Replace Salon AC Marine Air

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Bsterk

Bsterk

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 21, 2014
Messages
38
Location
USA
Vessel Make
Mainship 34t
My salon ac fan motor died on me. I had an ac tech (non marine, friend in the HVAC business) check it out and he determined the motor needs to be replaced ( it definitely wasn't blowing, condenser was running, he ruled out capacitor). I called Dometic supplier down here and got a price of $620 for a new blower (parts only). This seems really high (unit is a marine air 7000btu model VCD7k/2) considering an entirely new marine air 7k unit is only $1200. Question is how difficult is replacing an entire unit and is it worth the extra money to replace a 6yr old system.
 
I'd be inclined to just replace the blower. A/C units can last a very long time if properly maintained.

If you can give me the exact part number of the blower you need I might be able to get it for you at a better price.
 
Pull the blower off to get the specs and then go to amazon for a replacement. Probably 100 to 125 bucks for the same unit dometic rebadges on their units.


Via iPad using Trawler Forum
 
>Probably 100 to 125 bucks for the same unit dometic rebadges on their units.<

NO ONE builds much of anything , almost every part is purchased and then stuck on a chassis by the item creator.

When purchasing stuff like an air cond what you are paying for is the QUALITY of the parts purchased to assemble. And the skill in assembly , mostly with an eye to later service.

Why are gensets and air cond painted ? To cover all the labels so you will need the factory as a parts source instead of elsewhere 50% 75% cheaper.
 
Thanks for the help all. I will be at the boat today to pull the part number off the blower. Getting that down to a reasonable price makes it an easy decision.
 
If it is just the motor, see what an electric motor shop can do with it. Might be a $100 rebuild, or less.
 
Bsterk said:
My salon ac fan motor died on me. I had an ac tech (non marine, friend in the HVAC business) check it out and he determined the motor needs to be replaced ( it definitely wasn't blowing, condenser was running, he ruled out capacitor).
Click to expand...

The blower motor uses its own capacitor as does the compressor. They are independent units. Check again.

I called Dometic supplier down here and got a price of $620 for a new blower (parts only). This seems really high...
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Try calling or checking the websites for Mabru or Ed Helms in Fort Lauderdale, they may have the blower assembly for about half the list price from Dometic.

If nothing else, though this unit may be the exception, I have never seen a blower assembly made so that the motor could not be removed and replaced by itself. If the motor is really dead, the blower is easily removed. If you can get the motor out take it to Grainger and if they don't have a replacement in stock they can get it in a day or two for very little money.
 
Great idea Rick, I am going to be on the boat this afternoon, I already have the blower removed, I will play with it and see if I can pull the motor from it then find a replacement electric motor (or bring in for a rebuild as Cal suggested). I will also try the suppliers you mentioned to get a price.
 
I just looked up that unit and if I got the right book, it doesn't use a capacitor for start or run on the blower motor.

Is this your unit?

http://www.mabrumarine.com/admin/upload/pic/vector_troubleshoot_owner_manual.pdf

If it is then read page 12. Did your a/c guy read the manual while troubleshooting the thing? If you feel comfortable doing it, supply the fan motor with the proper flavor of electricity and see if it runs on its own. If not then it may be the reason suggested on page 12 of the manual.

Fault: Fan is not running but the
compressor is.
Possible Reason/Correction
1. Failed triac on Passport I/O circuit board.
Send for repair or call local service technician (see
back of book for a listing).
 
That looks like it Rick. Thanks for the resource. I hope it is not the circuit board, I assume that is a proprietary item that will not be cheap to repair/replace. The fan was difficult to turn, hopefully it means bad bearings or something similar that can easily be mechanically repaired. I will try to power the fan directly to rule out the I/O circuit board. I remember seeing a thread on here about someone noticing a burned spot on their board. I did not open mine up to look at it, I can also take a look and see if there are any issues that jump out at me.
 
OK, glad to help with information.

If the fan is hard to turn it certainly does point to a mechanical issue. See if you can take it apart, there might be something rubbing in the housing. Those little motors usually use bushings, try a bit of oil on it, there should be a little hole at each end to put a drop in. Sometimes they get gummed up and a bit of lube will restore them for quite a while.

It is possible that the motor not turning has overloaded and burned up the triac and if that is the case there may be a discolaration around it. The cost of a triac is only a buck or so but the technician time to replace it is obscene ... not much board level work is done these days because parts are cheap and good techs are expensive. If you are adventerous and want to have a go, there is probably someone local who you can get to help replace it. It takes a bit of specialized desoldering and soldering technique but it might pay you very well ... the other option is to buy the board and get on with boating.
 
Have we determined if it's the blower or the TRIAC?
Bill
 
RickB said:
And you would probably find out that the motor can be replaced for less than that.

DAYTON HVAC Motor,1/30 HP,1550 rpm,115V,3.3 - 3.3 Inch Diameter Motors - 3M557|3M557 - Grainger Industrial Supply

Just for grins call your local electric motor shop and ask about rewinding or replacing bushings in a 1/20 HP motor.
Click to expand...

Didn't want to set expectations to low, you never really know what someone else's reality is; actually I have had little motors like that redone like new for 25 bucks here in NC; takes the guy about 15 minutes.

Your advice about checking it with direct power first, given the good chance the relay is bad, is right on, by the way. I made the assumption someone would do that, but making assumptions is dangerous.
 
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I am surprised but glad to hear there are still shops that will do that, I didn't think there were any left that would touch a little split phase or "shady pole" motor these days.

Way back when motors were made of wood and stone I had an uncle who owned a motor rewind shop and would work for him in the summer burning out fields and rewinding motors. It was common to rewind even fractional hp motors then but it quickly became too expensive for most users. It was cheaper to replace than rebuild. The replacements were much lighter, less copper, and tighter design so that the only rewinds were larger motors.

I remember hundreds of wooden coil forms and spools of magnet wire. It was kind of fun really and the first time you saw your own rewind run was very cool.

Used to ream a lot of little bushings on motors like the one we are talking about since everyone had a dozen or so in fans back then. One of the local hardware stores here sells sintered bronze bushings so it can still be done. Not sure it is worth buying a line reamer for a one-off job though.
 
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RickB said:
I am surprised but glad to hear there are still shops that will do that, I didn't think there were any left that would touch a little split phase or "shady pole" motor these days.

Way back when motors were made of wood and stone I had an uncle who owned a motor rewind shop and would work for him in the summer burning out fields and rewinding motors. It was common to rewind even fractional hp motors then but it quickly became too expensive for most users. It was cheaper to replace than rebuild. The replacements were much lighter, less copper, and tighter design so that the only rewinds were larger motors.

I remember hundreds of wooden coil forms and spools of magnet wire. It was kind of fun really and the first time you saw your own rewind run was very cool.

Used to ream a lot of little bushings on motors like the one we are talking about since everyone had a dozen or so in fans back then. One of the local hardware stores here sells sintered bronze bushings so it can still be done. Not sure it is worth buying a line reamer for a one-off job though.
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I had mine rebuilt here in Jupiter foo 100.00 take it to any body that rebuilds electric motors
 
Just to update, I pulled the blower out, wired it to ac power, and determined it is a bad motor. Working on finding a shop that can rebuild (I did a search online for a replacement motor, but this seems to be a little used EBM motor that I can not find by itself). Once I got it out I also realized that this was not the same AC unit as in my other on board, this one is bigger, but the blower assembly is cheaper to replace (got a price if $340 vs the $620 I was quoted for the smaller marine air unit). Worst case now is replace the whole blower for 340, much more palatable than 620, but 100 sounds better still.

Capt. Jerry, do you have the info of the motor shop in Jupiter? I have in laws there that I see regularly and I have to travel to west palm frequently for work. If I have not found somewhere up here by my next trip, maybe I will take it down there.
 
Bsterk said:
Just to update, I pulled the blower out, wired it to ac power, and determined it is a bad motor. Working on finding a shop that can rebuild (I did a search online for a replacement motor, but this seems to be a little used EBM motor that I can not find by itself). Once I got it out I also realized that this was not the same AC unit as in my other on board, this one is bigger, but the blower assembly is cheaper to replace (got a price if $340 vs the $620 I was quoted for the smaller marine air unit). Worst case now is replace the whole blower for 340, much more palatable than 620, but 100 sounds better still.

Capt. Jerry, do you have the info of the motor shop in Jupiter? I have in laws there that I see regularly and I have to travel to west palm frequently for work. If I have not found somewhere up here by my next trip, maybe I will take it down there.
Click to expand...
it is Jupiter pump and motor repair on old dixie
 
Northern Spy said:
What is the model number of your fan motor?
Click to expand...


This is the best I can do for a model number (motor is at my office, I can get any illegible numbers from the photo in the am).

ImageUploadedByTrawler Forum1402619379.694505.jpg

I called a couple of shops around here and they all say they don't repair motors that small, just replace them. I've tried to explain it's not the usual 1/4 horse fan motor, but it's outside of the norm for most if these guys so it's not worth their time to investigate a resolution. I do have one guy that will look at it, going to try to get it to him tomorrow.
 
You might be better off to buy that $340 unit and be done with it. It appears that that EBM-Pabst unit may be a special run assembly made for the a/c builder that is not available as just the motor itself. It is a a unitized blower/motor.

That is not to say you can't find a domestic blower that will run on the same voltage and provide the same air flow. It is just a blower after all. See what Grainger has in the same size. You might have to wire it to run all the time or with the circ pump or something.
 
I got the numbers OK. But it is an odd fan. Tried all of the typical industrial channels to no avail.

Google found one in Sweden...
 
Yep, that $340 blower is looking better and better. Still hoping the local shop will be willing to refurb though. Find out tomorrow, if not, off to the marine air distributor for the complete blower assembly.
 
Agree, that doesn't look like a promising candidate. Maybe the motor shop will have a substitute.
 
Took it to a motor guy yesterday, no dice (though he found it a very interesting motor). Ordered the marine air blower, should have it installed next week.
 
How did you remove the floor to get at the AC unit? My salon AC needs to come out.
 
Sorry RC, I missed your post. I assume you already figured out your floor, but in my case there is a grate under the salon sofa. I was only pulling out the blower, but it looked like the entire unit would have fit out of the opening.
 
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