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MikeM

MikeM

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 6, 2012
Messages
281
Location
USA
Vessel Name
Tuscan Sun
Vessel Make
Krogen 42
What are the pros and cons of keeping your boat in the water for the winter around Norfolk, VA versus hauling and storing on the hard?

Where is a good place in the Tidewater area to store a 40ish foot boat for the winter?

Is there any inside heated storage in this area?

Thanks!
 
IF you screw up the winterization the boat wont sink.

The pipes could be cracked the water tank and hw heater trashed and the FW system need replacing.

The bilge pump trashed and the engine cracked or rusted solid , but you wont SINK.
 
winterization

A friend leaves his boat in to take advantage of those nice days in December and January. I think you can give up on February! He winterizes his boat, uses a bubbler system and if he uses his boat he re-winterizes the engine. Of course he doesn't use the fresh water or the head.
 
To me it's all a matter of how much you'll use it and how close to it are you to keep a check. Also, can you use a heater to protect it. Norfolk typically only has the temperatures to be scared of the last week or so of December and January and February. The true winter is very short. March typically has highs in the mid 50's and lows in the upper 30's and low 40's. Today it's 67 degrees there. When we lived in a colder climate we used our boat year round. But one huge advantage we had was the boat was docked at our home. So we could easily keep a check on it daily. Our main worry was an ice storm and loss of power.
 
BandB said:
To me it's all a matter of how much you'll use it and how close to it are you to keep a check. Also, can you use a heater to protect it. Norfolk typically only has the temperatures to be scared of the last week or so of December and January and February. The true winter is very short. March typically has highs in the mid 50's and lows in the upper 30's and low 40's. Today it's 67 degrees there. When we lived in a colder climate we used our boat year round. But one huge advantage we had was the boat was docked at our home. So we could easily keep a check on it daily. Our main worry was an ice storm and loss of power.
Click to expand...


It will be new to us, so we'd like to have access to do some work over the winter. We'll be about 45 minutes away.
 
Mike, we have the boat behind the house and I would not hesitate to keep it in the water in your environment if you had it behind the house or near by. 45 minutes is doable, but I would want to have some sort of onboard warning system for things like, bilge pumps, temps in various areas, and so on and have it tied to your cell phone. Also a way of heating it if power went out....That way if anything goes wrong you get notified right away and can head over there. I remember someone on here had that kind of system and it was not that expensive. Certainly less than pulling the boat. I think it came from one of our Alaskan members but not sure. Hopefully they are monitoring and can chime in.
 
I added this system to our boat last year.

The Simple to Use Water Alarm | Sump Pump Alarm System | Basement Flood Alert System

It gives you the option of different sensors when you buy the unit. Power loss is built in and I added a high water sensor and a high/low temp alarm. If you have cell coverage where the boat is you can get a text on up to 3 phones when an alarm hits. This was a great piece of mind last year as the boat was only 30 minutes from the house. Now the boat is 4 hours away so the service is even more important to me. We run block heaters all winter so would still have plenty of time to get there in a power outage, high water would require a look-see from the marina a bit sooner.

I believe the set up cost is a bit over $200 but after that it's a $30 a year cell charge. Worth every penny in my opinion.
 
MikeM said:
What are the pros and cons of keeping your boat in the water for the winter around Norfolk, VA versus hauling and storing on the hard?

Where is a good place in the Tidewater area to store a 40ish foot boat for the winter?

Is there any inside heated storage in this area?

Thanks!
Click to expand...

Where do you keep it now? Marina? Private dock? No place, you are bringing it from somewhere else?

I would check around and see what other boaters in that area do. I would think you are pretty much on the border of where boats are hauled or stay in the water.
 
We keep our boat behind our house in Oriental, NC which is about 150 or so miles south of Norfolk. The creeks rarely freeze and the water temp stays above freezing a foot or so below the surface even if it does freeze, so no worries about thru hulls freezing.

I keep a couple of heaters set at 40 degrees or so, one in the main cabin and one in the engine room. I check the boat in the morning after a cold snap, ie 15 or so degrees. I don't winterize but I might if I were a long way away from the boat.

If we were to have a power outage longer than a few hours after or during a real cold snap, I would start the engine and the genset, warm everything up nicely, shut down and wait for the power to come back on. I might have to repeat that if the power were still out the next morning, but power has never been off for more than a few hours in the winter. Hurricanes are another story.

Norfolk gets a little colder, but not much. I doubt if you really need a bubbler.

David
 
Rogerh said:
but I would want to have some sort of onboard warning system for things like, bilge pumps, temps in various areas, and so on and have it tied to your cell phone. Also a way of heating it if power went out....That way if anything goes wrong you get notified right away and can head over there. I remember someone on here had that kind of system and it was not that expensive. Certainly less than pulling the boat. I think it came from one of our Alaskan members but not sure. Hopefully they are monitoring and can chime in.
Click to expand...

I'm the Alaska member :)

Our boat is in the water. Since the harbor is pretty much full I'd have to say thats the norm up here.

AS far as monitoring...We monitor for:

  • High bilge water on both sides of our watertight engine room bulkhead.
  • Shore power
  • Inverter power
  • DC battery voltage
  • Engine Room temperature
  • Cabin Temperature

In addition to this we have cameras:

  • Engine room
  • Salon
  • Pilothouse
  • Cockpit

If anything goes into alarm I get a email and a text message on my cell.

The cameras are viewable from a computer, or my phone, or Ipad.

If the cellular system goes out, the system automatically uses the high speed satellite backup link. :blush:
 
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ksanders said:
I'm the Alaska member :)

Our boat is in the water. Since the harbor is pretty much full I'd have to say thats the norm up here.

AS far as monitoring...We monitor for:

  • High bilge water on both sides of our watertight engine room bulkhead.
  • Shore power
  • Inverter power
  • DC battery voltage
  • Engine Room temperature
  • Cabin Temperature

In addition to this we have cameras:

  • Engine room
  • Salon
  • Pilothouse
  • Cockpit

If anything goes into alarm I get a email and a text message on my cell.

The cameras are viewable from a computer, or my phone, or Ipad.

If the cellular system goes out, the system automatically uses the high speed satellite backup link. :blush:
Click to expand...

If you don't mind sharing, what system do you use to monitor?

Thanks,
Evan
Prairie 29 Coastal Cruiser
Willow B
 
The boat will be new to us. Bringing her from Maryland...probably to Hampton (Salt Ponds Marina) to avoid Norfolk personal property tax. We live in Virginia Beach and have no personal property tax but our marinas are about twice the cost of others in the area.

Seems like most people leave their boats in the water here so we will probably do the same. Having some form of monitoring sounds like a good idea since we will be 30 miles away.
 
MikeM said:
The boat will be new to us. Bringing her from Maryland...probably to Hampton (Salt Ponds Marina) to avoid Norfolk personal property tax. We live in Virginia Beach and have no personal property tax but our marinas are about twice the cost of others in the area.

Seems like most people leave their boats in the water here so we will probably do the same. Having some form of monitoring sounds like a good idea since we will be 30 miles away.
Click to expand...
You are close to the coast and the ocean. This keeps it warmer than further inland. I doubt the water will freeze around your boat.

Talk to the marina manager and other boaters at your marina about what to do for winter.
 
I have minimal experience since I am in the Chicago area and haul out annually.

That being said, I have a diesel furnace I have set to work at at a lower temperature than the dockside electric heat. Just in case the electricity goes off for a while. The assumption for me is that the electricity will come back on or I will be notified in time by the marina before I have an issue.
 
Spike said:
I added this system to our boat last year.

The Simple to Use Water Alarm | Sump Pump Alarm System | Basement Flood Alert System

It gives you the option of different sensors when you buy the unit. Power loss is built in and I added a high water sensor and a high/low temp alarm. If you have cell coverage where the boat is you can get a text on up to 3 phones when an alarm hits. This was a great piece of mind last year as the boat was only 30 minutes from the house. Now the boat is 4 hours away so the service is even more important to me. We run block heaters all winter so would still have plenty of time to get there in a power outage, high water would require a look-see from the marina a bit sooner.

I believe the set up cost is a bit over $200 but after that it's a $30 a year cell charge. Worth every penny in my opinion.
Click to expand...

This is what I have been looking for...

Thanks
 
We are just north of you in DC, and we keep the boat in all year long. Our insurance covers ice damage, but we can't leave the dock in Jan and Feb. We could remove that restriction, but those two months are not very good for boating. Our marina shut down the water and pump out just after Veterans Day, so we emptied the holding tank and filled the water tank, as we will use the boat until the end of December (head is only used for emergencies during winter and we flush with the pink antifreeze). We will winterize the AC/reverse cycle heat when the water gets below 40 degrees, as the system doesn't really work at those temps. At that point, we resort to small electric heaters for nights we stay on board (which is quite often even in winter). At the end of december, we will drain the water tanks and water heater, fill the lines with the pink stuff, and also winterize the engine and generator. We use bilge heaters, so this is really just belts and suspenders in the event the power goes out at the marina (which has happened due to ice storms). We also have a block heater on a thermostat so that it turns on if the block gets below 37 degrees. We don't use a bubbler, but some around us do. Our marina is on a river with a pretty constant flow, so it only ices over when really, really cold, and even then is only about an inch thick. We start her again on March 1. We've never had a problem, knock on wood. We have however had a few boats sink in the winter, almost alwasy due to failure to close thru-hulls and winterize the block.
 
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Carolena said:
We are just north of you in DC, and we keep the boat in all year long. Our insurance covers ice damage, but we can't leave the dock in Jan and Feb. We could remove that restriction, but those two months are not very good for boating. Our marina shut down the water and pump out just after Veterans Day, so we emptied the holding tank and filled the water tank, as we will use the boat until the end of December (head is only used for emergencies during winter and we flush with the pink antifreeze). We will winterize the AC/reverse cycle heat when the water gets below 40 degrees, as the system doesn't really work at those temps. At that point, we resort to small electric heaters for nights we stay on board (which is quite often even in winter). At the end of december, we will drain the water tanks and water heater, fill the lines with the pink stuff, and also winterize the engine and generator. We use bilge heaters, so this is really just belts and suspenders in the event the power goes out at the marina (which has happened due to ice storms). We also have a block heater on a thermostat so that it turns on if the block gets below 37 degrees. We don't use a bubbler, but some around us do. Our marina is on a river with a pretty constant flow, so it only ices over when really, really cold, and even then is only about an inch thick. We start her again on March 1. We've never had a problem, knock on wood. We have however had a few boats sink in the winter, almost alwasy due to failure to close thru-hulls and winterize the block.
Click to expand...


Thanks for the info. The water temp at this end of the bay stays above 40 degrees, so I am told we could get away without winterizing...assuming the power stays on...but our insurance doesn't allow that, nor would I be comfortable doing it. But that is what we are relying on right now since the boat is still near Annapolis. We'll bring her down early next month. We could sure do without this cold weather right now.
 
I'm in pretty much the same situation....In Washington NC right near Norfolk Temp wise. I just ordered a small, Inexpensive engine compartment heater from Defender. Caframo Pali brand and should cover any cold snaps we may experience. Kicks on automatically at 41 degrees. Covers up to 80 cubic feet at -4° F (-20° C) outside ambient temperature. My Compartment is well insulated and sealed so this should do the trick..

901645.jpg
 
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Heron said:
I'm in pretty much the same situation....In Washington NC right near Norfolk Temp wise. I just ordered a small, Inexpensive engine compartment heater from Defender. Caframo Pali brand and should cover any cold snaps we may experience. Kicks on automatically at 41 degrees. Covers up to 80 cubic feet at -4° F (-20° C) outside ambient temperature. My Compartment is well insulated and sealed so this should do the trick..

901645.jpg
Click to expand...


Does that mean you won't winterize? If so, what happens if you lose power?
 
MikeM said:
Does that mean you won't winterize? If so, what happens if you lose power?
Click to expand...

I'll do some basic winterizing (Head, Hot water heater, AC etc)... Power losses are minimal in the area.
I'll actually be pulling the boat during the worst months Jan-Feb
to do some cosmetic maintenance... I'll be asking around at the marina to see what most do..
 
Heron said:
I'm in pretty much the same situation....In Washington NC right near Norfolk Temp wise. I just ordered a small, Inexpensive engine compartment heater from Defender. Caframo Pali brand and should cover any cold snaps we may experience. Kicks on automatically at 41 degrees. Covers up to 80 cubic feet at -4° F (-20° C) outside ambient temperature. My Compartment is well insulated and sealed so this should do the trick..

901645.jpg
Click to expand...

I'd also recommend some form of alarm to notify you of power outages and/or temperature drops. I'd also have an alarm for notification of water in bilge and a few other things so a system of keeping one aware of anything unusual. The alternative is a human on site providing monitoring services but finding someone reliable and willing is difficult.
 
MikeM said:
Does that mean you won't winterize? If so, what happens if you lose power?
Click to expand...

At least around here you can't leave a hauled boat plugged in. If you are on it working you can plug in, but need to unplug when you leave. Cords running everywhere, especially running space heaters, is a very high fire risk and none of the marines I know of will allow it. But I'm sure it varies in different parts of the country.
 
While we don't get severe enough winters to warrant winterizing, we do get the occasional cold snap for a few days when the wind comes from the north out of the BC interior through the Fraser River canyon.

We keep two electric heaters on the boat from December through March. These are the oil-type heaters that look like a small steam radiator. We keep one in the aft cabin and one in the engine room. They are set to their lowest settings (600w) with the thermostats halfway up.

The one in the engine room keeps that space at about 50 degrees, so the FL120s start immediately even in January (we use the boat year round, winds permitting). The nice thing about these heaters is that if there is a power outage they come back on when the power comes back. We used to use an electric ceramic heater and it needed to be manually reset after a power outage.

The large boatyard in our marina has ground power outlets at every "stall" so boats in the yard can remain on ground power 24/7. Extension cords that might be used while working on a boat cannot be left on the ground when the boat is not being worked on.

We used to use the pink stuff in our fresh water system during the winter and used a portable container for fresh water when we used the boat. It would take all summer to get the pink stuff taste and smell out of the water,and the portable container was a pain, so we stopped doing this some 10 or 12 years ago.

Instead we put a pillbox heater in the lazarette with the water tanks, and if it's forecast to be below freezing for a couple or more consecutive 24 hour periods we plug it in. As long as it gets above freezing during the day, we leave it unplugged.

Occasionally it will get cold enough long enough to freeze the top layer of water in the marina, which has a low or no salt content most of the year. But these occasions are very rare. The photo below, taken a couple of winters ago while we were in temporary moorage while our old dock and fingers were being replaced with new ones, was one of these occasions.
 

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Mike,

You're in an area (VA) that wintering in the water is not much of a problem. I've been sailing and motor boating for 45 years out of Rhode Island. We've always hauled the boat for the Winter, but last Winter, I stored the boat in the water. We were up the Pawcatuck River, where it turns to fresh water in Westerly RI. There are many marinas in CT and RI that have in-water storage capacity. Here's my experience.

1. At the end of November, we washed and covered the boat with a coat of wax (not buffed out). I've stored all my boats uncovered but for a coat of wax. While the marina had shut off the water, for washing, I was using my washdown system drawing fresh water from the river.

2. Fresh water system was flushed and winterized with RV antifreeze.

3. Engine acid flushed and filled with the RV stuff. If you're running the engine periodically, at this location, we could have waited and winterized the engine just for January and February. At the dock next to us, a local seal watch downeaster was running seal watch trips until December 31st, and resumed March 1st.

4. My Cummins diesel has an immersion heater that I keep plugged in from November to March. That alone keep the engine and engine compartment warm (relatively speaking).

5. During the super cold January and February days, the marina had a blubber system going, so there wasn't an ice problems.

Would I store in the water again? Not really, at least in this location. I can keep the boat in the water at my boat yard until about the middle of November, and be relaunched by mid-April. I've hauled as late as December 1st, and re-launched by April 1st. The problem I see is that, at least in New England, there isn't any real reason to take the boat out in the Winter. And if you need assistance out on the water, other than commercial fisherman, there are no other boaters out, and the tow services are not running. Besides, hauling over the Winter allows some hull and running gear maintenance, ding repairs, and you can even get a jump on bottom prep and painting during those rare 50 degree days.

A friend on mine has always stored his boat in the water in a well-protected marina in Wickford RI. He did a short-haul in October for bottom cleaning, zincs, and paint. He simply winterized his fresh water system and engine, and covered the boat with clear shrink wrap. Never had an issue. Of course, his boat, cosmetically, looks like it's been stored in the water. Difficult to get polishing, rubbing out, and dings taken care of while in the water. Oh, by the way, he retired a couple of months ago and moved to Charleston SC.

The biggest problem I had is that I was not able to get the boat hauled for bottom prep and paint until after Memorial Day. The yard was just too busy with normal boat prep and launches. Photo taken January 8, 2014.
 

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What is the routine for winterizing a heat pump ?
 
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Puffin_NT32 said:
Mike,



You're in an area (VA) that wintering in the water is not much of a problem. I've been sailing and motor boating for 45 years out of Rhode Island. We've always hauled the boat for the Winter, but last Winter, I stored the boat in the water. We were up the Pawcatuck River, where it turns to fresh water in Westerly RI. There are many marinas in CT and RI that have in-water storage capacity. Here's my experience.



1. At the end of November, we washed and covered the boat with a coat of wax (not buffed out). I've stored all my boats uncovered but for a coat of wax. While the marina had shut off the water, for washing, I was using my washdown system drawing fresh water from the river.



2. Fresh water system was flushed and winterized with RV antifreeze.



3. Engine acid flushed and filled with the RV stuff. If you're running the engine periodically, at this location, we could have waited and winterized the engine just for January and February. At the dock next to us, a local seal watch downeaster was running seal watch trips until December 31st, and resumed March 1st.



4. My Cummins diesel has an immersion heater that I keep plugged in from November to March. That alone keep the engine and engine compartment warm (relatively speaking).



5. During the super cold January and February days, the marina had a blubber system going, so there wasn't an ice problems.



Would I store in the water again? Not really, at least in this location. I can keep the boat in the water at my boat yard until about the middle of November, and be relaunched by mid-April. I've hauled as late as December 1st, and re-launched by April 1st. The problem I see is that, at least in New England, there isn't any real reason to take the boat out in the Winter. And if you need assistance out on the water, other than commercial fisherman, there are no other boaters out, and the tow services are not running. Besides, hauling over the Winter allows some hull and running gear maintenance, ding repairs, and you can even get a jump on bottom prep and painting during those rare 50 degree days.



A friend on mine has always stored his boat in the water in a well-protected marina in Wickford RI. He did a short-haul in October for bottom cleaning, zincs, and paint. He simply winterized his fresh water system and engine, and covered the boat with clear shrink wrap. Never had an issue. Of course, his boat, cosmetically, looks like it's been stored in the water. Difficult to get polishing, rubbing out, and dings taken care of while in the water. Oh, by the way, he retired a couple of months ago and moved to Charleston SC.



The biggest problem I had is that I was not able to get the boat hauled for bottom prep and paint until after Memorial Day. The yard was just too busy with normal boat prep and launches. Photo taken January 8, 2014.
Click to expand...


Thanks for all the great info. Your boat looks very lonely and cold!

I think I am going to get the engine room heater Heron recommended, although I hope to only use it once. We will be much further south next year at this time!
 
>I'll actually be pulling the boat during the worst months Jan-Feb<

Still can freeze hard enough to brake stuff on land

She wont sink, but it could be expensive.
 
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