In the Trawler Market

Wanting to move up to the trawler ranks, can anybody tell me what brands they recommend I stay away from? I am looking at the late 70's to mid 80's. ANy and all inout is appreciated.

Well...... That's about an impossible question to answer. What you need to supply is what you want to do with the boat, where you will be using the boat and where you want to go, how experienced of a boater you are, are you willing and able to work on a boat and its systems or do you plan on hiring most work out, do you want to go fast or slow, how many people do you anticipate having on board with you, do you want to take long cruises or short cruises, and so on.

Just about every boat is good for something but no boat is good for everything. Listing what each of us feel is a good boat brand is not going to do you any good at this point. It's like asking what are good vehicle brands. I'm gonna say Aston Martin, somebody else will say Honda, and another guy will say Kenworth. By itself it's useless information.

If you can supply some of the details I mentioned in my first paragraph then people can start matching your requirements* and abilities to boat brands and even specific models that they feel might serve you well.


-- Edited by Marin on Saturday 22nd of January 2011 10:05:33 PM

I guess what I was trying to say was, *are there cheaper lesser quality boats that one should stay away from. Having had a 28' Cabin Cruiser and knowing there are lesser quality boats such as the difference between a Searay and a Bayliner. The main issue being the hull construction.

To answer your questions, I am looking for something in the 38-42 foot range to dock on the coast of South Carolina. I want to spend weekends and do some long range cruises during the summer months. Would like to go to the Bahamas, Keys, Northeast, and do the Loop one day. Mostly just the wife and I, but occasionally another couple will accompany us.

As for experience, I have cruised the entire South Carolina coast line inside & out. We enjoy overnighting and anchoring.

things I know I want: AC/Heat, genny, two cabins, twin helms, twin diesels, windlass, radar & all normal electronics, & No teak decks.*

Hope this helps! *

wind,
No one here is going to tell you what boats to avoid as there is bound to be someone here that has that boat. We can tell you what boats we think are good or great and you can make a note of what boats we don't mention. However I assume you're talking used trawlers so I'm going to repeat what I told someone else and then some.
1. Drive a hard bargin and do lots of shopping because the boat you buy will only be a beginning. You will be very lucky to find a turn key boat and one set up and configured just the way you like it. So you will most likely put lots of time and MONEY into that boat. And I'm not talking about insurance and stuff*** ...just the boat. A broker told me the best way to buy a boat is to find one that has had 3 or 4 owners all w different priorities. One owner installs a new engine and fuel tanks, the next repairs the decks and gives it a $50K Algrip paint job, the next goes nuts w electronics hot water heaters and the next buys a $20K dinghy and a $10k crane to launch it with. Then he gets into the divorce game and the $300K boat would cost over a million dollars to duplicate. You prolly have the idea. Most people invest in their boat so***** ...let'em do it*** ...and then you buy it for $220K.Few of us will spend so much time putting together such a deal but lean in that direction. Find a boat that will only require about a days work once a year or less to keep blisters in check. Learn the difference between blisters that will require a bit of time in the spring to blisters that will cost you $20K.
If it's an old boat try to find one that has been repowered and had it's fuel tanks replaced. Look for a boat w modern equipment and very few things that are very old and likely will need replacement. Avoid boats w teak decks. The only teak deck that's a good teak deck is one that is held in place w something that does not penetrate the fiberglass deck. If you can see screws or bungs it's a time bomb. Teak decks can be dealt with but almost always at great expense or/and lots of labor.
Of great importance is to honestly evaluate what kind of boat you really should have. You say you want a trawler. I think you probably haven't fully evaluated what you need but ther'es also a good chance you have. You may be more happy w a cruiser or a houseboat. Learn all you can and take advantage of TF**** ...and on that note welcome to Trawler Forum.

Agree with all the above. I would ask yourself why a trawler and not just an aft cabin cruiser or something of that nature. For me, the advantage of a trawler is fuel economy and for me that translates to a single screw. Trawlers are sloooowwww so make sure you are ok with going 7-9 knots. When you get into older boats, brand and make grow less important (to a degree) and upkeep and maintenance plays a much larger roll. so as others said, look more at systems and updates and overall condition instead of make/model. Fuel tanks are definitely something to watch for. Feel free to post any links to any particular boats you are considering and folks here will be happy to provide any insight available. Welcome to TF!

Good Points! I have done some research that is why I said I don't want the teak decks. Yes a trawler is what I want. i have the done the cruiser thing and now that I will be 50 this year I am looking for a slower pace. I have my summers off and get ample time in the winter and other times during the year. I live an hour an half from the coast and enjoy learning and working on my boat. I also have a job that will allow me to*at the boat*from time to time.

I'm not sure how much you know about cruisers, but you have to be a contortionist to work on them.*Not for me!


-- Edited by windmill29130 on Saturday 22nd of January 2011 10:57:30 PM

Wind,
Don't rule teak decks out. If you get the mother of all deals on the mother of all boats you can deal w teak decks. Would be a whole lot easier if the screw holes haven't let water into the cores yet. But then you should remanufacture the boat the way it should have been built in the first place. Don't rule anything out. Buy a boat w a toasted engine but get it at a price whereas you can install a new and better engine without getting into the boat beyond it's value. And about fuel tanks. With steel tanks not even a good surveyor can tell you how long they will last. Old steel tanks are a time bomb. Look for aluminum.

I agree with Eric. We happen to like teak decks--- they provide a superior deck surface in terms of wet and dry traction plus we like the look of them. Our boat is 38 years old now and still has it's original deck planks. They've been over-sanded by previous owners and we had to have the main deck re-grooved and re-seamed. But we've learned how to take care of them properly and we anticipate getting many more years of service out of them.

That said, there are good reasons to NOT have a teak deck, too. They get really hot in hot climates. Not a problem, I guess, if you wear shoes all the time. They do take maintenance, but not nearly as much as people who don't have them or don't know how to care for them properly tend to think.* And a teak deck that has not been taken care of properly or has been allowed to deteriorate to the point where it's beyond saving can be a major headache and, ultimately, a major cost.

So... if you like teak decks there's no reason to avoid boats with them IF you know ot judge their condition and understand how to keep them in good shape. But if you don't want teak decks there are plenty of "trawlers" out there without them.* And it's possible to find examples of makes that typically have teak decks, like Grand Banks, that have had their teak planking removed and a new deck surface applied, which generally means a couple of layers of additional glass to restore stiffness and a non-skid surface.* If done correctly, these re-decking jobs can be very nice.* If done poorly, they can end up being more of a hassle than the original teak would have been.

nomadwilly wrote:

And about fuel tanks. With steel tanks not even a good surveyor can tell you how long they will last. Old steel tanks are a time bomb. Look for aluminum.

Click to expand...

I don't know enough about this issue to give a compelling reason one way or the other.* But I have read and been told as miany times that aluminum fuel tanks are NOT an a good idea as I have that they are.* So if a boat you like has aluminum tanks, it might be a good idea to talk to some fuel tank fabricators or other pros in the marine industry to get as much accurate information as you can about them.

Marin,
The problem usually with teak decks is that while you are correct that if they are taken care of they will be problem free for a long time, 99% of boat owners don't take care of them properly so they are often a major cause for rotten coring, etc. But hey- my boat is a case in point- just b/c you don't have teak decks doesn't mean you won't have coring issues. I had to recore our foredeck and bridge deck when we bought our Monk this past fall and our boat never had teak decks. It was poor installation of after market stuff that caused leaks into the coring on our boat.

Fiberglass tanks seem to be the most bulletproof fuel tanks out there. That is all hatteras uses. Albin has them in some of their boats (I know a 49' albin we almost bought had them at least). Any metal will corrode over time.
If you buy a trawler with metal tanks of any time you definitely need to take the time to take off the inspection ports and inspect the interior of the tanks for rust.

Grand Banks now uses "plastic" tanks.

Most of the older boats will have issues you will have to address.* It is usually reflected in the price the seller is willing to take.***We replaced our fuel tanks with ones made of crosslinked poly.* They are roto molded with no seams or welds. They have passed the USCG testing of fuel tanks and we hope to get alot of service out of them.** Have fun boat Shopping.

Woodsong wrote:

Agree with all the above. I would ask yourself why a trawler and not just an aft cabin cruiser or something of that nature.

Click to expand...

Don't worry.* Many trawlerforum users don't have (slow)*trawlers.* Sedan cruisers (fast)*are also popular here.

*

Old Stone wrote:

All the comments so far are valid, but has your original question of hull intergity been answered? Aside from blisters, which are pretty obvious (use a good surveyor under any circumstances) most hulls manufactured in the 70s and early 80s were definately overbuilt because fiberglass was still sort of new. Most are "tanks" that many of us find preferable to the newer, much thinner hulls coming out of molds nowadays. Very valid comments have been made about the decks and the fuel tanks, two of the most expensive fixes. Only thing that wouldn't sway my decision would be one engine or two. No trawler is fast, so consumption is not that much worse on a twin screw, but maintenance on the twins is more costly. If you get a single, a bow thruster can be helpful, and is not needed with twins.


Best of luck with your search.

Click to expand...

I think this answers my main question about boat quality. Knowing that most hulls in this time period are of good quality is good information. I know today due to cost and competition, boat manufactures are finding ways to make things cheaper. The hull quality is my main concern, everything else I feel comfortable working on or having to replace.*

I appreciate all the input and keep it coming. I am finding and what I have been told, it can take a year or more to find the right boat.*
thanks!
Trrawler*Hunting in the South*

*

http://marinesource.com/broker-photos/sale-pictures-1983-38-CALIFORNIAN-WELLCRAFT-MOTOR-YACHT-Port-Charlotte-FL-100446875.cfm

http://marinesource.com/broker-listing/1984-38-Present-Double-Cabin-Trawler-Cocoa-Beach-FL-100425251.cfm

A couple boats I am interested in. What are your thoughts?

thanks!

nomadwilly wrote:

Don't rule teak decks out.

And about fuel tanks. With steel tanks not even a good surveyor can tell you how long they will last. Old steel tanks are a time bomb. Look for aluminum.

Click to expand...

Everything on a boat is a time bomb.* Everything has a service life given it's use and maintenance/level of care.* Also, there is no perfect boat.

For our teak decks, we take a lot of care in keeping the deck sealed.**For our steel fuel tanks, they are kept dry and coated.* The sumps are*drained frequently.

Sure, these items will probably require removal/repair/replacement, but I'm thinking/hoping for another 20 years from now.* They're 37 years old now.



*

http://marinesource.com/broker-details/for-sale-1984-38-Present-Double-Cabin-Trawler-Cocoa-Beach-FL-100425251.cfm

http://marinesource.com/boat-details/for-sale-1983-38-CALIFORNIAN-WELLCRAFT-MOTOR-YACHT-Port-Charlotte-FL-100446875.cfm

A couple of boats that I am interested in. Any thoughts?
thanks!

http://marinesource.com/boat-details/for-sale-1983-38-CALIFORNIAN-WELLCRAFT-MOTOR-YACHT-Port-Charlotte-FL-100446875.cfm

http://marinesource.com/broker-details/for-sale-1984-38-Present-Double-Cabin-Trawler-Cocoa-Beach-FL-100425251.cfm

A couple of boats I am interested in. Any thoughts?
thanks

My opinion is that you should make sure your spouse likes*whatever boat you decide on.* No matter how much you might like it, you will never enjoy it if she does not like it.*

Seaisleman wrote:My opinion is that you should make sure your spouse likes*whatever boat you decide on.

Click to expand...

I don't tell my wife what kind of refrigerator to buy and she doesn't tell me what
kind of boat to buy. That's fair isn't it?

*

charles wrote:Take a look and then tell me that aluminum tankage on a boat is not good.

Click to expand...

All I can do is relate what I've read in a lot of places and been told by a few shipwrights.* Perhaps, like stainless tanks, it depends on how the aluminum tanks are made or the alloy used.* But I have read as well as heard a number of shipwrights who are in a position to be credible on the subject say that aluminum fuel tanks are less than ideal.

i have also read as well as heard shipwrights who are in an equally credible position say that aluminum fuel tanks are great.

My point is that if one is contemplating the purchase of a boat with aluminum fuel tanks it would behoove them to talk to some pros on this specific subject, as opposed to taking the advice of people on an internet forum.* If there are ways that aluminum tanks can be problematic, it would seem to make sense to find out from people who* make their living by knowing what they're talking about what those ways are so they can be avoided.

*

Marin,
You just did that and came up w a 50/50 split. If we were to take your advice we'd come up just as confused. I know you're not confused. Most (as in almost all) knowledgable people (professionals) say aluminum is best. I was going to use SS before I researched the matter. As for plastic**** ..probably fine until there's a fire and then Duhhh.

Marin,
Did you go to the meeting?

-- Edited by nomadwilly on Sunday 23rd of January 2011 11:29:17 PM

nomadwilly wrote:

1. Marin,
You just did that and came up w a 50/50 split. ....Most (as in almost all) knowledgable people (professionals) say aluminum is best.

2. Marin,
Did you go to the meeting?

Click to expand...

1.* Yes, but......* The people who said aluminum fuel tanks can have problems had reasons convincing enough to make me want to learn more about them if we were contemplating getting a boat with aluminum tanks or having new tanks made for a boat we owned.* It may have to do with construction methods or specific alloys--- I don't recall the details since the subject had no bearing on either of our boats.

What was interesting was that none of the comments I can recall, including the ones that said aluminum fuel tanks were good, said that they were the best choice.* In fact most of them said iron tanks were the best if you took the proper steps to keep rust at bay.

2.* No.

nomadwilly wrote:

Marin,
You just did that and came up w a 50/50 split. If we were to take your advice we'd come up just as confused. I know you're not confused. Most (as in almost all) knowledgable people (professionals) say aluminum is best. I was going to use SS before I researched the matter. As for plastic**** ..probably fine until there's a fire and then Duhhh.

Marin,
Did you go to the meeting?

-- Edited by nomadwilly on Sunday 23rd of January 2011 11:29:17 PM
Eric,* All fuel tanks regardless of material are tested to the same standards.* If a tank is labeled having passed the USCG 183.590 it has passed the fire resistance test.* There is nothing wrong with a well made aluminum fuel tank, the problem is if the installation or location allows water to sit between the tank wall and the supports, this can lead to pitting and eventual leaking.** The USCG does not approve new steel (iron) tanks.** JohnP

Click to expand...

*

SeaHorse II wrote:

*
Seaisleman wrote:My opinion is that you should make sure your spouse likes*whatever boat you decide on.
I don't tell my wife what kind of refrigerator to buy and she doesn't tell me what
kind of boat to buy. That's fair isn't it?

Click to expand...

Walt,

First place I don't believe that for a second.*

And fair has nothing to do with it. :>))

*


-- Edited by JD on Monday 24th of January 2011 09:22:50 AM

The Gulfstars were also made with fiberglass tanks. It is nice not to worry about corrosion.

JD wrote:


SeaHorse II wrote:

*
Seaisleman wrote:My opinion is that you should make sure your spouse likes*whatever boat you decide on.
I don't tell my wife what kind of refrigerator to buy and she doesn't tell me what
kind of boat to buy. That's fair isn't it?

Click to expand...

Walt,

First place I don't believe that for a second.*

And fair has nothing to do with it. :>))

*
Walt, I believe JD's vision is clearing up.* He's RIGHT on this one.

*

JohnP wrote:*The USCG does not approve new steel (iron) tanks.****

Click to expand...

http://edocket.access.gpo.gov/cfr_2010/octqtr/46cfr182.440.htm

*

Moonstruck wrote:


JD wrote:SeaHorse II wrote:Seaisleman wrote:My opinion is that you should make sure your spouse likes*whatever boat you decide on.
I don't tell my wife what kind of refrigerator to buy and she doesn't tell me what
kind of boat to buy. That's fair isn't it?
Walt,

First place I don't believe that for a second.*

And fair has nothing to do with it. :>))

Click to expand...

Walt, I believe JD's vision is clearing up.* He's RIGHT on this one.
Must be the new coffee my wife bought for the Keurig.

*

I always recommend to my customers not to rule out any trawler based upon her brand; there are many good boats of all the makes and models, you just have to find them. In addition, I have come across lemons in each brand too, I call them Friday boats...

But in the age of boats you'll be seeing, teak decks are common and if you are willing to run the chance of a leak, they are usually fine. Most do not leak however.

As far as tankage goes, fuel tanks were generally built of steel but several builders coated them with epoxy as are those on my Labelle; no corrosion what so ever.

Leaking windows was a common problem with the early boats too.

The principle deal breakers with my clients boats as been corroded fuel tanks, rotten wood around windows, corroded rudder posts and struts. But if you can find a boat free of those issue you probably have found a good boat.