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Nomad Willy
Guru
Tony,Thank you so much for mak'in*this happen. To me w the FB gone it's turned into a real boat. Edwin Monk would be proud of her like this. The topsides look even higher for obvious reasons but the whole boat looks much longer and lower. Looks a little like an old Forest Service boat and they are all beautiful. With the keel ending well fwd of the propeller it would seem the side wind-age*would be much better balanced so the bow may not even get blown downwind at all. With the high*freeboard*there's plenty of*though. I'm looking at the Nordic 32 again because I found out the Yanmar is a good engine and suitable for extended under-loading as long as it is'nt the 175hp inter-cooled engine. Price is 28K more than I'm willing to pay so I'll prolly not be getting it.
Perhaps that's the main reason the Nordics look so good as they don't have the FB.
Thanks again Tony!
Here is a link Tony has already seen but I post it for others to see how a GB 32 looks*<a></a>
like w/o her FB.
http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1989/Grand-Banks-Hardtop-With-No-Flybridge-%28perfect-Combination-Trawler-downeast-Style-Vessel%29-2213277/Manchester/MA/United-States
-- Edited by nomadwilly on Friday 24th of December 2010 07:42:14 PM
Perhaps that's the main reason the Nordics look so good as they don't have the FB.
Thanks again Tony!
Here is a link Tony has already seen but I post it for others to see how a GB 32 looks*<a></a>
like w/o her FB.
http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1989/Grand-Banks-Hardtop-With-No-Flybridge-%28perfect-Combination-Trawler-downeast-Style-Vessel%29-2213277/Manchester/MA/United-States
-- Edited by nomadwilly on Friday 24th of December 2010 07:42:14 PM
Eric---
I agree, the GB32 with no flying bridge is a much better looking boat than the same boat with a flying bridge. Particularly since the GB32's flying bridge has to be accessed via a nearly vertical ladder, as opposed to the larger GBs that use steps to the aft cabin and then steps up to the flying bridge. A lot of older folks have a tough time with ladders and this particular GB32 eliminates that issue. I'm going to post the link on the GB owners forum and see how many howls of fury it stirs up over there. They're a bunch of traditionalists over there, you know. All devoted to old stuff.
I agree, the GB32 with no flying bridge is a much better looking boat than the same boat with a flying bridge. Particularly since the GB32's flying bridge has to be accessed via a nearly vertical ladder, as opposed to the larger GBs that use steps to the aft cabin and then steps up to the flying bridge. A lot of older folks have a tough time with ladders and this particular GB32 eliminates that issue. I'm going to post the link on the GB owners forum and see how many howls of fury it stirs up over there. They're a bunch of traditionalists over there, you know. All devoted to old stuff.
Nomad Willy
Guru
Finally got the "hyper" into the link but it dosn't work. Boat prolly sold.*"They're a bunch of traditionalists over there, you know. All devoted to old stuff."
Trying to bait me Marin? Ha Ha! Do you consider FBs to be "next generation"?
Do you remember this boat from Ketchikan? Looks like Spray put I suspect it
was a burnt hull and home made replacement cabin. What's your opinion?
Trying to bait me Marin? Ha Ha! Do you consider FBs to be "next generation"?
Do you remember this boat from Ketchikan? Looks like Spray put I suspect it
was a burnt hull and home made replacement cabin. What's your opinion?
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I think flying bridges are fine where they make sense.* We don't use ours to run the boat from but we do like to sit up there once we get to where we're going and watch the world.* And on the rare occasions we have guests on board and the weather's nice, they like to ride up there.* So I wouldn't remove ours for the sake of appearance.* I'm not sure our tri-cabin boat would look all that great without the flying bridge anyway.* Not that it's a very good looking boat to begin with, but I think the FB does add something to the aesthetics.
The boat in Ketchikan is not Spray.* Spray is alive and well somewere in the Midwest, I think on Lake Michigan.
Sailor of Fortune
Guru
I agree she looks better without the fly bridge. I'd take the sawzall to her!
OP
OP
Woodsong
Guru
Personally, I think she kind of looks like she had her bridge knocked off by a low bridge! 
That's just me though- I guess i am too used to seeing the Monk 36 with a bridge. I do LOVE downeast style boats though and she has a unique downeast look to her without the bridge so I probably just need to get used to it.
I would not want to take my bridge down off my Monk, even if I was in a climate that it never got used. If never used, just have a canvas cover built for it and it will keep it out of the weather and then you also have a giant storage area.
That's just me though- I guess i am too used to seeing the Monk 36 with a bridge. I do LOVE downeast style boats though and she has a unique downeast look to her without the bridge so I probably just need to get used to it. I would not want to take my bridge down off my Monk, even if I was in a climate that it never got used. If never used, just have a canvas cover built for it and it will keep it out of the weather and then you also have a giant storage area.
Nomad Willy
Guru
Tony,
The main reason I would lean toward removal is because of the very substantial amount of weight so very high above CG. Using it for storage makes it even worse. Perhaps a light aluminum framework and a nice colorful cover would be a good compromise. As I recall Steppen has such a FB. Just because the boat may look better just says that removal ain't all bad.
The main reason I would lean toward removal is because of the very substantial amount of weight so very high above CG. Using it for storage makes it even worse. Perhaps a light aluminum framework and a nice colorful cover would be a good compromise. As I recall Steppen has such a FB. Just because the boat may look better just says that removal ain't all bad.
The eye of the beholder.
To my eye, both the GB and the Monk look as good, or better with the FB!
To my eye, both the GB and the Monk look as good, or better with the FB!
Nomad Willy
Guru
Yes. Since most of us see trawlers most of the time w FBs it would seem that to see one w/o would look odd. That's a no brainer but mostly I don't like the weight that far up in the air. But if I buy a boat w a FB I'll try it for awhile before scrapping it. The view is great and as Marin says there are special times when it would be great to be up there. I'm sure a lot of guys like to maneuver in close quarters from the FB too. But it's a long way down to the rail and float when one needs to make a line fast to the float. FB or not
MERRY CHRISTMAS everyone!
MERRY CHRISTMAS everyone!
OP
OP
Woodsong
Guru
Eric,
One thing to keep in mind about the Monk 36 is that there is really not all that much to the flybridge. If you look in one of the pics I posted you can see the flybridge crated up in the foreground. I bet it does not weigh much more than a couple of hundred pounds? I am sure it adjusts the center of gravity due to height but the weight, i think, is relatively minimal. I agree though- if you buy one, obviously try it out for a while before you pull it off to see if you find handling/performance acceptable with it on. It definitely will help with resale to have it on I think. Either way- it's a great trawler.
One thing to keep in mind about the Monk 36 is that there is really not all that much to the flybridge. If you look in one of the pics I posted you can see the flybridge crated up in the foreground. I bet it does not weigh much more than a couple of hundred pounds? I am sure it adjusts the center of gravity due to height but the weight, i think, is relatively minimal. I agree though- if you buy one, obviously try it out for a while before you pull it off to see if you find handling/performance acceptable with it on. It definitely will help with resale to have it on I think. Either way- it's a great trawler.
From an aesthetic viewpoint there is something else to consider regarding removing a flying bridge. On some boats--- the GB tri-cabins among them--- the flying bridge helps the superstructure of the boat follow the sheerline of the hull. It "raises" the front of the cabin to complement the rise in the sheerline at the bow. The top of the main cabin itself is often straight, which makes construction easier and less expensive.
Removing the flying bridge from a boat like this creates two lines that do not always complement each other. The main cabin roofline is straight, while the hull sheerline is curved up. On some boats this works okay, on others it doesn't.
The other consideration is the aft cabin.* While I think the GB32 that had its flying bridge removed looks like it was deliberately designed that way from the outset and is a very good looking boat, I think the Monk pictured at the beginning of this thread has suffered aesthetically from having the flying bridge removed. With no flying bridge to balance it, the aft cabin now looks awkward, like an added-on afterthought. One reason removing the bridge from the GB32 works so well is that there is no aft cabin on this boat.
I've posted this picture before, but I think Chinook has almost perfect lines from an aesthetic point of view. But this is because everything--- the curved main cabin roofline, hull sheer, window lines--- all work together to give the boat a sweeping look. This boat has a raised structure over the aft cabin but it is separate from the main cabin, it's very low, and it's constructed in a manner that compliments the rest of the boat.
The Monk in the photos would work much better for me if there was no aft cabin. But with the aft cabin, the boat--- like a GB tricabin--- now looks unfinished. If I had seen these photos with no explanation of what I was looking at, I would have said it was a partially completed boat in the yard awaiting the installation of its flying bridge. I think most tri-cabins need that bridge structure aesthetically to balance the stepped down aft cabin.
But boat design is like music--- everyone has different tastes.
-- Edited by Marin on Saturday 25th of December 2010 02:25:28 PM
Removing the flying bridge from a boat like this creates two lines that do not always complement each other. The main cabin roofline is straight, while the hull sheerline is curved up. On some boats this works okay, on others it doesn't.
The other consideration is the aft cabin.* While I think the GB32 that had its flying bridge removed looks like it was deliberately designed that way from the outset and is a very good looking boat, I think the Monk pictured at the beginning of this thread has suffered aesthetically from having the flying bridge removed. With no flying bridge to balance it, the aft cabin now looks awkward, like an added-on afterthought. One reason removing the bridge from the GB32 works so well is that there is no aft cabin on this boat.
I've posted this picture before, but I think Chinook has almost perfect lines from an aesthetic point of view. But this is because everything--- the curved main cabin roofline, hull sheer, window lines--- all work together to give the boat a sweeping look. This boat has a raised structure over the aft cabin but it is separate from the main cabin, it's very low, and it's constructed in a manner that compliments the rest of the boat.
The Monk in the photos would work much better for me if there was no aft cabin. But with the aft cabin, the boat--- like a GB tricabin--- now looks unfinished. If I had seen these photos with no explanation of what I was looking at, I would have said it was a partially completed boat in the yard awaiting the installation of its flying bridge. I think most tri-cabins need that bridge structure aesthetically to balance the stepped down aft cabin.
But boat design is like music--- everyone has different tastes.
-- Edited by Marin on Saturday 25th of December 2010 02:25:28 PM
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JohnP
Guru
- Joined
- Dec 13, 2009
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- 1,361
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- V E N T U R E
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- 1996 36' Island Gypsy Classic
Nomad,** What is your opinion of the Lord Nelson Victory Tug.* There are a bunch on yachtworld and one as low as 99k asking.* I like the vintage look and at 37 feet they seem a practical size.*Perhaps they may not be new enough for you. Any thoughts?
JohnP
IG 32 #25***
TR** NJ
JohnP
IG 32 #25***
TR** NJ
Nomad Willy
Guru
JohnP,
There's so few full displacement trawlers that I scrutinize every one. The Lord Nelson (LN) looks like it would be a full bodied heavy hull below the WL but it's NOT. It's a fairly light disp canoe shaped that i'm quite sure would roll a lot and not much of anything to dampen it. It's cutesy old time tug boat look is, in my opinion taken too far. The cabin roof looks like an old sway back horse or a rocking chair leg. Just too cutesy. BUT IT IS full disp and if the 99K LN was on the west coast i'd prolly be look'in at it. If I get a Nordic I'll prolly remove the tug boat "smoke stack" too. Just don't like that silly stuff. Now that you mention it I'll look at them. One very important thing is that it is a sizeable boat without being too big to be still in the handy catergory. Can't even remember what engines they have. Over powered like most all trawlers probably. Thanks for the heads up John.
There's so few full displacement trawlers that I scrutinize every one. The Lord Nelson (LN) looks like it would be a full bodied heavy hull below the WL but it's NOT. It's a fairly light disp canoe shaped that i'm quite sure would roll a lot and not much of anything to dampen it. It's cutesy old time tug boat look is, in my opinion taken too far. The cabin roof looks like an old sway back horse or a rocking chair leg. Just too cutesy. BUT IT IS full disp and if the 99K LN was on the west coast i'd prolly be look'in at it. If I get a Nordic I'll prolly remove the tug boat "smoke stack" too. Just don't like that silly stuff. Now that you mention it I'll look at them. One very important thing is that it is a sizeable boat without being too big to be still in the handy catergory. Can't even remember what engines they have. Over powered like most all trawlers probably. Thanks for the heads up John.
markpierce
Master and Commander
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- penultimate Seahorse Marine Coot hull #6
Sometimes, Eric, you make my head spin.
markpierce
Master and Commander
- Joined
- Sep 25, 2010
- Messages
- 12,557
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- Carquinez Coot
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- penultimate Seahorse Marine Coot hull #6
Watch out.* That*could be where there is stored a tank to fuel the stove.
*
Nomad Willy
Guru
John,
I looked. Mostly as I remembered but one has a 4 cyl Cummins and that's better but 65-75hp is all that's needed and then one could load the engine better. I see they all have a bow thruster and it's prolly standard equipment after the first one went forth banging and smashing into boats and floats when the wind was blowing. The styling in the wheelhouse is over the top and that bow is WAY too high. And the draft is much more aft than fwd so that thruster better be a full time unit. I love the main salon and after deck.
The BMW engines seem very out of character w the tug image. Better w a small Cat or a Deere. Again the 4cyl Cummins comes close. I showed my wife the LN pics and she loves it.The LN w the little Cummins IS on the west coast but it's $50K over my head.
Would seem to be a obvious replacement for a Willard but the Willard hull is the real thing whereas the LN is a bit of a play act. Kinda like getting a FG replica of an XK120 Jaguar w a Pinto engine in it.
I looked. Mostly as I remembered but one has a 4 cyl Cummins and that's better but 65-75hp is all that's needed and then one could load the engine better. I see they all have a bow thruster and it's prolly standard equipment after the first one went forth banging and smashing into boats and floats when the wind was blowing. The styling in the wheelhouse is over the top and that bow is WAY too high. And the draft is much more aft than fwd so that thruster better be a full time unit. I love the main salon and after deck.
The BMW engines seem very out of character w the tug image. Better w a small Cat or a Deere. Again the 4cyl Cummins comes close. I showed my wife the LN pics and she loves it.The LN w the little Cummins IS on the west coast but it's $50K over my head.
Would seem to be a obvious replacement for a Willard but the Willard hull is the real thing whereas the LN is a bit of a play act. Kinda like getting a FG replica of an XK120 Jaguar w a Pinto engine in it.
The Victory Tug was the boat we wanted to get long before we got serious about getting a boat.* It is still one of our favorites.* We really like the design, and think it does a much better job of replicating the harbor tug look than the Nordic Tug, which to me does't really look like a tug at all.* If you think the Victory Tug's lines are way over the top, then I assume you think the boat it is based on-- the New York harbor tug of the first half of the 1900s, is way over the top, too.* I think Lord Nelson did a pretty good job of capturing the look of what inspired their design.
While not that many Victory Tugs were made, they seem to have used a number of engines.* Some of the early ones have BMW engines.* Some of them have Yanmars.* We've met a couple of people on cruises who had 37' Victory Tugs powered by Cummins engines.* I know of one that has a Lugger in it, but this might have been a re-power.
Victory Tugs came in two sizes, 37' and 49'.* I have only seen two of the 49-footers in this area, one in Bellingham and one in Anacortes.* I don't know what they used for engines.
The 37' Victory Tug in the attched photo is in Bellingham-- it used to be on our dock--- and is currently for sale for $154,000.* It is Cummins powered.* The owner bought it back east-- Massechussetts I assume since that's where Minot's Light(house) is--- but later had it trucked out here for his son to maintain and use. He's had it and has been using it for at least seven years or so.* I have no idea why he's selling it now.
-- Edited by Marin on Sunday 26th of December 2010 03:18:34 PM
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Nomad Willy
Guru
Hi Marin,
Thanks for the reply and picture. I agree that they did a good job of building a tug look-alike and if that bow was lower and the wheelhouse wasn't going up a hill and if it was'nt over powered I'd prolly be all over it. Actually if it was a NA Cummins and $98,000
I'd prolly be all over it. How long has the Bellingham boat been for sale? I'm going to call about a 32 Nordic tomorrow that has a 140hp Yanmar. Went down the bay to a party last night and left late at night** ...the GPS wouldn't come up. After a little waiting I stopped before we hit someth'in and booted up the radar. Sure was nice to have the .25 mi range. Went half way to town on radar before the GPS found enough satellites. It's very icy now and raining on the ice. I'm scared to go down and move Willy into her own slip. Why don't you buy the cute green tug Marin.
http://grayandgrayyachts.com/privatelabel/listing/pl_boat_full_detail.jsp?slim=pp217712&boat_id=2226193&ybw=&units=Feet¤cy=USD&access=Public&listing_id=77122&url=
Marin, This is a picture of the LN for 99K. Looks really good head on.
http://www.yachtworld.com/core/list...o+2&back=/core/listing/boatMergedDetails.jsp%3Fboat_id%3D1996002%26listing_id%3D77240%26units%3DFeet%26currency%3DUSD%26access%3DPublic
-- Edited by nomadwilly on Sunday 26th of December 2010 06:32:16 PM
Thanks for the reply and picture. I agree that they did a good job of building a tug look-alike and if that bow was lower and the wheelhouse wasn't going up a hill and if it was'nt over powered I'd prolly be all over it. Actually if it was a NA Cummins and $98,000
I'd prolly be all over it. How long has the Bellingham boat been for sale? I'm going to call about a 32 Nordic tomorrow that has a 140hp Yanmar. Went down the bay to a party last night and left late at night** ...the GPS wouldn't come up. After a little waiting I stopped before we hit someth'in and booted up the radar. Sure was nice to have the .25 mi range. Went half way to town on radar before the GPS found enough satellites. It's very icy now and raining on the ice. I'm scared to go down and move Willy into her own slip. Why don't you buy the cute green tug Marin.
http://grayandgrayyachts.com/privatelabel/listing/pl_boat_full_detail.jsp?slim=pp217712&boat_id=2226193&ybw=&units=Feet¤cy=USD&access=Public&listing_id=77122&url=
Marin, This is a picture of the LN for 99K. Looks really good head on.
http://www.yachtworld.com/core/list...o+2&back=/core/listing/boatMergedDetails.jsp%3Fboat_id%3D1996002%26listing_id%3D77240%26units%3DFeet%26currency%3DUSD%26access%3DPublic
-- Edited by nomadwilly on Sunday 26th of December 2010 06:32:16 PM
1.* Minot's Light was hauled out in the yard at Seaview North several months ago and that's when I saw the For Sale sign on it.* It is back in its slip but it's in a different section of the marina than we are so we just see it from a distance.* I don't know if the sign is still there but if the sale listing on the internet is still current then I guess it is.
There is also a 37' Victory Tug, gray I think, for sale in Anacortes, also Cummins-powered.
2.* We still really like Victory Tugs in terms of the design aesthetics--- far superior in our minds to the GB--- but our boat is paid for, it's set up and equipped the way we want it, and we do not want to spend any more money on boating at this point other than what it takes to keep ours going.
Also, when we got into this kind of boating we had no intention of taking guests out other than perhaps for a run around the bay.* As I've said before, we are not social boaters.* So a single-stateroom boat like the VT would have suited us just fine.
But..... in the fall of the past two years we have taken good friends from France and then friends I used to work with in television in Hawaii who have just moved here on week-plus cruises in the Gulf Islands. And will probably do so again in the future.* What we have learned is that the tri-cabin layout for this sort of thing is essential, in our opinions.* Each couple has their own stateroom* and head separated by the main cabin.* Nobody has to sleep in a berth made up in the main cabin.* So if somebody wants to get up early and make coffee and watch the sunrise or whatever, they can do so without disturbing anyone else, or worrying that they are disturbing anyone else.*
The 37' Victory Tug, like a Nordic Tug, has the master stateroom forward and that's it.* There is a full-length, full-width transverse berth that can be made up in the VT's pilothouse but the only way from the forward stateroom to the main cabin is through the pilothouse.* Also, the only head is up forward off the main stateroom.
*
