Florida fishing teenagers missing.
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If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
healhustler
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Oh boy, are the opinions going to fly over that one.
psneeld
Guru
2 days since departure....unless there is something pretty outstanding.....the search now is well beyond USCG resource capability.
Usually we called in the Navy by the second day, the Air Force also by the third day and after that we just satisfied the politicians trying to look good. The Gulf Stream in that region makes it all a crap shoot.
Miracles happen but statistically debateable. I always hated making the call...but the experts and SAR crews knew when it was futile.
Another day or two is worthy of the effort.
Usually we called in the Navy by the second day, the Air Force also by the third day and after that we just satisfied the politicians trying to look good. The Gulf Stream in that region makes it all a crap shoot.
Miracles happen but statistically debateable. I always hated making the call...but the experts and SAR crews knew when it was futile.
Another day or two is worthy of the effort.
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Sure does man
Things may have changed a bit since you and I were in.
In this case, they had CBP, State, Local and other resources in the air and on the water in fairly short order. This whole "homeland security" crap has to be good for something!
Yes they do, and we've all seen them
And while each passing hour makes a "live rescue" that much less likely, there have been miracle stories that just make you shake your head.
For that reason, we never gave up until we were ordered to stand down.
Oh, and I really despise politicians that want to "look good"
BruceK
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So sad, 2 14 yo boys, with loving families. It seems your emergency services are well resourced, but oh for Epirbs, boat and personal. Here`s hoping.
gwkiwi
Guru
We liveaboard just south of the Jupiter Inlet and although the weather of late as been pretty benign once in the Gulf Stream they are going to move north at a fairly quick clip.
There have been a lot of boats in the water fishing but mainly close to shore, I hope they are safe but chances are getting slim.
There have been a lot of boats in the water fishing but mainly close to shore, I hope they are safe but chances are getting slim.
psneeld
Guru
Sure does man
Things may have changed a bit since you and I were in.
In this case, they had CBP, State, Local and other resources in the air and on the water in fairly short order. This whole "homeland security" crap has to be good for something!
Yes they do, and we've all seen them
And while each passing hour makes a "live rescue" that much less likely, there have been miracle stories that just make you shake your head.
For that reason, we never gave up until we were ordered to stand down.
Oh, and I really despise politicians that want to "look good"
Oh those resources were available even back in the early 80s...just not 50+ miles offshore...wonder with GPS now whether their bravery is up a notch?
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It's a parent's nightmare. Anyone with children has imagined the horror. I hope the family finds solice.
You must have been very high in the USCG chain of command to make that call. Had to be a tough decision every time.
psneeld
Guru
And grows exponentially by the hour......
I have always been amazed the USCG finds as many as they do.
Unfortunately not all.
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psneeld
Guru
I should be more accurate....the guys I knew were brave enough....their organizations probably held them back....at least most of them.Oh those resources were available even back in the early 80s...just not 50+ miles offshore...wonder with GPS now whether their bravery is up a notch?
Some people don't realize just how vast an area we're talking about, how quickly things change, and how darned difficult it is to find a body bobbing in the water!
(BTDT, ain't a piece o' cake!)Lights, EPIRBS, Bright colors...have 'em, wear 'em!
Oh those resources were available even back in the early 80s...just not 50+ miles offshore...wonder with GPS now whether their bravery is up a notch?
I know man, but we didn't call on them as often. Being intimately familiar with both sides, there just wasn't the level of integration that we have now for SAR work at least.
I should be more accurate....the guys I knew were brave enough....their organizations probably held them back....at least most of them.
You nailed it. Fits right in with my comment above.
Fortunately (I guess?) things are getting better.
I haven't checked this AM. Any updates on the kids?
Some people don't realize just how vast an area we're talking about, how quickly things change, and how darned difficult it is to find a body bobbing in the water!
Lights, EPIRBS, Bright colors...have 'em, wear 'em!
I know man, but we didn't call on them as often. Being intimately familiar with both sides, there just wasn't the level of integration that we have now for SAR work at least.
You nailed it. Fits right in with my comment above.
Fortunately (I guess?) things are getting better.
I haven't checked this AM. Any updates on the kids?
None other than gossip page regarding family of one and Joe Namath's involvement.
Impressed the boat was found so far from where it started. Looks like 100ish miles north of Jupiter FLA and the reports I read said 67 miles offshore. Never ceases to amaze me how fast the Gulf Stream moves...
The Gulf Stream data I just read has the water being 70-80+ degrees which is helpful. If the kids survived the capsize and have on PFDs, they have a chance...
Later,
Dan
The Gulf Stream data I just read has the water being 70-80+ degrees which is helpful. If the kids survived the capsize and have on PFDs, they have a chance...
Later,
Dan
psneeld
Guru
Water temp is only part of the formula....
What has been the air temp, especially at night? People are surprised about hypothermia...or even the reverse...what were the daytime, unshaded temps? Any drinking water?
70 degrees and alternate cooling and wetting can cause hypothermia in fast coolers.
Any survival expertise? Like don't drink the salt water even if thirsty .....
They need other things more than PFDs, especially at this point, people have been found clinging to all kinds of things..but survival basics never chsnge (much).
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Yep, water temperature is only the beginning and after three days, if they don't have fresh water to drink...
I read a bunch of articles about the kids but information was sorely lacking. As usual. On Cruising Forum, someone down in FLA said that the water temperatures were in the 80's, I would assume the air temp is 70-100 since that is what it has been here in NC and down in FLA.
Seems like I remember a guy a few years ago who went into the water in South FLA and he was rescued a few days later off north Florida or maybe GA...
Later,
Dan
Water and air temperature aren't the problems they'd have in South Florida. It's hydration, followed by nourishment, and just physical exhaustion.
Now, they are searching further north, already to Jacksonville and then expanding into Georgia. If they were in the Gulf Stream then the flow charts put them a good bit farther up the coast by this time.
I'm personally having a hard time making sense of it. Engine cover off might indicate trouble. Only one life preserver on the boat might indicate they were wearing theirs. But thinking dead engine and then for some reason boat flips. Why leave the boat? Only thing I can think of is with the speed of the gulf stream they couldn't swim back to it.
Here's a photo of the boat.
http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news...k-public-search-florida-georgia-shore-n399051
Now, they are searching further north, already to Jacksonville and then expanding into Georgia. If they were in the Gulf Stream then the flow charts put them a good bit farther up the coast by this time.
I'm personally having a hard time making sense of it. Engine cover off might indicate trouble. Only one life preserver on the boat might indicate they were wearing theirs. But thinking dead engine and then for some reason boat flips. Why leave the boat? Only thing I can think of is with the speed of the gulf stream they couldn't swim back to it.
Here's a photo of the boat.
http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news...k-public-search-florida-georgia-shore-n399051
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No, don't think that's the case here.
psneeld
Guru
Why not? Unless there is more info in a better article, my experience with SAR cases with this many holes in it sometimes lead down that path.
Law enforcement has been involved with this from jump. While they are certainly concentrating on the search and rescue aspect, I can assure you from My experience that they are also exploring any potential foul play issues. pretty much standard operating procedure.
in this case however, there is enough overwhelming information readily available to pretty well exclude foul play via a third party.
in this case however, there is enough overwhelming information readily available to pretty well exclude foul play via a third party.
psneeld
Guru
Unfortunately I doubt any "foul play" info would be released yet....and I haven't seen any "leaked info"....
Just the usual SAR release stuff.
Where is there ANY definite info other than the boys refueling and the next bit of info is an overturned boat in the middle of nowhere?
Just the usual SAR release stuff.
Where is there ANY definite info other than the boys refueling and the next bit of info is an overturned boat in the middle of nowhere?
