Insurance coverage, What do I need?

If your car isn't running right, would you walk past an expert mechanic to get advice from a stranger waiting for a bus? That's what this is starting to look like. Work with a good insurance agent, like Pau Hana, and follow his/her advice.

Environmental damages are capped by the EPA at about $850K. So the OP's current 500K of liability won't even cover that. That's bad advice or a bad choice.

My advice to clients is as follows. Liability on the yacht policy of at least one million dollars. Then an Umbrella policy that covers your assets, future income and any planned inheritance, bonuses, etc, and round up to the next million. The Umbrella also funds your legal defense.

You never know how good your insurer is until you file a claim. Search Insurance Commissioner statistics in your State. Scour the Internet. Talk to several brokers. You will quickly learn who the good companies are.

On every yacht policy I have seen, environmental cleanup and liability are 2 separate coverages.

Most marinas I have been to have required $300,000 in liability. The last one that asked for a policy copy as a transient required $100,000.

In my experience, getting an umbrella policy isn't just as easy as asking for one, nor is establishing the limits. While a good idea, getting proper coverage isn't necessarily the most you can get and might take some negotiating with your company or looking further.

Anytime I see someone here just comparing rates, it scares the heck out of me. Rates are just a small part of the equation and until you've compared every element of a policy you have no idea what you have.

There are two old phrases regarding insurance coverage. The first was "Have as much as you can afford." But the second was better, "Have as much as you can't afford being without." Then there's probably a third thought and that is to insure to share the risks with others.

That's the essence of what insurance is about. Sharing risks while paying someone else fees to arrange for that sharing.

This also means you can't look at just one aspect of your insurance protection in a vacuum. In business it's part of a company's Risk Management program. Well, that's really the same individually. What risks am I willing to take overall and which ones do I want to protect myself against. I can't answer any of those questions without looking at my overall coverage nor can I without knowing the specifics of each policy and coverage. Understand there's a natural conflict here too. The insurer is also attempting to manage their risks.

Psneeld, with all due respect I have reviewed policies from dozens of different companies and environmental damage is NOT always a separate limit. Read the original post as one example.

Generally speaking, you can be sued for everything you have and everything that you realistically are going to have. That's why most financial planners recommend getting an Umbrella policy to cover your net worth, rounded up to the next million.

When you apply for an Umbrella policy the insurance provider looks at things like your driving record, source of income, and (generalization) your risk profile. So someone with several recent at-fault accidents or a DUI may have trouble getting an Umbrella. I have provided Umbrellas to hundreds of clients and have only seen a couple of cases where one has been declined or non-renewed. Both cases involved multiple speeding tickets, one with at-fault damages exceeding a hundred thousand dollars and one with providing a car to someone with multiple speeding tickets and a DUI.

Many people on this forum have older yachts that are covered with policies provided by general lines carriers. A boat policy is very different from a yacht policy. Not all yacht policies are alike. Talk with a good insurance agent or broker, review your risks and coverages. Protect your assets.

Robster_in_edmonds said:

Psneeld, with all due respect I have reviewed policies from dozens of different companies and environmental damage is NOT always a separate limit. Read the original post as one example.

Generally speaking, you can be sued for everything you have and everything that you realistically are going to have. That's why most financial planners recommend getting an Umbrella policy to cover your net worth, rounded up to the next million.

When you apply for an Umbrella policy the insurance provider looks at things like your driving record, source of income, and (generalization) your risk profile. So someone with several recent at-fault accidents or a DUI may have trouble getting an Umbrella. I have provided Umbrellas to hundreds of clients and have only seen a couple of cases where one has been declined or non-renewed. Both cases involved multiple speeding tickets, one with at-fault damages exceeding a hundred thousand dollars and one with providing a car to someone with multiple speeding tickets and a DUI.

Many people on this forum have older yachts that are covered with policies provided by general lines carriers. A boat policy is very different from a yacht policy. Not all yacht policies are alike. Talk with a good insurance agent or broker, review your risks and coverages. Protect your assets.

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Just passing along what I know.

my insurance company would not let me round up on my umbrella....but that was years ago....maybe I should check again.

I have checked with many good brokers and companies....I am an educated consumer...which means I don't know everything but enough to know what I should be looking for.

Much of the terminology in the first post is not what I am used to seeing or hearing with yacht policies...never heard of "collision" except as a term in the body of coverage.

All I ever had was yacht policies. Never bothered with the small boats I used to own. This is also my 3rd liveaboard. And am pretty familiar with the environmental clauses as I work for a company that does cleanups after boat sinkings.

psneeld said:

All I ever had was yacht policies. Never bothered with the small boats I used to own. This is also my 3rd liveaboard. .

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Ok, my boat/yacht insurance history and lessons learned along the way.

I grew up with a boat on an inland lake. My father insured it through one of his clients, then I continued to insure the same. I guess I assumed they were all standard like cars and with our relationship with the insurer, all was good. But...I found out when buying a new boat that I was paying more than double what I could get an equivalent or better policy for. I was quoted over $1000 per year on a $30,000 boat.

So moved on to insurer 2. I was quoted under $400 per year plus I found out my initial policy didn't cover residual damage from a non-covered mechanical problem. So better coverage and cheaper from an agent and company I had no previous relationship with.

As to an umbrella policy, I decide along the way to look at them and get a rather small one.

Now, I move to South Florida, we buy a boat, and need to insure. Insurer 3. At this point I get "yacht" insurance and I find out all the environmental and salvage coverage I didn't have previously. I get an All Risks Policy. I have no exclusion for named storms, none for implied warrantees of seaworthiness, none for location except for certain specified countries (Countries far outside my areas of use) for which I would need a rider.

Also, with the move we relook at all our insurance including our umbrella. I find out increasing the coverage costs surprisingly little and I get into the areas of complications of saying the burden is the other insurer's. My policy now puts the burden on the umbrella carrier to get it all worked out.

Now a couple more lessons learned along the way. Choosing a broker, choosing who to get advice from. It's difficult and requires interviewing some. Actually in business I understood that, but for my personal insurance took things for granted. That may be one of the biggest lessons is to treat insurance and other personal things like you would in a business. When I worked for a large company, we had a risk manager who coordinated all the insurance. I also learned it is often not one company for everything. You may be lucky, but I cost myself in terms of price and coverage using my auto and home insurer.

Oh, and most importantly, even though I have others I trust review the policies, I do read every page, every word, of all my insurance policies now. For any of you who don't, I bet if you took all your policies for home, auto, boat, life, health-everything-and read them you would find out something you didn't know and it might just have the potential of coming into play some time.

BandB said:

But...I found out when buying a new boat that I was paying more than double what I could get an equivalent or better policy for. I was quoted over $1000 per month on a $30,000 boat.

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Surely, you mean $1000 per year and not per month, no????

Donsan said:

Surely, you mean $1000 per year and not per month, no????

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Thanks. I just edited it.

All very good points BandB-
I'm very interested in the Sea Insure because of price, but am also told it has a "mechanical coverage" coverage as well. As you mentioned- I guess it's time to sit down and read our current policy (both are comparable on the Salvage/ Environment coverage) along with the one I'm considering. I guess the answer I was looking for was if anyone on the board is using them and how their experience has been if any losses. Being associated with Sea Tow would seem to be a good thing. And their network of contractors could possibly reduce the
salvage and other associated costs when an accident happens.
We lost our Bayliner 2859 in Hurricane Katrina. It was insured through Progressive and basically all we had to do was get on board and grab a few personal belongings after she was salvaged. Within a few weeks after that we received our check for the loss. I would be with them now- but they only covered vessels up to 30' at the time.


1983 Present 42 Sundeck
Twin Lehman 135's

Sea Insure doesn't do live aboard policies but New Hampshire does.

The Sea Insure guy sits right next to the New Hampshire girl....

Don't ask me how I know and whether I have New Hampshire....

Hmmmmmm .


1983 Present 42 Sundeck
Twin Lehman 135's

How many car salesman try to sell you the cheapest car on the lot?

Today paid $1,413 my annual boat insurance through BoatUS. The major coverages are $223,255 for the boat (no deductible because I've been a good boy), $300,00 liability, $854,400 spill liability, and $300,000 uninsured boater.

Nice to see the post resurrected. The point of the original post was to determine if the insurance coverages quoted by an insurance broker were adequate. I was not too concerned with the rates. I am an almost trawler owner and don't know about Yacht insurance. I asked for quotes from a broker at a boat show but who am I to know if he is looking out for me or looking out for him? I have been in contact with Paul Hana and am awaiting a quote from him.

I do appreciate the replies.

markpierce said:

Today paid $1,413 my annual boat insurance through BoatUS. The major coverages are $223,255 for the boat (no deductible because I've been a good boy), $300,00 liability, $854,400 spill liability, and $300,000 uninsured boater.

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No discount for a steel boat???

Donsan said:

No discount for a steel boat???

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Not that I'm aware of. At least one company won't insure a steel boat (due to inexperience?): Progressive.

BoatUS quoted a price about half of the rate of my nationally-televised auto/home/blanket-liability insurance company.