Replacing bilge pumps

Going to replace all pumps on board. Looking at the Rule Fully Automatic Series. This is the one that comes on an senses for water every 2 minutes then goes off if water is not found. Will this type pump put a drain on the battery system? Has anyone used this type ?

I've had these in small CC's, they're junk. A good float switch (Ultra) with a good pump (I prefer whale) is the best most reliable system.
http://www.defender.com/product.jsp?path=-1|51|2234226|2234229&id=2010625

N4712 said:

I've had these in small CC's, they're junk. A good float switch (Ultra) with a good pump (I prefer whale) is the best most reliable system.
Whale Orca 3000 Electric Bilge Pump

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Yep!!

Do they even make those POS pumps anymore??? Junk and yes they use power every time they switch on (unless you get the gas powered ones for more money)

N4712 said:

I've had these in small CC's, they're junk. A good float switch (Ultra) with a good pump (I prefer whale) is the best most reliable system.
Whale Orca 3000 Electric Bilge Pump

Click to expand...

A big X2 on that! Just what he says, though the big non-automatic Rules are very good as well.

caltexflanc said:

A big X2 on that! Just what he says, though the big non-automatic Rules are very good as well.

Click to expand...

Yes rules are great too. We actually just replaced our main bilge pump (jabsco diaphragm) with a gulper, and run whales in all my little boats.

I like my Jabsco Water Puppy and all the others of that rotary vane in bronze type. Had one in my boat on Juneau in 1972 and it's my main bilge pump now. I also have an electric Whale diaphragm type that is very dependable but of low output. I have a dedicated bilge pump only for my Lazerette. It's actually an oil changing pump rigged as a bilge pump. And I have a big Rule type pump just in front of the engine. Only the Water Puppy is wired automatic and uses a typical foot style switch. I should probably wire the big pump for automatic too as those foot switches aren't very dependable ... I hear.

I was going to start another thread but found this one

I have 3 bilge pumps in my boat I just replaced one with The Whale Supersubup much lower keep my bilge much dryer

the others now do not run at all because this picks

it has been in about 3 months I am about to replace the others and was thinking of putting the same in I have 3 bilge pumps in all

Whale SuperSub Smart IC 1100 Automatic Bilge Pump

siestakey said:

I was going to start another thread but found this one

I have 3 bilge pumps in my boat I just replaced one with The Whale Supersubup much lower keep my bilge much dryer

the others now do not run at all because this picks

it has been in about 3 months I am about to replace the others and was thinking of putting the same in I have 3 bilge pumps in all

Whale SuperSub Smart IC 1100 Automatic Bilge Pump

Click to expand...

Those are nice pumps, I installed one (as an addition, not a replacement) in a tight spot that was not draining well. However, in my opinion 1100 is way too small for a boat your size, advise 2000gph with at least on large capacity (say 3700) high water back-up.

Geroge

Thanks I may play with some creative ideas

if I put 2 more of these in and next to 2 of them I have plenty of room for one like this

Rule 4000 Electronic Automatic Bilge Pump

or this

Whale Orca 3000 Electric Bilge Pump

Thinking the Whale supersub keeping it ultra dry while at the dock and the others for high water back up

thoughts?

I'd go with the big Rule pump. But not the automatic one. I'd use the regular Rule with an UltraSwitch float switch. And as you said mount it up higher than the rest of the pumps as an emergency pump. And install a high water alarm that would go off before the water got high enough to kick on the emergency pump.

Oh, and be sure to use nice large diameter wire for the pump so it gets good strong voltage to it.

I tried one of the Rule pumps that turn on briefly every few minutes. It was reliable and didn't seem to cause much drain on the battery. It was in a small boat and I could hear it each time it started. For that reason, I replaced it with a pump and float switch.


On my current boat I have one of the new style Rule automatic pumps that has a magic water sensor, no moving parts. I think it is a flux gate capacitor that senses the water. Anyway it has worked fine for a couple of years now.

When I bought the boat the alarm was right at the middle pump at would go off with every wave or when cruising

I moved it right next to the high pump near the galley

I was just introduced to the whale supersub by the yard doing some work for me. They're going to install one down in the bow. (I sit bow low at the dock. ) The current pump can't get low enough so there is always water there. Drives me crazy. We are going to leave the existing Rule in place as well. I think I'm going to love this thing.

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kartracer said:

Going to replace all pumps on board. Looking at the Rule Fully Automatic Series. This is the one that comes on an senses for water every 2 minutes then goes off if water is not found. Will this type pump put a drain on the battery system? Has anyone used this type ?

Click to expand...

Yes these pumps put a small drain on the battery system. Not too bad if you're plugged into shore power but if you're out of the water with non shorepower it could be a problem.

I have heard nothing but bad reviews of these pumps.

Unless you are "upgrading", the easiest thing to do is replace what you have with identical pumps. You can just insert the pump into the base, hook up the hose and wires. No drilling new holes and sealing the old ones.

Sometimes you can find a higher capacity pump that uses the same base and hose.

Capt.Bill11 said:

I'd go with the big Rule pump. But not the automatic one. I'd use the regular Rule with an UltraSwitch float switch. And as you said mount it up higher than the rest of the pumps as an emergency pump. And install a high water alarm that would go off before the water got high enough to kick on the emergency pump.

Oh, and be sure to use nice large diameter wire for the pump so it gets good strong voltage to it.

Click to expand...

Now this is advice I can use.

I really like the idea of a high volume pump above the normal pump, with a different alarm.

That would advert disaster when someone, who shall remain nameless, turns off the bilge pumps inadvertently, until three feet of water had collected.

HopCar said:

I tried one of the Rule pumps that turn on briefly every few minutes. It was reliable and didn't seem to cause much drain on the battery. It was in a small boat and I could hear it each time it started. For that reason, I replaced it with a pump and float switch.


On my current boat I have one of the new style Rule automatic pumps that has a magic water sensor, no moving parts. I think it is a flux gate capacitor that senses the water. Anyway it has worked fine for a couple of years now.

Click to expand...

Parks, what is this magic water sensor you speak of? Similar to the Water Witch I'm guessing??


1983 Present 42 Sundeck
Twin Lehman 135's

Some Rules just turn on and sense if there is resistance or not on the impeller.

The computerized sequence is pretty short for sensing , maybe 2-3 min cycle, and one a couple seconds max for seeing if water is present.

While they had issues and some people just don't like them, if you do the math on the total drain on batteries, it is almost imperceptible.

psneeld said:

The computerized sequence is pretty short for sensing , maybe 2-3 min cycle, and one a couple seconds max for seeing if water is present.

While they had issues and some people just don't like them, if you do the math on the total drain on batteries, it is almost imperceptible.

Click to expand...

The noise would drive me crazy at night. I'd never sleep.

jl

me too

I had a Rule automatic pump in the keel, the type that turns on every 2 mins and if no water is present shuts off after a couple seconds. My experience is they are junk, had 2 neither lasted longer than a couple of months. Google the reviews on them and you'll see what I mean, they are warranted but I don't want to replace my bilge pump every couple of months even if they are free. I went to the Rule without the auto-sence switch it's been in for over 4 years with no problem.

Forkliftt said:

Parks, what is this magic water sensor you speak of? Similar to the Water Witch I'm guessing??


1983 Present 42 Sundeck
Twin Lehman 135's

Click to expand...

think he said it was a flux capacitor?

Angus, I think you were the only one to catch the Flux Gate Capacitor reference.

Forklift,
This is what Jabsco actually says about it.

"The Rule Mate series of Bilge pumps feature a solid state water
sensing technology that eliminates the need for a separate
float switch.

When water enters the bilge and reaches a certain height (2-3/4 inches) a
sensor turns the pump on. After the water is pumped out, another sensor
shuts the pump off.
The sensor’s unique “field effect” technology will only recognize water. If
a 100% concentration of oil is detected the pump will not activate. This is
not a zero discharge prevention system."

I have no idea what field effect technology is, there for it must be a Flux Gate Capacitor.

Whale and Johnson also make pumps that use field effect to turn them on and off.

The Water Witch switch does not use field effect. It uses two contacts and the conductivity of water to turn the pump on.