Tide Clocks

Marin wrote:

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rwidman wrote:

I have slip neighbors with a satellite dish on the dock. It only works when they are in their slip.


The great thing about the*TracVision antenna is that it*stays locked on the satellite no matter what the boat does.* So it doesn't matter where you are*or*or what the boat's doing--- running at cruise speed, swinging around an anchor, whatever. If the antenna can see the satellite, it can lock on it and stay locked.* TracVision supplies antennas for entertainment (TV) and communications (internet, phone, etc.).* I believe that's why you see a lot of boats with two of their antennas, one for each type of service.

We are very tentatively considering getting one for our boat, not for TV-- which we don't care about-- but for connectivity for my work.* It's not cheap, though, so we may very well*decided against it.

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-- Edited by Marin on Monday 25th of October 2010 04:41:30 PM
When you say "not cheap", you're talking a couple thousand dollars, right?* Plus a subscription?

Somebody made the point above that a weak analog signal is usually watchable, while with digital signals, it's either there or not.*

In many respects, the US government's decision to switch broadcast TV from analog to digital is like their decision to adultrate gasoline with ethanol.* It's a boon for some people, but not for the general public.* Reception distance from the transmitter seems much less for digital signals.

*


-- Edited by rwidman on Monday 25th of October 2010 07:04:04 PM

rwidman wrote:
When you say "not cheap", you're talking a couple thousand dollars, right?* Plus a subscription?

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That's correct.* More than a couple thousand I believe.

*

Ok, so maybe I should have described the aerial/antenna ideal for TV within reasonable distance of shore based transmitters/translators, as 'digital capable', rather than 'digital' in design, but actually, there are special antennae which are designed to optimise TV reception within reasonable distance of coastal stations, and they are not that costly and not as complicated as TracVision or DirectTV and require no subscription. Below is an abstract, or follow the link Rocky et al.......
Ok, these are Australian sites, but you will have the equivalent, and for coastal cruising would probably do fine, and don't cost that much - coupla hundred or less...

http://www.discovermarine.com.au/marinedigital.asp
or in the US...... http://au.shopping.com/tv%20antenna%20boat/products~NS-1~linkin_id-8024509

"The image quality of Marine Digital TV is far superior than that of Analogue. In fact, Marine Digital TV's image quality and sound is equal to that seen on DVD. Dolby Digital 5.1 surround sound is even available on some programs. This exceptional difference is derived from the actual chipset (Brain of the Tuner) and also from high gain marine antenna which become a vital combination, if your system is to operate effectively. You will need high gain marine antenna, this will allow the signal to be transmitted with a more directional beam which will allow for more precise targeting of each desired Digital TV signal."




-- Edited by Peter B on Tuesday 26th of October 2010 05:30:24 AM

-- Edited by Peter B on Tuesday 26th of October 2010 05:35:53 AM

"Marine" digital television? What, they have special stations and transmitters for the marine market?? And since when did your marine antenna on the boat transmit? *Marketers gone wild!

I won't try to make the argument that the picture quality of digital TV is no better than analog and I won't discount the sound options or the ability of the broadcaster to transmit multiple signals (programs) on the same frequency, but the major problem with digital TV (in the US) is that the distance from the transmitter that a usable signal can be received is less (sometimes far less) than for an analog signal.

The bottom line for many users is that in the same location where they formerly received many analog signals, they now may receive few or even no digital signals. For these folks (I am included here at my marina), "digital" TV is not an improvement.

rwidman wrote:The bottom line for many users is that in the same location where they formerly received many analog signals, they now may receive few or even no digital signals. For these folks (I am included here at my marina), "digital" TV is not an improvement.

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It is for the cable and satellite providers.* An improved*increase in*their customer base.

*

Keith wrote:

"Marine" digital television? What, they have special stations and transmitters for the marine market?? And since when did your marine antenna on the boat transmit?

*Marketers gone wild!

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Yep, but many folks will believe this BS and buy the components.

I'm sure if the marketer actually understood what he/she was trying to say about the antenna, it would have read "receive" instead of "transmit", but as you read the post, they are talking about a directional antenna and as I posted above, do you really want to get up and turn your antenna everytime the boat swings?

And remember also, there are many locations where TV transmitters are in opposite directions from your location.* You might have to face the antenna south for one sytation, north for another, southwest for a third, etc.

*

JD wrote:


rwidman wrote:The bottom line for many users is that in the same location where they formerly received many analog signals, they now may receive few or even no digital signals. For these folks (I am included here at my marina), "digital" TV is not an improvement.

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It is for the cable and satellite providers.* An improved*increase in*their customer base.

*


THe television standards for the US had not been changed since the invention of television (except for adding color) and were way behind the rest of the world as far as resolution, clarity, etc.* They did need to be updated.** Another factor, this change freed up a large frequency band that the government was then able to auction off to other users.

But, it could have been done better.* Far better.

Most of the TV stations have little incentive to increase their transmitting power or antenna height because the vast majority of users receive the programing via cable or satellite.* I think they could compensate if they really wanted to.

*

Or you could forget about the TV and just enjoy time spent on the water.

SD

Skipperdude - I do enjoy my time spent on the water, however, there are times for us (as we are not liveaboards) when we come for the weekend, only to discover the weather isn't going to be accommodating for a cruise and it would be nice to have a television, thats all.

Thanks to all for your input. We'll figure out something on this one way or another.

skipperdude wrote:

Or you could forget about the TV and just enjoy time spent on the water.

SD

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Of course we enjoy our time on the water, but after a day's worth of cruising, or during a weekend at the marina, it's nice to watch the news or sports.* It's there if we want it.

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Gotcha.
I just never watch any of that stuff.
Outdoor kind of guy. Give me my boat my fishing rods and my guns and my tools.
That's about all the entertainment I need.
Heck I don't even have a stereo on board
You big city folk down in the lower 48 have different requirements. I can appreceiat that.
*Pardon me.

SD

We put flat screen tvs' in 6 of the 7 staterooms and have a 50" flat screen in the crew lounge.
Our company was kind enough to buy us satalite system and monthly subscription.

Rocky,

I just completed the installation of a 19" tv/dvd combo in my saloon. I also have a tv in the stateroom that has a rabbit ear antenna which sometimes works when docked but doesn't when on a mooring can. So I installed an omnidirectional antenna called Glomex which is made by Imtra. Although I haven't taken the boat out yet, I am very impressed with the reception that I get at the dock. I am loving digital tv now. I didn't know there are so many over-the-air stations. And if I learned spanish and became an evangelical christian I can enjoy all the channels instead of just half.

Hiya,
**** Hahahaha....Mr. mahal, good one!* Ain't THAT the truth-thanks.

Mahal, that was a good one, gave me quite the chuckle. Also, thats interesting about the rabbit ears; and in googling around the net I saw the Glomex, and it wasn't all that expensive, like maybe $130 or so, definitely something we could handle. We aren't on a mooring can, so just might try the rabbits ears first. Thank you so much for sharing your experience.

Rocky wrote:

Mahal, that was a good one, gave me quite the chuckle. Also, thats interesting about the rabbit ears; and in googling around the net I saw the Glomex, and it wasn't all that expensive, like maybe $130 or so, definitely something we could handle. We aren't on a mooring can, so just might try the rabbits ears first. Thank you so much for sharing your experience.

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The Glomex is a*"omnidirectional" antenna as explained above, the "rabbit ears" are "bi-directional", they pick up signals from either side in a direction perpendicular to the orientation of the elements.

*

rwidman wrote:Yep, but many folks will believe this BS and buy the components.

I'm sure if the marketer actually understood what he/she was trying to say about the antenna, it would have read "receive" instead of "transmit", but as you read the post, they are talking about a directional antenna and as I posted above, do you really want to get up and turn your antenna everytime the boat swings?

And remember also, there are many locations where TV transmitters are in opposite directions from your location.* You might have to face the antenna south for one sytation, north for another, southwest for a third, etc.

Click to expand...

Ron, I suggest you follow the link and read again.* The antennae are not directional, they are set 70cm + apart, but fixed, so you don't have to re-align them all the time, but the twin tuners are synch'd in such a way as to avoid blurring (from Doppler effect) when on the move, and as long as not too far from the transmitter or translator, the gain or amplification available helps compensate for poor signal. They work well, and it is not all BS.* Several of my boating buddies have them, and here in Aussie anyway, they are very effective.* I would think for what Rocky wants.* You know, the news, baseball game, etc, if at anchor or at the dock with bad weather, then it would probably be ok, but I must admit I am not au fait with the US scene, and yes - it's possible your technology is a bit behind ours, but not that much surely.

*

Peter B wrote:

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rwidman wrote:Yep, but many folks will believe this BS and buy the components.

I'm sure if the marketer actually understood what he/she was trying to say about the antenna, it would have read "receive" instead of "transmit", but as you read the post, they are talking about a directional antenna and as I posted above, do you really want to get up and turn your antenna everytime the boat swings?

And remember also, there are many locations where TV transmitters are in opposite directions from your location.* You might have to face the antenna south for one sytation, north for another, southwest for a third, etc.

Click to expand...

Ron, I suggest you follow the link and read again.* The antennae are not directional, they are set 70cm + apart, but fixed, so you don't have to re-align them all the time, but the twin tuners are synch'd in such a way as to avoid blurring (from Doppler effect) when on the move, and as long as not too far from the transmitter or translator, the gain or amplification available helps compensate for poor signal. They work well, and it is not all BS.* Several of my boating buddies have them, and here in Aussie anyway, they are very effective.* I would think for what Rocky wants.* You know, the news, baseball game, etc, if at anchor or at the dock with bad weather, then it would probably be ok, but I must admit I am not au fait with the US scene, and yes - it's possible your technology is a bit behind ours, but not that much surely.

*


I'm not getting much information from the link and page.* First, it seems to be comparing the quality of digital TV to analog.* Digital is better provided you have a strong signal, that's a given.* It's also pointless in the USA, because, except for a few low powered stations, all we have available is digital transmission.

TV standards are different in different parts of the world so I don't know if something designed for Australia would even work in the USA.

It's not clear from the link if this is an antenna system or an antenna and tuner designed to work together.* Obviously, there is a big difference.* An antenna/tuner combination would have to be connected to a single channel on the TV or an auxilliary input.* Either way, there would then be two remote controls involved in operating the set and features such as scanning for channels and channel display would no longer work.

Again, as I read the pages, I see advertising hype, not technically accurate information.* There's not enough there for me to figure out exactly what they are making and selling and if it would work for me in the USA and improve my TV reception.

If someone could design an omnidirectional antenna/amplifier combination, powered by 12 volts DC and suitable for marine use, and it was significantly better than the several "UFO" style antennas available from several manufacturers, I would buy and install one, no doubt.** I don't see the product featured in the link as this product.

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-- Edited by rwidman on Thursday 28th of October 2010 08:42:24 AM

TV sets from Europe are not the same Protocol. We had several from a job we did in europe
last year and would not work in the U.S.

rwidman wrote:
TV standards are different in different parts of the world so I don't know if something designed for Australia would even work in the USA.

Click to expand...

No, it won't.* In standard definition the two main consumer television standards are NTSC (US, Mexico, Canada, Japan, S. Korea and a few other places) and PAL (everywhere else).

In high-definition the standards are defined by the resoution and the scan type (720p, 1080i, etc) but they are all either -60 (US, Canada, etc.) or -50 (the rest of the world).

Computer-based video formats (.wmv, .mov, etc.) are universal.* So I can put a high-res .wmv of a video I produced in Seattle on a thumb drive, take it to China and the foreman at one of our suppliers can plug the thumb drive into his computer and download and play the video.* But when it comes to television itself, there are distinct differences between formats and standards.

In the days of standard defintion many consumer video products sold in Europe were dual or tri standard--- VCRs would play PAL, NTSC, and sometimes even SECAM, for example.* This sort of equipment was never available in the US which was too bad because the US video standard was the worst of the bunch in terms of quality.

The HD cameras we use at Boeing are switchable--- when we shot the televison commercial for Turkish Airlines the other week we put the camera we used in 1080i-50 so the airline could use the camera original tapes in Istanbul for editing.* When we shoot for ourselves we put the cameras in 1080i-60 which is a US HD format.

More than you wanted to know, but the bottom line is that despite the advances in video, there is still a compatibility wall between the US and most of the rest of the world when it comes to TVs, DVRs, and DVDs.


-- Edited by Marin on Thursday 28th of October 2010 01:28:12 PM

I have an omnidirectional antenna and all I did was buy a $30 digital converter box.* When you want to use it just hit the autoscan and it will pick up any signal in the area.* We always pick up at least 10 channels.* Once we picked up a station in Florida (we were on the NC/SC border), must have been atmospheric "skip" that night...* I would reccomend this setup, it works great!

Egregious - what brand of omnidirectional antenna did you get? This is a brand new HDTV/DVD combo tv, do I still need to buy a digital converter box??? I'm thinking no, but please advise. Also, for those of you that have indicated you have one of these omnidirectional antennas, where did you mount it on your boat?

Rocky wrote:Also, for those of you that have indicated you have one of these omnidirectional antennas, where did you mount it on your boat?

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We have a Shakespeare Omni mounted inside the flybridge enclosure. For those rare ocassions when we are within receiving range of a digital TV station (our home harbor is surrounded by a bowl of hills and is 60 miles from the nearest station and we can get one or two stations occasionally) it works fine. Used to get analog signals fine though.

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Rocky,

You do not need a converter box. Those are for non digital tv sets that are no longer sold. As for the antenna location, I installed mine on the radar arch. One thing I forgot to mention in my previous post is that you will be amazed at the picture quality. It is almost as good as hdtv at home through cable (verizon fios).

Okay great, thank you all for you input.

Rocky wrote:

Egregious - what brand of omnidirectional antenna did you get? This is a brand new HDTV/DVD combo tv, do I still need to buy a digital converter box??? I'm thinking no, but please advise. Also, for those of you that have indicated you have one of these omnidirectional antennas, where did you mount it on your boat?

Click to expand...

Mount any TV antenna as high as practical on the boat.* Remember at best, it's only a few feet above sea level.

*