Hose Clamps directions

I'm in a dispute and need some back-up, or to eat crow.

Under the waterline all hoses have two hose clamps. I was taught and always put one on in one direction, and the other, the opposite way around. I don't know why except Daddy did it that way on our boat.

Yesterday afternoon I was told that as long as two where there, they didn't have to be on in opposite directions. "It's the same" and I'm being too particular. Well, that's not the exact word used, but you get my drift.

On your boat, below the waterline or where ever you have two hose clamps side by side, are they run in the same direction or not?

[And should I eat crow, or can you provide me with a why you do it my way -- which I happen to think is correct!]
Thanks.

Normally I put them on in opposite directions. I have no reasoning for doing that other than gut feel from my engineering background.
However when the situation is that I cannot easily get access to the screw in the opposite direction I put them in the same direction.
I have never experienced a failure that I can attribute to directional installation. (only to inadequate tightness, clamping on a piece of copper tube that has no barb, etc)

Don't think it makes a bit of difference.

The purpose of the second clamp is to keep the joint together should the other one fail. The joint is fine with one. But...

I put them on staggered as the clamping is not completely uniform around the circumference due to the bump of the screw part. Stagger them and it probably has a bit of a better seal. Splitting hairs there, though.

Janice,

Funny you asked this question. I recently looked it up myself and learned that it indeed doesn't make a difference--us trawler owners are a particular lot! I am more concerned about accessibility. I also have several barbs under the waterline of my boat that will not permit two clamps. As I recall, ABYC only requires two clamps on the exhaust.

I think Ski has it right. On the old serrated, screw clamps, the hose could bunch under the clamp, hence a bit of unequal pressure. Offset clamps even it up.

Of course I am making this up as I type, but feel free to use it to avoid eating crow!

Whoops-not really "serrated", just the old clamps rather than the smooth ones.

Well, rats. Crow it is.

Thanks all the same. I was wrong. Life is long so it surely won't be the last time I'm mistaken.

Janice I think your DaDa was right but it is probably fly stuff most of the time and perhaps always.

It is something I do. Started doing it on my ultralight aircraft fuel lines to reduce the chance of sucking air in the two paces where, depending on the type of hose used where the hose can pucker up under the flat part of the clamp.
Clamps that employ two wires don't have the flat spots but can't be clamped as tight. One should have a hose that fits well and if so shouldn't require much clamping pressure. There are other types of clamps that don't have the flat spot.

To gain any benefit from clocking the clamps 180 they should be very close together.

janice142 said:

Well, rats. Crow it is.

Thanks all the same. I was wrong. Life is long so it surely won't be the last time I'm mistaken.

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I don't think you are wrong just maybe splitting hairs.

I think Ski has it right...especially on smaller sizes and some clam types...the flat spot is obvious when you remove the clamp and it is no longer round.

I also agree that some barbs are too short for double clamping and if not "pressurized" I say phooey. I have come across so many hoses that the clamps were never tightened, or the screw or band has failed, etc...and the hose is environmentally welded to the hose bard and took superhuman strength and tactics to get it off anyway.

I have also started to agree with and I'm not positive it was boatpoker or not who thinks using reinforced vinyl hose in smaller applications instead of wire reinforced rubber wet exhaust hose is OK. Too many times have I seen the rubber hoses rotten and wire rusted and able to twist and break off while the vinyl hose while hardened is still tenaciously doing it's job.

I'm not sure where ABYC and many other get their ideas as to what is safe...but many don't seem to follow real world examples.

psneeld said:

I have also started to agree with and I'm not positive it was boatpoker or not who thinks using reinforced vinyl hose in smaller applications instead of wire reinforced rubber wet exhaust hose is OK. Too many times have I seen the rubber hoses rotten and wire rusted and able to twist and break off while the vinyl hose while hardened is still tenaciously doing it's job.

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I agree with you about using the heavy duty vinyl "wire" reinforced hose in many cases where others would use the rubber reinforced version.

As to the clamp position question, the only time it may matter as to which way you put two clamps on is in some cases the barb is a bit short and if you stagger the clamps you can get them a bit closer together and there by get the clamps further up on the hose barb.

Capt.Bill11 said:

I agree with you about using the heavy duty vinyl "wire" reinforced hose in many cases where others would use the rubber reinforced version.

As to the clamp position question, the only time it may matter as to which way you put two clamps on is in some cases the barb is a bit short and if you stagger the clamps you can get them a bit closer together and there by get the clamps further up on the hose barb.

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I was actually referencing and thinking thread reinforced vinyl....the wire rusts and seems to hasten the demise of the hose as the weak spots are right along the rusty wire.

psneeld said:

I was actually referencing and thinking thread reinforced vinyl....the wire rusts and seems to hasten the demise of the hose as the weak spots are right along the rusty wire.

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I was talking about the reinforced vinyl hose that has the plastic "wire" in it. Like sanitation hose or Tiger Flex. I would never use the vinyl hose with just the thread in it to replace rubber wire reinforced hose. The thread embedded style is way to likely to collapse or kink over time. Especially in a hot engine room environment.

In fact I don't use the thread reinforced hose for much of anything if I can help it. There are to many better alternatives.

I have to agree that it likely doesn't make a difference but for us anal people it makes us feel better.

The most satisfying way is to listen to what your own OCD tells you to do and stick with that.

Then go around and try to convert everyone to your way of doing it.

Just know that if you do them the opposite way like Janice does, your boat will sink at the dock while unattended and your insurer won't cover it.

Capt.Bill11 said:

I was talking about the reinforced vinyl hose that has the plastic "wire" in it. Like sanitation hose or Tiger Flex. I would never use the vinyl hose with just the thread in it to replace rubber wire reinforced hose. The thread embedded style is way to likely to collapse or kink over time. Especially in a hot engine room environment.

In fact I don't use the thread reinforced hose for much of anything if I can help it. There are to many better alternatives.

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Mine have outlasted the rubber wire reinforced hose on every boat I have has.

They only kink if you place a significant bend in them....and yes for certain applications with a lot of suction...then they may collapse, especially as they get very warm.

In truly hot places I would be less inclined to use them...just haven't encountered that yet on any boat I have owned and only a few I have run.

I would have to say in my experience the "better" or "recommended" hoses have done just the opposite in terms of long life and security.

psneeld said:

I would have to say in my experience the "better" or "recommended" hoses have done just the opposite in terms of long life and security.

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Well as they say, YMMV.

My builder put them in opposite directions.

To bad your builder didn't see fit to use better clamps. Personally I would change them out if I was going to be owning the boat for any length of time.

The clamps' screws should be at least 120 degrees apart. 180 is fine. The workings of the clamps is the same regardless of the orientation.

The thing to keep in mind is that when one goes to work on them it is way easier to get the job done when they can both be worked on from the same positioning of your body. In other words align everything so access when in service is easy.

Mark are those clamps round ends that use just a screwdriver? It looks like they are the kind that keeps the blade captured to prevent slipping, which is okay, but I really greatly prefer the kind that can be adjusted with a 5/16" nut driver. Any size of nut driver prefered, but it so nice to know what tool to grab for any hose clamp job. I have made it a point to get replacements that are 5/16" driven. I also really like the tee handled torque nut drivers plumbers use. Getting those clamps to be not too tight or too loose is much simpler with one. And the price is right because they can be obtained from the plumbing dept of the big box store - where they don't say marine.

What? Me worry? Particularly about screw slots? ... I don't worry about a rock hitting me from outer space.

Sample of thru-hulls:

The Home Cheapo clamps with round heads are frequently >SS< but not marine grade.

A half a decade in a bilge and there mostly gone , the usual savoir is most hoses weld to the fitting in time.

The installed direction doesnt matter , but the QUALITY of the material and construction IS a BIG DEAL.

Sorta like a fantastic anchor hooked up with an Asian no rating shakle.

FF in my comments (if that is what you are commenting on) it is that the torque tee handled nut drivers are available there, not the clamps.

I have been systematically shifting to T-bolt clamps.

Capt.Bill11 said:

To bad your builder didn't see fit to use better clamps. Personally I would change them out if I was going to be owning the boat for any length of time.

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And on fuel lines no less, not good. Should ideally have fittings like on the other four connections on that manifold. Wonder why they did it that way. The inner calmps on two of those hoses have already eaten halfway into the hose, either someone over tightend badly, or whatever is being used as a barb is too small for the hose. That's what it looks like from here.

T-bolt clamps are great for the way they work. But a nut driver doesn't work on them. And the size range is tighter, so more spares are needed. A deepwell socket (or sockets depending on the clamp sizes) is more than I want to deal with when the time frame is determined by circumstances beyond my control. My goal is to have as little variety to deal with as practical on the boat. The time available and conditions I might need to work in carry more weight on the boat. In an industrial use I would likely choose the t-bolts.

Oetiker clamps are likely the "best clamps" for hoses, but too size specific and not reusable, so not boat wise.

Good compromises make great boats.

How many systems, including cars, tractors, jet skis, snowmobiles, etc...etc...have you seen recently with just wire ties substituting hose clamps?

I've seen plenty and tend to agree...ABYC and a boatload of other people need to get a grip as to what works and doesn't.

2 different boats can have completely different leads and stresses on hoses serving the same function.

it's not the function that determines what is safe...it's the system and stresses involved that does.

This is one area I strongly disagree with "experts" because their "one size fits all" mentality suggests their "laziness" to seek realistic safety /risk management protocols.

Interesting read. True? Can't tell as ABYC wants your money to look at the standards.

Hose Clamps, Surveyors, and the ABYC | boats.com Blog

psneeld said:

How many systems, including cars, tractors, jet skis, snowmobiles, etc...etc...have you seen recently with just wire ties substituting hose clamps?

I've seen plenty and tend to agree...ABYC and a boatload of other people need to get a grip as to what works and doesn't.

2 different boats can have completely different leads and stresses on hoses serving the same function.

it's not the function that determines what is safe...it's the system and stresses involved that does.

This is one area I strongly disagree with "experts" because their "one size fits all" mentality suggests their "laziness" to seek realistic safety /risk management protocols.

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Sure, you may see wire ties on the fuel lines of outboard motors located under the cowling, on a hose and barb type designed for just that type of situation. But I'll stick to being lazy and going for over kill with quality solid band SS hose clamps that don't cut into the fuel lines on my engines, exhaust hoses and the raw water lines that feed them and other critical systems.

Call me lazy or a foolish expert but relying on wire ties to hold fuel lines together when I'm 100+ miles offshore just doesn't give me the warm and fuzzies.

How many systems, including cars, tractors, jet skis, snowmobiles, etc...etc...have you seen recently with just wire ties substituting hose clamps?

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Last time I checked, none of those things were in a position to sink in the ocean.