, I did not make any changes to the salon lighting....yet. They are the standard ceiling mounted lights, and I don't really use them that often, seem a little bright. I like lamps better. they make the space feel homey and give off a softer light. Also a lamp shade sheilds the bulb. The right shade will make the room. As for the bottom paint, I had Cantina hauled Feb. 2009 and repainted. The bottom has no blisters and actually looked very good, so no need for anything other than paint and zincs. Its time again.*Good luck on your voyage up the coast. Sounds like you have really made alot of improvements and upgrades to your boat so have fun...enjoy the ride!

*

Superdiver, The helm chair does take up alot of room, read my previous post ( about 6 posts up ). I feel there is ample room to pass through the door, when the footrest is UP. I'm 6' tall and 178 pounds, so I don't need too much room but as I expand over the years, this could be a problem! Hope my explanation gives you a better picture.

Cheers, Mike Martin

*

Dave:

C&L 44, so similar hull. twin Volvos, 200 hp each,so similar power. 8.2knot cruise,so similar usage.
4gph consistently, including diesel stove and genset usage.
Your 5 gph at 9 knots sounds right.

BEWARE , comparing boats with say a 35ft lwl , the difference in power required between 9K , 8K and slower is HUGE!!

For a 36ft LWL , about 7K is where cheap to operate stops, an extra 2K (9K) may cost 2X the 7k burn.

Good point. We have been buring 6.5 gal an hour at an average speed of 8.5 Knots. Yesterday with lots of wind and current at 9.3 knots we burned an average of 8.8 GPH. When I return, I plan to post our fuel burn numbers for the Twin Lehman SP225 Engines.* To your point a Trawler that is 45 feet will have different numbers then a 38 with different engines. However, it is an interesting data point.

Just returned from by run from Fort Lauderdale to Rhode Island. 1700 Miles to figure out fuel burn with twin SP225 Lehman Diesels.
I found that at on average I burned 6.5 gallons per hour at 1600 RPM with a average speed of 8.6 knots. At 1400, I would be close to the 4.5 to 5 per hour and at 1800-1850, 8 to 8.5 gallons per hour . Add wind and current and these numbers get better or worse as expected.
Given that five people plus gear plus a heavy dingy were aboard, I was pleased with these numbers.

If interested, I created a website for the trip: www.redgypsy.net

Besides pictures and blogs, I will also be posting reference materials on the major systems as I have time or find them so that the Cheer Men community can begin to build a reference Library. If these type of site exists or you have material that can be posted, let me know.

Regards,

Coast Guard Dave

Dave,

Very nicely done on the website. Also quite an adventure in the telling. *Thanks for sharing!

*

Mike

Brookings, Oregon

Welcome CG Dave. You have chosen to fly with the eagles and can now look down on those lesser Javex bottle boats that clutter our waterways. May the teak fairy bless you and care for your brightwork this season, and for many to come.

Dave B is right, we have a Pacific NW group (now 31 boats) but we are strictly a paper tiger, and haven't actually DONE anything yet. But we share boat names, home ports and cell phones, so it's hoped that we will arrange some informal cruising among the boats in the future.

I am happy to add you to our elite group, but warn that you will forever be an outsider, forced to sit at the back of shareholder meetings, and reduced to nibbling the dry sandwiches afterwards, because (a) you are 42', not 38', and (b) you are on the right hand edge, and we are all lefties. [Note that only Delta still treats PT-38s as handluggage. I am unclear on their policy regarding PT-42s, so getting across to visit us may be expensive.]

Safe cruising, wherever your final destination may be.

Rick Hudson

"Raincoast Gypsy" PT-38

Sidney, BC

Rick,

Thank you for making me the first right edge member. The 38 and the 42 are so similar they are often mistaken to be twins. If I get three months and hit the lottery, I will plan a trip to meet the my left edge friends in the BC area. I am sorry it has taken so long to respond but I have swamped since bring the boat up from Florida. I look forward to hearing from you and being added to and getting a copy of your list I hope to start scanning some original manuals and other materials soon. I will post them on www.redgypsy.net under the resource section. If you or anyone has any vendors or sources you want to share, I will be happy to post them.

Regards

David

Hi CG Dave,

Currently cruising in the Broughton archipelago, a group of ragtag islands north of Vancouver Island, where comm is sporadic. Any scanned data would be of great interest to others, as original instructions tend to be lacking when buying a 25 year old boat! One of our Pacific NW members even has the original showroom brochure from 1983! Oy vey, but things were cheaper then. Not necessarily better, but cheaper.

Wish you could see the sunset I'm looking at.

Regards,

Rick Hudson

"Raincoast Gypsy" PT-38

North Saanich, BC

Rick,

Sounds beautiful. As I sit in the rain today, I will dream of
beautiful sunsets. It would be great if we could create an
archive everyone could leverage to better understand
the boat and systems. Will start to dig soon.

David

Rick,

I hope you made it back safely from your Joirney . Since we last spoke I have been adding new systems to the boat. This winter I am having the props done as well as the cutless bearings.

When you get a chance, I was hoping to get the list of PT owners you have put together. Let me know of you need info from me.


I look forward to hearing more about what you have been doing with your boat. I looked at the pictures you sent again . What a beautiful boat.

Be well

David

Hi Dave,

Welcome to the wonderful world of PT ownership! May your seas be calm and your teak decks never leak. I have lots of fuel performance data for my PT-38, which came with a Perkins* 135 hp, but that won't help you.

Really just writing to wish you well with your new pride & joy and to let you know that at the 2011 AGM of the Most Exalted PT-38 Owners of North America (MEPTONA) it was, after considerable debate, resolved that we would allow PT-42-ers into the society, and*induct them into the secret handshake. An agent will be contacting you shortly. When someone says, "Your cat is full of resin", you reply, "It is hot in Beijing today." Instructions to follow.

Regards,

Rick Hudson

"Raincoast Gypsy" PT-38

Sidney, BC

Sent from my SNOWBERRY, Atyrau, Kazakhstan