New AIS and Questions

Please forgive if these questions have already been asked.

I installed a new Raymarine AIS (Connected to a Raymarine c97 MFD) and turned it on yesterday afternoon. The unit was uploaded with my MMSI, boat name and deminsions. I have a BoatUS mmsi number.

Questions:

1. How long before my boat shows up on marine traffic (live ships) website?
2. Will my MMSI/AIS be useless when I go to Canada/inside passage?

It should be about 5 minutes for the AIS to boot up and display your position.

Mine will not display my position at the dock with out a heading source, so make sure you have heading fed to it.

Marine traffic has very spotty coverage. Traveling from FL to MD there were large areas that I didn't register on the site. Transmission reception is pretty much line of site between their station and your boat antenna. Wouldn't expect any reception in remote areas especially with hilly topography.

Ted

Marine Traffic showed my friend's boat which is about 400 feet upriver from me. Man the avoidance alarm scared the crap out of me!

So is my BoatUS MMSI number useless in BC Canada and will I be able to see other ships?

Alaskan Sea-Duction said:

[*]Will my MMSI/AIS be useless when I go to Canada/inside passage?
[/LIST]

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It will work just fine there too. Not sure about functionality in the southern hemisphere, however.

Agreed re MarineTraffic coverage. Even if you can see other vessels near yours (thereby demonstrating that MT covers your location), if you have Class B, its relatively weaker signal (as compared to Class A) may not be strong enough for MT to pick up -- so if you see other vessels near yours, check whether any of them are class B.

The easiest way to check may be to ask another vessel that your AIS picks up. Contact the other vessel on VHF using DSC and its MMSI # shown on its AIS info.

Why didn't you just go online and get your own number instead of thru BoatUS?

Wxx3 said:

Why didn't you just go online and get your own number instead of thru BoatUS?

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Ignorance I guess. I wanted a number for my DSC, so everyone I asked said go to BoatUS, it's free.

Now in order to get an FCC number I would have to take both VHF radios and my AIS and have them reset.

If the BoatUS number works fine, then I will go with that unless anyone here on TF thinks there is a big issue.

Alaskan Sea-Duction said:

...If the BoatUS number works fine, then I will go with that unless anyone here on TF thinks there is a big issue.

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As long as you stay in the US and don't go to Canada you're fine.


BoatUS has been authorized by both the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) and the U.S. Coast Guard to assign MMSI numbers only to vessels that meet the following criteria:

• Used for recreation only
• Not required by law to carry a radio
• Do not make international voyages or communications

Do NOT Register with BoatUS MMSI if:

• your vessel is required to carry a radio onboard (“Compulsory Equipped”)
• you plan to visit or communicate in a foreign port including Canada, Mexico, Bahamas, and the British Virgin Islands

FWIW from the BoatUS Site -

MMSI FAQ's - Maritime Mobile Service Identity - BoatUS

Q: I am a recreational boater in the United States but regularly go into Canadian waters. Can I still use the BoatUS MMSI?
A: While Canada is considered “international waters” which calls for an FCC Ship Station License, it is our understanding that Canada is not enforcing US regulations. Canada has also de-licensed recreational boaters. That does not mean they can not or will not require it if given reason to do so. If you proceed to operate in the shared waters without license you do so at your own risk. Under international treaties to which the US is a party, you are required to have an FCC license to transmit your radio in a foreign port. It is recommended for Mexico, Bahamas and the Caribbean etc. BoatUS and the GMDSS Task Force are working to have the FCC lift the rule for Canada and the Bahamas. Also, the U.S. & Canadian Coast Guard are working together to respond to any distresses in the border waters.

Previous thread info

http://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s4/ais-mmsi-question-16468.html

Wxx3 said:

Why didn't you just go online and get your own number instead of thru BoatUS?

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I went on line direct to the FCC and had my MMSI in 3 days.

If it works here in the PNW, Alaska and in Canada my BoatUs number should be just fine.

Directly from the BoatUS web site:



BoatUS has been authorized by both the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) and the U.S. Coast Guard to assign MMSI numbers only to vessels that meet the following criteria:

• Used for recreation only
• Not required by law to carry a radio
• Do not make international voyages or communications

Do NOT Register with BoatUS MMSI if:

• your vessel is required to carry a radio onboard (“Compulsory Equipped”)
• you plan to visit or communicate in a foreign port including Canada, Mexico, Bahamas, and the British Virgin Islands.

Alaskan Sea-Duction said:

If it works here in the PNW, Alaska and in Canada my BoatUs number should be just fine.

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Should work? Good question.

Boat US, makes it clear, that if you are registering with them that you are operating only in US waters. Whether it will work in Canada I don't know.

The fee for your Radio Station Authorization, Form FCC 605 is $215 and includes a MSSi number and is good for 10 years. It also licenses you to operate a VHF, Radar, EPRIB, HF radio plus some others and is good anywhere you go.

1) It will work just fine in Canada and anywhere else, but you will not be in compliance with the laws. Does anyone care? Probably not, but you;ll have to decide how risk averse you are.

2) I haven't tried it personally, but it looked to me like when you apply for an FCC Ships Station license which is what you need to be in compliance with the law taking a US boat into Canadian waters, that you can supply your current MMSI number. This might enable you to essentially "convert" your boat US number to an internationally licensed number. If you try this. please report back because I think it would be really useful if this can be done.

3) Also to be in compliance you need to be licensed too, not just your ship. This is an RO (Restricted Operator) license.

4) The two licenses are $200 or so, but good for something like 10 years.

I hear you on not wanting to get your VHFs and AIS reset by a dealer, so if I were in your shoes I'd try the FCC application process ot see if it will accept your existing MMSI. Afterall, the MMSI is supposed to stay with the boat even though the SA (ships station) license is not transferable, so that suggests there must be a way to bring the ships MMSI number to be included in a new SA license.

As for boating in Canada with an MMSI obtained through Boat US vs the FCC - I believe there is more than just a compliance issue.

As of a couple of years ago, the Canadian CG did not recognize, or have access to, any non-FCC MMSI's. If you have a Boat US MMSI, your DSC distress signal will be received and responded to but the CCG will only know your location, not who they are responding to, what type of vessel they are looking for, or who to contact regarding the emergency (emergency contacts, next of kin etc.).

This may have changed recently but I don't think so.

THREAD DRIFT WARNING - If the DSC radios are designed to be connected to a GPS, why don't my Uniden DSC Radio and Foruno NavNet Vx2 have plugs/terminals to facilitate the connection? I can't figure out how to wire them. I also couldn't navigate my way through the FCC site. I use a SPOT Messenger.

mitkofisle said:

As for boating in Canada with an MMSI obtained through Boat US vs the FCC - I believe there is more than just a compliance issue.



As of a couple of years ago, the Canadian CG did not recognize, or have access to, any non-FCC MMSI's. If you have a Boat US MMSI, your DSC distress signal will be received and responded to but the CCG will only know your location, not who they are responding to, what type of vessel they are looking for, or who to contact regarding the emergency (emergency contacts, next of kin etc.).



This may have changed recently but I don't think so.



THREAD DRIFT WARNING - If the DSC radios are designed to be connected to a GPS, why don't my Uniden DSC Radio and Foruno NavNet Vx2 have plugs/terminals to facilitate the connection? I can't figure out how to wire them. I also couldn't navigate my way through the FCC site. I use a SPOT Messenger.

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What model uniden do you have?

Is the purpose of your AIS to avoid collisions or for someone to track your vessel? The tracking properties usually only work near US shores but the collision avoidance should work most anywhere. I recently made a trip to the Dominican Republic and Cuba (solo) and the collision alarm served me well at 5 mile alarm range. Lost tracking when I was about 20 miles off Key West. So I was told.

Well I am transmitting as of last night on Marine Traffic (Live Ship)! One project done 50 more to go.

If you'd like a distress call to supply the Canadian CG with your boat/owner information, it seems that's not going to work with a BoatUS MMSI. Here's a recent response from BoatUS to a question about MMSI's from a boater heading into Canada:


The problem is not one that BoatU.S. can fix unfortunately, though we are actively lobbying the government to push for a change. The problem is that the International ITU database can only accept MMSI numbers ending in zero and BoatU.S. is not authorized to issue MMSI numbers ending in zero. If you are required to be licensed, but are cruising within range of the U.S. or Canadian Coast Guard, you can continue to use the BoatU.S. number in your radio rather than reprogram with the MMSI assigned by the FCC. Foreign rescue authorities just won't be able to look up your registered data in the international SAR database in the event of a distress.

If you are cruising in Canadian waters, the Canadian Coast Guard is working with the U.S. Coast Guard on any distresses.

Kristin L. Loyd
Supv, Special Programs
Technical Services
(Surveyor Referral/MMSI/Seaworthy Magazine/Captain Locator)
800.563.1536 ext. 3561 | KLoyd@BoatUS.com | BoatUS.com/MMSI

mitkofisle said:

As for boating in Canada with an MMSI obtained through Boat US vs the FCC - I believe there is more than just a compliance issue.

As of a couple of years ago, the Canadian CG did not recognize, or have access to, any non-FCC MMSI's. If you have a Boat US MMSI, your DSC distress signal will be received and responded to but the CCG will only know your location, not who they are responding to, what type of vessel they are looking for, or who to contact regarding the emergency (emergency contacts, next of kin etc.).

This may have changed recently but I don't think so.

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Yes, I believe this is correct.

There is an international database of ships that is used to get more info on whoever has issued a distress alert. This info aids in a search operation. When you get your MMSI through the FCC, you info gets placed in the ITU database. When you get your MMSI from BoatUS, it does not get placed in the ITU database.

I dont' think this will impact AIS use in any way, but you are correct that it will place you at a disadvantage should you have to issue a DSC distress call.

I agree with others that if you have any thoughts of international travel, and that includes Canada, Mexico, and the Bahamas, to just get the FCC license and MMSI and be done with it.

The interesting challenge is the one the OP has, which is essentially converting from a BoatUS MMSI to an internationally registered one. Gettign a new MMSI is easy, but having to send all your equipment in for reset service is a pain in the butt. I'm real interested to see if anyone is able to get an FCC license and reuse their old MMSI, thereby getting it into the ITU database.

Just completed the FCC Online registration but no mention of how long it will take to get the MMSI.

Can some one advise?

twistedtree said:

I'm real interested to see if anyone is able to get an FCC license and reuse their old MMSI, thereby getting it into the ITU database.

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Great question! But if the FCC numbers all end in "0" and BoatUs cannot issue these numbers, then there maybe a problem.....

I may have to go through the process of grounding my fleet of one and send in all of my radio/AIS gear to have it reset.

It took about 4 days for me.

mitkofisle said:

THREAD DRIFT WARNING - If the DSC radios are designed to be connected to a GPS, why don't my Uniden DSC Radio and Foruno NavNet Vx2 have plugs/terminals to facilitate the connection? I can't figure out how to wire them. I also couldn't navigate my way through the FCC site. I use a SPOT Messenger.

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One would think that NMEA would come up with a standard plug/jack arrangement that the manufacturers could all implement instead of every radio/GPS having a different wiring scheme. Nope. Probably THE reason most DSC radios are not interfaced at all.

High Wire said:

One would think that NMEA would come up with a standard plug/jack arrangement that the manufacturers could all implement instead of every radio/GPS having a different wiring scheme. Nope. Probably THE reason most DSC radios are not interfaced at all.

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They do make them their called Nmea 2000 capable VHF's.

ulysses said:

It took about 4 days for me.

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Seems like they improved on that. I got it this morning via an email and a link. So it was less than 24 hours.

Well had my first trip up river today with the AIS. I have disarmed the sound alarm! I must have pushed "OK" at least 60 times. Lots of boat traffic in the Columbia today. We are at St. Helens OR tonight.

I did not use the email/link option and relied on the USPS, Still a pretty fast turnaround time for a federal agency.