Old and Decrepit

The friendliest place on the web for anyone who enjoys boating.
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
See posts with no answers
Look into a Marine Trader 34. Short, stout, cheap, roomy and plentiful. These people switched from a cruising sailboat to trawler and seem to have it well worked out. Your budget, maybe not so much...

The Trawler Beach House
 
alormaria said:
Look into a Marine Trader 34. Short, stout, cheap, roomy and plentiful. These people switched from a cruising sailboat to trawler and seem to have it well worked out. Your budget, maybe not so much...

The Trawler Beach House
Click to expand...

A quick look at them shows they look like they fit my price point. Thanks for the info. I'll look at them more in depth.
 
scurvy-yard-dog said:
Regarding your post above about sending engine oil out for inspection, wouldn't a magnet do the same thing? I'm guessing you'd be looking for coolant/water in the oil (milky oil) or metal shavings.
Click to expand...

Short answer-NO. You're looking for things that wouldn't be detectable just using a magnet.
 
As to the ads for boats on the lower end of the price scale. Lazy owners, lazy brokers. I worry about the lazy owner, thinking perhaps he treated the boat the same way all it's life. As to the broker, if he has a million dollar boat, a $500k boat and a $30k boat many are not going to work the $30k boat. They'll just respond to inquiries. It's a matter of spending the time and effort where the larger commission is.

One thing that doesn't get mentioned but ran across my mind yesterday talking about real estate brokers. When you have a boat or house to sell, look for someone whose business is built on that size and price range to broker it.
 
it sounds to me that you don't have much experience sailing. In that case avoid a sail boat. Most spend half their time under power anyway. A small single diesel powerboat would be my recommendation. Look long and hard for one that was well loved by someone not able to use it any more. They do exist and if everything is sparkling including the engine space that is a good clue .
 
syd - I recommend you go to the search feature and ask one to three word "questions" about ALL you would like to learn. It is obvious your learning curve for pleasure boating is in the straight-up angle. Read all you can in forums as well as asking questions to Google in general. IMO - you have a lot of reading to catch up on in order to ease your boat-search and to make sure your boat choice becomes a boat you can live with... and, then, learn to love! - Best Luck! - Art
 
Scurvy-yard-dog,

B
We bought our sailboat new in 2006. It is 43 foot long and we have traveled all through the Caribbean and the Bahamas. Our engine now has 1100 hours and burns about 1.5 gal an hour and pushes the boat at 8 -.8.5 on flat water. We could get it down to a gallon an hour or less if we slowed down to 7 - 7.5 knots.

I figure that the boat will cost on average $1000/month, on average. permanent dockage $250/month on the Chesapeake. Insurance, $140/month. Electricity at the dock, $30 - $40 per month. The other $500 or so is money you have to set aside for big things that break.

A gallon of bottom paint can run more than $200/gallon. Our boat takes three gallons every two years. Almost any minor issue will cost you money and not infrequently a boat unit. (boat= break out another thou). So, while I go for months and months without spending the allocated $1000, I have to set money aside so that I have it when I need it.

As far as boat life, you will find that you will spend what you have. I have learned that folks tend to end up with folks who spend similar amounts of money. Some folks go to the bars and restaurants every night, other don't. Some never fix anything on their boat and others polish every screw.

A serviceable set of cruising sells for our boat would cost $6- $10,000, depending on how fancy you get. These sails could last you 15 - 20 years with care. Of course, they will need occasional mending and new sacrificial cloth. Last sacrificial cloth mounted our our boat ran about $600.

Others will have different figures depending on the size and age of their boat. We are looking to move to a trawler because of the room and we are most likely done with bluewater sailing. I expect to burn 5 gals an hour at trawler speed and to spend a bit more on boat maintenance. Just think about servicing two engines every 100 hours or so. We would often go a year and never put 100 hours on the boat, or genset.

Good luck
 
scurvy-yard-dog said:
Regarding your post above about sending engine oil out for inspection, wouldn't a magnet do the same thing? I'm guessing you'd be looking for coolant/water in the oil (milky oil) or metal shavings.

Is it possible to run on one engine? I'm guessing it is and would be great in the case of one engine failing but is it advisable for fuel conservation?
Click to expand...

No a magnet will not do the same thing. I've attached an older analysis report so you can see. Different parts of the engine have different metals and they can usually see what the wear is..clutch..bearing..etc besides how much water or coolant there is. good thing to know, especially if you do them periodically you can see something happening long before you're calling for a tow.

yes you an run on one engine, your steering may be a bit affected, but sure.

EDIT: you'll see in the report, they saw a clutch being worn in the main trans, and the smaller wing engine (backup only), even thou its 10 years old, its still being broken in (only had 20 hours actually) among other things
 

Attachments

  • Oil analysis.pdf
    1.2 MB · Views: 30
Last edited:
bayview said:
it sounds to me that you don't have much experience sailing. In that case avoid a sail boat. Most spend half their time under power anyway. A small single diesel powerboat would be my recommendation. Look long and hard for one that was well loved by someone not able to use it any more. They do exist and if everything is sparkling including the engine space that is a good clue .
Click to expand...

I have zero experience and am looking for something that I can live on full time. You bring up a good point about somebody unable to use or enjoy the boat anymore and has a good maintenance record. That's the kind I would look for anyway, whether it be a boat, truck or whatever. I'm looking for a boat owned by that little old lady that just drove it to church on Sundays.
 
scurvy-yard-dog said:
I have zero experience and am looking for something that I can live on full time. You bring up a good point about somebody unable to use or enjoy the boat anymore and has a good maintenance record. That's the kind I would look for anyway, whether it be a boat, truck or whatever. I'm looking for a boat owned by that little old lady that just drove it to church on Sundays.
Click to expand...

Over the decades we've found boats you describe. There are/is way to qualify a boat before ever going to see it... right over the phone or via email. Then, once a boat seems to maybe be one that fills your criteria... go forth and review same. If it taint the one to purchase be not afraid to walk away. There is one waiting for you two to meet.

In "old-salt" world of marine doings: When the boat finds you, you will know it's a correct match. - Or something like that - LOL
 
Gordon J said:
Scurvy-yard-dog,

B
We bought our sailboat new in 2006. It is 43 foot long and we have traveled all through the Caribbean and the Bahamas. Our engine now has 1100 hours and burns about 1.5 gal an hour and pushes the boat at 8 -.8.5 on flat water. We could get it down to a gallon an hour or less if we slowed down to 7 - 7.5 knots.

I figure that the boat will cost on average $1000/month, on average. permanent dockage $250/month on the Chesapeake. Insurance, $140/month. Electricity at the dock, $30 - $40 per month. The other $500 or so is money you have to set aside for big things that break.

A gallon of bottom paint can run more than $200/gallon. Our boat takes three gallons every two years. Almost any minor issue will cost you money and not infrequently a boat unit. (boat= break out another thou). So, while I go for months and months without spending the allocated $1000, I have to set money aside so that I have it when I need it.

As far as boat life, you will find that you will spend what you have. I have learned that folks tend to end up with folks who spend similar amounts of money. Some folks go to the bars and restaurants every night, other don't. Some never fix anything on their boat and others polish every screw.

A serviceable set of cruising sells for our boat would cost $6- $10,000, depending on how fancy you get. These sails could last you 15 - 20 years with care. Of course, they will need occasional mending and new sacrificial cloth. Last sacrificial cloth mounted our our boat ran about $600.

Others will have different figures depending on the size and age of their boat. We are looking to move to a trawler because of the room and we are most likely done with bluewater sailing. I expect to burn 5 gals an hour at trawler speed and to spend a bit more on boat maintenance. Just think about servicing two engines every 100 hours or so. We would often go a year and never put 100 hours on the boat, or genset.

Good luck
Click to expand...

This is what I like to hear, Gordon. A lot of people seem to be doing it on $1k or less per month.

I'm willing to invest about $50k into this and what I don't spend on the boat will be put back for unforeseen expenses (emergency fund). If I can find a decent boat in the $20k to $30k range, I'll be happy as long as I don't have to immediately sink my emergency fund into the boat to make it safe and functional.

I like the idea of the trawler but am not 100% sold on it yet. I think I can probably get a boat in better shape for my money with a sailboat as opposed to a powerboat. I'm looking in the 32' to 40' range on motor-sailers and think I'd be comfortable with that size although a 40' boat may be a bit big to learn sailing on but I don't have the money to throw at a lesser 'beginner' boat to turn around and unload it at a loss and then purchase a larger boat. The learning curve may be steep but I'm always up for a challenge.

Since I have a house to sell, I'm not in any real hurry so I have time to read up, look things over and maybe do some local sailing. Missouri has some pretty large lakes with active sailboat communities on them. All I need is some warm weather.

Again, thanks.
 
No Mast said:
No a magnet will not do the same thing. I've attached an older analysis report so you can see. Different parts of the engine have different metals and they can usually see what the wear is..clutch..bearing..etc besides how much water or coolant there is. good thing to know, especially if you do them periodically you can see something happening long before you're calling for a tow.

yes you an run on one engine, your steering may be a bit affected, but sure.

EDIT: you'll see in the report, they saw a clutch being worn in the main trans, and the smaller wing engine (backup only), even thou its 10 years old, its still being broken in (only had 20 hours actually) among other things
Click to expand...

Cool. The transmission part is what really concerns me. I could refurbish an engine but have never been inside of a transmission. I just spent $2300 having the tranny in a jeep grand cherokee rebuilt so I could only imagine the cost involved in rebuilding a marine tranny.
 
scurvy-yard-dog said:
Cool. The transmission part is what really concerns me. I could refurbish an engine but have never been inside of a transmission. I just spent $2300 having the tranny in a jeep grand cherokee rebuilt so I could only imagine the cost involved in rebuilding a marine tranny.
Click to expand...

In a good shop with truthful techs - about the same $$$
 
My only experience as a boat operator is with sailboats, dinghy to 40 feet. My experience as the owner is with sailboats 36-40 feet. Costs will vary greatly depending on where you cruising grounds are.

I think that $1k a month is wishful thinking. Moorage costs in my area are typically $7-10 per foot. Add to that taxes, insurance, maintenance, utilities and you start to get close to that $1k figure. However, older boats have more things break. That costs money, even in materials.

Also, FWIW, I saw at least one person mention that there would be little difference in fuel cost between sail and power. I doubt that. On my 40' sailboat with a Yanmar 56hp engine, I burn under 1g/hr at 7knots. On my 36' my fuel burn was only .75g/hr at 6 knots. I don't know of many (any?) trawlers that can match that fuel efficiency.

So not to rain on your parade, but when you here folks talk about a boat being "a hole in the water you pour money into", they aren't far from the truth.
 
I think I can match your fuel economy...with my generator...at idle... :)

Yes I agree with you also. I think ft for ft a sailboat will be more economical to run as a whole. That includes fuel economy.
 
dhays said:
So not to rain on your parade, but when you here folks talk about a boat being "a hole in the water you pour money into", they aren't far from the truth.
Click to expand...

Thanks Dhays.... I'm already pouring money into vehicles and a home so I'll really just be redirecting the funds. I don't really consider repairs as living expenses. How much do you spend on fuel a month for your sailboat and do you live on it? ;)


PS.... I've found slips for a 36' boat in SW Florida for under $500 a month ($11 a foot) plus $35 a month of for electricity. Living on the hook is free isn't it?
 
Last edited:
scurvy-yard-dog said:
Thanks Dhays.... I'm already pouring money into vehicles and a home so I'll really just be redirecting the funds. I don't really consider repairs as living expenses. How much do you spend on fuel a month for your sailboat and do you live on it? ;)


PS.... I've found slips for a 36' boat in SW Florida for under $500 a month ($11 a foot) plus $35 a month of for electricity. Living on the hook is free isn't it?
Click to expand...

I have never lived on any of my boats. However, my 36' sailboat was used by the PO as his and his daughter's only home for a number of years.

I spend very little on fuel. My boat is used on the weekends and for vacations. A couple weeks ago it was used as a floating hotel when I had to attend a meeting. 4 hours motorsailing each way and a cheep dock at a Yacht Clubs reciprocal dock. So my situation is going to be very different than yours.

If you are anchored in some anchorage, you don't have to pay. However, unless you have a very good solar or wind generation, your utilities cost has now because fuel costs as you run your generator. I have no experience with that. At anchor, you also will need to likely run your dinghy into shore to buy supplies. From my experience up here, the stores within walking distance of a dock tend to be more expensive than the local supermarket you drive to. Again, I know nothing of the cruising areas in the SE.

I don't want to discourage you and probably $1k/month can be done. However, I am fiscally cautious and think that if something can go wrong, it probably will. If I was you, I would try and pencil out all of your expected costs, get them as close as you can, then add 50% for the unexpected.
 
A number of years ago, my family and I went cruising one summer on our Trawler. At the end of the summer we calculated that we spent about $100 per day while "actively" cruising.

Diesel was about a buck a gallon at that time and fuel was a minor part of our expenses. We rarely anchored out, usually tied up to locks and sometimes marinas (especially with restaurants) and went to restaurants (especially with docks).

We could have done the trip in a sailboat but every one we looked at was like a cave. The trawler allowed a nice view out the large windows that was not possible in a sailboat.
 
alormaria said:
We could have done the trip in a sailboat but every one we looked at was like a cave. The trawler allowed a nice view out the large windows that was not possible in a sailboat.
Click to expand...

I get it. I am a sailor and love sailing and sailboats. However, I am also middle-aged and am starting to have back problems. I am looking to make the move to a trawler. Up here in the PNW, most sailboats spend much more time under power than under sail anyway.
 
dhays said:
I don't want to discourage you and probably $1k/month can be done. However, I am fiscally cautious and think that if something can go wrong, it probably will. If I was you, I would try and pencil out all of your expected costs, get them as close as you can, then add 50% for the unexpected.
Click to expand...

You may not have seen all of my posts but I did mention a couple of times that I'd have $10k to $20k held back just for major repairs.

Thanks again for responding.
 
Scurvy, you were looking for a comparison:

Lets say in a year you travel 2500 NM.

We had a 42" sailboat it burned 1.8 gal/hr for 5.5 knots.
If you motored the entire distance thats 818 gallons.
If you sailed just 1/3 of it now you're at 540 gallons.

Our trawler burns 6.4 gallons/hr for 8 knots.
the same distance would be 2000 gallons.

Assuming gas will go back to $4 a gallon thats $2,160 vs. $8,000
 
No Mast said:
Scurvy, you were looking for a comparison:

Lets say in a year you travel 2500 NM.

We had a 42" sailboat it burned 1.8 gal/hr for 5.5 knots.
If you motored the entire distance thats 818 gallons.
If you sailed just 1/3 of it now you're at 540 gallons.

Our trawler burns 6.4 gallons/hr for 8 knots.
the same distance would be 2000 gallons.

Assuming gas will go back to $4 a gallon thats $2,160 vs. $8,000
Click to expand...

So that breaks down to $180 a month for fuel vs. $667 a month with the trawler. That's quite a difference and I'm guessing it'd be even less for a 32' boat that's going to require about half as many HP to move.

Can you give me an example of your itinerary that would be 2500 NM? I'm not at all familiar with distances between popular areas like the keys vs. Bahamas or Caribbean trips.
 
IMO - Have really good dink. Anchor with a really good anchor close to shore where items such as laundry, food, fuel, sundries... etc are readily available. Make sure the boat you purchase is in very good condition to begin with. Live aboard and take slow motoring excursions as desired. Then the costs of dockage are eliminated. Insurance is not required by law (I believe in most states). Only your desires, daily needs are what costs... along with at least some boat maintenance. I'm confident with frugal actions you could then live on $1K per month or even less! :dance:


Happy Boat-Life Daze!! - Art :speed boat:
 
Well sir, welcome aboard from Texas! As far as your search/question.......I see no reason why not..........but, a question: Is that Peculiar Mo? Just curious.
 
Art said:
IMO - Have really good dink. Anchor with a really good anchor close to shore where items such as laundry, food, fuel, sundries... etc are readily available. Make sure the boat you purchase is in very good condition to begin with. Live aboard and take slow motoring excursions as desired. Then the costs of dockage are eliminated. Insurance is not required by law (I believe in most states). Only your desires, daily needs are what costs... along with at least some boat maintenance. I'm confident with frugal actions you could then live on $1K per month or even less! :dance:


Happy Boat-Life Daze!! - Art :speed boat:
Click to expand...

You get it, Art, and I'll dance to that. :dance:

I know that a lot of people who boat like their booze, their Cuban cigars as well as eating out a lot and shopping. I don't do any of that anymore.

Years ago, I drank like a fish, enjoyed expensive cigars and fine dining. I can remember waking up and not knowing how I got home, if my car (or Harley) was even in the garage and if they were, what kind of shape they were in. Let's just say that I liked to party a lot. That's when I decided it was time to give it all up.

All that I want to do right now is to simplify my life and just enjoy being out there, taking it all in.
 
Have an iPad? I's suggest downloading Garmin BlueChart. Its a really nice program to generate routes and see distances, fuel consumption etc.

2500NM thats roughly what Houston to Jacksonville and back probably. Or a year up and down the eastern seaboard. Bahamas, well the tip of Grand Bahama is only 50 or 60 NM from the florida coast. But you could easily put 1200NM/2500NM or more traveling around the Caribbean in a year. Bahama to the Grenadines is over 1300NM.

Also keep in mind thats traveling time. You'll end up at anchor needing to charge batteries and want heat or AC, thats also going to cost you fuel.
 
wyoboater said:
Well sir, welcome aboard from Texas! As far as your search/question.......I see no reason why not..........but, a question: Is that Peculiar Mo? Just curious.
Click to expand...

Thank you, Wyoboater. Peculiar, Misssouri it is. Are you familiar with it or just thought the name was 'peculiar'. I'm about 20 minutes south of the southernmost city limits of Kansas City, Missouri.

Texas is a place I've considered for a home base. I have a long time friend that owns a vacation home in Galverston where he spends a lot of his free time.
 
Last edited:
Yep, I'm an over the road trucker...have stopped at the Flying J there numerous times....really wasn't sure anyone actually LIVED there, lol! And, to think you're interested in the trawler world to boot.........WOW
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

PNW
Seattle, new to trawling, excited to learn all the diesel things
Replies
18
Views
1K
socalrider
socalrider
O
Hello All, Looking for Research Help
Replies
8
Views
1K
orange150
O
F
New to the forum from Buffalo, NY
Replies
4
Views
316
RT Firefly
RT Firefly
B
New member, big dreams :-)
Replies
14
Views
603
ranger58sb
ranger58sb
Boatmama
searching for information
Replies
6
Views
468
RT Firefly
RT Firefly

Latest posts

Back
Top Bottom