Why Do Brokers Bash Bayliner?

Why do all the brokers I talk to advise me to avoid Bayliner and Meridian boats?

Cause that's not what they have in their brokerage at the moment? Bet they would be pushing them if they had one to sell.

Ted

O C Diver said:

Cause that's not what they have in their brokerage at the moment? Bet they would be pushing them if they had one to sell.

Ted

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Yep!

jacks88 said:

Why do all the brokers I talk to advise me to avoid Bayliner and Meridian boats?

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1. What OC said.
2. They want to move you into a more expensive boat.
3. Not knowing any better, they have bought into the false stereotype that Bayliner/Meridian boats are low quality boats.
4. They are simply repeating what they hear other unknowing people say and are unwilling to research the reality of the brand themselves.

Mostly because they have there head up in very dark smelly place

Bayliners usually survey well. Brokers seldom lose a sale over a bad survey. I honestly think they, brokers, feel they would foolish promoting a Bayliner because popular opion bad mouths them so much. Having owned two and having 60 years of boating and working on boats Bayliner builds a well engineered boat for their design purpose. They don't always have the snob apeal but they usually get the job done.

I am not sure if the older bayliners are comparable, but the newish Meridians are very nice.

What about the 4550, 4588's ? Saturation problems with the flybridge deck and arch?

dhays said:

What about the 4550, 4588's ? Saturation problems with the flybridge deck and arch?

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That's news to me.

dhays said:

What about the 4550, 4588's ? Saturation problems with the flybridge deck and arch?

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The 45' Bayliners had a wood core to the decks, just like any other boat of the era. Their decks have no more and probably no less than other boats of the era, which are more previous owner induced than any other thing.

With the 4788 starting in 1994 the decks were synthetic, and like any improvement in manufacturing processes any associated faults disapered.

There is a 4588 on our marina, one of 3 US imports (the others a Luhrs and a Riviera) on a 28 or so boat marina. It looks a big tough no nonsense boat, I can`t see a reason to denigrate the make. No idea what engines it has but the exhaust note alone excites me.
Did the wood cored decks have teak screwed to them? If not, water damage is much less likely.

BruceK said:

There is a 4588 on our marina, one of 3 US imports (the others a Luhrs and a Riviera) on a 28 or so boat marina. It looks a big tough no nonsense boat, I can`t see a reason to denigrate the make. No idea what engines it has but the exhaust note alone excites me.
Did the wood cored decks have teak screwed to them? If not, water damage is much less likely.

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No teak decks, but the 45's had considerable exterior teak and a all teak iinterior.

THe 47's after 1995 did away with the teak exterior, and "lightened up" the interior by using more white. Not as nice as the older ones in my opinion but I think they were trying to get away from dark interiors.

My question really was a question and not an accusation. There are a number of 4588s around and the prices are very good. While the design doesn't appeal to me as much as some others, they check almost all the boxes at an amazingly affordable price.

I owned a 1984 sailboat with cored decks that ended up with saturation. It makes me a bit leery of that problem.

Dave

I believe my answer was non accusatory and honest.

There are no "solid fiberglass decks" that I'm aware of that are completely devoid of any core. Exceptions being antique 1960's vintage boats such as mine. Majority of 30-60' boats will have some sort of "core" for decks and roofs.

The 4588s had wood cored decks as noted earlier. The engines are Hinos, Toyota's diesel brand. Their big advantage is that they are individually sleeved so they can be rebuilt without removing them from the boat. Or so I have heard.

Smaller Bayliners built in the 1980s hurt the brand. The yachts built in WA have always been a great value. Great owner support on www.baylinerownersclub.org. We love our 4788.

Whether a cored deck is likely to be a problem depends partly on the core. Foam is preferable to wood, imo.

Yeah, the 4788s are pretty nice. The extra 2 feet and $100k is a problem for me however. They still seem like an amazing value however.

Thank you all for the info.

Dave

"Smaller Bayliners built in the 1980s hurt the brand."

Precisely right , the smaller boats were built to price in a very tough market.

We had one of the smaller Bayliners back in the early 80s and my father cursed that boat more than he seemed to enjoy it (Volvo/Penta is still forbidden in our family). That, combined with what I hear from brokers, has me avoiding them. As pointed out above, the seem to be everything we are looking for and at a very good price compared to traditionally recommended trawlers. I think I'll find some nearby and have a look.

Well can someone explain how they fit the trawler profile?

here's link to the 45 & 47 comparison.


& this one http://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s3/bayliner-4588-a-11530.html

jacks88 said:

. I think I'll find some nearby and have a look.

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A bit of a drive but we are in Kemah until the end of the month. You are welcome to come look at our 4788.

jacks88 said:

Why do all the brokers I talk to advise me to avoid Bayliner and Meridian boats?

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There is a TF member who is a broker in Florida and he specializes if Bayliner/Meridian boats. He will have nothing bad to say about them and usually has several nice boats on his website. If you do a web search on "pilothouseking", you should find his web site. I haven't seen him posting on TF for several months but he was active last winter.

This is a timely thread for me as I'm looking at a 1991 4387 Bayliner and a 2004 459 Meridian as liveaboards. I would be grateful if anyone has had any experience with either of these boats.

No experience but if those two boats are in the same price range that's either one sweet Bayliner or a Meridian that's been fire sale priced.

Although obviously very similar the 45 and 47 Bayliners have many 'significant' differences in the hull, layout, and the way they handle. While they are both pretty robust the differences between the two should not to be ignored if anyone should ever look at them as a purchase.
Looking at range on the 47 you can pretty much get what you want dependent upon speed chosen - in neutral seas at 6.5 knots or less you are at about 4 nmpg , at 8 knots about 2nmpg , at 10.5 knots about 1 nmpg and at 16 knots about 0.95 nmpg.
One of the key reasons I decided to buy my first larger Bayliner was for the ability to 'fight' the tides I was often against on the Hudson and long Island sound when running my 8 knot trawler.
I have found that these larger Bayliners can run at the lower speeds if desired and get me at or near what I was getting before but also they can get up and plane without too much effort and without breaking the bank.
Hope this helps

CPseudonym said:

No experience but if those two boats are in the same price range that's either one sweet Bayliner or a Meridian that's been fire sale priced.

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Hi Craig, no they are vastly different prices the Bayliner $160K AUD and the Meridian $289K AUD but I'm looking at a range of options including these two,

Cheers

Brett

"This is a timely thread for me as I'm looking at a 1991 4387 Bayliner and a 2004 459 Meridian as liveaboards. I would be grateful if anyone has had any experience with either of these boats."


You can likely get a bunch of feedback on both boats over at the Bayliner owners club where the activity on these larger Bayliners is high.
Additionally there are a number of Aus members that that check in and have experiences with sourcing these boats overseas and moving them back home. Their insight into moving both the boats as well as sourcing parts in that area should provide good value.


Hope this helps

jacks88 said:

Why do all the brokers I talk to advise me to avoid Bayliner and Meridian boats?

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OK, I'll bite. What do they tell you to not avoid?

sunchaser said:

OK, I'll bite. What do they tell you to not avoid?

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The $2.0 million Eastbay they want to sell you.

"OK, I'll bite. What do they tell you to not avoid?"

A great question indeed. I have myself heard some answers to this question from brokers at boat shows and the like but each time they presented an answer they were unable to support it with any data or have the technical background other than a general statement such as "they are cheaply made".
When you than pressed them for details on that answer they always have had none.


But , this is a really great question and one I would always love to hear the answer to.

Jimbo2015 said:

Well can someone explain how they fit the trawler profile?

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They don't. But you can operate almost any vessel at trawler speeds and often obtain trawler fuel economy.