What boats actually SOLD for

soldboats.com lists the actual sales data for all boats listed on yachtworld.com

it costs me about $600/yr for access.

Most yacht brokers and some surveyors have access.

Find a broker that you like, is interested in helping you and has an understanding of the types of boats you like. Tucker Fallon in Ft Lauderdale might be such a guy- www.yachtbrokerguy.com. He is an active member of this forum.

As the buyer there is no downside to working with a broker and lots of potential upsides.

Almost all brokers pay the fee and have access to the Soldboats part of Yachtworld. It is mostly accurate. Sometimes if the broker is also the new boat dealer of the same brand he will pad the price maybe 10% so discount those accordingly. Otherwise brokers put the real sales price in there when the sale closes.

David

I always thought most all surveyors were subscribers until the other day I had a seller commission a full buyers survey prior to putting his yacht on the market, so he would know the true condition of his boat, and we would have something to hand the buyer so he would too. After the survey, I quickly realized there's a HUGE difference in the quality of surveyors from the coast to Tennessee, that's for sure! Not only was it minuscule in its scope, but the value was WAYoff the market. I asked the surveyor where he garnered his value, and he replied "I used the survey I did in 2011, and just subtracted some money off for time". I asked where did you get your value in 2011? "I looked at boats for sale on Yachtworld and added money for freshwater". Wow. I sent him comps from Soldboats.com to show him he was over 75% off on the money even back then! And the quality of his photos were useless. No wonder damaged boats from the coast are taken inland to be sold!
Make sure any surveyor you hire subscribes to soldboats.com.
This was money wasted.

Soldboats.com does have some value. However, where do you think those sold prices come from? The listing broker can put ANY price he wants on there. So, let's say the buyer 'steals' the boat. Does it do the listing broker any good to have that price reported? No. To the contrary. My educated guess is that if you subtract 10-20% from the average reported sale prices, you will be much closer to actual prices...

In theory and by contractual agreement that one can lose their membership for fraud, a surveyor (hoping that the surveyor who did the survey) is supposed to report a broker for fraud. Yes, there's fraud, but we brokers know which brokerages are honest, and who is posting not only incorrect prices, but posting sales of ghost listing (never existed)in an attempt to sway the market either direction to their personal agenda. The beauty of soldboats is that we can call the selling broker up on the phone to confirm the sale, and actual condition if he didn't post comments.
Yes, brokers do post the "steal price" usually with a note of why it was a steal.
The problem for those who only use soldboats to get a market snapshot, is realizing that some of the major players don't report at all. MARINE MAX doesn't, and without a doubt sell more particular models than all brokerages combined. So what I do is call up different Sales Manager's and get recent comps. They don't report because Yachtworld went to war with them over rates for all their different offices. I quit reporting myself over Yachtworld not taking any action against offenders despite them being specifically identified. I regularly receive calls from them asking for recent values on the boats I specialize in. Brokers communicate with each other worldwide.That all said, it's better than nothing, and like I said it allows brokers and surveyors the phone numbers, specs, and photos to have a baseline for comparisons.

I bought my 1976 Gulfstar for a fairly low price and I noticed the broker never even said the boat was under contract on YW then after I bought it the ad disappeared.
Bill

I used a buying broker who was a huge help in the purchase of my boat. He helped with comps, surveyor, and transportation.

We used a broker to find and buy Lollygag. He was recommended by the broker I used to buy my first trawler. It doesn't cost you anything, he splits the commission with the selling broker. They can narrow the list and get you in the ballpark pricewise. No boats are created equal so prices vary but they can tell you if the condition is normal or worn for the area you're in and stuff like that.

Is their any value in using a blue-book value (NADA, Kelly etc..)? Looking at Yacht World asking price, and using NADA figures, price difference is big.

Would a proper survey also include current value?

Just a newbie trying to gain some insight.

degidio said:

Is their any value in using a blue-book value (NADA, Kelly etc..)? Looking at Yacht World asking price, and using NADA figures, price difference is big.

Would a proper survey also include current value?

Just a newbie trying to gain some insight.

Click to expand...

NADA values always seem very low to me. I have no idea what they're based on. Asking prices are all over the map and don't tell you the story. I've seen variations of asking price over 100%! Looking at actual asking vs selling prices for the boat I'm looking at tells a much different story but even THAT is not complete unless you have some knowledge of the boat's history and condition. My broker ran comps on the Albin 43 model I'm looking at and it was a real eye opener. He called on a few that were close and got some details on condition, etc that really helped fill in the blanks.

A proper survey should ALWAYS include estimated value.

Ken

This is my 2 cents on this subject which has worked for me in the past. I will not say it is 100% but it will put you in the ballpark on the selling price of any given vessel.

Use a buying broker is always a good idea as some has pointed out but you can also have a chat with your bank as well. In most cases the bank can give you the average selling price on a vessel in that class. As I said it is not 100% but the bank is basing their loans on market price on any given item. Houses, Cars and Vessels and so on.

You also can have a chat with an Insurance company. They have a good handle on the market price as well. As we all know they never want to over pay to repair anything.

Like anything else you can pay to much for something or sometimes you get a great deal.

Happy cruising.

H. Foster

degidio said:

Is their any value in using a blue-book value (NADA, Kelly etc..)? Looking at Yacht World asking price, and using NADA figures, price difference is big.

Would a proper survey also include current value?

Just a newbie trying to gain some insight.

Click to expand...

NO, and supposed to.

Boats are more like houses than cars when it comes to pricing. There are so many differences that you don't see when looking at sell price such as condition, upgrades, options, maintenance, electronics, engines. All those matter to a smart buyer but are hard to see when looking at sell prices for all 40' MTs.

A surveyors opinion Boat Values, a crap shoot !

Great information! Thanks

Be careful not to put TOO much weight into the comps on soldboats.com. It's hard to tell what the condition of the comps are. I suppose there are very few other tools to rely on, but we had fits with broker(s) that kept wanting to compare our (former) '86 Senator to other Senators that sold over the past few years. This broker insisted we look at the comps and that we were overpriced, but we knew (as did he) that our boat was in FAR FAR FAR better shape than any of the comps he listed. Moreover, some of the comp boats were still on the market from when we first purchased over 4 1/2 years ago. Soldboats.com can't filter boats in the the same condition as other boats, just by the usual year, make, model, size, hull, engines, etc...

This broker is notorious for getting the listing and then pressuring sellers to lower their price if it doesn't sell in 30 days. The irony (if that's the right use for the term) is that the same broker sold us the boat and helped us a lot through our first years of ownership. He saw almost all the upgrades we did and when he had a potential buyer, our boat had value, however, when WE approached him to list the boat, he actually turned down our listing because he said he couldn't sell it for what we were asking. What a tool...

It was damn frustrating. Lucily, forum member DaddyO took the time to come look at the boat and agreed that we were very much in the ballpark with price.

In the end, we did a FSBO with DaddyO's help and got exactly what we wanted and what it was worth. The moral is, rely on more that one value guide and find a broker that isn't a dickface. :lol:

TomB, Every owner thinks his boat is worth more than it is. You may very well be the exception that proves the rule.

boatpoker said:

TomB, Every owner thinks his boat is worth more than it is. You may very well be the exception that proves the rule.

Click to expand...

That is true, but in this case, we really did price the boat at it's expected market value for its condition and NOT based on comps of the same year/make/model boats listed at soldboats.com. The only exception is that we did do what everyone does and that was to price a little higher to account for negotiating room and broker fees. Which, since we didn't technically HAVE a listing or buyer's broker for this potential buyer, during the first call with the buyer, we instantly knocked the 10% commission right off the top (a mistake I think, but it still worked). In the end, we compromised a little bit on price in order to make a quick sale. It was just a couple-thousand bucks in order to sell her in about than 30 days.

That's the inherent problem with comping boats. A complete crap wagon sells nearby and the pristine refit one is expected to be priced similarly. As a cash buyer comps have some value to me but much less than if financing is in the mix.

As Tom's boat proves, well priced pristine boats are snapped up quickly by educated and astute buyers while over priced garbage decomposes in a pricy marina slip.