Can I afford a KK42?

Hello all,
I'm really liking just about everything about the Krogen 42. It's the perfect size, pilothouse up, full displacement, soft chine, covered cockpit, flybridge... It's everything I've ever wanted in a boat. It's even lovely to look at.

Now comes the question... Would it be reasonable to expect to find one in good shape for under 200 grand? My budget isn't very firm yet, as I'd be selling out and all, but I think it's pretty close.

I currently own a 24 year old boat, and there's always something wrong with the damned thing. That's what worries me, I guess. Just about all of the KK42s in my price range are even OLDER than my boat. I know there's no such thing as a perfect boat. I certainly expect to have to work to maintain whatever I end up with. But I don't want a handy man special fixer upper...

I told you guys I had lots of stupid questions!!

A few months ago there were a half a dozen available, now all gone. Yes, they were less than 200k. There are some available on the west coast if you want to make it a voyage.

Wayfarer said:

Now comes the question... Would it be reasonable to expect to find one in good shape for under 200 grand? My budget isn't very firm yet, as I'd be selling out and all, but I think it's pretty close.

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So long as you understand the purchase price is only the ante to buy a seat in the game.

CPseudonym said:

So long as you understand the purchase price is only the ante to buy a seat in the game.

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Yup. That is the "gotcha!" that many people just do not seem to grasp. My own rule of thumb (having had several boats) is to put aside an equal amount as the purchase price (of course I am talking about used boats, never having been able to afford a new one). This has worked pretty well so far. So if I want to buy a $50K boat then there is also another $50K in the savings account. If it does not get used, then so much the better. But some of it always get used!

jwnall said:

Yup. That is the "gotcha!" that many people just do not seem to grasp. My own rule of thumb (having had several boats) is to put aside an equal amount as the purchase price (of course I am talking about used boats, never having been able to afford a new one). This has worked pretty well so far. So if I want to buy a $50K boat then there is also another $50K in the savings account. If it does not get used, then so much the better. But some of it always get used!

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$200,000 seems in the ballpark, perhaps not with a wing engine or active stabilizers. Depending on what you are planning on doing you may not need them.

One caveat, if you want a feature on the boat it will be cheaper to find one with the feature already installed then to add it yourself. Generator, dinghy lift, stabilizers, wing engine, heaters, 12 volt refrigeration are examples.

Also, take a look at the layouts. They do vary a bit. Bill Harris over at Krogen is a very patient, non-pushy type of guy that I would use to scout-out such a vessel. Plus, he knows all the pitfalls and changes in the boats over the years. The 42' bought right is about as right as you can buy a boat. Southwest Florida Trawlers has one they rent if you want to get a feel for how the boat performs.

meridian said:

There are some available on the west coast if you want to make it a voyage.

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That's the idea!

windmill29130 said:

1982 Kadey Krogen Pilothouse Trawler Power Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com

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I saw that one the other day. That price strikes me as being 'probably too good to be true.' Also the phrase "some updating needed" scared me a bit.

CPseudonym said:

So long as you understand the purchase price is only the ante to buy a seat in the game.

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I have caught myself thinking "wow, this one's only 150K! I can afford that!" haha

Bay Pelican said:

$200,000 seems in the ballpark, perhaps not with a wing engine or active stabilizers. Depending on what you are planning on doing you may not need them.

One caveat, if you want a feature on the boat it will be cheaper to find one with the feature already installed then to add it yourself. Generator, dinghy lift, stabilizers, wing engine, heaters, 12 volt refrigeration are examples.

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I think more consideration is needed in regards to what I'm going to do with her. I have some nebulous plans in my head, and some general ideas of places I'd like to visit, but no real clear direction yet.
Good to know about the optional equipment pricing. That makes sense. Same with a car, really.

healhustler said:

Also, take a look at the layouts. They do vary a bit. Bill Harris over at Krogen is a very patient, non-pushy type of guy that I would use to scout-out such a vessel. Plus, he knows all the pitfalls and changes in the boats over the years. The 42' bought right is about as right as you can buy a boat. Southwest Florida Trawlers has one they rent if you want to get a feel for how the boat performs.

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I may have to look into that. It would be great to take one for a test drive sometime. A broker would definitely help, too.


Thanks for the replies, gang!!

Wayfarer,

1. On a scale of 1-10 (10 being the closest to buying), how close are you to being able to make this purchase?

2. On a scale of 1-10, how far is your intended use of this vessel defined in your mind (and that of your SO)?

3. The only way to know a boat is to look at it first hand and have it professionally surveyed. On a scale of 1-10, how close are you to being able to do that?

Wayfarer said:

Hello all, . But I don't want a handy man special fixer upper... :

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The KK 42 has some great attributes. But be aware of those older ones that can have wet saturated hulls due to compromised composite laminates below the waterline. This construction method was abandoned by KK about a third of the way through their construction run.

FlyWright said:

Wayfarer,

1. On a scale of 1-10 (10 being the closest to buying), how close are you to being able to make this purchase?

2. On a scale of 1-10, how far is your intended use of this vessel defined in your mind (and that of your SO)?

3. The only way to know a boat is to look at it first hand and have it professionally surveyed. On a scale of 1-10, how close are you to being able to do that?

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1/3. I'm at about a 1 on that scale. Honestly, the thought that this was even a possibility only popped into my head about a week ago. I'm very much in the preliminary stages. I haven't set foot on a single boat yet, and I'd still need to sell the house etc.. It will be a couple of years before I'd be able to make a move. Much thinking and soul searching to be done.

2. As far as intended use is concerned, I'm at about a 5. I know I'll be spending the majority of my time in near coastal situations, with a healthy dose of Great Lakes and Canals. I do want the capability to take longer trips, and for that purpose, I've benchmarked Bermuda.

sunchaser said:

The KK 42 has some great attributes. But be aware of those older ones that can have wet saturated hulls due to compromised composite laminates below the waterline. This construction method was abandoned by KK about a third of the way through their construction run.

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I'm hoping to avoid those early foam cored hulls. If I find one that's otherwise perfect, and the hull seems to be in good shape, It wouldn't be a deal breaker.

When I was looking for my current boat, I fell in love with an old Wellcraft. It had the right engines, a great layout, and looked really clean and well taken care of. I called in the surveyor and he informed me that the hull was soft and soggy, and the stringers were rotten. I never would have known. I dodged a bullet with that one. Turns out it was a chronic problem with those boats.

If you haven't spent time on one of these boats, you might consider chartering one. I was all but convinced the KK 42 was the boat for us based on countless hours reading about them, touring them at rendezvous, taking short trips on the boats owned by generous owners, etc. While I still like and admire them a ton, it took a 5-day charter in Florida to understand that it wasn't the boat for us. The charter taught us we wanted twins over a single, a walk-in, vs a drop-down engine room and a center-line queen vs a Pullman berth (which is relatively hard to find on a KK 42). Chartering was probably the best $X,000 we spent.

Wayfarer said:

Hello all,
I'm really liking just about everything about the Krogen 42. It's the perfect size, pilothouse up, full displacement, soft chine, covered cockpit, flybridge... It's everything I've ever wanted in a boat. It's even lovely to look at.

Now comes the question... Would it be reasonable to expect to find one in good shape for under 200 grand? My budget isn't very firm yet, as I'd be selling out and all, but I think it's pretty close.

I currently own a 24 year old boat, and there's always something wrong with the damned thing. That's what worries me, I guess. Just about all of the KK42s in my price range are even OLDER than my boat. I know there's no such thing as a perfect boat. I certainly expect to have to work to maintain whatever I end up with. But I don't want a handy man special fixer upper...

I told you guys I had lots of stupid questions!!

Click to expand...

You sound much like me a few years ago.
We had a budget and maybe 10% more but not much else.
YOu can make it work if you want to.

What everyone dsaid below is also sound advice, a few key points from my viewpoint:
1. Pretty much two layouts with one or two heads, figure out what works for you.
2. The older boats, early 80's, do have issues, we pretty much decided that the difference in money did not make up for the added risk. Also it turns out that greater than 25 years old may be an issue with insurance.
3. Your budget is your budget, if you find a great boat for 190, leaving you only 10k in reserve, I'd do it. But what's important here is that you know what you want and can live without.
4. 12v Fridge/freezer ended up costing less than $2500 and totally transformed electrical use on boat. I should have done it first thing. Adding 4 solar panels for $500+500 install also.
5. Try to get a boat that was used as you will use it. We spent more money because we were going to live on it and take it across ocean. had the PO been living on it, it may have been better in the long run for us.
6. Even after we had settled on KK42 two head, 1987 to 1989, we kept looking at other boats, it really helped to confirm our decision.
7. you must plan on some sort of stabilization unless you never take it out of the ICW, but it that's the case, why spend money on a KK.

Ladyhawke, owned my Dick & Lynne Davenport, was in upstate NY near you.
I think it was sold last year, but it was the one of the best boats we ever saw.

email me and I'll be happy to help.

Holy moly, buy that one up on the Great Lakes while you have a chance. You can't beat freshwater boats. Don't think-DO!!

Southwest Florida Yachts doesn't show a KK-42 for charter. Any others out there?

meridian said:

Southwest Florida Yachts doesn't show a KK-42 for charter. Any others out there?

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Sorry about that. I've read several accounts of persons renting the 42 from them. Guess they must have taken it off the list. Too bad,,,,they also had a KK Manatee some years ago. The last account I read of the 42 did indicate there were some issues that needed to be resolved before leaving the dock, but they are usually operator misunderstandings. These rentals often run aground and are sometimes damaged. I never felt that the 42 was a good candidate for renters unfamiliar with the shallow cruising waters around here, but then again, when its new territory with an unexperienced crew, there might not be anything shallow enough.

Wayfarer

Opinions may differ but the Krogen 42's best use is as a long range live aboard. Marina hopping in the Great Lakes is not a good use for the boat. Bermuda, the Bahamas or even living on the Chesapeake Bay is ideal. (PNW of course.)

Thus decide what you plan to do with the boat and if it works a Krogen 42 is a wonderful boat for living aboard at anchor and cruising.

"But be aware of those older ones that can have wet saturated hulls due to compromised composite laminates below the waterline"

Could you tell me a bit more about this and when did KK quit using that method of laying up fiber glass

meridian said:

Southwest Florida Yachts doesn't show a KK-42 for charter. Any others out there?

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That's too bad. We used them and had a good experience.

Wayfarer, you might consider joining Krogen Cruisers, a great bunch of folks with troves of info about these boats. They likely know if there are others available for charter. They also hold a great rendezvous every year where you can tour lots of Krogens and question owners about them.

A Resource for Krogen Owners - Krogen Cruisers

Krogen Cruisers is a wonderful organization with an annual rendezvous in Solomons, MD that is the best! Better yet, hanging around Baltimore in the Fall is boater heaven with the Trawler Fest, Annapolist Power-Boat Show, and Krogen has it's own intimate showing of models away from the crowds. The Chesapeake is its own collection of boating cultures that has to be experienced.

Wxx3 said:

You sound much like me a few years ago.
We had a budget and maybe 10% more but not much else.
YOu can make it work if you want to.

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This is extremely reassuring coming from you! I'm about 18 pages into your crossing thread, and the microwave can't keep the popcorn coming fast enough. What a trip! Extremely inspiring. I just busted out my navionics app to see how far Hawaii is from the west coast... haha.

angus99 said:

If you haven't spent time on one of these boats, you might consider chartering one. I was all but convinced the KK 42 was the boat for us based on countless hours reading about them, touring them at rendezvous, taking short trips on the boats owned by generous owners, etc. While I still like and admire them a ton, it took a 5-day charter in Florida to understand that it wasn't the boat for us. The charter taught us we wanted twins over a single, a walk-in, vs a drop-down engine room and a center-line queen vs a Pullman berth (which is relatively hard to find on a KK 42). Chartering was probably the best $X,000 we spent.

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I'm definitely interested in doing this. Sounds like a great reason to escape the frozen north this winter...

Bay Pelican said:

Wayfarer

Opinions may differ but the Krogen 42's best use is as a long range live aboard. Marina hopping in the Great Lakes is not a good use for the boat. Bermuda, the Bahamas or even living on the Chesapeake Bay is ideal. (PNW of course.)

Thus decide what you plan to do with the boat and if it works a Krogen 42 is a wonderful boat for living aboard at anchor and cruising.

Click to expand...

I agree completely. I'm perfectly comfortable marina hopping the lakes in my current boat. I work on the lake freighters, so really, as beautiful as the lakes can be, It's old news to me. I want to see the rest of the world! The majority of the reason for any Great Lakes adventuring will be to visit home for a few months at a time.

sunchaser said:

The KK 42 has some great attributes. But be aware of those older ones that can have wet saturated hulls due to compromised composite laminates below the waterline. This construction method was abandoned by KK about a third of the way through their construction run.

Click to expand...

Krogen went to solid fiberglass below the waterline at hull #186 of 206 boats, I believe this was around 1993.

After looking at KK42 for many years and not knowing what the final budget would be, we finally purchased ours last year. For us, a brand new KK44 would have been the best choice until you throw in the cost factor. We wanted:
1. Sound Hull
2. Good mechanical
3. Well outfitted
4. Queen walk around w/1 head

When the budget was finally set we started looking. With only 20 KK42's made with the solid fiberglass hull few came on the market and the price was quite a bit higher than the cored hulls and the ones that came on the market just didn't suit us. We ended up with a cored hull and the two head model, but #1,2, & 3 were all met (boat compromises). We spent less than the budget allowed giving us the freedom to upgrade as we see fit and plenty of (financial) room for maintenance.

Definitely watch the cored hulls closely. Get a good surveyor and listen to him. If there isn't a problem after 15-20 years, with good maintenance you shouldn't have a problem. There are many good, cored hull 42's out there and only a few solid glass hulls.

Enjoy the search!

Following info may be useful:

Hulls 1 through 6:

Hull: Fiberglass sandwich construction, PVC core - gelcoat
finish

Main deck:
(fore deck, alleyways,
aft deck) Wood deck beams, plywood, fiberglass and teak.
Boat deck: Fiberglass sandwich with plywood squares 4" x 4" core
with teak over, wood overhead beams, painted with teak
cap on interior, peg board and later fiberglass sheets
on exterior overhead.

Pilothouse: Same as boat deck, but no teak
Deck house side: Plywood, glass covered

Hulls 7 through 65:

Hull: Fiberglass sandwich construction, PVC core (gelcoat
finish)

Main deck: Wood deck beams, plywood, fiberglass and teak.
Boat deck: Fiberglass sandwich with plywood squares 4" x 4" core,
wood overhead beams, painted with teak cap on interior,
peg board and later fiberglass sheets on exterior overhead


Pilothouse top: Same as boat deck
Deck house side: Single laminate, fiberglass with wood stiffeners glassed to
inside

Superstructure and deck were all painted with PU paint

Hulls 66 to hull #___ in 19__:

Hull: Fiberglass sandwich construction, PVC core (more recently
solid fiberglass below the waterline and foam core above).

Main deck: Fiberglass sandwich with plywood squares as core Ð interior
fiberglass overhead liners throughout
Boat deck &:
Pilothouse: Balsa core, fiberglass sandwich with balsa core

House sides: Fiberglass sandwich with PVC core

Chien Hwa used plywood squares in boat deck on last few
boats built (150's), without KKY knowledge

Now foredeck is balsa core. (from hull # 165)

Oh wow, I was thinking there were more solid fiberglass hulls out there. I haven't found anything from the 90's that fits my price range either... so I guess It's a cored hull for me! haha. I'm fine with that. If it's good enough for Dauntless, It's good enough for me!

I really need to take a walk around one of these. I've never actually been aboard one before. I know I love them from the pictures, but I suppose things could be different in person. I doubt that, though.

There may be one coming up for sale downunder. PM me if you want the details.

Wayfarer, wanted to send some encouragement your way. We very recently bought a KK42 with a budget of 140k for a solid, seaworthy, comfortable long-range trawler. Didn't have to be a KK, but we kept looping back to KK during the hunt. Ours is a 1982 KK42 with fibreglass fuel tanks and centreline queen. The PO had pulled the teak foredeck and boatdeck off, checked the underlying structure for rot (none at all), and re-finished with anti-skid white paint. After the well-regarded surveyor finished the inspection and the owner had departed, he strongly recommended that we buy the boat. We had been looking for two years, kissed a few frogs, first time we had heard that. The surveyor taught me how a good hull sounds while he was 'ringing' (tapping it with a ballpeen hammer) our cored hull, because a good hull sounds textbook like ours. Sounds a bit like ringing steel, when it is really solid with no rot. Nice feeling.

So hang in there, they do come up if you keep looking and maintain discipline. One thing that helped was setting up Yachtworld.com to report any new Krogens that came up for sale, though we found our boat in a fairly obscure ad on Krogen Cruisers. It was the only place the PO had advertised it.

1979 kk42

I have a 1979 KK42 that have owned for 20 years and have done extensive work on her. selling her for $150k. boat is in NJ.

Don, that will make somebody very happy.
I'd love to get a 39 KK but have to same some more pennies