Bridge openings in US ICW

Any forum members had issues regarding penalties for unnecessary bridge opening in the ICW ?

In reference with DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION 33 CFR Part 117
§ 117.11 Unnecessary opening of the draw. No vessel owner or operator ...
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/pdf/uscode33/lii_usc_TI_33_CH_11_SC_I_SE_499.pdf

Not me.

The way I see it is pretty simple, if you take down your antennas and still don't fit, you're ok requesting an opening.

I have read about bridge tenders (in Florida mostly ;-) giving boaters a hard time, even requesting masts and biminis be lowered. That is extreme.

In most cases bridge tenders are accommodating and will work with a boater. But Florida is a special case.

David

OP question was regarding penalties.

Regarding hard times, yes I have also had a bridge or two in FL give me a hard time about opening. Turns out they were right, we fit. The ribbon showing clearance was off. Had it been accurate, the state of Fl was going to buy me a new arch.

No, I have never even heard of one, even as the operations officer in the USCG with a few draw bridges in the operational area.

I think it would be extreme for them to file a formal complaint....

Most are very helpful and at least comply with an opening schedule if there is any doubt.

The mouthy ones are probably the same personality too lazy to file the paperwork..they just want to throw their nearly weightless authority around.

That's a shame, as the conscientious ones need to sting the lazy, arrogant boaters who don't take the time to see if they will fit following the regs.

I've always had good experiences with FL bridge tenders, though I studiously avoided running afoul of the harpies at the two Venetian Causeway bridges who seemed to want to give everyone grief they could. The guy at Andrews Avenue on the New River in the mornings would give me a good natured ribbing evry now and then a t mid tide that he thought I could get under, but I always asked him if he wanted to bet a radar on that. I'd always have all my antennas down in heavy bridge areas, to get under the ones I could and to show I was trying to the ones I couldn't or were too close for comfort; I had my various clearances measured carefully as i'd just as soon slide under rather than go through the whole drill. . I've never heard of someone being asked to lower a mast or bimini, but they will tell the sport fishers to lower outriggers .

Having also spent also lot of time on the various roadways involved, I can understand the pressure they are under to avoid unnecessary openings.

***Thread hijack alert***

How often if at all would a boat with a 10' air draft have to call for an opening on the ditch from Maryland south? Not asking for an actual count, just a ballpark wild guess.

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My guess as to fines for unnecessary openings based upon around here is never.

Depending on Dismal Swamp route or not 1 to 5 openings till Florida....just checked the Waterway guide....None in FL till Ft Pierce....not sure after that but not many are less than 10.

4 out of the 5, I mentioned above were 11 or 12 and we're probably swing bridges so no additional except for extreme tides or mismarking.

Sweet, thanks

Detailed bridge data by state

You might find the attached PDF helpful. Search for the 2015 version, and perhaps keep a copy on your boat's hard drive for easy reference.

Best,

Henri

CPseudonym said:

***Thread hijack alert***

How often if at all would a boat with a 10' air draft have to call for an opening on the ditch from Maryland south? Not asking for an actual count, just a ballpark wild guess.

***We now return to the thread topic***

My guess as to fines for unnecessary openings based upon around here is never.

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There are two in South Carolina. Little River Swing Bridge and the Socastee Swing Bridge south of Myrtle Beach.

windmill29130 said:

There are two in South Carolina. Little River Swing Bridge and the Socastee Swing Bridge south of Myrtle Beach.

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Socastee is listed at 11 feet both on my chart and waterway guide.

psneeld said:

Socastee is listed at 11 feet both on my chart and waterway guide.

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You won't get under there with 10' at high tide. I couldn't get under with my 28' Searay with a 9' air draft. I tried and ended up going outside the pylons between the bridge and the shore to make it. Not recommended, but I was determined not to wait.

Several bridges on the ICW I have marked as inaccurate according to the tide boards...Socastee wasn't one of them....guess I will take a closer look on my way north.

There was one bridgetender at the Two Mile Bridge north of Cape May, who would not open the bridge until you dropped everything possible while all of the other tenders of the same bridge would not argue. Always good comic relief while waiting for the fish to bite. Think he retired.
I have found the tenders in SW FL most helpful and would tell me they would open even if I thought it was good enough but close with antennas up.
We drop the antennas on trips to NOT HAVE TO WAIT for an unnecessary opening.

High Wire said:

There was one bridgetender at the Two Mile Bridge north of Cape May, who would not open the bridge until you dropped everything possible while all of the other tenders of the same bridge would not argue. Always good comic relief while waiting for the fish to bite. Think he retired.
I have found the tenders in SW FL most helpful and would tell me they would open even if I thought it was good enough but close with antennas up.
We drop the antennas on trips to NOT HAVE TO WAIT for an unnecessary opening.

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That same guy at 2 mile argued with me as to how much clearance I had. I've measured my boat several times, other tenders agreed with my measurement and this guy was saying something like 3 feet difference. But as usual 2 mile is really one of the better bridges I am used to.

The only time I had a disagreement t with a bridge tender I politely offered to call the CG to ask their opinion. The bridge opened.

"I have read about bridge tenders (in Florida mostly ;-) giving boaters a hard time, even requesting masts and biminis be lowered. That is extreme."

NOPE its the law.

All this will be solved if the camera setup (as for red lights) is installed.

Your boat will be photoed as you pass with height marks on the bridge for reference.

If you cause an unneeded opening it will co$t , there thinking of $500, first offense , going up for repeat offenders.

This concept has been proposed in the Fl legislature a few times , eventually it WILL pass.

Cameras are far cheaper than installing 65 ft bridges , takes no time and will raise a lot of bucks , at least the first year or so.

I've been on the Atlantic ICW from J'Ville to Deerfield Beach, and never experienced any problem with the bridge tenders.. all were cooperative and accommodating. I have noticed that at the George Musson Bridge in New Smyrna the bridge tenders won't tell boat captains the air clearance but they'll refer them to the tide boards - I'm guessing that's to protect the bridge tenders in case the clearance was less than they thought.. there's about a 4 foot tide difference at the NSB bridge.

Earl34Mainship said:

I've been on the Atlantic ICW from J'Ville to Deerfield Beach, and never experienced any problem with the bridge tenders.. all were cooperative and accommodating. I have noticed that at the George Musson Bridge in New Smyrna the bridge tenders won't tell boat captains the air clearance but they'll refer them to the tide boards - I'm guessing that's to protect the bridge tenders in case the clearance was less than they thought.. there's about a 4 foot tide difference at the NSB bridge.

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What drives me nuts is the lack of consistency.

One tender will climb down on the girders and eyeball you through, some will tell you to the inch of clearance and others will say it's your call and stay out of it. Then you have high and low steel. Then you have accurate, inaccurate and missing tide boards.

One has to wonder why bridge clearance has to be such a big deal.

I had a bridge tender in Seattle scream at me with his loud hailer as I went through on a sailboat. He seemed to think that there was no problem with my VHF radio scraping along the underside of the bridge.

Agree... what I'm hearing on Ch 9 from the bridge tenders, is "There's the tide board; it's your call Cap." Personally, if it's that close, I'd rather it be my call...

Sisters Creek just North of Jacksonville, Florida was the friendliest ever with saying "if its within 2 feet capt, we will open no questions". It may have been more but I know it was at least 2 feet.

Obviously the ones with heavy car traffic are probably under greater scrutiny....but why should it be any harder than looking at the tide board/charted clearance, lower anything that is made to come down easily, and pass through or request an opening because you are within a couple feet of getting under.

I've had Florida bridges opened well over 100 times total. I've never had a problem. Now the fact that I'm not borderline and it isn't antennas pushing me over may well be why. However, I've heard others have problems and typically they've deserved them. Primary reason I've heard was those who did not know the schedules, especially during morning rush hour when the car owner are angry that they're ever opened. Other than that, it's primarily been sportfishermen with 15' boat heights and double that with antennas and outriggers. One other factor in South Florida is that often there will be other boats and so the bridge is opening anyway.

Last: I engage in extreme politeness and respect and show full recognition that they are the one in power and I'm the one in need. And upon going through thank them and wish them a good day as they do have memories.

good policy... cooperation/consideration helps ease the passage and knowing the schedules is a big help... I sometimes hear captains say they're slowing down to time the next opening of the George Musson bridge.. that bridge opens every 20 min; on the hour and @ 20 min intervals.. As Si says... Happy, happy, happy/

Earl34Mainship said:

good policy... cooperation/consideration helps ease the passage and knowing the schedules is a big help... I sometimes hear captains say they're slowing down to time the next opening of the George Musson bridge.. that bridge opens every 20 min; on the hour and @ 20 min intervals.. As Si says... Happy, happy, happy/

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The bridges around us all have schedules and they're mostly coordinated for you to go between them at a moderate speed and hit each one about right. Now, there are a couple that you can't make it if you go 7 knots or if you play around doing something else along the way. If your boat only goes 7 knots though it wouldn't seem to be your nature to be in a hurry. One day we observed a boat that got through one bridge, pull out of the channel and we don't know what they were doing, but we were out of sight while they were still sitting. Apparently they started on then and they just raked the tender over the coals because he didn't wait, saying that was as fast as their boat would go. Obviously they didn't realize the tender was watching and fully aware of what they did. This tender's response was harsh. He basically told them if they harassed him any more he'd call the authorities and they'd never make it through the bridge. Well, they didn't make it through the next opening as by then a FWC boat had pulled alongside them and was talking and I'm guessing checking all their equipment, just an excuse to cause them further delay and support the tender. We spoke to the tender on the phone on our way back and that's when we learned that part. The tender did not notify FWC but they were listening.

BandB said:

Last: I engage in extreme politeness and respect and show full recognition that they are the one in power and I'm the one in need. And upon going through thank them and wish them a good day as they do have memories.

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