Why Boardings?

Pineapple Girl said:

The USCG boarded them just off the bar and reminded them they needed at least two sober operators.

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Two sober operators? I've never seen or heard of that before. There are times when I'm on my boat alone. I wonder what they would say about that?

GFC said:

Two sober operators? I've never seen or heard of that before. There are times when I'm on my boat alone. I wonder what they would say about that?

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That's a new one on me too...there is a line of thought that the operator is not a "proper lookout".....thus 2 people...but as much as the USCG sanctions solo almost anything on the water...they are hard pressed to enforce that concept.

FF said:

It just seems that on the ICW a random boarding would seem entirely unnecessary.

Perhaps the Seizure laws have as much to do with boardings as toilet checks..

If they get lucky , they own the boat.

Some folks carry CA$H , rather than risk credit card fraud (they may not discover for months ,) and a >large< (unspecified) amount of cash is proof of bad intentions and can be confiscated.

Just as at any airport.

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Well here's the answer folks. And all along, I thought boardings were for our safety.

We used to have the utmost respect fro the CG until we were boarded in March 2006 a few miles from Miami while returning from the Bahamas. two young guys came on board and were friendly and courteous. Everything checked out, we had everything required and then some. But suddenly there were whispered conversations on the radio and we were told there was a problem with our paperwork. What's the problem? We can't tell you but a more senior person will have to come aboard. Since we were living on the boat we had every piece of paper along from the time we first looked at the boats and then bought it. Not good enough, there is a problem. What's the problem? We can't tell you but you have to go into the CG station in Miami.

Up to this point we thought this was just part of the cruising adventure. They left the two young guys aboard and the big CG cutter followed us into Miami. The guys were having a good time, they had never been on sailboat. We were coming straight back from Nassau, having been under way for almost 24 hours now, we asked if it would be OK to go below and take a shower, sure no problem. Coming up on the Miami sea buoy I started to turn into the wind to take the sail down and the two guys almost wet their pants. I guess they thought we were going to make a run for it, our 52HP Perkins against their 50,000HP cutter.

Coming into the CG station they made us tie up to a huge concrete dock meant for the cutter and had to literally pull us up the side to get off the boat. My wife scraped her knees and elbows pretty bad. Then we had to stand behind a building, out of sight of our boat while they did whatever they did. Part of it was putting a dog aboard which left muddy paw prints all over the deck and cockpit cushions. Whenever I asked what was going on, there was no answer. They finally told us we were free to leave. I started making a scene because I wanted some answers. Finally some other guy came up and told us the our boat had been involved in some drug activity in 1999, hence the search. That was absolute BS because in 1999 the boat spent the whole year in a slip in Kemah, TX, while we were working on it to get ready to go cruising.

They finally did offer my wife some band aids but we told them what they could do with them. At this point it was dark so I asked if we could append the night but were told that we had to leave. Luckily we had been at the anchorage we were heading for before, otherwise it would have been really exciting anchoring at night in a new location.

I spent two years writing letters asking for when and where this alleged drug activity took place and who was aboard. After getting the run around for a year I finally gave up.

After that experience I put the CG right down there with the customs people at the airports, bullies with badges and guns that give them the right to harass, intimidate and bully the people who pay their salary.

Any current or ex CG who might shed some light on what happened that day?

Bob

BobH said:

We used to have the utmost respect fro the CG until we were boarded in March 2006 a few miles from Miami while returning from the Bahamas. two young guys came on board and were friendly and courteous. Everything checked out, we had everything required and then some. But suddenly there were whispered conversations on the radio and we were told there was a problem with our paperwork. What's the problem? We can't tell you but a more senior person will have to come aboard. Since we were living on the boat we had every piece of paper along from the time we first looked at the boats and then bought it. Not good enough, there is a problem. What's the problem? We can't tell you but you have to go into the CG station in Miami.

Up to this point we thought this was just part of the cruising adventure. They left the two young guys aboard and the big CG cutter followed us into Miami. The guys were having a good time, they had never been on sailboat. We were coming straight back from Nassau, having been under way for almost 24 hours now, we asked if it would be OK to go below and take a shower, sure no problem. Coming up on the Miami sea buoy I started to turn into the wind to take the sail down and the two guys almost wet their pants. I guess they thought we were going to make a run for it, our 52HP Perkins against their 50,000HP cutter.

Coming into the CG station they made us tie up to a huge concrete dock meant for the cutter and had to literally pull us up the side to get off the boat. My wife scraped her knees and elbows pretty bad. Then we had to stand behind a building, out of sight of our boat while they did whatever they did. Part of it was putting a dog aboard which left muddy paw prints all over the deck and cockpit cushions. Whenever I asked what was going on, there was no answer. They finally told us we were free to leave. I started making a scene because I wanted some answers. Finally some other guy came up and told us the our boat had been involved in some drug activity in 1999, hence the search. That was absolute BS because in 1999 the boat spent the whole year in a slip in Kemah, TX, while we were working on it to get ready to go cruising.

They finally did offer my wife some band aids but we told them what they could do with them. At this point it was dark so I asked if we could append the night but were told that we had to leave. Luckily we had been at the anchorage we were heading for before, otherwise it would have been really exciting anchoring at night in a new location.

I spent two years writing letters asking for when and where this alleged drug activity took place and who was aboard. After getting the run around for a year I finally gave up.

After that experience I put the CG right down there with the customs people at the airports, bullies with badges and guns that give them the right to harass, intimidate and bully the people who pay their salary.

Any current or ex CG who might shed some light on what happened that day?

Bob

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Sounds obvious that it was a drug check, either suspicion in the past or actual drugs on it, unless mistaken identity of boat. When did you acquire the boat?

While I see all of it as a very disturbing situation and your wife's injuries unnecessary, I don't see the "harass, intimidate, bully" part. They even allowed you to shower.

I was traveling back into the US by plane with a friend one day and his name and city had obviously kicked him out as he was immediately pulled aside. I sat waiting over 2 hours but it was obvious that he and the agent with him were talking casually so no big issue. Turned out he wasn't the one they were after. But while sitting, I did see them take a lady with a baby off in custody to be put in jail.

Now, as long as we as a country insist they fight this war on drugs this is part of what they do. That is an entirely different subject for debate, but given their current responsibilities what you had happen is part of it. In their worst days years ago, they were far less courteous and did a lot of damage to boats.

That's a truly scary story Bob, having your wife pulled up the side of the concrete dock was grossly irresponsible and negligent. I think if you had documented her injuries you would have had a solid legal case. If it had have been my wife they in the least would have learned some new obscenities.

It is this sort of bureaucratic nonsense that disturbs me, there doesn't seem to be any accountability when civil servants over step their authority. There should be a clear path between the person standing on your boat and his superiors on shore. I see no reason why they can not state on boarding what to do and who to call if you feel you have been mistreated. No different than being read your rights when being arrested. I realize that in the vast majority of cases a boarding is amiable and professional but when it does go badly there should be some clear well established recourse to take.

2006 most likely is too long ago to ask that someone from the CG be held accountable, but having heard this, if I'm boarded I'll document with photos of everything... boarding crew, names, following CG vessels, names of anyone/all involved.... dates, times, locations sea conditions, and I would document the entire encounter and send it to the Commandant of the Coast Guard and ask for an explanation. I would think that the Commandant would want to know this and would give their side of the story...

Like I said, there was no way that boat was involved in anything like that in 1999, we bought the boat in June or July of '98. And neither one of us has ever had anything to do with drugs or been accused of anything like that. I would have liked to have had some explanation, if not an apology, that either they made a mistake, can happen, or it was a training exercise. But all I ever got for a year was the runaround.

I realize that at this point there is not going to be an answer, I just want others to be aware that they apparently can do as they please and no one has to answer for it.

Bob

BobH said:

Like I said, there was no way that boat was involved in anything like that in 1999, we bought the boat in June or July of '98. And neither one of us has ever had anything to do with drugs or been accused of anything like that. I would have liked to have had some explanation, if not an apology, that either they made a mistake, can happen, or it was a training exercise. But all I ever got for a year was the runaround.

I realize that at this point there is not going to be an answer, I just want others to be aware that they apparently can do as they please and no one has to answer for it.

Bob

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But perhaps the year was wrong. Perhaps it wasn't 99 but was 98. I'm just tossing that out as a possibility. You don't know the boats history prior to you purchasing it. It could have even been that the previous owners were involved in something in 99. Regardless, as it's part of an investigation, they aren't likely to give answers. Definitely wasn't a training exercise. It was an investigative effort for whatever reason.

You said you chased for answers for a long time. Did you ever consider consulting with a Maritime attorney?

BobH said:

We used to have the utmost respect fro the CG until we were boarded in March 2006 a few miles from Miami while returning from the Bahamas. two young guys came on board and were friendly and courteous. Everything checked out, we had everything required and then some. But suddenly there were whispered conversations on the radio and we were told there was a problem with our paperwork. What's the problem? We can't tell you but a more senior person will have to come aboard. Since we were living on the boat we had every piece of paper along from the time we first looked at the boats and then bought it. Not good enough, there is a problem. What's the problem? We can't tell you but you have to go into the CG station in Miami.

Up to this point we thought this was just part of the cruising adventure. They left the two young guys aboard and the big CG cutter followed us into Miami. The guys were having a good time, they had never been on sailboat. We were coming straight back from Nassau, having been under way for almost 24 hours now, we asked if it would be OK to go below and take a shower, sure no problem. Coming up on the Miami sea buoy I started to turn into the wind to take the sail down and the two guys almost wet their pants. I guess they thought we were going to make a run for it, our 52HP Perkins against their 50,000HP cutter.

Coming into the CG station they made us tie up to a huge concrete dock meant for the cutter and had to literally pull us up the side to get off the boat. My wife scraped her knees and elbows pretty bad. Then we had to stand behind a building, out of sight of our boat while they did whatever they did. Part of it was putting a dog aboard which left muddy paw prints all over the deck and cockpit cushions. Whenever I asked what was going on, there was no answer. They finally told us we were free to leave. I started making a scene because I wanted some answers. Finally some other guy came up and told us the our boat had been involved in some drug activity in 1999, hence the search. That was absolute BS because in 1999 the boat spent the whole year in a slip in Kemah, TX, while we were working on it to get ready to go cruising.

They finally did offer my wife some band aids but we told them what they could do with them. At this point it was dark so I asked if we could append the night but were told that we had to leave. Luckily we had been at the anchorage we were heading for before, otherwise it would have been really exciting anchoring at night in a new location.

I spent two years writing letters asking for when and where this alleged drug activity took place and who was aboard. After getting the run around for a year I finally gave up.

After that experience I put the CG right down there with the customs people at the airports, bullies with badges and guns that give them the right to harass, intimidate and bully the people who pay their salary.

Any current or ex CG who might shed some light on what happened that day?

Bob

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Let me share with you some VERY old news from those in the know. They have the capability to read your radar signals and are able to detect who bought that Radar, GPS, or VHF and where, and when. If a name comes up on their "we've been wanting to meet this guy list"-you might get the treatment. I sold a 48' fast sailboat (yes they exist) back in the late 80's that belonged to a "quite open about his source of income" guy living in a mansion on Miami Beach-quite open on his running fast from Jamaica to Miami only in heavy sea's and storms, and to top it off he was half Palestinian and half Jamaican. I sold her to a fellow from Germany, who owned a home in Ecuador, but kept her in Cartagena Colombia. He used to haul for repairs in Cuba. So he's bringing the boat to me to resell 4 year later, and the shaft fell out (probably why you never hear people touting Cuban boat yards!) between Cuba and here, so he pulls into Key West. Did I mention that he never changed the name of the boat, and that the centerboard well had been filled in with foam? He said "You couldn't believe the delight of the Coast Guard when I showed up". They had a field day, they were ready to bring out the TV crews for a press conference. BUT- he was a founding member of the United Nations, and in one phone call to obviously somebody pretty high up- they apologized for the inconvenience and towed him over to a boat yard.
Moral of the story? Always unplug your electronics when coming from places that's nobody's business, change the name of your boat if bought from a known outlaw, and pay cash for your electronics IF your a outlaw.
AND better yet, have a friend in high places.
Another time my son (back when he was young and cute) and I was given a tour of a navy spy boat by a long time client who turned out to have been a quite high up guy with the DEA. This stealth boat had a BIG room inside it like a Star Trek movie set =totally surrounded by big screens (back when there were no such things as big screens) and it was tracking every boat and airplane in a 360 radius, and they zoomed into just one, and pulled up where registered, and what electronics it had, where bought by whom, with what credit card and where. WOW. And that was BEFORE the NSA.
That all said, I've come back and forth from the Bahamas "forever" on boats with no electronics at all, and I've never even seen law enforcement boats, much less been boarded. At the boat ramp locally I've been asked "you have any foreign citizens onboard?" as I loaded the boat on the trailer.. "Nope" was the answer they were looking for-so that's as far as it goes. Also- having been in rooms in Bimini stacked to the ceilings with cocaine, I'm pretty sure that the guys who sell it-immediately phone their cousins who work for the Bahama Royal Defense force, who call the US Government to report who-what -when, and where, so they can all go on happily doing business as usual. lol
Oh, wait a minute I just remembered a "river blockade" the Feds had on the Miami River, checking every boat coming in (early 90s) and I was told on the radio by boatyard owner to "don't come today, they're stopping and searching every boat"-so since I was on a schedule, and didn't want to wait until tomorrow, I put my big Confederate Flag up on the transom of my 50' Pilothouse Powerboat, and came up the river with Hailer announcement "I'm a CSA boat not bound by your laws" and much to my surprise they parted and I steamed on. I think they figured "ok, sounds good to us". lol

I still have the records, boat bought in '98, kept in a marina all of '99 and most of 2000. All electronics were new and purchased by us from WM or direct from the manufacturer, no ebay items. All I was looking for was for someone to say sorry, we made a mistake.

Bob

>>>While I see all of it as a very disturbing situation and your wife's injuries unnecessary, I don't see the "harass, intimidate, bully" part.<<<

The fact that nobody up the food chain ever admitted that they had made a mistake, apologized for our scrapes and bruises or the dirty paw prints all over the boat makes me think it was out and out harassment. The folks on the cutter were obviously bored so they decided to play games at our expense. Turning us loose after dark to find an anchorage was downright irresponsible.

Bob

That is an unfortunate occurrence and I certainly wouldn't want to go through a secondary inspection while at sea either.

I can't speak for the Coast Guard, but the part of the world you were boating in is ripe with crime and violence. Quite literally in a constant state of war and much of law enforcement operates at a heightened state of alert.

Law enforcement agencies gather most of their drug and criminal gang intelligence information from past arrests/contacts, witness statements and informants. Very little of it is electronically obtained in advance and even less from any wide information net (like the NSA or CIA might employ). All this intelligence ends up in several law enforcement data bases which then attempts to associate all this data into something meaningful. Sometimes witness statements and informant information is wrong. I suspect that was what happened too you!!

I had a friend who's fathers nickname was Bud. For his birthday, his son gave him personalized license plates for his Dodge Durango that read "MR BUD". Every time he crossed the U.S. - Canadian border, he got sent in for a secondary inspection. Finally when they started lifting seats and door panels, he had had enough of it and got in the Customs officers face, which caused him more grief. But looking back on it, understanding that "Bud" is a term associated with Marijuana and it turns out that "Mr. Bud" was the nickname of a known drug smuggler in this area. When he entered the border check point, the license plate scanners read the plate, queried the LEA database and up popped an association with "Mr. Bud" the drug smuggler.

PS: If you really believe everything and everybody in the world is monitored electronically. . . Then why can't they locate Malaysian flight MH 370??

My guess is a case of mistaken identity...if the boat was in texas and another boat with the same ID was involved elsewhere...some bad guy was doctoring boat IDs maybe.

As far as the USCG being bored...I severely doubt it...their life often is so much harsher than many civilians..it's sometimes hard to understand how someone can complain of mistreatment after a lot they have been through.

No...the USCG are not civil servants....if you think I like the word "servant" used in my title for risking my life for this country and putting up with all I did...and all the long hours.... for over 20 years..."ya gotta nother thing comin' to ya."

EVERY situation I was ever in...even prisoners got treated with respect and reasonable treatment...most coasties would demand no less of their subordinates....and most are giving souls anyway.

For the one time you are treated poorly by a government agency that usually enjoys a pretty good rep for being extraordinarily professional on the water...remember all the times you were mistreated by some civilian that had far more to gain by treating you nicely than the average Coastie.

psneeld said:

my guess is a case of mistaken identity...if the boat was in texas and another boat with the same ID was involved elsewhere...some bad guy was doctoring boat IDs maybe.

As far as the USCG being bored...I severely doubt it...their live often is so much harsher than any civilians..it's sometimes hard to understand how someone can complain of mistreatment after a ot they have been through.

No...the USCG are not civil servants....if you think I like the word "servant" used in my title for risking my life for this country nad putting up with all I did...and all the long hours.... for over 20 years..."ya gotta nother thing comin' to ya."

EVERY situation I was ever in...even prisoners got treated with respect and reasonable treatment...most coasties would demand no less of their subordinates....and most are giving souls anyway.

For the one time you are treated poorly by a government agency that usually enjoys a pretty good rep for being extraordinarily professional on the water...remember all the times you were mistreated by some civilian that had far more to gain by treating you nicely than the average Coastie.

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Hear hear!!!

Last year a good friend was coming home from a summer cruise in the Gulf Islands. One of his brand-new oil lines failed and dumped about four quarts of oil all over his engine room before his alarm sounded. It' swingy and the seas are pretty rough, his wife is at the helm and he is sucking up the oil in the bilge with a toy water sprayer, and putting the oil in pots and pans. They call Customs in Friday Harbor, explain the situation and ask for a pass on docking at Friday Harbor. Customs answers NO.

They offer to limp home to Edmonds, WA on one engine and stay on the boat until a Customs Officer can visit. NO. So they come into Friday Harbor, have an exciting landing on the dock, have to wait 30 minutes to be boarded, and a young guy walks over to their boat and tells them they can leave.

My friend says no way, you made me come here for an inspection, get yer @ss on board and inspect it! He wouldn't let the kid leave until he had crawled through the oily engine room. After getting home my friend lit up the phone lines and a few days later had a personal apology from all involved, along with a telephoned apology from a senior Customs official.

The prettiest bureaucrat can do more to make you miserable than the richest person in the country.

I get what you are saying and I agree that 99% of coasties are respectful and helpful. Thank you for your service.

That said, when treated poorly by a civilian I walk away. If you are being detained by the military that isn't an option.

In this case a simple explanation, even after the mistreatment would have gone a long way. Being secret about it only served to cause mistrust.

eseyoung said:

I get what you are saying and I agree that 99% of coasties are respectful and helpful. Thank you for your service.

That said, when treated poorly by a civilian I walk away. If you are being detained by the military that isn't an option.

In this case a simple explanation, even after the mistreatment would have gone a long way. Being secret about it only served to cause mistrust.

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If it's part of an investigation they have to be secret sometimes. Let's say for a moment it relates to the previous owner. They don't know your relationship with that owner. Should they have assisted in a way no one was injured? Yes. Perhaps they should have said, "Sorry we had to detain you. Hope you can still have a nice day." But I imagine at that point they could see by your face and hear in your voice that a statement like that was more likely to get ire than peace.

I once was waked at 3:00 AM by a loud knock on my hotel door and yelling my name. When I opened the door, their were guns drawn on me. They had apparently had a car similar to mine stolen and I still had temporary tags. This was in a small town. The thought of checking the VIN apparently didn't cross their minds. They asked for my paperwork, which was of course in the car. So I had to dress and then go out with them. There was no apology, just "We had reports of a car like it stolen." I wanted to call them idiots and ask why they didn't check the VIN and all the other things but they were just the type of good old boys who would have turned anything into more. So I just let them go and went back to my room. Checked out of there immediately and hit the road at 3:30 AM. Oh and as they walked away they were laughing away. I'm sure at the look on my face or something like that. Who to complain to? Probably everyone in town was brothers or cousins.

Some do abuse their power, but if I'm not really hurt by it, I just accept and go on. If I was harmed in a significant way, then I'd respond differently.

Edelweiss said:

......I had a friend who's fathers nickname was Bud. For his birthday, his son gave him personalized license plates for his Dodge Durango that read "MR BUD". Every time he crossed the U.S. - Canadian border, he got sent in for a secondary inspection. ........

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Someone (I think on this forum) asked if my boat's name "HIGH COTTON" was some sort of drug slang. That was a first for me but I suppose if that's where your mind is you can read what you want into just about anything.

Ron... isn't HIGH COTTON the second part of this expression? I used to hear the expression, TALL COTTON...

Walking in high cotton means you are doing well (your cotton crop is growing well).

The group Alabama had a big hit song with that name.

That was the name of the boat when we bought it and we liked it so we kept it.

Earl34Mainship said:

Ron... isn't HIGH COTTON the second part of this expression? I used to hear the expression, TALL COTTON...

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A southern expression. Same as "High on the Hog." Means doing well.

Robster_in_edmonds said:

Last year a good friend was coming home from a summer cruise in the Gulf Islands. One of his brand-new oil lines failed and dumped about four quarts of oil all over his engine room before his alarm sounded. It' swingy and the seas are pretty rough, his wife is at the helm and he is sucking up the oil in the bilge with a toy water sprayer, and putting the oil in pots and pans. They call Customs in Friday Harbor, explain the situation and ask for a pass on docking at Friday Harbor. Customs answers NO.

They offer to limp home to Edmonds, WA on one engine and stay on the boat until a Customs Officer can visit. NO. So they come into Friday Harbor, have an exciting landing on the dock, have to wait 30 minutes to be boarded, and a young guy walks over to their boat and tells them they can leave.

My friend says no way, you made me come here for an inspection, get yer @ss on board and inspect it! He wouldn't let the kid leave until he had crawled through the oily engine room. After getting home my friend lit up the phone lines and a few days later had a personal apology from all involved, along with a telephoned apology from a senior Customs official.

The prettiest bureaucrat can do more to make you miserable than the richest person in the country.

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Obviously never had your credit score screwed up by some 2 bit civie....

Talk about secretive and trying forever to get straight answers...and there's no criminal investigation with "gag orders" in it like a "military" (which it wasn't it was LE)...or a Law Enforcement operation.

For a brief moment in time, I considered naming my boat FREE BEER. I immediately came to my senses when I figured I'd be asking for trouble from the authorities... and every cheap mooching yahoo on the water.

Coming to raft for free beer.

"Tall Cotton" Know the song well... popular in GA also.. the inference is spot on... great name for a boat.

Folks that would like to meet dozens of Coasties or local LEOs should purchase any boat that was on the >drug boat suspect< list , even if it was 25 years ago.

A friend did , and as he had ALL the boarders sign his log , it makes a fantastic read.

FF said:

Folks that would like to meet dozens of Coasties or local LEOs should purchase any boat that was on the >drug boat suspect< list , even if it was 25 years ago.

A friend did , and as he had ALL the boarders sign his log , it makes a fantastic read.

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Yes, easy enough to do, just go to one of the auctions. Or go to National Liquidators. They have contracts with the Department of Justice and Homeland Security in addition to other federal and state enforcement agencies.

And if having law enforcement after you isn't scary enough, try this one on. How about one that was taken by US Marshals as part of Witness Protection so was actually the boat of the one who turned state's evidence against some mobsters?

Seriously, in getting a title search it might be wise also on a boat (and on houses in some areas) to get a complete history search.

Hello All, I certainly appreciate all of you who took the time to share your experiences and comments regarding boardings.

As I got no definitive answer as to the "why", and perhaps, more likely, there is no simple answer, I do not exactly feel comforted. The idea of having someone's wife dragged over a seawall and forced to stand against a wall is, frankly, scary.

Probably going to rethink this whole ICW thing. Perhaps touring the East Coast by auto is the way after all.

Thank you all,

D.