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Difficult to generalize. Could be more about that particular boat, the features it offers, how wide a market those features appeal to, etc.


Or it could be overpriced.


Depends.


-Chris
 
Too many variables, but worth considering is that if its been on the market for a while it is likely dead weight financially for the seller and they may be more motivated to sell - especially if they have payments to make on the new boat already.
 
Prices are going up and used inventory is dropping.
 
Or it might be a boat one cant give away.
 
Where is it located? Frozen north? My understanding is the market drops off in the fall and picks up in the spring.
 
Ski in NC said:
Simple answer: Yes. Otherwise it would have sold.
Click to expand...

Maybe I am deceiving myself but we put boat on the market in August and it has been in winter storage since October in the Great Lakes. I don't consider it over priced. If the boat were in FL, my opinion might change.
 
It used to be 1-2 yrs was not that far off for a boat to sell. Have times changed?
How did you determine an asking price?

If someone is interested in your boat could they do a sea trial? If not then perhaps your boat has been on the market for only 2 months.
 
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The boat is in Delray Beach, FL. and is for sale by owner. It was initially listed last August. I'll have to learn boat values. I saw 2 boats earlier today online for sale by owner that were the same model, model year, length, engine, etc. and the price difference in the 2 was about $60k. Apparently there are differences in the 2 boats but it's not something that's easily discernible for a beginner. Part of it could be cosmetic, part could be maintenance and part could be ego. That's the part I need to figure out.
 
Could be a difficult seller (in general, a great source of great deals), or under-exposed to the market, but otherwise it must be overpriced and probably significantly so.
 
"Boat" and "Economics"
...non sequitor...



Jim
Sent from my iPad using Trawler Forum
 
I have seen boats for sale that are way over market price one broker said some husbands do this to keep the wife happy that he selling the boat but truth known he has no intention to :)
 
gaston said:
I have seen boats for sale that are way over market price one broker said some husbands do this to keep the wife happy that he selling the boat but truth known he has no intention to :)
Click to expand...

I think those are the ones where they open the storage areas and take photos of EVERYTHING and put them on yacht world. Anyone in their right mind would give up early and not even contemplate the boat being sold.

If I were a broker, I would:
dejunk / declutter the boat.
clean the boat well
remove any personal effects (at least temporarily)
get a pro photographer to take good photos of the boat
post selected photos of the boat
Add info on each photo so it doesn't say "Photo 15" but describes the photo.
Make sure all the parts in the description are clearly worded and correct.
Typo check the whole thing before I click submit.
then I would read the posting again once it is on Yachtworld and make any corrections needed there.
 
Since year one,, "Paint Sells the Boat"has been the mantra.

Even truer today with folks with Zero boating background as buyers.

They want to come aboard with their toothbrush and a photo for the wall, and put put away on a new adventure.
 
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Our boat was listed with a broker for a year. No one came to take a look. Two friends had sold their boats earlier. Dropped my broker and listed with theirs. Boat sold in less than three months with the second party that looked at it.
The right broker makes all the difference.
And no, I am not a broker.
 
The boat is listed here. Endeavour boats for sale - YachtWorld

It's the 9th one down in the far left hand column.
Endeavour 37 A-PLAN (1)

I'm not ready to buy it because I have a house to sell but I'm trying to learn how to tell if a boat is being offered at a fair price. Should I sell my house quickly where I could make an offer, what kind of offer would a boat like this bring?
 
"Is a boat that's been on the market since last August likely overpriced for this economy?"

DEFLATION has hit the world after two decades in Japan.

That means every day things get cheaper , money becomes more valuable.

So "overpriced " is only if there has not been a price reduction today.

For the decades "I like your house , I will come back next year and buy it cheaper ,"has been the Japan motto.
 
Dog

A 37 year old sailboat is not an easy sell. It looks like lots of them are for sale, further adding to the conundrum. Cost to rerig, new sails, rudder shaft rebuild, keel bolts, engine replacement etc could all enter into the go forward costs.
 
scurvy-yard-dog said:
Should I sell my house quickly where I could make an offer, what kind of offer would a boat like this bring?
Click to expand...

You can make any offer you want but I would expect a selling price of 90% of the asking price then a further reduction might be negotiated for any issues found during the survey. A lot will depend on how many other buyers are interested and how badly the seller wants to move boat. I am aware of a seller who sold an absolutely pristine 1984 Southern Cross 35' for about $50K. I don't think Endeavour has quite the desirability of the Southern Cross which is a true blue water boat.

If you plan to keep it in FL, I would hope you are keeping in mind insurance rates are very high in FL due to tropical storms even though we have had any in 11 years.
 
scurvy-yard-dog said:
The boat is listed here. Endeavour boats for sale - YachtWorld

It's the 9th one down in the far left hand column.
Endeavour 37 A-PLAN (1)

I'm not ready to buy it because I have a house to sell but I'm trying to learn how to tell if a boat is being offered at a fair price. Should I sell my house quickly where I could make an offer, what kind of offer would a boat like this bring?
Click to expand...
Well, it is listed at Horizon Marine Center (the broker listed in Yachtworld) so I'm not sure how it's FSBO. Perhaps because the broker spelled the manufacturer's name wrong (Endeavor vs. Endeavour)?

You've clearly got the itch for this boat, but I have to say it looks like a very average boat, from a very average builder, with average equipment, in somewhat below average condition. The sun damage, the water damage evident on the bulkhead at the chair locker, the overall neglect - this boat was respected and invested in some time in the past but it really looks let go to me notwithstanding the replacements in the past several years.

I can't spot the air conditioner - where is it? I did see a vent in the saloon so I believe there's something somewhere, but I suspect it's marginal for this boat in a hot climate.

As to your question about selling your house quickly - and presumably realizing a lower price - I don't know your market or how fast you earn your money, but it would almost certainly be a poor decision from a net worth perspective. But if you've got the fever there's really no way I can communicate all the warning bells I'm hearing.
 
Donsan said:
If you plan to keep it in FL, I would hope you are keeping in mind insurance rates are very high in FL due to tropical storms even though we have had any in 11 years.
Click to expand...

LOL.... insurance is high on everything in Florida and not just because of storms. I used to live in South Beach and if it wasn't chained down, someone would steal it. :nonono:
 
refugio said:
Well, it is listed at Horizon Marine Center (the broker listed in Yachtworld) so I'm not sure how it's FSBO. Perhaps because the broker spelled the manufacturer's name wrong (Endeavor vs. Endeavour)?

You've clearly got the itch for this boat, but I have to say it looks like a very average boat, from a very average builder, with average equipment, in somewhat below average condition. The sun damage, the water damage evident on the bulkhead at the chair locker, the overall neglect - this boat was respected and invested in some time in the past but it really looks let go to me notwithstanding the replacements in the past several years.

I can't spot the air conditioner - where is it? I did see a vent in the saloon so I believe there's something somewhere, but I suspect it's marginal for this boat in a hot climate.

As to your question about selling your house quickly - and presumably realizing a lower price - I don't know your market or how fast you earn your money, but it would almost certainly be a poor decision from a net worth perspective. But if you've got the fever there's really no way I can communicate all the warning bells I'm hearing.
Click to expand...

I have the itch but not for this boat. I'm just trying to get an idea what it's really worth so I can guesstimate how much additional will have to go into it. I don't need specifics but I don't want a $36k boat turn into a $50k boat before it can be launched.

This is the kind of feedback that is helpful to me and I thank you.
 
scurvy-yard-dog said:
This is the kind of feedback that is helpful to me and I thank you.
Click to expand...
Well because it's Friday afternoon and I'm trying to avoid doing some work, here's some more - value it for what it costs (that would be zero!).

Let's assume you do a deal at $30K. And a sea trial, haulout ($250), and survey ($300) shows nothing major wrong. There are lots of minor things, but let's just assume that it is what it looks like. So it runs, no major issues with structure, engine, or rigging. Most of the gear works. All of the safety gear is missing or out of date, but you're on your own. $30K, plus 6% Florida sales tax, and it's yours.

Insurance: $50/month (you can't get moorage without insurance)
Moorage: $400/month (wild guess here, $10/ft)
Utilities: $30/month for power, water's free, no TV, you might get wi-fi
Maintenance: $300/month minimum. I'm figuring you find someone who can maintain the boat for $25/hour & 3 hours/week. You could spend zero one month, $200 the next on a fresh water pump. This isn't going to get the woodwork in yacht club condition, but maybe it won't deteriorate further. Over time you might get some skills and tools and be able to take over most of this yourself, but then you're also not going to be earning money so there's some opportunity cost. And parts are expensive.

So...$800/month to keep the boat in essentially the same condition, tied to the dock, you living aboard. If you want to start using it then you're going to pay for fuel. You're going to end up doing more maintenance (and that generator looks sketchy). You'll pay guest moorage fees (or if you anchor out nearby, maybe you can "cruise" for very little).

But there are some surprisingly expensive pieces of equipment on that boat. The PV panel on the aft arch. The dinghy on davits. The windlass. The SSB radio. The winches. All of them are well used and...something might go tits up at any point. So you're going to need to keep a reserve fund to pay for replacing them as they reach end of life. $200/month reserve would, again, be minimum.

So...$1,000/month to live on a boat on the water. It won't be an end tie in a swanky marina with lots of facilities and it won't cover refurbishing and improving the boat, but it could be equivalent to "rent".

And then it's time to sell the boat. No hurricanes, no major change in boating tastes, but...let's say it's now 10 years down the road and the boat is 10 years older. What's it worth then? $25K? So you lose another $5K, and another $2,500 in brokerage fees when you sell it.

Tons of assumptions, but that's not an unreasonable scenario.
 
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scurvy-yard-dog said:
I'm not ready to buy it because I have a house to sell but I'm trying to learn how to tell if a boat is being offered at a fair price. Should I sell my house quickly where I could make an offer, what kind of offer would a boat like this bring?
Click to expand...
My thoughts on what to offer may offend some people ( especially the sellers).
But I'd start with an almost insulting offer...depending on condition and length of time for sale. For that boat I'd insult them with a 20k offer.:eek:
Honestly it doesn't look in great shape. The boat we just purchased started at 59k and we settled on 32k. The last phone call from the broker went something like this...Broker: "What's your best offer?"
Gerry " ummm maybe we can do 34? ( me in the background waving frantically NO)" Broker" Well the seller wants 38" Gerry " Sorry can't do it." Three minutes later the broker calls back and says" what does your wife say your final offer is?"

We got it for 32!

I've done this with cars, houses and boats...if you have cash and are willing to walk away, there will be a good boat etc. out there for you. :socool:
Good luck.
 
Ah, such a common topic on boating forums but always fun to talk about. Our first bid on a big boat was about 90% of the asking price, but the seller scotched the deal over a $700 repair issue that arose after a survey. Dumb and annoying. Next big boat we offered about 50% of asking price. They were insulted and blew us off. Three months later, they called us back and took it. Next big boat, I watched it for months, too high, too high -- the seller finally wanted to just unload it, did eBay (even though it was listed with a broker) and I bid an incredibly, ridiculously low price, actually the opening bid he set on eBay, and at about 50% of his initial asking price with the broker. Miraculously nobody bid against us and we got it (and the seller was a fantastic guy and honored the bid price and could not have been more helpful). Then we had to sell that first big boat we bought, listed it on Craigslist in December in South Dakota, frozen like a popsicle in a boat storage yard covered in ice and snow. I never dreamed it would sell until spring, I figured I'd just get it out there for kicks, Craigslist is free, might as well. Sold in two weeks for about 90% of asking. The day I showed the boat it was literally twenty below zero.

So in short, boat sales are nuts. I've given up trying to be rational about it.
 
refugio said:
Well because it's Friday afternoon and I'm trying to avoid doing some work, here's some more - value it for what it costs (that would be zero!).

Let's assume you do a deal at $30K. And a sea trial, haulout ($250), and survey ($300) shows nothing major wrong. There are lots of minor things, but let's just assume that it is what it looks like. So it runs, no major issues with structure, engine, or rigging. Most of the gear works. All of the safety gear is missing or out of date, but you're on your own. $30K, plus 6% Florida sales tax, and it's yours.

Insurance: $50/month (you can't get moorage without insurance)
Moorage: $400/month (wild guess here, $10/ft)
Utilities: $30/month for power, water's free, no TV, you might get wi-fi
Maintenance: $300/month minimum. I'm figuring you find someone who can maintain the boat for $25/hour & 3 hours/week. You could spend zero one month, $200 the next on a fresh water pump. This isn't going to get the woodwork in yacht club condition, but maybe it won't deteriorate further. Over time you might get some skills and tools and be able to take over most of this yourself, but then you're also not going to be earning money so there's some opportunity cost. And parts are expensive.

So...$800/month to keep the boat in essentially the same condition, tied to the dock, you living aboard. If you want to start using it then you're going to pay for fuel. You're going to end up doing more maintenance (and that generator looks sketchy). You'll pay guest moorage fees (or if you anchor out nearby, maybe you can "cruise" for very little).

But there are some surprisingly expensive pieces of equipment on that boat. The PV panel on the aft arch. The dinghy on davits. The windlass. The SSB radio. The winches. All of them are well used and...something might go tits up at any point. So you're going to need to keep a reserve fund to pay for replacing them as they reach end of life. $200/month reserve would, again, be minimum.

So...$1,000/month to live on a boat on the water. It won't be an end tie in a swanky marina with lots of facilities and it won't cover refurbishing and improving the boat, but it could be equivalent to "rent".

And then it's time to sell the boat. No hurricanes, no major change in boating tastes, but...let's say it's now 10 years down the road and the boat is 10 years older. What's it worth then? $25K? So you lose another $5K, and another $2,500 in brokerage fees when you sell it.

Tons of assumptions, but that's not an unreasonable scenario.
Click to expand...

Thanks, Refugio. Good to know but many of them I'm aware of, like slip fees, insurance, utilities and maintenance. Those are the ones that I know about, although I have no idea the details of maintenance. My plan is to set $10k to $20k aside just for emergency repairs and then the ongoing maintenance can come of out my budget, which I know I won't use every month.

The things that are beyond me are things like extra added fees that only someone living on a boat would know about. Did I read somewhere that you have to pay fees for cruising the waters of certain islands or that a trip through the Panama canal could cost $17k? :eek:

I do appreciate the insight and I'm consuming everything that I can. Again... thanks.
 
Aquafarm said:
My thoughts on what to offer may offend some people ( especially the sellers).
Click to expand...

kthoennes said:
So in short, boat sales are nuts. I've given up trying to be rational about it.
Click to expand...

Thanks guys. I'm a cash buyer and don't have a problem walking away in hopes of a better deal. I've seen enough of Richard Rawlings to not worry about hitting someone with a lowball offer. :thumb:

I've dealt enough in cars and motorcycles to know that there's always another one out there that'll fit the bill. I'm looking for that boat that was owned by that little old couple (related to the little old lady that only drove her car to church on Sundays) that maintained her well and just doesn't have the time or room for her in their lives anymore and will get more out of fulfilling someone else's dreams and seeing her go to a good home as opposed to trying to make bank.

She's out there if I'm patient.
 
scurvy-yard-dog said:
Thanks, Refugio. Good to know but many of them I'm aware of, like slip fees, insurance, utilities and maintenance. Those are the ones that I know about, although I have no idea the details of maintenance. My plan is to set $10k to $20k aside just for emergency repairs and then the ongoing maintenance can come of out my budget, which I know I won't use every month.

The things that are beyond me are things like extra added fees that only someone living on a boat would know about. Did I read somewhere that you have to pay fees for cruising the waters of certain islands or that a trip through the Panama canal could cost $17k? :eek:

I do appreciate the insight and I'm consuming everything that I can. Again... thanks.
Click to expand...

Keep in mind Refugio is on the west coast and not in FL. If you keep a boat in FL during Hurricane season, your rates will be 4-5 times higher for say a 36' boat than what he has suggested. There is a reason so many boats head north before hurricane season besides the weather.
 
Donsan said:
Keep in mind Refugio is on the west coast and not in FL. If you keep a boat in FL during Hurricane season, your rates will be 4-5 times higher for say a 36' boat than what he has suggested. There is a reason so many boats head north before hurricane season besides the weather.
Click to expand...

Hey Donsan.... thanks for the heads up. I lived in South Beach at one time so I know a little bit about the higher rates whether on land or sea. If the weather didn't get ya, the crime would. Where do most cruisers go during hurricane season?
 
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