Testing Drinking Water for Bacteria

Lead service supply lines were common prior to 1950, these were lead based service lines from the meter to the older homes. Municipal water systems used cast iron pipe (no lead) up until the 1950's then Ductile Iron Pipe became the Norm for municipal systems. PVC started being used in the 1970's and is very common today. The breakdown of any municipal system piping would not produce any lead unless the system was perhaps insalled in the late 1800's. Asbestos /cement pipe enjoyed a brief period and can still be found in many systems today. Where found it is usually removed and replaced with pvc or ductile iron pipe.

The USCG told us at the base ....asbestos ingested from the water pipes is not dangerous as opposed to being inhaled.


Any truth to that?

ulysses said:

The breakdown of any municipal system piping would not produce any lead unless the system was perhaps insalled in the late 1800's. .

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I don't know when they were installed, but Chicago and DC have both had lead issues. EPA testing in Chicago identified the problem. Chicago used lead to connect houses to the water mains into the 80's. They found that when they replaced water mains they were getting spikes of lead that lasted for years, so actually part of their issues came from updating their systems. American Water in Illinois advises running the water before using for drinking or cooking to remove lead. They also suggest you may want to get your water tested and refer you to the EPA regarding that. This is all in their annual report to homeowners. To my knowledge, none of this has been resolved, is just a continuing discussion as to cause, extent of problem, and fix.

I'll write specifically about Fort Lauderdale's water, since that is where I live. First, the taste is bad. Over 5% of their monthly samples showed excessive Coliform bacteria. Their Peele-Dixon treatment facility is 81 years old and had issues maintaining quality. In August of last year there was a problem with E-Coli in the water so we were on boil water instructions. Water in Fort Lauderdale often appears yellowish or tea-like in color due to Tannins. They are not dangerous but create a smell and bad taste. (We do have a filtering system on our home supply).

My hometown of Charlotte NC had issues too with color and taste and occasionally with disinfection products and other things and occasionally with lead. The water sources were considered to have high contaminant and susceptibility ratings. Ours came from the Catawba River and rivers are considered the most difficult source for cities to treat.

Perhaps there is some confusion as to what I have said about the "lead" in drinking water. Yes, it can be found in drinking water it is primarily due to lead pipes used as service supply lines common in the 1900's. The supply lines from the municipal meter to the home. You can also find lead and copper in plumbing fixtures in the house including your nice brass and bronze items up until the 1980's. Lead and copper becomes a problem when it leaches out of that type of piping and enters your drinking water at or near the tap. It becomes a problem for the municipal system due to the corrosiveness of the water that they are supplying through the pipes. It is not a breakdown of their piping but rather a breakdown of the homeowners piping DUE TO THE PH AND CORROSIVE PROPERTIES OF THE MUNICIPAL WATER. Therefore if a system is having trouble meeting the safe drinking water act regulations they will notify through the annual consumer confidence report and ask that you run the water for a minute or two at the tap if they are known to have a problem. If your fixtures and/or service line was put in after the 1980's there should not be a problem. If the problem was in the municipal line then there would be no amount of running it to fix the problem.
There are places (Flint Michigan) that have not had a problem with lead then changed to a different water source (Flint River) that had a different PH and now the system has a problem with lead and copper due to the change in PH of source water. The wording in your consumer confidence report is the same no matter where you live, the lead warning is required on everyone's report. The trick is to look at the system lead results from the lab.

Years ago we were told to boil Sydney water because of the presence of giardia and cryptospridium. For weeks, it was a PITA, but we were told if you drink it without boiling, you`ll get sick. Then the State elections rolled around. Our wily State Premier worked out people wouldn`t be happy voting for him at the ballot box just after spending time boiling and cooling water to drink. Suddenly, election week, all was well,we could drink the water unboiled. And no one got sick.

Psneed: The asbestos Maximum Contamination Level in drinking water is set at 7 million Fibers per liter. If it goes over that then it is considered a health risk. Primarily the asbestos effects lungs through the air but it has been found drinking it at these high levels may cause intestinal cancers and polyps.

BruceK: giardia and cryptos are bad news. They are difficult to test for and are relatively large bacteria with a hard shell making chlorine less effective. Please do not get me started on Water and Politics. I was chairman of my local water authority for about 19 years and saw way too much politics involved. None of it for the best.

Been RV'ing boating for over a half a century. Never got sick off the water. That said, coffee a la pink is not my thing.

Cook with bottled. Everything else with tank.

"First, as to the bottles. Nearly all the plastic bottles from bottled water are recyclable and a huge percentage of them are recycled plastic."

I understood recycled plastic was never used in food or drinking water .

Thought it became park bench or patio decking.

There are a couple of new business startups that are delivering drinking water in cardboard containers (think milk carton) .

Supposed to dissolve in the land fill much faster than plastic , and also dissolve in sea water .

BandB, You are sounding like the head of advertising for a bottled water company. Obviously you have a right to choose to drink only bottled water, but the quantity you claim to drink would be extremely expensive. You would probably come out ahead in the long run by buying and installing some sort of purification system.

And while water bottles can be recycled, many are not. My city provides recycling service (free) and perhaps 20% of the people in my neighborhood take advantage of it (I do). That means that 80% of the water bottles are going into the landfill.

Recycling reduces landfill usage but it still uses a lot of energy and labor. It's far more environmentally favorable to not use something that's not needed than to manufacture, use and then recycle something.

I think your concerns over the safety of city water are way overblown. Millions of people drink it every day without issues.

BandB: Being a water utility owner and operator for over 30 years I appreciate the efforts municipalities, communities, and water system owners put in to comply with the safe drinking water act. This is a 24/7/365 profession. I researched your complaints with the FT Lauderdale Water System. They did have a "one time" violation of the coliform rule in April of 2014 with the samples going over the 5% positive for that month only. In testing for over 280 different contaminants annually over the past five years that was their only violation. Tannins are an issue but as you said there are no health related issues with tannins in the water it is due more to where you live and the source water than anything harmful.
A "Boil Water Notice" is usually issued when a POTENTIAL exists for the system to be compromised. I have issued them when there is a break in a main line or other such distribution problems may arise that could allow the system to be effected. It is lifted as lab tests prove the threat is no longer an issue. It does not always mean that the water is contaminated. Be aware though that there are competent trained individuals addressing the problem during the boil water adviseary.
Much of the apparent issue you are taking with Lead and Copper is from reading the Consumer Confidence Reports required information for ALL SYSTEMS TO INCLUDE AS A LEARNING TOOL IN THEIR CCR. It does not mean your system is at risk. The Ft. Lauderdale system had no Violations on the Lead and Copper tests. It is important to look at the actual tests results and not at the required EPD definitions. You will note that most of those definitions and written explanations of a water born threat will start with "IF PRESENt" that is where you should go and see if the test results show a presence in your specifice system.
Any questions I would be happy to answer for you. We are extremely blessed to have a water treatment and distribution system in this country that addresses these issues.

WesK said:

BandB, You are sounding like the head of advertising for a bottled water company. Obviously you have a right to choose to drink only bottled water, but the quantity you claim to drink would be extremely expensive. You would probably come out ahead in the long run by buying and installing some sort of purification system.

And while water bottles can be recycled, many are not. My city provides recycling service (free) and perhaps 20% of the people in my neighborhood take advantage of it (I do). That means that 80% of the water bottles are going into the landfill.

Recycling reduces landfill usage but it still uses a lot of energy and labor. It's far more environmentally favorable to not use something that's not needed than to manufacture, use and then recycle something.

I think your concerns over the safety of city water are way overblown. Millions of people drink it every day without issues.

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I agree our concerns might be overblown to many and know millions don't have problems, although a lot more have problems than know it. In Fort Lauderdale, taste makes it necessary and we have a very fancy filtering system. It makes it tolerable for showering, washing dishes, cooking, and tolerable for drinking but not as tasty as bottled. If we only drank a glass of water a day we might think different. Yes, it does get expensive but the amount we spend on beverages is less than 98% of you. Seven 16 ounce bottles of water cost us about $0.58 per day. $1.16 for the two of us. Eight would be $0.67/$1.34. Less per day than one soda or one beer would cost. As to trash, it's our water bottles vs. soda and beer bottles and cans. They all create trash.

As to the percentage of plastic recycled, I agree with your numbers. They're also true as to the percentage of paper products recycled. I don't know of any city where the recycler is able to actually recycle all they collect. There was an interesting facility built a couple of decades ago in Pembroke Pines. It was to be a true state of the art facility going through all trash and recycling everything possible. Only one problem. The people in the neighborhood didn't want it there. It was sold and the new owners continued the fight. Finally they gave up too. Recycling seems to be another of those things like prisons and mental hospitals that we're all in favor of, just not in our neighborhood.

We do not have good systems to get items recycled. The only things I think of being recycled well is batteries and tires. Voluntary recycling isn't working. For homes, there's a simple, but distasteful to many, solution. Garbage man checks bags of garbage for items that should have been recycled and issues warnings. Eventually they lead to tickets.

In manufacturing we always recycled all cardboard boxes, actually getting paid for it. Retail stores though have a lot of cardboard and a very difficult time disposing of it. We pay to have ours collected.

Back to water, it is part of our healthy regimen. (Note that we admit to some unhealthy habits as well). I think anything that maximizes the likelihood of us drinking lots of water is good.

We're not trying to convert anyone to bottled water and sorry if we sound like an ad. Simply it's what we drink and what we intend to continue to drink for the present time.

You are suggesting "garbage police"? There are many legitimate functions of government but deciding what items we put in what trash can is not one of them.

WesK said:

You are suggesting "garbage police"? There are many legitimate functions of government but deciding what items we put in what trash can is not one of them.

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Much of the developed world controls what is put in the trash can.
It actually works quite well.

Back to the subject, - there are many local governments which have banned single serve bottled water in the effort to reduce wasted resources. (Vancouver, Toronto, Concord Mass., Bundanoon Australia.)

AusCan said:

Much of the developed world controls what is put in the trash can.
It actually works quite well.

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Sure. Dictatorships work quite well, at least from the dictator's point of view.

Saying no dead animals or explosives in the garbage can is one thing, giving people a ticket for accidentally putting a plastic bottle in the garbage can is something else entirely.

There's a practical solution for this - put everything together for collection and then sort it out at the dump or transfer station.

Remember, the government is supposed to be working for us, not the other way around.

I recycle but I put glass bottles in the garbage container, not the recycling bin. Why? Because the recycle people often mishandle the recycling bin and drop the glass bottles on the street, breaking them. Do they clean up the broken glass or just leave it on the street? What do you think?

I think it suffices to say recycling is only a minimal success at this point compared to what it could be. There are many ways to answer it. The Pembroke Pines facility design was to do as someone suggested, sort all garbage. In many areas trash collectors are already issuing warnings for many things such as location of trash can and items outside can.

Fort Lauderdale is getting high usage of their recycling. However, people are struggling with what can be included. In Fort Lauderdale you get "uh oh notices" on your recycling cart if you put the wrong things in it. The most common one is contamination. That is paper that you haven't rinsed all the food and grease off of. Pizza boxes are a no as are plastic bags and foam and egg cartons. It gets complicated though as some glass is recyclable and some is not. Newspapers can't be included if they've been wet. Cardboard must fit in the bin and can't get wet. Every town has different rules. About 20% of what Fort Lauderdale picks up and can't use is contaminated, that is paper that still has signs of grease or food.

You shouldn't have to access a manual to know what to put in what bin.

Oh, and plastic water bottles are recyclable in Fort Lauderdale. Plastic bags aren't recycled. However, they could be and are by special recyclers. Just they equipment in Fort Lauderdale cannot handle them.

A regular consumer of bottled water here can buy at the supermarket 10L or larger containers which have a tap fitted. We buy them for the boat, use the water, and refill with "tap" water(the inbuilt tap unscrews). Whole towns here have banned the single plastic bottle as an environment hazard, a disposal and littering problem, and a waste of finite resources to manufacture.
Most non "fine dining" restaurants will happily supply a pitcher or bottle of cold "tap" on request (or even without), fortunately our "tap" is usually of acceptable quality.

BandB said:

I think it suffices to say recycling is only a minimal success at this point compared to what it could be. ..

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That's because the recycled trash isn't worth what it costs to collect and process it.

The simple solution is to not use excess packaging or products in the first place. Think about it. Single use plastic bottles, Styrofoam packaging, paper plates and plastic utensils, etc.