Full River L16s?

Anyone have experience with this brand or this model (DC400-6) in particular? I'm thinking of a 4-battery AGM house bank in the 800 to 900 amp hour range. These have good specs and the manufacturer claims 1250 cycles at 50% depth of discharge. I have the vertical clearance and the footprint would be significantly less than the four 8Ds I'm replacing. But they ain't cheap . . .

http://resources.fullthrottlebattery.com/fullriver-battery/spec-sheets/DC400-6.pdf

I can't speak to these but Victron makes a 'Telecom " battery that is 12v and half the foot print of an 8D. I'm in the middle of an install of 4 of them. Good specs.

I have 12 ea. AGM 6v 225A in series parallel for my house bank.


Brand is Fullriver.


These have been installed and functioning since 2008 with no loss of capacity that I have noticed.


I rarely run the bank lower than 70% before initiating a recharge.


Make sure your charging system is up to the task of AGM's.

bshanafelt said:

I have 12 ea. AGM 6v 225A in series parallel for my house bank.


Brand is Fullriver.


These have been installed and functioning since 2008 with no loss of capacity that I have noticed.


I rarely run the bank lower than 70% before initiating a recharge.


Make sure your charging system is up to the task of AGM's.

Click to expand...

I like the way you guys think!! I wish I had that capacity.

What alternator(s) and shore charger are you using to charge that bank?

While underway:
single Largeframe Penntex 200A coupled to a Balmar ARS-5. Regulator derates the Alt. to 160A


Dockside:
Iota 75A w/ IQ4 regulation.

"These have good specs and the manufacturer claims 1250 cycles at 50% depth of discharge.?\"

How does this compare with Trojan or Surette?

FF said:

"These have good specs and the manufacturer claims 1250 cycles at 50% depth of discharge.?\"

How does this compare with Trojan or Surette?

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Or Lifeline, which makes an equivalent AGM versions. (Or perhaps FF meant that, ref Surette.)

-Chris

Appreciate all the input, guys. (bshanafelt, that diagram is excellent!)

http://www.trojanbattery.com/pdf/L16-AGM_Reliant_DS_Final.pdf

Lifeline Batteries - Marine & RV Deep Cycle Batteries

http://www.dcbattery.com/rollssurretteagm_s6-460agm.pdf


Generally it looks to me that all these have the same or less amp hours than the FullRiver AGMs at higher cost--in some cases significantly higher.

FR's warranty is 7 years, with 2 years full replacement--longer than I'm seeing from the others.

I can't find the number of cycles at 50% discharge for Rolls or Lifeline. Trojan/Reliant has comparable cycles, but only 370 amp hours. Surrette has slightly higher reserve capacity.

I'm still new to this so I may not be interpreting all this correctly, but the FullRivers look like the better choice.

angus99 said:

I can't find the number of cycles at 50% discharge for Rolls or Lifeline.

Click to expand...

Open the Lifeline "printable specs" (Word) doc. 1100 cycles to 50%, 500 cycles to 100%.

-Chris

My house batts are Fullriver purchased from Boat Electric in Seattle (now defunct). Four or five years now and no complaints. I'd recommend and the people at Boat Electric always had the best stuff.

Thanks, Chris & Eric.

Chris, looks like FR edges Lifeline out with about 1250 cycles at 50% but I'm guessing any differences that close are nearly meaningless. Based on specs and my limited insights, I give FR the edge with performance, cost and warranty.

Eric, are yours AGMs?

Check the other forum for posts by MaineSail, and then go to his site (forget the name) to see if he's ever done some comparisons.


I know he does frequently mention that battery specs based on lab testing may or may not translate to real world. And I think he's also mentioned that various companies might use slightly different testing protocols.


-Chris

I had Lifeline AGMs before and on my previous boat as well. And bought the FullRiver batts because I felt the Lifelines fell short on performance. Not very objective but there it is.

Support the Red Chinese, it's the American thing to do: buy the Full Rivers. And all manufacturer specs are 100% truthful as we all know. And everyone charges discharges and maintains their batteries perfectly...

I like the L16 footprint, I had four in an extremely heavy usage 24v inverter bank... due to full time cruising and living for months full time on moorings. On a cost per amp hour basis, I could not make any of the AGMs pencil out, and my US Battery set far out lived their expected life, and the Trojans that replaced them (only due to convenience of purchase) seemed well on their way. Mine were extremely easy to water and service, so that helped.

The main advantage to AGM batts is their ability to be charged faster , full 100% in a shorter time.

Big batts take a big charging ability , or they are not worth the extra boat bucks.

How are you going to keep them fully charged?

FF said:

How are you going to keep them fully charged?

Click to expand...

I'm leaning toward an upgraded alternator--whatever a Ford Lehman 135 can accommodate--and a Magnum 2812 that has a 125-amp charger. Actually upgrading my DC system and adding the Magnum inverter/charger.

Sound reasonable?

My head is swimming.

With all the BS and inconsistencies about battery specs and use patterns, I'm trying to see if four L16s, with their reputation for deep cycling and relatively high reserve capacity (885 minutes for the unpatriotic FullRivers) are any better than six or eight golf carts with the same amp hours. Whatever I buy will be AGMS.

Thanks, Chris. I'll need to check MaineSail's site again (compass marine). I don't recall that he addressed AGMs in any detail.

angus99 said:

Thanks, Chris. I'll need to check MaineSail's site again (compass marine). I don't recall that he addressed AGMs in any detail.

Click to expand...

Yep, that's him. Yes, he's looked at AGMs, too.

-Chris

Just spoke with him. What a great guy and depth of knowledge! I have three reservations about flooded lead acid batts: off-gassing, filling/spilling and my ignorance of the equalizing process. After our talk, I'm less concerned and will probably give FLAs a good look. My house bank is in the ER with temps in the low 100s while underway in summer. If high temps shorten battery life anyway, do I want expensive AGMs in there? Maybe it makes sense to buy cheaper to begin with.

An alternative to consider is the Odyssey one with similar footprint
ODYSSEY Batteries - PC1800-FT
These are 'ultra thin plate pure lead' type with good cranking and deep cycling capability. While I normally only 50% DoD, they claim the batteries can handle 80% DoD (ie 20% remaining) with quite reasonable cycle life. My house bank is 6 x PC 1800, and each engine has 1 x PC 1800 as a start battery. Blue Seas ACR's and RBS's to automatically parallel or isolate, with manual overides in ER and at the helm.

I use 2 x 200 A Leece Neville alternators to recharge while cruising, and can see 350 amp going to the batts at low speed cruise engine rpm. On the hook 1820 W of solar panels do a reasonable job of recharging whilst meeting day needs. A Honda 2000 for emergency is the only genny as I don run AC.

Bought 2 Deka AGM 8d 245 amps for about $500.00 each including tax. West Marine was selling the same battery (their label) for about $700 ea.

Don, those are the very same batteries I killed last winter (all 4 of them) by not realizing there were parasitic loads still connected, despite the battery switches being off. Expensive lesson.

Brian, that sounds like a great setup. Not a lot of price competition on Odysseys on this side of the pond, it seems. Another factor for me is that going with differently sized batteries could require new boxes, cables and locations for my three banks. Too many choices!

"Bought 2 Deka AGM 8d 245 amps for about $500.00 each including tax. West Marine was selling the same battery (their label) for about $700 ea."

Detroit Diesel and many other truck places will have 8D in wet lead acid for $150 or so with a trade in.

Just a comparison ,,

angus99 said:

Just spoke with him. What a great guy and depth of knowledge! I have three reservations about flooded lead acid batts: off-gassing, filling/spilling and my ignorance of the equalizing process. After our talk, I'm less concerned and will probably give FLAs a good look. My house bank is in the ER with temps in the low 100s while underway in summer. If high temps shorten battery life anyway, do I want expensive AGMs in there? Maybe it makes sense to buy cheaper to begin with.

Click to expand...

Our oldest AGM battery bank is in it's 10th season now, installed in the engine room, heat apparently a non-factor.

(These are 3x Odyssey PC-2150s, Group 31, and sold by Sears as Platinum Plus -- usually for less, usually without bit shipping charges, and sometimes on sale. Not comparable to your 6V target set-up, just mentioning in passing.)

I too want to avoid maintenance (ours not easy to reach and fill), although a battery hydration system might speak to that. (We'd have had to recable everything; our cables block most of the fills.) I too prefer no (less) off-gassing in our engine room.

Not a recommendation, just an observation...

Most AGMs are apparently not equalizable, whereas Lifeline says you can equalize theirs. I didn't notice about the Full River L16s...

-Chris