I've Kinda Figured Out What I Want! So What Now?

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cool beans

cool beans

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 18, 2015
Messages
308
Location
USA
Vessel Make
Bayliner 3870
I'm really leaning towards a Motorsailer :thumb: Not a 90/90 sailboat either, I mean someone stuck a mast and sails on a trawler and called it good.

Kind of running into several issues though. . .
1) There doesn't seem to be many floating around (pun intended). The style boat I really like seems to be mostly in the Pacific NW, Canada, and Europe. Not much to pick from anyways (as compared to say, a Catalina 36 or a Mainship), even less so on the East Coast.

2) They are definitely over the budget I set. $50k is what I was hoping to stay under. Cash for a boat up to a point, then down payment and small loan I could pay down in 3-5 years. Currently debt free and it feels good :dance:

On the other hand, you get what you pay for and any of these boats seem to be well taken care of and loved.


I also have another more specific boat that, while not my first choice, seems to offer a more affordable package of compromises: A Bayliner 38XX. . .which is kind of odd considering my #1 choice :rolleyes:

I really like the aft cockpit, which is hard to find in a smaller, affordable diesel boat (also like the Shuckers and Lancers for the aft cockpit). Salon seating is kind of meh, but does remind me of home. . .except being able to occasionally sail, it does check off most of the items I'm looking for. And while it does look good, definitely missing "that look".


SO here is where I'm at. . .I could probably put my nose to the grind stone and find a nice under budget Bayliner in the next month. Or I could narrow down the MS field and hope something comes along while I save cash in the next year or two (or 3)? Or possible get a real ships mortgage and just go for it as soon as something nice pops up?

Is maybe now a good time to get a Broker to start looking for me?

Yeah, I know only I can really answer these questions. . .but bouncing these off experienced folks does help (better than the circle of reasoning going on in my head).

Thanks!
 
Most of the sailing blogs I read have the boats under power most of the time, my advise forget about sails and mast (bridge clearance) and go straight power. One less thing to replace a couple years down the road. You have 50K? Get to 80K and buy a 50K boat then you have 30K to spend getting it right. Good luck, this is the exciting part. Then the cash eating monster lands in your yard and you're a boat owner.
Mike
 
A Motorsailor is great in many ways. You get the ability to sail and yet you still get a Pilothouse. OTOH, there are problems. Most motorsailers don't sail all that well, and at least around here, they still spend almost all their time motoring, and rarely if ever sailing.

I have never boated on the East Coast, but I have lots of family that have sailed on the lakes in NY and in the Chesapeake Bay area. There is some great cruising to be had, but much of it is shallow and many of the waterways have annoying bridges. With a motorsailor, you will always be waiting for the bridge to open.

I think it is too soon to get a broker looking for you. You can do most of the looking yourself until you decide which direction you want to go. Then you can think about a broker.
 
To me, a motorsailor is just seriously complicating matters without much gain. You have all the trawler issues but now have to deal with a mast and sails and bridge clearance and other things you wouldn't on a Trawler. That you be great if your intent was to sail 50% of the time or more. However, if not, it's a lot of pain for little gain.
 
If you want a motor sailor because you feel you will need a sailing fix every once in a while, you are going to be disappointed. If you want it because you plan long range cruising, don't.

Weigh very small amount of time you're going to roll out some sails against maintenance and dodging standing rigging and bridges and ......

Many of us are former / current Sailors, I've never looked back and enjoy going to weather in a straight line. When I need to sail, I get on a real sailboat.

Get a Trawler that meets your needs and budget and charter or rent a real sailboat when you need the fix.

$0.02

:socool:
 
The bayliner 38 series is a popular boat. More info on the bayliner forum.
 
A Motor sailor is a great way to have a Blue Water cruiser.

The scantlings are ocean grade and the sails allow almost unlimited range.

A Bayliner is in no way an offshore vessel.

Decide just what you want to do, Ocean Voyaging or inshore lakes , bays and rivers.

The ocean voyager will set you back about 300% more for the boat , power or sail.
 
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The shucker that donsan posted looks clean with low hours. Looks like a sailboat hull with no mast. I didn't like how the rudder restricts pulling the shaft without dropping the rudder, but with a protected prop and skeg, you shouldn't have to do that often, and if you do, it will likely be on the hard.

Of course, the broker needs to learn that commas follow the word, not the beginning of the next word...
 
There are a few Fishers for sale on the East coast. Check out the Fisher Owner's Group.
 
That Schucker is an interesting boat for sure but It's gonna be very rolly I bet. Hang on!
 
If those pix really represent the current condition of the Shucker what are you wasting time here for. Go for it.
 
You have probably seen this listing but I boarded this boat in Port Townsend for a preview. Really liked it but got distracted for another in the mean time. I think it could be hauled cross country with that beam and the price is sort of in your range. Good solid builder in my view.

Not much of a sailing rig I expect but a little downhill assist and roll abatement anyway.


1984 Comfort Motorsailer 38 Power Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com
 
Motorsailers should do well do well on a reach.
 
Our marina neighbor next door is a Bayliner 3888. Very nice boat, lots of great things about it, but that really high ladder to the flybridge would be a deal killer for us. We're still physically capable of climbing ladders all day, it's just darn inconvenient. Try getting a dinner and drinks tray to the bridge. Or guests and relatives who aren't spry.
 
Ladders, tiny steps, and seven-vertical feet of stairs (with head-bumping clearance) are just three reasons I don't miss a flybridge. The list of negatives is longer. Nevertheless, the vast majority of our boats have flybridges which means one has limited choice. Fortunately, most motorsailers don't have a flybridge.
 
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Fishers are handsome motorsailers, but not inexpensive.

 
Consider the sails a get home engine.
 
"Motorsailers should do well do well on a reach."

Perhaps in the 1930's .

Todays MS takes full advantage of the past 70-90 years.

With power operation the only downside is the weight of the sail rig (1/2 ton)and perhaps 40% extra weight in the keel.

On a 40 ft boat 3- 5 tons of ballast would come up to an extra 6-10 HP required motoring perhaps 1/3 to 1/2 GPH in extra fuel burn.

You get the better ocean ride and get home engine for a buck an hour extra .

Sailing, the only MS downside is carrying the weight of engine & fuel which might be a bother in 2K of breeze , but most folks just push the button anyway when SOA is under 5K.

For many a modern diesel would be about the same weight as a noisemaker , and provide the came creature comforts.

The "old 50-50" MS is as dead as a hand crank on a Caddy.

The IN the boat vs ON the boat lifestyle issue remains.
 
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First, you need to decide what you want your boat to do. Many dream of blue water cruising but never do, even if they have the correct boat. A motor sailer can be a great blue water boat with unlimited range, but will be much more expensive than a Bayliner. If you only plan to cruise lakes, bays and sounds, a Bayliner may be suitable, but I've always said that you get a lot of boat for your money with a Bayliner, but you don't spend much money. If you truly want to cruise in open waters you need a boat that is much better built than a Bayliner.
 
Donsan said:
This Schucker showed up on YW yesterday for $45K:

1976 Schucker 40' shallow draft trawler Power Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com
Click to expand...

:eek:

I'd like to learn more about the joystick steering (no wheel) setup. . .but, if I can get a hold of the Broker I think that boat is good as sold! New pictures posted, it's as close to perfect as I have seen. Need to join the Schuckers group and start reading! Thanks for the lead :thumb:

You don't really sail a motorsailer (you can, but. . .). You're supposed to "motor-sail" it ie., run the engine in gear with the sails up. In the light winds of the Chesapeake I've motor-sailed my Ranger33. 3.5-4 knots in light winds, sails only. . .or I could run the engine in gear and drive it to 5.5 knots easy at ~40% less throttle than if I was under power alone. Having the sails up really stiffens the boats motion as well.

Artic Traveller, the most immediate thing I want to do is go fishing and be able to take people out and have fun. Second, explore as much of the Bay as I can and as often as possible with out burning a hole in my pocket with the fuel bill. This will also be home as I live aboard. . .

I do want to spend a year or two cruising the Caribbean. Would be great if that happened in a couple years, but no real time line yet. I started making plans to do it in the R33, but refit/rebuild costs are close to $20k and it would take a couple years. . .of which using as I'd like described above probably wouldn't work out.

I might have to suck it up and plan to sell whatever and buy a third boat in the future :rolleyes:

Not sure if anyone has mentioned this, but yall are awesome!

:Thanx:
 
I really like that Schucker. I could see cruising just as you describe. I would hope the survey confirms what looks to be a very nice vessel.
 
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cool beans said:
:eek:


Artic Traveller, the most immediate thing I want to do is go fishing and be able to take people out and have fun. Second, explore as much of the Bay as I can and as often as possible with out burning a hole in my pocket with the fuel bill. This will also be home as I live aboard. I do want to spend a year or two cruising the Caribbean.
Click to expand...

For fishing and bay cruising, a Bayliner should be just fine, saving you quite a bit of money in the purchase process. I'm not sure I'd want to cross the Gulf Stream in one though, but when that time comes (many years down the road?), sell the Bayliner and buy a more capable boat. By then you will have much more experience and know better what kind of boat suits your new needs.
 
Arctic Traveller said:
For fishing and bay cruising, a Bayliner should be just fine, saving you quite a bit of money in the purchase process. I'm not sure I'd want to cross the Gulf Stream in one though, but when that time comes (many years down the road?), sell the Bayliner and buy a more capable boat. By then you will have much more experience and know better what kind of boat suits your new needs.
Click to expand...

I'd have no concern about crossing the gulf stream with a Bayliner. I'd obviously want to choose a good window. Now, I wouldn't go further than the Bahamas, not on south in the Caribbean. As travel steps up to Cuba, I'd take one.
 
What do you want to do with the boat? that is the first question. Second, is what can you afford that will do what you want to do. I think this is kinda simple. You don't go fall in love with a motor sail that has masts that can't get where you want or goes to slow to get there in the time you need to be there! $50K is a tiny budget. My little trailer trawler was over that used but does what I need her to do. That's my thought or find the girl that already has the boat, lol.
 
Good choice Mr Beans.


I am a complete fan of motorsailers, although they have a bad reputation. Power boaters see them as sailboats. Sail boaters see them as powerboats. They are neither.

To me, it is plenty of gain and no pain, unless you use your boat primarily onprotected inland water.

The biggest plus is stability in rough water. Roll reduction is as good asparavanes; and almost as effective as active stabilizers. Try finding a cruising boat for $50k equipped with another effective type of stabilization.

The get home propulsion is also a plus, without having another engine crammedin limited space and unprotected props.

A motorsailer is not a sailboat. It isn't designed to win races therefore the sail and rigging design is simple, robust anduser-friendly. It may only sail at 4 knots ratherthan 6 in a "real" sail boat in similar conditions, but I'mhappy with that. The motor & sails are designed to be used together in most situations, but the option is there to use only one or the other.


I travel under motor & sail the majority of the time. Raising & trimming the sails takes less than 3 minutes whensinglehanded. With a self tacking headsail it's set & forget unless conditions change substantially. Fine tuning toget another 0.1 knot is optional.

I haven't done any maintenance on my sail rigging in 3 years, other than aquick inspection, and lubrication of the mast tracks. I wish I could say the same for the rest of the boat.

The reward for motorsailing is greater stability than a conventional full displacement power boat, better economy, maybe a slight gain in top speed, get-home redundancy, and something to tinker with during a long offshore cruise.
 
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