1974 Gulfstar

After a lot of questions and looking I have temporarily (anything can change) decided that I am looking for either a Cape Dory trawler / downeast, Nausset, or Gulfstar. I origially wanted a single diesel. I have found a 36 ft Gulfstar that so far looks possible. It has twin 85 hp perkins engines. Question: are all Gufstars twin engine. I would not have a probelm with twin engines as long as there is good access for maintenance and repair work. Anyone have any thoughts regarding this. Do all Gulfstars have twin engines. Are the props protected? Any other issues typical with gulfstars? The owner claims a cruise of 10 to 12 knots and a burn of 8.5 gal per hour at 80% power and 2000 RPMs. This does not seem right. First 80% power would be about 136 hp. I believe a rule of thumb is a burn of 1 gal per hour for every 20 hp. This would equate to 6.8 gal per hour. The water line is 31 ft. I would think ths would equate to a hull speed of 7.46 knots. My bet is the boat is trying to plane at 10 knots or so. Probably at 7 knots and 1300 to 1500 RPM would burn 5 gal per hour. Anyone have any comments to add?

Ken

There's a marina by me that there is a 44 gulf star, we know the guy. I'm not sure of his engine size, but he makes and headway of 5.5 knots, not sure if that's full power or cruising. He also had oversized fin stabilizers put on because the boat is so slow regular stabilizers for his size range wouldn't work, so stabilizers are a definite on a boat like the gulf star 36, due to their bathtub style hull. Here's a picture of an 36 I found on the Internet.

I had a 1973 Gulfstar 36 for 8 years and cruised it extensively, the new owner, John Nall, is on the forum pretty regularly as well. Here is first hand knowledge from someone who isn't trying to sell you a boat.

1. Twins vs. Singles. I think most but not all gulfstars were twins. I don't want to start a VERY beat to death debate, but I think it is a better boat with twins. The 4-236 perkins is a very economical engine and parts aren't too expensive for the most part. No real advantage to a single here other than slightly better access to the outsides of the motors, which is doable on the 36. The stb motor has a door that opens to the aft end through the aft cabin. pretty good access there. The port impeller and starter are a little tough to reach. The stb alternator is tough to change.

The boat is VERY maneuverable with twins. There were many, many times I was glad I had them. None when I wished for a single.

2. At 7.5 to 8 knots you will urn 3.25 gallons per hour. This is the sweet spot, about 1750 to 1850 rpms. Faster than that yu just burn more fuel. The boat MAY do 10 knots, but I doubt it. Not 12 for sure.

On the other hand, Gulfstars are no slower than any other trawler. I used to cruise with a KK39, we were consistently faster than they were. It's an efficient, slippery hull. Rolls though. More than a hard chine boat, but not to the extreme as was quoted to you above. I've never seen a 36 with stabilizers. I can't imagine where you would put them.

"so stabilizers are a definite on a boat like the gulf star 36, due to their bathtub style hull."

"It's an efficient, slippery hull. Rolls though."

Yes that almost round bottom (like a sailboat hull) IS the most efficient at low displacement speeds.

Sure it will roll, but what is important is the QUALITY of the roll.

A rounded bottomed boat will check the roll slowly and will not become a Vomit Comet like a boat with harder chines.

It is the accelerations and reversals that get folks puking , the mild roll has the lowest accelerations.

$25K "stabelizers" for less roll, perhaps on s semi plaining boat, hardly needed on a hull better design for displacement cruising..

There are a few singles out there but not many. I have the 36 with the 4.236 option and I doubt your man is seeing 12 knots. Maybe riding on a 4 knot ebb! There is a roll but I can tell you it passes with my wife but still makes my dog barf, but he is a dog ;-)

The runing gear us protected by the full keel as shown above.

Ok, after looking at a Gulfstar, the MkI I decided I wanted a MKII since I would like a little deck space other than the flybridge. I found a MkII but is has 62HP perkins instead of the 85. Any comments? Will speed be considerably less? Will cruise RPM be higher? What about fuel consumption at cruise? Also, no stabalizing sail. I am told the sail works very well. From what I can see this boat does not have it. Was it an option? Did the MK II just not have them? Will the handling be significantly changed?

Ken

"62HP perkins instead of the 85."

You are lucky as the smaller engine will last longer and have lower fuel consumption at the same cruise speed.The cruise RPM will be comfortable as 2 -2 1/2 GPH is all that's required, 30-40HP. 6K cruise

Top speed , running at full throttle , may be 1/2K less , but for most that is .01% of the vessel operation.

OK sounds good FF regarding the engines. Another question regarding these boats. I notice there is not an opening front window. This is probably good since less chance of leakage but what about ventilation. I know most poeple wil be operating from the flybridge in hot clear weather but what about passenges not wanting or able to get onto the flybridge. The boat I am looing at does not have AC, which I do not want, but will the cabin area be terribly hot? On Mk II one door and side windows do open, is that enough? I quess I am asking what the comfort level is in hot weather for passengers in th cabin?

kpinnn said:

The boat I am looing at does not have AC, which I do not want, but will the cabin area be terribly hot? On Mk II one door and side windows do open, is that enough? I quess I am asking what the comfort level is in hot weather for passengers in th cabin?

Click to expand...

I don't have AC and the cabin is as hot as it is outside as would be expected. We use fans and leave hatches and windows open just like we do at home when it's hot.

Yes, I guess the question regarding heat should have been rephrased. Certainly without air the temp of the air in and out will be the same with some reduction due to being out of the sun. In out cruiser, we open the hatches and being on a mooting it swings into the wind. The breeze through the forward birth and cabin very comfortable even on the hottest days. While moving teh front window opens and again airflow creates a very comfortable condition. The Gulfstars I have looked at do not have opening front windows and therefore I question airflow through the salon.

The raised deck will make the aft stateroom seem much larger but you gain one more height down to your swim platform. Around here I have never seen a steadying sail rigged. We get plenty of air from the forward hatch, and ports but around here sometimes the A/C is a must. I don’t know where you are but if your south of the Mason Dixon line A/C is nice.

kpinnn said:

Ok, after looking at a Gulfstar, the MkI I decided I wanted a MKII since I would like a little deck space other than the flybridge. I found a MkII but is has 62HP perkins instead of the 85. Any comments? Will speed be considerably less? Will cruise RPM be higher? What about fuel consumption at cruise? Also, no stabalizing sail. I am told the sail works very well. From what I can see this boat does not have it. Was it an option? Did the MK II just not have them? Will the handling be significantly changed?

Ken

Click to expand...

Also depends on how well your engine room is insulated. If it is all falling down it will transfer heat through the deck into the salon. we have fairly good insulation and after a day of motoring there is no perceivable heat from the deck.

kpinnn said:

Yes, I guess the question regarding heat should have been rephrased. Certainly without air the temp of the air in and out will be the same with some reduction due to being out of the sun. In out cruiser, we open the hatches and being on a mooting it swings into the wind. The breeze through the forward birth and cabin very comfortable even on the hottest days. While moving teh front window opens and again airflow creates a very comfortable condition. The Gulfstars I have looked at do not have opening front windows and therefore I question airflow through the salon.

Click to expand...

I looked at a Nausset 28 and you cant beat the engine access on that boat! I was told the Nausset is a cape dory 30 hull. Leon

A sun cover that is easy to rig is more important than a fwd opening bridge window.

I have a 43ft 1973 Mark 1 trawler, it has the twin Perkins 654's. We cruise at 1700 rpms, which yields 8-9 kts and burns about 2.5 gallons/hour. Full throttle, I don't remember the rpm, I think around 2100, got us going at 12 kts.

Ok, Just looked at a Gulfstar MK II 36 ft. Looked at Mk II after the M I because the MK I lacks and aft deck space other than the flybridge. Came up with other questions regarding the use of a MK II First and foremost, how do you board the boat from the swim platform. We are usually on a mooring or anchored. From a dingy you board from swim platform. This is fine except there isn't a ladder that goes to the aft deck from the platform. Second no opening in the rail surrounding the aft deck. Yes I can probably climb up and over but some people can't and how about when loading supplies? The other issue was the feeling of being unsafe when on the aft deck due to lack of solid gunnel around the deck. I believe this feeling could be eliminated by attacking some canvas to the rails around the deck. The loading issue is by far the most daunting issue. I can't believe there isn't a good solution. Any thoughts would be appreciated.

Ken

We have one, I imagine the PO had it removed. You can always buy a boarding ladder that you can hang over the port or stbd side.

kpinnn said:

Ok, Just looked at a Gulfstar MK II 36 ft. Looked at Mk II after the M I because the MK I lacks and aft deck space other than the flybridge. Came up with other questions regarding the use of a MK II First and foremost, how do you board the boat from the swim platform. We are usually on a mooring or anchored. From a dingy you board from swim platform. This is fine except there isn't a ladder that goes to the aft deck from the platform. Second no opening in the rail surrounding the aft deck. Yes I can probably climb up and over but some people can't and how about when loading supplies? The other issue was the feeling of being unsafe when on the aft deck due to lack of solid gunnel around the deck. I believe this feeling could be eliminated by attacking some canvas to the rails around the deck. The loading issue is by far the most daunting issue. I can't believe there isn't a good solution. Any thoughts would be appreciated.

Ken

Click to expand...

My soon to be 1976 Mark II has a boarding ladder from the swim platform to the aft deck as well.
Billylll

My MKII has the ladder but no swim step. canvas on the rails really helps.

I believe the 62 hp engines are 4-154s. I have them, good engines but finding parts is a bear. I don't know why as other perkins (4-108 & 4-236) seem to have good parts availability. Maybe they just didn't make many of the 4-154s?

I think the A4-236's were used in tractors for decades as well as large generators and pumps.
Bill

Billylll said:

I think the A4-236's were used in tractors for decades as well as large generators and pumps.
Bill

Click to expand...

And forklifts!!! They were used in the Clark and Caterpillar machines in diesel and gas/LP versions in the 80's.


1983 Present 42 Sundeck
Lehman 135 Twins

On The Rocks said:

My MKII has the ladder but no swim step.View attachment 29265 canvas on the rails really helps.

Click to expand...

Perhaps your Gulfstar might have an advantage if following seas without the swim platform. Mine has a swim platform but I haven't had a chance to sea trial her yet. That's happening tomorrow.
Bill

On The Rocks said:

I believe the 62 hp engines are 4-154s. I have them, good engines but finding parts is a bear. I don't know why as other perkins (4-108 & 4-236) seem to have good parts availability. Maybe they just didn't make many of the 4-154s?

Click to expand...

Well it turns out I learn something new everyday! My 36 Mark II manufactured and titled as a 1976 also has the 4-154 engines or the 62 hp version Perkins mains. The sea trial was yesterday and everything with the exception of the generator passed with flying colors for an almost 40 year old boat. Maximum speed with only 50 gallons of diesel not (250) was 9knots at 3200 rpms. That's 200 off the 3000 rpms they are rated for. We had no smoke, temperatures were good as we measured them at various points on both engines with a thermal heat gun. They started after 4 years of sitting on the 1st crank. I did have the impellers, oil, oil filters and fuel filters replaced prior to launch for sea trial. I installed 2 new 4D batteries and a new generator battery. In addition I had the tank professionally cleaned and the old diesel fuel evacuated. It appears over the last 2 years of a 4 year lay up the owners had installed 2 new starters, 2 alternator rebuilds, new raw water pumps installed as well as the impellers. How would I know this? The spares were left hidden in a compartment on the boat and I found the receipts for the work. I actually have the original factory delivery and acceptance sheet as well as the warranty information for the engines as well as every sub system on the vessel. It's pretty cool to read the literature as well as the original Perkins manual and warranty information.
New canvas and window covers were made over this past winter, that and a dingy crane are part of the sale.
The Westerbeke generator appears to have a fuel or governor issue and this will be repaired prior to me purchasing the vessel. Closing will be no later than Saturday of the upcoming week.
I feel I'm practically stealing the boat for what I offered and what was accepted.
Bill

On The Rocks said:

I believe the 62 hp engines are 4-154s. I have them, good engines but finding parts is a bear. I don't know why as other perkins (4-108 & 4-236) seem to have good parts availability. Maybe they just didn't make many of the 4-154s?

Click to expand...

Trans Atlantic Diesel carries parts for the 4-154 Mazda Perkins motor. These are quite popular in Australia in pickup trucks. I originally thought my boat had 4-236m's but not so. I'm quite happy with the performance of the 4.154M's.
Bill

I purcahsed the 36 Gulfstar Mark II complete with the 4-154 engines. The generator turned out to have a bad oil pressure sender unit. It also runs great. The generator is a newer model installed 6 to 8 years ago. So far so good I'm having the marina do some work on her. It should be re-splashed this coming weekend.
Bill

Sounds like you have a good boat there Billy. Those Perkins 4-154 engines are a good match for that hull. Show us some pics when you get her in the water!