Winterizing 2015

Having moved my boat up to Connecticut this summer where we plan to leave it on the hard this winter, I just finished thoroughly winterizing the boat in prep for haul out. We have a normal trawler with all of the systems: engine, raw water anchor flush, generator, waste system, bilges, fresh water system and air conditioner. All of these need to be winterized as well as the DC system. So here is what I did:

The engine and generator were the easiest. I just closed the seacock, used a bilge pump to empty the strainer of water (to limit the amount of antifreeze I had to add) filled it with antifreeze, started the engine and poured antifreeze into the strainer while the engine idled and sucked it up. I used a half gallon for the single cylinder NextGen generator and three gallons for the 6 cyl Yanmar.

The air conditioner and the raw water wash down system both use the same thru hull and strainer. I winterized the wash down by using the same procedure as the engine: filled the strainer, flipped the switch on the raw water pump and ran a half gallon through it.

The air conditioning system was a bit more trouble because that pump isn't self priming like the others. So I removed the suction supply hose, elevated it a foot or so and with a funnel poured antifreeze in while the compressor and raw water pump were running. It took 30 seconds to suck down a half gallon of antifreeze.

The fresh water system was the most difficult. First I pumped the tank dry and disconnected the supply and return to the hot water heater and cross connected them with a short piece of tubing. I also opened the drain valve to the hot water heater. Then I pulled off the suction hose to the fresh water pump and temporarily connected a 3/4" piece of tubing to the suction fitting on the pump. I put the other end in a gallon jug of antifreeze, started the pump and one by one opened the fresh and hot water taps on the sink, bath lavatory and shower until I got a good stream of pink stuff out.

I also dumped a pint of antifreeze into the drain trap on the sink and lavatory and dumped a half gallon into the shower drain until I heard the shower sump pump go on and off.

The toilet is a raw water electric flush system. So I shut the thru hull supply and ran the flush pump to dump the bowl as dry as possible. Then I put a half gallon in the bowl and flushed it through. The holding tank was previously dumped and although a half gallon of antifreeze probably won't keep the couple of gallons that are probably left from freezing, it won't harm the tank if it does.

The last thing to do was the bilges. The boat has a forward bilge and pump which is always dry. But there is a bilge underneath the engine that overflows into an aft bilge with a pump. So I pumped the engine bilge over to the aft bilge with a hand pump. Any water left won't hurt anything if it freezes and there can't be more than a couple of quarts anyway. Then I dumped a gallon of antifreeze in the aft bilge to protect its pump.

The final thing to be concerned about in our climate where the overnight temps can get down to -10 F is the batteries. If they are discharged they will freeze and ruin them. Some remove the batteries and put them in the garage on a trickle charger. I have a 100 watt solar panel that has worked fine to keep them charged while on a mooring all summer so I am going to rely on that to keep them topped off for the winter. Every boat yard I know of will not allow you to permanently plug in an electric cord, even for battery charging only. I wouldn't rely on it to keep my boat or batteries from freezing in any case- too easy to get disconnected.

This whole process was somewhat tedious. It took about 3-4 hours and 8 gallons of antifreeze or about $30-40 worth. But the marina where I moor charges a flat rate of $750 to do all of this stuff and I know that they will not bypass the water heater which is a pain to flush out in the spring if it is filled with antifreeze. So the time was well spent to do the job right.


David

Mostly right...

The toilet is a raw water electric flush system. So I shut the thru hull supply and ran the flush pump to dump the bowl as dry as possible. Then I put a half gallon in the bowl and flushed it through.

All you did was add antifreeze to the tank, the toilet has no protection....'cuz nothing poured into the bowl recirculates--at least it's not supposed to!--through the inlet hose and pump, which means the inlet hose, pump and bowl have NO protection from freeze damage. I can't begin to count the number of bowls we used to replace every spring for people who thought that's all they needed to do to winterize their toilets...in GEORGIA! And your boat will be on the hard in CT, where the winters are a lot longer and harder!

So go back to the boat with another gallon of the "pink stuff" and this time, disconnect the inlet hose from the thru-hull (to anyone reading this who's still in the water: close the seacock first!), and stick it into the jug of antifreeze. Flush the toilet to move the antifreeze through the WHOLE system. Flush the whole gallon though...the half-gallon you've already put in it won't be enough if you have an extended hard freeze.

You should also have rinsed out your holding tank to get rid of any sludge after your final pumpout (apparently you missed the whole thread on cleaning a holding tank), but it's prob'ly too late now.

Dave, what kind of mufflers do you have on the gen and main? I ask because mine held a lot of water, and you need to push enough pink through the engine to sufficiently dilute the residual water in the mufflers. Otherwise they are at risk of freezing.

Alternately, some mufflers (maybe all) can be drained before running pink through the system. Then they have very little residual water, and the amount you already ran through is probably enough. My Cummins QSCs on my Grand Banks took 15 gal of pink for EACH engine, and most of that was for the benefit of the mufflers.

Second the muffler issue. You need to run the engine and genset until you see pink coming out the exhausts.

Dave...

My $0.02 -
Your summary sounds similar to what I do on my MS34HT except I have my yard do the engine & gen.
My HWH does not have engine heating and I wonder if the 3 gal is enough to get to the HWH & back to engine... might be worth pulling the temp connection you made to make sure? I had an experience on previous boat where yard di engine fine but it wasn't enough to get to the HWH coil - froze & broke the HWH coil - my yard admitted it was their fault and repaired the HWH coil at no charge.

Make sure all sea cock valves are opened after haul out.
If not you will still have water in the ball cavity which will freeze and ruin the valves.

Also - 1/2 gal in shower sump may not be enough unless you cleaned & dried out the residual water before the AF was added.

I'm a bit confused about the Hwh. The loop from the engine to the HWH is typically engine coolant, not raw water, so should already be freeze protected. Or maybe we are talking about different things?

For what it's worth, I most recently have taken to blowing out the fresh water system with compressed air rather than running pink through it.

I think the pink approach is more fool proof, but air leaves no residue in the fresh water system so I find it preferable as long as you are sure to get all the water out.

twistedtree said:

For what it's worth, I most recently have taken to blowing out the fresh water system with compressed air rather than running pink through it.

I think the pink approach is more fool proof, but air leaves no residue in the fresh water system so I find it preferable as long as you are sure to get all the water out.

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I try a combo of both...use the pink...blow it out and recover it for the next system....minimizes costs and amount of spring flushings...

Understanding your systems and low spots, plus points that need foolproof winterizing such as certain valves, etc that would collect water, even condensation over the winter is important to know . That way you can know what can be blown dry and what can be benefited by a little pink.

I agree on blowing out the fresh water system, we hook up a pancake air compressor and set the pressure of 25 pounds and use the connector we use to winterize the RV connected to the fresh water inlet on the boat. My question is, if we drain the hot water heater, will the hot water tank fill with air and blow out the hot water lines?


Thanks Ray

Ray said:

My question is, if we drain the hot water heater, will the hot water tank fill with air and blow out the hot water lines?


Thanks Ray

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Yes, that's how I have done it.

Thanks


Ray

twistedtree said:

I'm a bit confused about the Hwh. The loop from the engine to the HWH is typically engine coolant, not raw water, so should already be freeze protected. Or maybe we are talking about different things?

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twistedt...

I believe you are correct - my last boat did not have closed cooling so HWH was raw (fresh) water cooled along w/ engine - my mistake - probably apples & oranges comparison in my original post.

Ray said:

I agree on blowing out the fresh water system, we hook up a pancake air compressor and set the pressure of 25 pounds and use the connector we use to winterize the RV connected to the fresh water inlet on the boat. My question is, if we drain the hot water heater, will the hot water tank fill with air and blow out the hot water lines?

Thanks Ray

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Ray...

Yes but - I say blow out first (w/ HWH full) it will displace some of the water and blow out the cold supply and HW lines... then drain the HWH.
If you drain first then blow you could possibly blow addn'l water from the supply line into the HWH and may have a freeze problem at any fittings near the bottom - e.g. the drain?
I blow - drain HWH - bypass HWH - then pink FW & HW lines using the FW pump and a 3 way valve / inlet ahead of the FW pump (pic)
That's how I've done RV's and boats and never had a problem.

I have seen previous discussions re: blowing our vs pink and whether to blow out pink immediately after filling.
My understanding from those discussions...

"unwanted stuff" will grow in a damp environment when O2 is present faster than if O2 is excluded so the recommendation is to fill the lines w/ pink and leave it there for the winter. This excludes O2 and minimizes any growth in lines.

Tanks are another story - can't or don't want to fill those so you can't avoid growth. My last boat had easily accessible clean out ports and I've confirmed they do grow a slimy film over the winter. Typically I added a gal or so of water & some bleach and "scrubbed" the tank interior w/ a long handled carboy brush (Pic) available from any wine making supply (readily available in NY Finger Lakes Wine Country)

Part of spring commissioning RV & boat is a bleach flush of the fresh water system (after clear water flush) and this usually gets rid of any "pink" taste / smell and sanitizes the FW system.

WOW! I've learned a lot today!

I read all the posts in this thread twice and this is what I've learned:

1) My hat's off to you guys who go through this every year!
2) I'm definitely living in the right place!

Codger2 said:

I read all the posts in this thread twice and this is what I've learned:

1) My hat's off to you guys who go through this every year!
2) I'm definitely living in the right place!

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Walt, I'll guarantee you are in the right place!

I just winterized our boat this last week, and won't be back aboard until March

Peggie- You are right. My heat gun failed when I got to the toilet winterizing, so I didn't pull off the raw water supply hose to flush that side with antifreeze. Should have noted that in the write up. I will do that when I go back to the boat next week and secure everything once it is hauled. Heat guns are $21 now at Amazon. I think I paid more than $50 about ten years ago for the one that failed.

Twistedtree- My boat has a horizontal muffler that exits the side of the boat. While I was sucking up three gallons of antifreeze, the engine was blowing most of the water out of the muffler. It should be fine as long as a half gallon of antifreeze made it that far.

I will open all thru hull valves once the boat is on the hard to dump any water that is trapped inside the ball.

David

I use an air compressor, too... with pre-made hoses and appropriate fittings.

I don't bother to bypass the WH; it empties "enough" and the manual says a freeze of any remainder won't hurt it. I do run a little pink AF through the filter/water pump/accumulator tank after the system is all emptied out. Some AF into the (pumped and rinsed first) holding tank.

-Chris

My heat gun failed when I got to the toilet winterizing, so I didn't pull off the raw water supply hose to flush that side with antifreeze.

Blow dryer works and is a lot less likely to "cook" the hose in a moment of inattention than a heat gun.

Sheesh. This winterizing concept sounds like lots of work!

I'm in south Texas and wondering how much I need to winterize? We do get some hard freezes from time to time-- by hard freeze I'm talking about temps dropping under freezing for a few hours during the night but then warming up during the day. Similar to south Florida I guess?

Would a decent space heater or two inside the boat be sufficient?

cardude01 said:

Sheesh. This winterizing concept sounds like lots of work.

Would a decent space heater or two inside the boat be sufficient?

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My MS came from Dallas and the PO had an engine rm heater installed.

Inside easy to just blow out lines w a compressor hooked up via dockside water connection...literally takes 5-10 min to do.

David,

Another time saver is to install a water heater bypass valve. These are available at most marine or rv stores. Rather than having to disconnect lines and add a connecting piece like you did one just turns a single valve that cuts out the water heater and combines the cold and hot systems.

John

cardude01 said:

Sheesh. This winterizing concept sounds like lots of work! I'm in south Texas and wondering how much I need to winterize? We do get some hard freezes from time to time-- by hard freeze I'm talking about temps dropping under freezing for a few hours during the night but then warming up during the day. Similar to south Florida I guess? Would a decent space heater or two inside the boat be sufficient?

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For just an overnight dip, you don't even need one space heater, much less two. It takes longer than that for the boat to cool down from the day's solar heat to anything close to freezing.

djmarchand said:

Peggie- You are right. My heat gun failed when I got to the toilet winterizing, so I didn't pull off the raw water supply hose to flush that side with antifreeze. Should have noted that in the write up. I will do that when I go back to the boat next week and secure everything once it is hauled. Heat guns are $21 now at Amazon. I think I paid more than $50 about ten years ago for the one that failed.
David

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David try a hose pick to get the hose off the barb. Works really easy.
FWIW I use just a little less than 3 gallons of pink to winterize the Ford-Lehman. 1 1/2 for the genny and raw water wash down. 1 1/2 for the domestic water system.

cardude01 said:

Sheesh. This winterizing concept sounds like lots of work!

I'm in south Texas and wondering how much I need to winterize? We do get some hard freezes from time to time-- by hard freeze I'm talking about temps dropping under freezing for a few hours during the night but then warming up during the day. Similar to south Florida I guess?

Would a decent space heater or two inside the boat be sufficient?

Click to expand...

Really depends...local knowledge on this topic really trumps most general info.

Here in New Jersey when water temps are in the 50s, maybe even 40s, the rule of thumb is 3 consecutive nights of freezing temps before winterizing the Shamrock 26s. That is the salt water system engine cooling system only and in shallow bilges.

Some boats have fresh water tanks and plumbing pretty high up in the bilges...valves with small spaces in them and the metal quicly transferring heat could freeze and break in any good hard freeze lasting overnight. My rule of thumb would be conditions needed to freeze ice cubes in a couple hours.

All of this is hard to guess...that's why I say local knowledge is king here.

Dave,
I do everything you stated to winterize but I'm more interested in the batteries. Did you take the batteries out before you got the solar charger or did you just secure your switches?
Peggie,
I must of got lucky last year since I did the same thing Dave did.
This is why I like this site so much, I learn something every time I read these post.


Thanks Jeff.

Was wondering what people do about batteries. Since I can't have them on charge thru out the winter and they're a little heavy to take out, should I disconnect the cables or leave them on. My thinking was if I had a little voltage leak somewhere I could be returning to dead batteries. Any thoughts ?

David try a hose pick to get the hose off the barb. Works really easy.

I have no idea what a "hose pick" is, but you don't want to use anything that will dimple a plastic fitting 'cuz dimpling prevents a hose from getting tight seal...so you'll have a source of odor you can't find, if not an actual leak.

I've always used a blow dryer (safer and a lot cheaper than a heat gun)to warm hose to make it easier to remove. Warming a bit along with a little lubrication makes it a lot easier to put the hose ONTO a fitting...Don't use Vaseline or anything that stays greasy or oily 'cuz that'll let hose work it's way off the fitting. The industry has always recommended dishwashing liquid, but K-Y surgical jelly is much slicker, is water soluble so it dries out, and available from any drug store and most supermarkets.

A hose pick (see pic below) won't damage anything if used properly (the ends are blunt). Auto mechanics use them every day.


I charge my batteries, then turn the switch to off. So far in 20 plus years of winterizing in Ct I've had no issues.

HeadMistress said:

I've always used a blow dryer...

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Must be something women usually have handy...



-Chris

gonesailing13 said:

Was wondering what people do about batteries. Since I can't have them on charge thru out the winter and they're a little heavy to take out, should I disconnect the cables or leave them on. My thinking was if I had a little voltage leak somewhere I could be returning to dead batteries. Any thoughts ?

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Trojan says a fully charged battery will freeze at -92 degrees F. Not too worried about that. However, if the battery gets down to about 40% charged, the freeze point goes up to just to +16 degrees F - a temperature we do hit around here.

I always fully charge the batteries and then disconnect them. That makes sure there are no drains from things like CO detectors or stereo memory.