Need Help with Windlass Application

FF wrote:

Just as in motor boats, the slip is charged for by LOA so a fat hull doesn't cost more to own.

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Not any more.* We just received a newsletter from the Port of Bellingham stating that they are contemplating (which means "are") changing from a moorage fee based on the length of the slip*to a moorage fee based on the boat's area (length x width).* According to them other marinas in this area are changing to this charging system or already have.

*

Port of Edmonds, WA. has charged moorage on a square foot basis since before 1996.

"We just received a newsletter from the Port of Bellingham stating that they are contemplating (which means "are") changing from a moorage fee based on the length of the slip to a moorage fee based on the boat's area (length x width). According to them other marinas in this area are changing to this charging system or already have."



This is fantastic good news if it spreads. The easiest way to get better "efficiency", boat speed vs fuel burn is to simply have the boat far longer. A Length / beam ratio over 6 is required to get fast as well as cheap to operate,

A 40 ft boat 15 ft beam vs a 60 ft LWL with a 10 ft beam , would be no contest for the fastest sea kindly ride.

Perhaps the era of Bloat Boats is coming to a close!!

Break out those old drawings of Commuters!

-- Edited by FF on Friday 14th of January 2011 05:50:49 AM

Seems to me a more logical, fairer*basis is the size of the berth/slip.* How effective one uses the space should be the boater's concern.* Why should I pay more for a bigger boat compared to a smaller boat using the same-sized berth?* The marinas I've checked out here charge by the size of berth.* Or am I off base (staying up way too late)*because the square-footage basis relates to moorings only?

-- Edited by markpierce on Friday 14th of January 2011 06:32:50 AM

At Port of Edmonds, we are charged for the size of the berth:* In my case, 40' x 15.5'.* There is also a minimum rule of having a boat with a LOA of 80% of the slip length.* Also, maximum 2' hangover, and you pay extra in 1' increments.

Most in Vancouver charge by the greater of slip length or boat length. Up to you to find a slip the correct width. Many older marinas have narrow slips in abundance, newer marinas have wider slips.
Shelters in our YC are by area under the roof.
Our YC is constantly wrestling with the pressure on slip width, and moves fingers along where they can, to accommodate wider boats. Reconfiguring of the whole marina has occurred a couple of times over its lifetime and will again, as pressures dictate.

That would seem a no brainer to me * * * ......just put a narrow boat in w a fat boy. With the narrow fairways down south I can't see why there should be any overhang at all and the bow shouldn't be hang'in over into the place where people walk. Outboards should be measured w their engines tilted all the way up. People put pads on the pulpit or anchor because others do bump into them. I'm a hard case on this overhang bit...*shouldn't be any at all. And the cost of the slip should be based on only the length of the slip. The cost to the boat owner should reflect the cost of providing the service. Just because a Marina has a lot of fat boats dosn't mean they should get any more money in slip fees. Of course the above only applies to public facilities. Private marina's should have the right to make any rules they want and charge whatever rate.

nomadwilly wrote:

Just because a Marina has a lot of fat boats dosn't mean they should get any more money in slip fees.

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While I'm certainly not a proponent of higher moorage fees, the Port of Bellingham has a mandate that Squalicum Marina must be self-sufficient.* In other words, the cost of operating, maintaining, and improving the marina must be covered by the income generated by the marina.* The Port cannot receive any subsidies or funds from the City of Bellingham for the operation, maintenance, and improvement of the marina.* The city prefers to spend its tax and fee income on schools, water, roads, police, fire dept., etc.

The cost of operating, maintaining, and improving a marina is going up all the time.* The only way the Port can continue to provide the facilities that boat owners need or demand is to increase the marina's income.

So on the one hand, you have the desire of the boat owners for the lowest possible moorage fees.* On the other hand, you have the city's desire to make the people who use the marina pay for the marina so the city's budget can be used for the services everyone in the city needs, not just boaters.

Another example of an issue being a bit more complicated than it might appear from just one perspective.


-- Edited by Marin on Friday 14th of January 2011 12:15:59 PM

But it's still a public service and just rates and fairness should prevail. But if public services were fair single people and childless couples wouldn't be required to pay for schools.

nomadwilly wrote:

But it's still a public service and just rates and fairness should prevail.

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I suspect the Port of Bellingham feels their moorage rates are fair for what they are supposed to accomplish, which is cover their share of the operating and maintenance costs of the marina.* I assume the marina also gets income from the rental of buildng space to all the businesses that are located on the marina property.

Marin,Yes and it would be nice if the real estate covered it's own expenses too.
My Firefox crashed and I'm 100% on Safari now. I think Hughs Net is "throttling" me.
Can't do much boat shopping as all the shopping stuff is bookmarked on Firefox.
Could be a blessing anyway as I think the boat shopping is about over.
One of the boats I was looking at had one of those Bull Frogs and after thinking they looked rather stupid I'm drawn to them now. Maybe I'll go davits and get one. Would be nice if they were 10' * * ....I'll look them up on the web.

nomadwilly wrote:

Marin,
Yes and it would be nice if the real estate covered it's own expenses too.
My Firefox crashed and I'm 100% on Safari now. I think Hughs Net is "throttling" me.
Can't do much boat shopping as all the shopping stuff is bookmarked on Firefox.
Could be a blessing anyway as I think the boat shopping is about over.
One of the boats I was looking at had one of those Bull Frogs and after thinking they looked rather stupid I'm drawn to them now. Maybe I'll go davits and get one. Would be nice if they were 10' * * ....I'll look them up on the web.

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Eric

The Bullfrogs start at 10 ft. *http://www.bullfrogboats.com/


-- Edited by Carey on Friday 14th of January 2011 05:30:22 PM

Hiya,
** Mr. Marin...Name suggestion if you buy a bullfrog...Jeremiah

RT Firefly wrote:

Hiya,
** Mr. Marin...Name suggestion if you buy a bullfrog...Jeremiah

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I'm not imaginative like you.* If we get one, if we give it any name at all, it will probably be "La Perouse 3."* Our Livingston is "La Perouse 1," the sailing dinghy is "La Perouse 2."* Actually the sailing dinghy has a previous name, "Wee Hand."* We've left it in place on the transom as whoever named it put the name on in nice bronze letters.

Of course if we were really imaginative we would call our Livingston "Boussole" and the sailing dinghy "Astrolabe."* These were the names of La Perouse's two ships on his voyage of discovery.* "Boussole" means "compass" in French and "Astrolabe" means just that, the astrological navigation tool of the same name.

*

Marin,
Why would you want to name your boats in a foreign language. Almost nobody has any idea what it means.*

Carey,
I looked at the Frog website. Thanks for posting it however now I know I won't be getting one. You can only go dead slow or on a full plane. A disp speed in a dinghy is only 2.5 knots and a full plane in a 10' boat is sorta nuts. The Frog weighs 3 or 4 times as much as my converted sailboat and cost's a bundle. It is cute though. The davits may be a go though.




-- Edited by nomadwilly on Friday 14th of January 2011 09:39:41 PM

nomadwilly wrote:

Why would you want to name your boats in a foreign language. Almost nobody has any idea what it means.*

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I know what they mean, and they mean something to me and my heritage.* As does the name of our GB and even the name of our dog (Albi).* I could care less if anyone else knows what they mean.***

How about those two billion sailboats around the world*that are named "Namaste?"* Know what that means?* (I'm not going to tell you, you can look it up.)

Our Arima fishing boat is named "Malolo."* (You can look that one up, too.)**Again, we named it for something that means something to us.* If nobody else knows what it means, so what?

Perhaps on his next boat, Eric will put the name of his boat on the boat so everyone can see.* His present*Willard trawler*shows no name.

Hiya,
** Mr. Marin.* Nothing to do with my imagination at all.* Three Dog Night's idea...Says it all in the first 25 seconds or so.

** Just a suggestion...

-- Edited by RT Firefly on Friday 14th of January 2011 09:52:48 PM

RT Firefly wrote:

Hiya,
** Mr. Marin.* Nothing to do with my imagination at all.* Three Dog Night's idea...Says it all in the first 25 seconds or so.

** Just a suggestion...

-- Edited by RT Firefly on Friday 14th of January 2011 09:52:48 PM

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I'm very familiar wth the song (I didn't care for it when it came out and still don't).* I always*liked the name of the group though.* Pop quiz for Eric--- What does "Three Dog Night" actually mean?

*

Hiya,
** I know....I know.....hahahaha* I'm not much a fan of theirs either.

-- Edited by RT Firefly on Friday 14th of January 2011 09:57:46 PM

nomadwilly wrote:


Carey,
I looked at the Frog website. Thanks for posting it however now I know I won't be getting one. You can only go dead slow or on a full plane. A disp speed in a dinghy is only 2.5 knots and a full plane in a 10' boat is sorta nuts. The Frog weighs 3 or 4 times as much as my converted sailboat and cost's a bundle. It is cute though. The davits may be a go though.

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I've ridden in Carey's Bullfrog more time than I can remember.* For my money, it's the only dinghy on the planet that makes any sense outside of a "real" boat like a*Boston Whaler or similar.* The Bullfrog can go any speed you want it to.* It is no different in that respect than an RIB.* But it can't puncture or tear, has no fabric to break down in the weather and UV, and has more usable*room inside since the "tubes" don't" have to be round (and aren't).* Carey had them fabricate a clever fuel tank that is part of the middle seat, so there isn't even a fuel tank underfoot in his.

There are only two drawbacks to a Bullfrog.* They're not cheap, and they're fairly heavy.* Not the sort of thing you put on Weaver Snap davits.* And since we don't believe in stowing a dinghy on a cabin top or boat deck (in coastal waters) our only choice if we ever get one will be to tow it.

But they're terrific dinghies.* They go slow if you want to troll and go fast if you want to make a multi-mile*run to town from the anchorage.* The ride is good and fairly dry for this kind of craft, even in rough-ish water.* Combine this with their infinite life (as opposed to inflatables/RIBs--- if I had a dollar for every half-inflated inflatable or RIB I see in our marina I wouldn't have to sue Hustler to get our Fleming).* It's an unbeatable little boat as far as I'm concerned.

*

nomadwilly wrote:
Marin,
Why would you want to name your boats in a foreign language. Almost nobody has any idea what it means.*

Carey,
I looked at the Frog website. Thanks for posting it however now I know I won't be getting one. You can only go dead slow or on a full plane. A disp speed in a dinghy is only 2.5 knots and a full plane in a 10' boat is sorta nuts. The Frog weighs 3 or 4 times as much as my converted sailboat and cost's a bundle. It is cute though. The davits may be a go though.



-- Edited by nomadwilly on Friday 14th of January 2011 09:39:41 PM

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EricI really couldn't care less if you or anyone but myself chooses a Bullfrog, but I will clarify a couple things. Your statement as to speed is incorrect. Yes, dead slow to about five knots would be the slow speed, and then, with the aid of my 15 horse with Dolphins, it gets on plane at about 12-15 knots (not scary or nuts if you want to cover a little distance). Then, if you are in a hurry, it will do about 25 knots with one person on flat water. Still not scary. As to cost, they are no more expensive than a comparable inflatable. They are heavy. Mine is about 400 lbs loaded with eleven gallons of fuel.

*

Hi Carey,I really liked the Frog until I saw it in the video at a 25 degree angle of attack and saw the weight numbers. Also I really like my converted sail boat. Chris sits fwd to port and almost never gets wet w the FG lapstrake sides. We use a 6hp OB at about half throttle. Runs at about 7 knots, at about 10 degrees AOA and very quietly. Could even run it w the electric Torqeedo OB. However I do like the Frog a lot better than the rubber duckies. Thanks for posting the Frog link.

The problem--- we have found--- with low, powered, low-freeboard dinghies is that while they are usually great as shoreboats and certainly easy to carry or stow, they are near worthless for longer distance runs, and even more so in choppy water. This is why the Bullfrog appeals to us so much. With a 15 hp motor it is fast, and so can be used to run miles to a store or town from an anchorage, or can be used to explore a fairly large area on a nice day, or--- most important--- be something that can get you somewhere quick in an emergency.

OK Marin


Bye Bye

Three dog night. = A night so cold you will need three dogs in bed to keep you warm.
(Those are dogs of the four legged variety) I believe that is an Australian saying.
Steve W.

I heard it was an Eskimo saying but regardless, the meaning is correct.

The original members of teh band were from Winnipeg Manitoba, where 3 dog nights were common