CHB Teak Fastening Method

Does anyone know when CHB transitioned from mechanical fasteners to using adhesives to apply teak to the deck surfaces? Thanks.

Sorry to be no help but what is CHB?

One of several Taiwanese made trawlers. My thread is based on general "info" that the industry transitioned from mechanical fasteners to adhesives at some point to minimize deck penetrations and subsequent subdeck rot issues....just what I've heard.

My answer won't be much help but "not soon enough!"

Chung Hwa something.

Xsbank said:

...Chung Hwa something.

Click to expand...

Maybe Chien Hwa Boat MFG. LTD.

My understanding of CHB is Chin Hua Brothers. Fairly confident in that. No help on the adhesives issue,sorry. The guys on here are GREAT and I'm betting you'll get an answer.

I can tell you with certainty it was after 1977.

CHB is Chung Hwa Boat Manufacturing Co. Taiwan. I had one for 25 years.
It came with a set of drawings for all systems and layup and construction.

1981 Pilot House model, the teak decks were fastened with screws and adhesive.

Having had it so long and one who did all of his own maintenance, it and I were intimately acquainted, in the biblical sense.

CCC

I have a 1984 34ft CHB, just getting into fixing and replacing the deck, they used an adhesive like roofing tar and screws, my deck has delaminated and has caused some core damage, I have to pull the hole deck off and start over. I will be using a flexible adhesive and not using any screws. I am also using quarter sawn teak. The original teak is flat sawn. I am building a layout table in my shop and plan to cut all my pieces before hand. I have to steam some pieces for the bow area. I thought about a non skid fiberglass deck but decided on teak to keep the boat original as possible and I love teak, I can work with wood but not so much with fiber glass.

Mine is a 1989 and is screwed down

Good luck steaming that teak. Everyone else uses sawn to fit planks. Wide boards and lots of waste. Or you can glue up your board with scarfs and then cut to fit. Less waste that way. 3M5200 is about the best adhesive for gluing teak to a deck. Thinner planking will stay adhered better, it has less movement to break the bond. 1/4 inch is about standard, sometimes thinner.

We replaced the teak decks on the house of our last boat and used TDS (Teakdecking Systems) SIS-440. We dry fitted all the teak before bedding in the SIS-440 then weighted everything down with cement blocks. We then went back, caulked the seams with more SIS-440 and then sanded. I believe TDS now has an adhesive that you would use to adhere the teak to the decks before caulking the seams. Personally I'd stay away from using 5200 for that purpose.

TDS installs more replacement teak decks that probably any company in the world. I would call them. They have always bee good about answering questions on the phone.

The World's Leader in Pre-Manufactured Custom Teak Decks - Teakdecking Systems®

Thanks for the information Larry. I am going to use products from TDS,one is a two part flexible epoxy and the other is a polysulfide caulk for the seams. Now you have be worried about steaming the planks. They are 2"x 1/2" x 8ft,i have to bend 12 pieces. I have never scarfed boards before, do you cut across the board or along the length of the board? Thanks ,Jim

We've never steamed deck planks as kullas44 says, we always cut to fit along the length. Look at the planks you have now or walk the docks and look at other teak decks. I bet they were all cut.

Grand Banks teak deck planks are bent to the curve, not sawn. I am almost positive on this but will confirm when we go up to the boat today.

Teak can be "bent" but not easily. The proper term is "sprung". Thinner planks tend to twist and pop up. 1/2 inch is entirely to thick to be glued and not fastened. It will not stay adhered. No glue can hold that kind of movement for long. Teak, being a hard wood and a dark color will expand and contract much more than the fiberglass. Fiberglass is not the best substrate for gluing to anyway. Any epoxy is to stiff, but sticks better to the FG. Do more research. There is a better way for DIYers to do this. I've done several decks. The most spectacular failures have been with epoxy. The best decks were adhered with WindowWeld, with 3M7200 a close second. I use fender washers and screws in the seams to hold everything down until the goop sets up. Then pull the screws and goop the seams. Then sand the entire area smooth.

Without Fasteners

Lin Sea said:

I have a 1984 34ft CHB, just getting into fixing and replacing the deck, they used an adhesive like roofing tar and screws, my deck has delaminated and has caused some core damage, I have to pull the hole deck off and start over. I will be using a flexible adhesive and not using any screws. I am also using quarter sawn teak. The original teak is flat sawn. I am building a layout table in my shop and plan to cut all my pieces before hand. I have to steam some pieces for the bow area. I thought about a non skid fiberglass deck but decided on teak to keep the boat original as possible and I love teak, I can work with wood but not so much with fiber glass.

Click to expand...

Don't try to reinvent the wheel. Fastening the teak makes the installation a lot easier. If you try to float the teak strip you will need a lot of spacers and weights to hold the decking in place. This a frustrating experience as everything moves around. I also think building a layout table is a waste of time, your better off cutting a fitting on the boat. IF YOUR DECK IS FLAT ENOUGH, you can cut wider planks and dado groves in the face for intermediate caulk joints. This is how many production boats were built, most had 3 planks per board. This speeds up the laying of planks and minimizes caulk joints that require a bond breaker between the fiberglass and the caulking. If you use foam board instead of wood as deck coring water penetration into the laminate is not as big a problem. Gluing down with epoxy really make the installation a challenge as pot life and the slippery epoxy are really difficult to work with. The fiberglass deck and teak expand and contract at very different rates 5200 and epoxies are mechanical adhesives that have great holding power but not a lot of flexibility. I've used West 105 epoxy with some success but the hassle of using it was not worth it believe me. It's only been a couple of years since the deck was laid and it seems to be holding up to this point, but the memory and frustration is fresh in my mind. I personally will not lay a deck down without fasteners again.

Marin said:

Grand Banks teak deck planks are bent to the curve, not sawn. I am almost positive on this but will confirm when we go up to the boat today.

Click to expand...

Your probably right but how much bend and a bet fasteners were used.

I think starting with 1/2" teak is good. After installation and caulking, you will be sanding, so your final thickness will be less. I have been told by 2 surveyors that 3/8" thickness or more is considered serviceable for screwed teaks decks. This allows for the fasteners, plugs and seams to work. I watched TDS do a deck on a 60' Swan. Templates/patterns were made, and then the final sections were shipped to the boat for installation. They still used some fasteners but not very many and not every 12" or so on each plank as done on the old school method.

1/2 inch planks will not work on a glued deck. 1/4 inch is max. 3/16 is better. Any kind of epoxy and 5200 is like apples and oranges, totally different. 5200 is flexible enough to stand the different expansion/contraction factors. Bond breakers are a non issue in this type of deck. Bond breaks are used on "real" teak decks, not glued teak decks. Do more research !!!!

Larry M said:

Your probably right but how much bend and a bet fasteners were used.

Click to expand...

I recall reading in an article about how GBs are built that the deck planks are steamed. Up into the 90s or so the planks were bedded in a semi-adhesive material and screwed down after steaming and being bent to shape. However, GBs after that (and Eastbays and Aleutians) have their teak decks glued down to the fiberglass subdeck surface. No screws are used. The adhesive used is a special formula developed for manufacturers by Teak Decking Systems (TDS). Other builders like Fleming use the same process.

We were at our boat today (1973 fiberglass GB36) and the planks bend with the curve. They were not sawn. I assume they, too, were steamed and bent to the desired configuration, set in the bedding compound, and screwed down.

A lot of good information, I read everything I can get my hands about teak decks. The teak should arrive this week. I will take pictures as I go along and post them, I have the right bedding material and the right caulk and the right teak. The boat is under cover but still I need 4 days of good weather at a time to work, so who knows maybe I won,t start until spring. Thanks all

Lin Sea said:

A lot of good information, I read everything I can get my hands about teak decks. The teak should arrive this week. I will take pictures as I go along and post them, I have the right bedding material and the right caulk and the right teak. The boat is under cover but still I need 4 days of good weather at a time to work, so who knows maybe I won,t start until spring. Thanks all

Click to expand...

looking forward to pictures of your project

Another method to consider is West Sytems epoxy for laying teak decks.


Thinner cuts of teak are used (about 1/8"), which give much less expansion & contraction. Also easier to bend. The teak is temporarily screwed down using a washer between the strips. The screws are then removed after the epoxy has set.


Rather than the painful process of using bond breakers and caulking, an epoxy/graphite mixture is used to fill the joints, sealing the screw holes at the same time for a permanent seal.


Less teak is used (lower cost and weight) and there is virtually no chance of leaks. It lasts just as long as thicker strips which require replacing when worn down to the plug depth.


See page 41-42 here for more details of the procedure:
http://209.20.76.247/ss/assets/howto-pub2/Wooden%20Boat%20Restoration%20and%20Repair.pdf

That same procedure, using a good PU adhesive works very well. Not so much with epoxy. If you insist on using 1/2 in planks at least route a couple of 3/8 dovetails in the backside to help minimize movement and provide some mechanical connection.

http://www.teakdecking.com/images/pdfs/FFE-200.pdf


This is TDS's Fitting & Fairing Epoxy. I've been using their products for 14 years with no failures.