Europa design?

Hi
We are curious about trawler owners who have chosen "Europa" designs over the standard aft cabin layout. We are moving from sailboats to trawlers and will be cruising in the Pacific Northwest and British Columbia. I realize this is strictly a personal decision and all boats are trade offs but we are gravitating towards the "Europa" because of the easy access to outside, comfortable outside seating area and the lack of stairs that many trawlers have. The main trade off is the V berth cabin which we are comfortable with. Would like to hear from other owners..
thanks

Like you said, it is totally a personal decision. That being said, there were ten times as many classic Grand Banks built as Europa versions, so someone must like the aft cabin classic style.

But personally, I agree with your selection for exactly the reasons you gave. To be somewhat snarky, I think that the aft cabin version is for dock queens and the Europa is for cruisers. I am sure I will get a lot of argument about that assertion, from Marin for sure.


David

We bought a C&L Europa 44' that has a sun deck. There is a steep clime to the upper area off the aft deck. We bought her for the looks , space, windows & class. There is a master v birth, with two guest bunks. Large saloon. We like her.

My wife will not go in aft cabin because of the ladder stairs. For a live a boards boat, I advise if you can not get on off the boat with one hand prefer not hands. Even our motor home with two steps outside and another 3 inside is a bit much with no hands. My wife bought the Eagle because of easy entry and the large COVERED stern deck.

Greetings,
Mr, bc. We've had both the aft cabin and the "Europa". We much prefer the latter, primarily for the large saloon and the all around views. When you think about it, unless you are newlyweds, how much time do you spend in bed? We also prefer complete walk around decks as opposed to a full width saloon. Makes things a lot easier to go from bow to stern without walking inside, particularly with soaking foul weather gear although I understand it never rains in the PNW. On rare occasions where is might rain, the deck overhang protects the saloon windows somewhat.

bcarli said:

Hi
We are curious about trawler owners who have chosen "Europa" designs over the standard aft cabin layout. We are moving from sailboats to trawlers and will be cruising in the Pacific Northwest and British Columbia. I realize this is strictly a personal decision and all boats are trade offs but we are gravitating towards the "Europa" because of the easy access to outside, comfortable outside seating area and the lack of stairs that many trawlers have. The main trade off is the V berth cabin which we are comfortable with. Would like to hear from other owners..
thanks

Click to expand...

We just went through the same process, sail to power. We also went from an aft cabin sailboat to a forward cabin power boat. I am sitting in the Pilothouse now after spending our first night on the boat. So recognize that I have little to know actual knowledge.

For all the reasons mentioned so far, I think the Europa is a more practical PNW design. The aft cabin designs give plenty of rear deck space, but not covered deck space.

However, there are a lot of aft cabin Grand Banks around here that cover all of the Salish Sea. They command a high price in the market and have a good reputation. So lots of folks must love them for our waters.

If you get a big enough Europa, you can have your cake and eat it too....ie an aft cabin also. A GB52 has an aft cabin!!!

Anyway, I think you should also look at pilothouse boats as they offer the same advantages as a Europa plus a proper pilothouse. And again, if you get big enough, you are blessed with a mid cabin master.

bcarli said:

Hi
We are curious about trawler owners who have chosen "Europa" designs over the standard aft cabin layout...easy access to outside, comfortable outside seating area and the lack of stairs that many trawlers have.

Click to expand...

I struggle with this one all the time. I have always liked the openness of a "sedan" Europa or otherwise. I like a clear view aft. The biggest hurdle I now have is ladders which are hard to avoid on one level boats. But that issue is one of age, me not the boat. Up and down a bridge ladder, most times carrying something becomes a struggle for old joints.

Aft or Tri cabins have just as many steps, deck to bridge, but are usually broken up and have some stair like quality.

A very nice setup is the 48 Offshore...Europa covered side decks, a cockpit ladder AND interior stairs to the bridge. There are some nice ones for sale on our coast.

1997 Offshore 48 Sedan Power Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com


http://www.yachtworld.com/core/list...=broker&&hosturl=grandyachts&&ywo=grandyachts&

I have had both configurations and I liked both. But then I really like boats.

Like Hogwash, I think a big plus of the tri-cabin is the ease of access to the fly: short flights of steps rather than one long ladder. Having said that, some of the newer, bigger Europas have stairs rather than ladders to go up to the fly.

With tri-cabins you get a lot of privacy between the two staterooms, which may be important to some.

The cockpit on the Europa is very practical as it provides a convenient covered space to enjoy the outdoor views. This is particular useful with good weather, less so in wet or cold days. The covered sides are great in hot weather for keeping the sun from coming into the saloon.

So some of the factors to consider are how many will be cruising, in what weather and how much you plan to use the flybridge.

Xlantic; said:

But then I really like boats...some of the newer, bigger Europas have stairs rather than ladders to go up

Click to expand...

All of your points are the same as mine. I looked at a 34 Mainship recently that had a nice set of molded steps to the bridge, but alas, that was about all I liked on it. Sigh.

Now, if I can get personal; you and Xsbank can chose to ignore the question, if you chose.

What is the significance of "X"?
I've only ever seen it here.

One of the feTures of my boat that I am enjoying is the easy steps up to the fly bridge from the Pilothouse. There also is a ladder up from the cockpit, but so far I have rarely used it, opting for the easy steps instead.

Hawgwash said:

Now, if I can get personal; you and Xsbank can chose to ignore the question, if you chose.

What is the significance of "X"?
I've only ever seen it here.

Click to expand...

My "X" means "trans" as I have spent half my life on one side of the Atlantic and the other half on the other side, at least for now.

Over to Xsbank.

I've had both.. liked the separation of the tri cabin for those times when the Admiral gets amorous... but prefer the Europa like the 40' ocean alexander europa we currently cruise. We step down 3 steps to the head and both Pullman and v berth cabins.. but if one has a hard time with ladders the fly bridge would be pretty tough.
I love having the salon door open in the rain and walking out on one level.

HOLLYWOOD

I think all of the main positive points about the Europa design have been made. I made the trade off between a pilot house and a Europa based on one fact. A pilothouse is useful when underway. When not, it is mostly wasted space (save for morning coffee.) I'm sure that I'll get feedback, but I'd wager that pilothouses are used what, 5-10% of the time that we actually spend on our boats? The rest of the time, that space serves as a big barrier between where we live and eat, and where we sleep--a space connected by stairs up, stairs down. Who needs more stairs?

We settled on a Europa design for the excellent salon view, the mostly one-level walk-around deck with covered sides and cockpit, and the easy dock-level boarding through the side boarding doors. No jumping down onto docks, no maneuvering dock steps or boarding ladders. We have one step up to the galley and lower helm station and three steps down to the forward staterooms and head, although we do have a ladder up the flybridge. We use the flybridge only in nice weather, which means it can go unvisited for days at a time.
It is a design that we enjoy in the PNW with its occasional rain showers.

Hi bcarli,
We chose a GB46eu because of the extra space in the salon and the covered walkway/aft deck areas. The flybridge area is also much larger on the eu version. And these are the places where we spend most of our time.
H.

My Hatteras had a great all around salon view (which extended to the lower helm), flush with a huge covered and enclose-able aft deck, covered walk around decks too. The seclusion of the aft cabin was very nice. But with a 56' hull and 18'2" beam, it was easier not to compromise. Our next boat will likely be more of a weekend/vacation boat, smaller. If I can find an "Europa"/sedan/express with a no-bow-slap master, that could well be the way we go as that style fits the non-full-time-cruising lifestyle a little better... just look at any marina on a weekday then a weekend.

bcarli said:

Hi
We are curious about trawler owners who have chosen "Europa" designs over the standard aft cabin layout. We are moving from sailboats to trawlers and will be cruising in the Pacific Northwest and British Columbia. I realize this is strictly a personal decision and all boats are trade offs but we are gravitating towards the "Europa" because of the easy access to outside, comfortable outside seating area and the lack of stairs that many trawlers have. The main trade off is the V berth cabin which we are comfortable with. Would like to hear from other owners..
thanks

Click to expand...

I think you've answered your own questions. Having covered aft and side decks where you live would seem to be a big plus.

V-births can get noisy with the constant lapping of wavelets against the hull. I kind of like the sound!

Also, the smaller Europa-style boats are good for two sleepers but not so much for guests. Your guests will have to sleep on the saloon settees, etc.

Trade offs.....

One probable fact is that the Europas are relatively top heavy. Or just plain heavy or both. If I was shopp'in I'd be looking for a Classic single engined GB36.

Giggitoni said:

...
Also, the smaller Europa-style boats are good for two sleepers but not so much for guests. Your guests will have to sleep on the saloon settees, etc.

Trade offs.....

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That's fine. I discourage overnight guests.

Giggitoni said:

...covered aft and side decks where you live would seem to be a big plus.
V-births can get noisy with the constant lapping of wavelets against the hull...
Also, the smaller Europa-style boats are good for two sleepers but not so much for guests. Your guests will have to sleep on the saloon settees, etc.

Trade offs.....

Click to expand...

Our "smaller" 36ft Europa has just one (fwd) sleeping cabin, with semi walk around bed. I call it "the selfish couple`s fitout". There is a 2 cabin version, Brisboy has one. No wave slap on the IG.
The covered cockpit is often a good size for socializing(I exclude Blue Seas),with easy direct access to the salon/living main cabin.
You avoid multiple up and downs.
You get good access for placing docking lines.
The extended FB is a good place to store the dinghy.
And, imo, they look good.

RT Firefly said:

Greetings,
Mr, bc. We've had both the aft cabin and the "Europa". We much prefer the latter, primarily for the large saloon and the all around views. When you think about it, unless you are newlyweds, how much time do you spend in bed? We also prefer complete walk around decks as opposed to a full width saloon. Makes things a lot easier to go from bow to stern without walking inside, particularly with soaking foul weather gear although I understand it never rains in the PNW. On rare occasions where is might rain, the deck overhang protects the saloon windows somewhat.

Click to expand...

Yeh - what he said 2.

When you travel with children the aft cabin is nice.

We really like our Mariner 40. Coming from a sailboat, we weren't too concerned about sleeping in the bow. We did notice a little more 'slap' than in our sailboat. But we are accustomed to it now , so all is good.
We like the ease of boarding on one level, a nice 'back porch', walk around decks, large sundeck/fly bridge and just all around great boat.

Wm Mayberry
OPTIMYSTIQUE
Mariner 40

On Mooring #19
Ft Myers Beach, FL

bcarli said:

Hi
We are curious about trawler owners who have chosen "Europa" designs over the standard aft cabin layout...we are gravitating towards the "Europa" because of the easy access to outside, comfortable outside seating area and the lack of stairs that many trawlers have. The main trade off is the V berth cabin which we are comfortable with. Would like to hear from other owners..
thanks

Click to expand...

I'll just simply answer by saying, we would consider no other layout than sedan or Europa as they now tend to call it. If you go to a length of 36' - 40' upwards, you would probably find a walk around double up front anyway, and probably a second guest cabin to port or starboard, and still have the nice roomy cockpit.