How to build a network on your boat

This subject comes up frequently here on TF.

The typical question are generally

How to get internet on my boat?
How to get alarming or monitoring on my boat?
Todays subject was how to get cameras on my boat?

All of these things point to the need for a dedicated, inexpensive Local Area Network for your boat. You probably have one at home already. Why not have a network for your boat as well?

Your network at home probably uses a Linksys or similar unit that combines a Router and a Ethernet switch, and a Wifi Access point all in one. Your home network typically uses your Cable Company, or your Phone company for a internet connection. Using your home network you can connect to all of the devices in your home. Things like printers, and disk storage, and cameras, and the internet all connect through your home network.

A network for your boat works the exact same way, and can provide the same connections to equipment, and the internet as your home network. The only real difference is that you need a way to connect to the internet.

This is where your cellular company can be your friend. You probably already have a shared family data plan with your cellular company. You can add a device to your family shared data plan for a very nominal expense that will provide a high speed internet connection to your boats network.

I use At&T as my cellular provider. I went into the local AT&T store and a few minutes later I walked out with this little gizmo. It cost $19 to buy it and $10 a month to add it to my shared data plan.



There is a handy USB port on that unit (called a AT&T BEAM) that is meant to plug into a laptop, but I didn't plug mine into a laptop. I plugged it into this little device.




The unit in the photo is made by a company called cradlepoint, and the model is a MBR1200. The current online price for this unit is $249

I plugged the AT&T BEAM into the Cradlepoint MBR1200 and used the handy setup guide to program the Cradlepoint, and viola, I had a network on my boat!

The Cradlepoint MBR1200 serves the same function as the Linksys unit you probably have at home. It is a Router, a Ethernet switch, and a WIFI hot spot all in one.

I even programmed the wifi hot spot as my boats name. .

Now when I go to the boat I just use the wireless hot spot and I've got internet, blazing fast internet anywhere I get a cell signal.

Well, you ask, what did this do for me?

First I added an Apple TV to the network for $99.00. Now I can watch Hulu, or Netflix, or Itunes based movies. Cool!



Then I added a Sensaphone Web600 Alarm system to the boat for $350. Now I have alarm monitoring for high bilge water, power outages, and a host of other things!



The list goes on and on!

I for example added a Cisco IP phone (an extension off of my business phone system), now I can run my business from the boat. (one more step towards full time cruising )

Then I added a wireless printer.

I'm adding cameras next.

The possibilities are endless!

So, My hope is that this post will help remove some of the mystery from boat networks, and how to set them up.

Thanks for posting this, Kevin. Is there such a thing as a DC router? How did you power your router?

Hmmmm. Sounds like something i want on my new boat? Just curious....approx how much does your setup add to your ATT bill? How expensive is a 2 hour movie?
I don't subscribe to extras at home since I retired because we are away from home more than at home so I don't have a comparator.

Yes, the key is how much data you will chew up streaming HD movies and the like. Not something I find palatable on a cellular network. A two hour HD movie is about 3.5 - 4 Gigs; standard def around 500 megs+. Even the Sprint and T-Mobile (if they have coverage) "unlimited" plans will start throttling after a certain point.

Most modern computers will form a hot spot without the need for something like a Cradlepoint. That's what we did; we had an iMac on a desk with the cellular USB air card plugged into it and set it up to share via wifi and/or ethernet.

By the way those Sensaphone units are really nice pieces of gear.

Thank you. You have just saved my day. This is why I spend so much time surfing this forum. This is information that we hardly get for free in a specialized equipment store. By the time you know all this, you have already committed yourself to spend thousands of very rare dollars.
But, then again, a guy like Kevin comes in and demystifies all these issues with a simple and practical wording and we all know what to do.

Thank you again Kevin

Portuguese

ksanders said:

This subject comes up frequently here on TF.

The typical question are generally

How to get internet on my boat?
How to get alarming or monitoring on my boat?
Todays subject was how to get cameras on my boat?

All of these things point to the need for a dedicated, inexpensive Local Area Network for your boat. You probably have one at home already. Why not have a network for your boat as well?

Click to expand...

Very cool, thank you for the great explanation. I'd like to add cameras to Delfin but wonder whether all the steel will make propagation of the signal troublesome? I guess I'll find out.

Not wanting to highjack the thread, nor is the following any reason not to take advantage of the wonders of advanced electronics, but based on the Nova program "Secrets of the Sun", available streaming on Netflix, we are due for the kind of coronal mass ejection that renders all such technology dead as a doornail for perhaps as long as ten years. Hard to imagine, but it really is only a question of when, not if a CME similar to the one we experienced in 1859 is experienced with the result of no more electronics for a long time, nor a particularly good way to recover them anytime soon.

Dougcole said:

Thanks for posting this, Kevin. Is there such a thing as a DC router? How did you power your router?

Click to expand...

I think the Cradlepoint units are 12VDC, but that needs to be checked on. It comes with a brick power supply, so I just plugged it in.

I powered the network gear using the inverter. This might sound a bit overboard, but I also added a small UPS to power all that stuff as well. That way if the inverter dies I get an alarm before we loose communication.

Bill Ranson said:

Hmmmm. Sounds like something i want on my new boat? Just curious....approx how much does your setup add to your ATT bill? How expensive is a 2 hour movie?
I don't subscribe to extras at home since I retired because we are away from home more than at home so I don't have a comparator.

Click to expand...

I have a shared data plan so I honestly dont track it that closely. Cellular data is not cheap though. I have a 30 gig plan through my business and pay 7.50 per gig, but thats shared between several phones, ipads, and even my home internet (we live in a rural area with slow dsl).

A 2 hour movie is as caltexflanc indicated below between .5 and 3 gig. We use SD on the boat, but I suppose we could use HD as well. We use HD at home and never go over our 30 gig so it works out.

Also as caltexflanc indicated cellular companies might offer unlimited data plans but they start throttling the speeds back at some point. I'd rather get the high speeds and decide how much I want to use and pay for.

caltexflanc said:

Yes, the key is how much data you will chew up streaming HD movies and the like. Not something I find palatable on a cellular network. A two hour HD movie is about 3.5 - 4 Gigs; standard def around 500 megs+. Even the Sprint and T-Mobile (if they have coverage) "unlimited" plans will start throttling after a certain point.

Most modern computers will form a hot spot without the need for something like a Cradlepoint. That's what we did; we had an iMac on a desk with the cellular USB air card plugged into it and set it up to share via wifi and/or ethernet.

By the way those Sensaphone units are really nice pieces of gear.

Click to expand...

Yes, you can tether to your cellullar phone (or as you did your MAC) and create a hot spot and buy nothing. The challenge i found with that is that if I actually use my Iphone for a voice call, the data throughput drops dramatically. Then you run into the issue that the phone (or computer) has to be there and be on for the data to work.

Because of those limitations we chose to go with the dedicated MIFI aware router solution. Its not a free solution, but it works all the time. I love the idea that I know that if something happens on my boat while I'm away I get a text and e-mail.

Before that my boats status was a mystery. One time went to the boat and the shorepower breaker was off, my batteries were dead, all my food in the freezer was smelly mush, and if I needed my bilge pumps they would not have worked.

Thats a bad situation, and one I was not going to let happen again.

Just a FYI to everyone...

I am not married to Cradlepoint, or Sensaphone. These are just products I found to work reliably and at a reasonable price. There are other products on the market that will also work, and as technology evolves there will be even more products to choose from.

Dougcole said:

Thanks for posting this, Kevin. Is there such a thing as a DC router? How did you power your router?

Click to expand...

As mentioned above, find the model that is powered by 12V DC adapter. The one I use is wired to boat's 12V DC.

FWIW, it is Encore ENHWI-3GN3 3G Mobile Broadband Wireless N150 Router & Repeater. It can be used as a wired or wireless router/repeater with your cell based hotspot, or can accept cell based broadband stick and use it to become a cell based hotspot itself. Kind of versatile cheap gadget.

Some more info here ... might be no longer available ... just as an idea:
Amazon.com: Encore ENHWI-3GN3 3G Mobile Broadband Wireless N150 Router & Repeater: Electronics .

Kevin...did you have to purchase the 4-20ma transducers from another vendor or can you get them from Sensaphone. Looking at their website I did not see them. Intersted in monitoring the 12 volt and 120 volt systems.

Thanks

Great thread, Kevin. I'm on a similar track on my boat, but have not reached the point of having a real vessel network as you have described. Your explanation clarifies some points in my mind and confirms I'm on the right track.

I have a Cradlepoint CTR-35 router onboard. It's available for under $100 and is 12V powered. Mine is hardwired to the boat and connected via ethernet cable to a Rogue Wave Wifi extender to pull in distant free wifi. Often an area restaurant or marina will offer the wifi to customers. I've pulled in free Wifi from almost 4 miles away.

We also have a tablet and two phones that are all Wifi hotspot capable, so if there's no free internet wifi in the area, we can use our 4G/LTE data. Since our marina environment is a bit more weather-friendly, boat monitoring is not a priority for us. Besides, we don't have internet capability when we leave the boat since we take our mobile devices home with us and there's no free Wifi available at my end of the marina.

We have the Netflix App on our devices to watch streaming movies and also have a 110V/12V-powered Roku which we can connect via wifi or ethernet cable. Roku offers a wide variety of content which we have only started to sample. We have only watched one streaming movie at home over 4G to test it out and it worked fine with no buffering and cost about 1GB of data.

I have 2 hard-wired 12V ER cameras that are wired through a camera select switching panel to the HDTV via RCA inputs. Our Wifi or 4G video displays on the HDTV via HDMI.

I need to learn more about the Cradlepoint's networking capabilities to allow input from a wifi capable GoPro camera. I tend to get lost in some of the finer points of router function and setup.

jstauffer said:

Kevin...did you have to purchase the 4-20ma transducers from another vendor or can you get them from Sensaphone. Looking at their website I did not see them. Intersted in monitoring the 12 volt and 120 volt systems.

Thanks

Click to expand...

The only 4-20ma sensor I'm running is for the 12v battery. I bought it from omega engineering.

I cheaped out on the sensor for the shore power and the inverter and used 120v relays. They work, but you don't get any more information, just on or off.

I was thinking about converting to 4-20ma for those but haven't been all that excited about it.

The temp sensors I bought from sensaphone, but they are just standard 10k units.

Portuguese said:

Thank you. You have just saved my day. This is why I spend so much time surfing this forum. This is information that we hardly get for free in a specialized equipment store. By the time you know all this, you have already committed yourself to spend thousands of very rare dollars.
But, then again, a guy like Kevin comes in and demystifies all these issues with a simple and practical wording and we all know what to do.

Thank you again Kevin

Portuguese

Click to expand...

Agreed! can't thank you enough Kevin for posting this. I've spent several days trying to get an apple extreme to talk to my mifi. It's been killing me. I love the simplicity of the cradlepoint but why not make things more complicated:.
I'm in Long Beach and I have terrible cell reception on every carrier but verizon. I have an unlimited mifi card that runs on the sprint network. So i was thinking of getting the Peplink Pepwave Max On The Go. It will take several mifi cards and combine them. Creating a smart network that can choose which cell card to go with based on the criteria you set. Or it will combine the cards giving you increased bandwidth.
Anyone have any experience with the Pepwave?

OKraskin said:

Agreed! can't thank you enough Kevin for posting this. I've spent several days trying to get an apple extreme to talk to my mifi. It's been killing me. I love the simplicity of the cradlepoint but why not make things more complicated:.
I'm in Long Beach and I have terrible cell reception on every carrier but verizon. I have an unlimited mifi card that runs on the sprint network. So i was thinking of getting the Peplink Pepwave Max On The Go. It will take several mifi cards and combine them. Creating a smart network that can choose which cell card to go with based on the criteria you set. Or it will combine the cards giving you increased bandwidth.
Anyone have any experience with the Pepwave?

Click to expand...

Why are you trying to get an Apple Extreme to talk to a mifi? Does the mifi not have enough 802.11 range to reach your computer/phone/tablets?

The mifi only allows 5 or 6 devices to attach to it. So If I wanted other devices to talk to each other it was difficult. For instance I wanted an iMac to talk to an Apple TV and I was relying on my mifi as the connection. If the family was on the boat together we quickly surpassed the connections. Plus the mifi is not as fast as an apple extreme.

OKraskin said:

Agreed! can't thank you enough Kevin for posting this. I've spent several days trying to get an apple extreme to talk to my mifi. It's been killing me. I love the simplicity of the cradlepoint but why not make things more complicated:.
I'm in Long Beach and I have terrible cell reception on every carrier but verizon. I have an unlimited mifi card that runs on the sprint network. So i was thinking of getting the Peplink Pepwave Max On The Go. It will take several mifi cards and combine them. Creating a smart network that can choose which cell card to go with based on the criteria you set. Or it will combine the cards giving you increased bandwidth.
Anyone have any experience with the Pepwave?

Click to expand...

I have no experience with pepwave. I cruised their web site yesterday briefly. They appear to be a competing company to cradlepoint, globesurfer, etc...

I can tell you that the cradlepoint units can do the same thing. They can choose, prioritize, and even bandwidth share between several internet connections. For example, I have a satellite connection on the boat. If the cellular is within range, it prefers the cellular connection. If the cellular connection is down then it automatically switches over to satellite. You could do the same thing with more than one mifi device as well. Neither the pepwave, nor the cradlepoint have a monopoly on the technology. I could do it with a Cisco solution as well, just more expensive.

OKraskin said:

The mifi only allows 5 or 6 devices to attach to it. So If I wanted other devices to talk to each other it was difficult. For instance I wanted an iMac to talk to an Apple TV and I was relying on my mifi as the connection. If the family was on the boat together we quickly surpassed the connections. Plus the mifi is not as fast as an apple extreme.

Click to expand...

What you need to do to solve this is to tie the mifi into a router, then have all your devices behind the router. That way the MIFI only knows about the router.

ksanders said:

What you need to do to solve this is to tie the mifi into a router, then have all your devices behind the router. That way the MIFI only knows about the router.

Click to expand...

Yes, thanks. Was answering caltexflanc question. Was responding from my phone but it did not use the quote. This is why I was so thrilled to read your thread. Trying to connect an Apple router was a pain and the cradle point or pep wave is a much better setup.

Does the Cradlepoint allow for 2 external mifi or USB connections? Didn't see one that allows for that configuration. Just saw one USB and one ethernet input.

OKraskin said:

Yes, thanks. Was answering caltexflanc question. Was responding from my phone but it did not use the quote. This is why I was so thrilled to read your thread. Trying to connect an Apple router was a pain and the cradle point or pep wave is a much better setup.

Does the Cradlepoint allow for 2 external mifi or USB connections? Didn't see one that allows for that configuration. Just saw one USB and one ethernet input.

Click to expand...

The MBR1200 has two USB ports. I haven't tried it though, as I only have one cellular company account, and the satellite makes a great backup.

OKraskin said:

The mifi only allows 5 or 6 devices to attach to it. So If I wanted other devices to talk to each other it was difficult. For instance I wanted an iMac to talk to an Apple TV and I was relying on my mifi as the connection. If the family was on the boat together we quickly surpassed the connections. Plus the mifi is not as fast as an apple extreme.

Click to expand...

Ok, got it. Kevin is pointing you down a road that may work well for you. The internet speed of your mifi is the gating factor, the Extreme won't make that any faster.

On our boat, we found the method of simply plugging the USB cellular card into one of the computers and using the network "sharing" function to be more than adequate. We did not have or really need remote monitoring, being liveaboards; even though I was in the business (and still am to a lesser degree) of enabling cellular monitoring solutions, mostly in the energy and agricultural world. That's how I got to see Sensaphone gear in operation.

The iMac sent out a strong enough wifi signal to all parts of the boat. I once hooked up various cellular and non-cellular wireless routers via ethernet (not one of the new Extremes) and didn't see enough improvement to bother adding more complexity. I was in the business so had access to all the various cellular routers and gizmos. I thought the Cradlepoint stuff was as good as anything out there and was generally better thought out and user friendly.

Watching internet TV is not a high priority, we could save that for being at a dock or having a convenient wi fi signal; we had full premium subscription satellite TV which was more than good enough for us. When you get over to the islands, cellular broadband is still a hard to find and very expensive option, a good wifi range expander like the Wirie is more practical, but someday that will change.

I already have a Novatel Wireless Mifi2372 that I use to interface my laptop with the enternet from my boat. It is suppose to be able to handle 5 devices. Can I just use the the Mifi to remotley monitor 4 or 5 cameras without using the Cradlepoint? Do I need something like the Cradlepoint to give me more security? Does the Mifi have an IP address that I would be able to access remotely? Would the Mifi have enough range to pick up a camera in the engine room?

As you can tell by my questions this is not my forte.

Thanks

jstauffer said:

I already have a Novatel Wireless Mifi2372 that I use to interface my laptop with the enternet from my boat. It is suppose to be able to handle 5 devices. Can I just use the the Mifi to remotley monitor 4 or 5 cameras without using the Cradlepoint? Do I need something like the Cradlepoint to give me more security? Does the Mifi have an IP address that I would be able to access remotely? Would the Mifi have enough range to pick up a camera in the engine room?

As you can tell by my questions this is not my forte.

Thanks

Click to expand...

OK, first step is to determine how many devices your MIFI can handle. You can find that from the manual.

I'm also assuming this is a stand alone device that uses a cellular connection as the internet gateway and creates a wifi hotspot.

Yes, you can use it for cameras, but there is a couple of catches. One is the number of devices supported. Another is wether those devices can communicate with each other.

If you want to see the cameras when not on the boat, you NEED to buy cameras that connect and hold up that connection to a outside service. For example the D Link cameras that are "my dlink" capable do that. Using a cellular connection for cameras that you need to initiate a connection to them, generally will not work, and heres why.

Cellular providers in the US are generally not providing "routable" IP address to their mobile clients. You can check this on your cellular device by going into network settings and seeing what the actual IP address is. If the IP address starts with 10 or 192.168 or 172.16 through 172.31 then its a "non routable" IP address. That means you cannot directly access it from outside the network.

This creates a problem in that you cannot access devices from outside the boat. The same problem exists with some land based ISP's as well.

What equipment manufacturers have done to overcome this is having a "free" service that your cameras link to, then you link to that service. Mydlink is one such service. The camera establishes a connection to the service. You then establish a link to the service, and you can see your cameras image. This works because the camera is initiating the connection from within your boats network.

If your cellular company issues an "routable" IP address (not 10 or 172.16-32, or 192.168) then you can, if you know the IP address link directly to your camera, but you have to know the IP address, and it occasionally changes. So, you see the problems with that method. You can overcome them, but in my opinion its just easier to buy products (like cameras)that automatically link to the manufacturers "free" service.

Gosh, this is a complex subject that gets more and more complex the deeper you delve into it.

I have all of those devices including one of the new Pepwaves. The Pepwave is going to replace the CradlePoint unless CradlePoint does something fast. The Pepwave is only $99 and has all the latest network tinkering capabilities and capabilities onboard. I'm probably going to write something about it in a newsletter in a week or two (too many other things to write about write now). It solves a lot of problems when you want to connect multiple devices especially at a marina and provides great support for using things like iPads below deck.

A few other warnings I'd make about this stuff...

- Most MiFi's cannot be used as routers. They can put multiple devices onto the internet over a cellular connection but they don't allow the devices to communicate with either other over the local LAN. That's an important requirement for many devices today as WiFi becomes the communications network within the boat. Plugging a MiFi into a CradlePoint or Pepwave is a great solution for this issue.

- Be very careful about finding a 12v power adapter on any of these devices and just clipping the connector and wiring it into your 12v battery supply. You've got to check the input voltage specification before doing that. Most of those power adapters that plug in the wall are called "regulated" because the regulate the incoming AC voltage as it fluctuates to provide something very close to exactly 12v. Your battery bank is never at 12v unless you're in deep trouble. In most cases, it is well above 12v. When underway, it's probably near 14v because of the alternator(s) charging the bank. That can quickly blow out a 12v device not designed to handle more than 12 volts of input. I'd want to see a device specify that it can handle 11-16v or higher before messing around with wiring it to a house bank.

- Every boat should consider how they can implement a boat-wide WiFi network. Everything in electronics - speakers, TV's, cameras, weather instruments, computers - is all going WiFi but most boats don't have a LAN strategy for going forward.

- Consider security for all of this networking stuff. Turning on WPA on your local router or MiFi might not give you what you think you're getting. If you are connecting to an open WiFi network anywhere, you've got to protect yourself today. Only VPN capabilities will give you security. If you're connecting over cellular, you're mostly OK. Open WiFi is a major hole that is so easy to hack with free tools.

I see some newer modem/routers are offering a 'WiFi-as-WAN' virtual WAN port. Am I right in thinking this could be used to connect a Smartphone's Hotspot to the router and thereby make it available to all ethernet & wifi devices connected through the router? And if the physical WAN port were used to connect an IslandPC or WaveRogue or similar amplified WiFi antenna, then by selecting the right preferences on the smartphone's hotspot settings, you would have a wifi internet connection when wifi was available, with 'failback' to the cellular network when wifi dropped out. What do the tech folks think of this?

On our boat the Wave will see a phone used as a hotspot and you just tell the Wave to connect to it like you would any other WiFi source and away you go.

Made me wonder why we bothered installing a Cradlepoint.

Capt.Bill11 said:

On our boat the Wave will see a phone used as a hotspot and you just tell the Wave to connect to it like you would any other WiFi source and away you go.

Made me wonder why we bothered installing a Cradlepoint.

Click to expand...

What happens when you need to use the phone Capt.?

I think CradlePoint's served their purpose for a good number of years. It was the best of breed for a while. The world just rallied around WiFi to replace connectors and wires making a cellular/MiFi/router less valuable.

Jeffrey S said:

I think CradlePoint's served their purpose for a good number of years. It was the best of breed for a while. The world just rallied around WiFi to replace connectors and wires making a cellular/MiFi/router less valuable.

Click to expand...

As a networking professional I see the trend as the opposite.

Pick your preferred brand of hardware, but I see an increased use of cellular data as a connection medium as data rates fall, and monthly per device connect charges fall as well.

What I am seeing is companies utilizing cellular data to provide quick to deploy, inexpensive connectivity without having to go through the trouble of building out infrastructure in areas that are challenging to serve utilizing 802.11 wireless.

What I am also seeing is that companies utilizing enterprise grade networks are more and more frequently equipping their employees laptops with cellular access accounts eliminating the need for employees on the move to find a wifi hot spot to be productive.

As a boater I may not represent the current norm but I recognize the desire for always on no set up required connectivity at any place and any time. Wifi might be attractive to the most frugal of boaters, and the "old men" generation of boaters, but there is a younger generation that are starting to get into boats, and that generation does not care about the expense of cellular data.

So, while I respect your position in the boating community, and your insight, I respectfully disagree with your analysis that cellular data is on the way out and WIFI is the preferred medium. You might be in fact correct today, but that will only last as long as the current generation of boaters that did not grow up with cellular data are boating.

As younger boaters, and I see more of them every day get into the hobby they won't even think about WIFI. Its not that they will shy away from it, they just won't think of it. Their devices will already be connected to cellular so they won't even think about wifi hot spots.

Specifically addressing your comment above is the concept that your onboard non cellular devices need a way to get to the rest of the world. That is where the cellular based router comes into play. Again, pick your brand but there are allot of things on a boat that can utilize a localized to the boat wifi (or wired) network, then use a cellular router to provide off the boat connectivity.

On my boat we have cameras, security, and TV/Radio all network enabled. Without the cellular router, a boater on the move would be constantly be farting around trying to find WIFI connectivity. On my boat I do not even think about connectivity. Where ever we go. To a harbor, or anchoring out, everything works. I do not need to get involved. The TV works. The Radio works, the internet is up, and the vessel monitoring system is operational. That is the way of the future. Borderless networks. Connectivity without boundaries.

...Kevin
Cisco Certifiied Network Professional

Great thread. Lots to learn, so I will study this intently this weekend. Until recently, I had Clear wireless unlimited internet service for $50 per month, with no contract or other commitment. The service was pre-paid, but any time my boat was in an area without a good Clear signal (basically when the boat was in Mexico), and could suspend service then reactivate, without any additional fee, when I returned.
Unfortunately, when Sprint acquired Clear they stopped providing that service. And so far, I haven't found anything comparable, even for double the price.

The question I have is About the marrying of cable-sat TV with broadband. I like my TV but I have not yet sprung for a domed dish. I like my internet also. If there is hardware out there to combine I have not seen it.

I am seriously considering an Intelligen I2 set up. Thoughts, wisdom, advice???

We have a KVH TracVision M5 and been very happy with it. It's nice to be in 8' seas in the middle of Providence Channel and be able to watch my daily dose of Steve Harvey and the price is right. One day we'll add a Iridium Go and V3IP for internet connectivity.