anchor chain on drum anchor winch

dimer2 said:

1979 model...I have 2 sizes of chain and 250 ft rope rode. Works well but requires operation from the bow. I would much rather have an electric drum winch (with free fall), which the Aussies seem to have the jump on us on.

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When anchoring I can't think of any other place to be but on the bow. There you can watch everything. Angle of the rode that tells fairly well where the anchor is. Watching the line tells some about what's going on down there. Feeling the line is even better. What's coming up the rode? Can't tell from the helm. Seaweed? Trees or limbs? And more often than not MUD. I can't imagine a more detached style of boating than pushing buttons from the wheelhouse. How do you know when the anchor's up? When it slams into the pulpit?

When I can't make it up to the bow to do my anchoring it's prolly time to hang up my prop and shaft.

We have a pressurized saltwater washdown hose at the bow to clean the chain and anchor during retrieve. That alone requires someone at the bow.

Oh Eric, we've had this discussion. If your boat had a proper flying bridge, you could see the anchor from the helm.

I'm not going to tell you guys what kind and size of anchor I use because you would point at me and laugh. I will say I use a combination rode with stainless steel chain. The stainless chain never brings up mud. It is rinsed clean on the way up. The galvanized anchor brings up plenty of mud, but it's hanging out over the water from the pulpit. The mud never comes aboard.

Manyboats says: The amount of rode stored on a reel winch is not one of their positive features unless one uses cable and in my years in Alaska I haven't seen a boat w cable. Heard of one though. To my knowledge I've not seen a reel winch w an electric motor but I know they exist. I've got one. Plath No. 5 with 12VDC motor. 300' of 1/4" 6x19 SS cable connected to 40' of 5/16" HT chain. Note that the attached pic shows the drum pulled away from the winch housing in order to service the pawl. (Probably easier to turn your computer screen! Sorry.)

One of the biggest advantages of the reel winch (RW) is that the rode is stored on deck. Yep, no smell below.

I carry 450' of 5/8" nylon for a storm rode that is in the forepeak and feeds thru the deck to the base of the winch - just unshackle the cable and attach the line to the 40' of chain.

As I see it the ideal rode can only be handled by hand or a reel winch. Have some hands-on history myself.

Sorry I wasn't clearer....I drop anchor when fishing and not only in a quiet cove. When its bumpy and you are using both hands to keep tension on the rode and feed it into the locker, washing it down is not going to happen. The reel I am considering holds over 350 ft of rode....How many feet do you need Eric? Here we fish in shallow, 60 -100 foot of water. And as Hopcar mentioned, it's possible to see your anchor arrive if you have either a fly bridge or raised pilot house. Detached style of boating? I would consider any time I don't have to be on the bow in a sea, a safe style of boating. But each to his own.

Jay,
Good to hear/talk to someone that actually has experience w cable. I considered it for my reel winch as 3 or 400' of 5/8ths nylon line won't fit on the average RW. Ever had any kinking, tangles or other problems? How bout corrosion or rusting? If you had to pull by hand it could be challenging. Have a good grip?

Hop,
Oh come on lets laugh. I'll bet my primary is weirder than yours. Most have seen it though.

Bruce,
"that alone" indeed the foredeck is the place to be.

dimmer,
"to each his own". For sure what ever works. Get er done. I like 400' rode.

Who said they needed to wax their anchor?

Eric, you know a man's manhood is inversely proportional to the size of his anchor.
I have a tiny Delta anchor and a happy wife.

Anchor Wax! That's brilliant! Another expensive useless product for me to sell. I'm going to get rich on that one.

"Anchor Wax! That's brilliant! Another expensive useless product for me to sell. I'm going to get rich on that one."

Anchor wax with mud repelling and bottom holding additives added. Put me down for a case

Dimer you've nailed it!
HopCar Anchor Wax,
Digs in Deeper, Comes Out Cleaner!
Now Fortified with Mudbegone

HopCar said:

Dimer you've nailed it!
HopCar Anchor Wax,
Digs in Deeper, Comes Out Cleaner!
Now Fortified with Mudbegone

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You gonna be rich!

Eric says: Jay, ever had any kinking, tangles or other problems? No kinking, no need for a swivel. How bout corrosion or rusting? I watch the compression fittings carefully to see if there is any corrosion from dissimilar metals. Seem to renew the eyes every 5-7 years preventative maintenance. A little rust appears after the galvanizing is knocked off the chain. If you had to pull by hand it could be challenging. Have a good grip? Have a good pair of high grip gloves in reserve that can get ahold of the 1/4" cable.

Who said they needed to wax their anchor? Bears repeating that I was told by an anchor salesman at the recent Seattle Boat Show that if you keep their polished stainless steel anchor waxed, that you don't need a wash down system! Just about lost it!

In Al's first post, I pictured a Powerwinch like this which I was told could handle line, but not chain. This is what my boat came with when I bought it.



After a couple years of hauling chain by hand, I changed to this Lewmar ProSeries 1000



and, like HopCar said, just push the button and watch line and chain deploy and retrieve effortlessly. Last weekend I was out fishing and we set anchor 7 times and never gave it a second thought. Love my Lewmar!

Flywright, you are just showing off! Bet it`s not as clean as that after 7 retrieves.
Jay N, are you saying there are people who don`t wax their anchor? Surely not on TF.

BruceK said:

Flywright, you are just showing off! Bet it`s not as clean as that after 7 retrieves.

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You're so right, Bruce. I took this photo after the last hookset to remind me that the aft roller had split. But it didn't take long before she was all cleaned up after returning to the slip.

I also replaced my old Simpson-Lawrence with a Lewmar 1000, particularly because they were identical in size, shape and mounting. The only difference I could find was the SS wrapping. Anyway, it works great with all 5/16 chain and a 35 lb. Bruce or Delta, but I think I'll be adding a 44 Rocna this Spring, and it might be asking too much for the unit. I sure like that drum style winch and I was looking at them at last year's Miami show.

44 Rocna this Spring, and it might be asking too much for the unit

The windlass will hardly notice an extra 9 lbs.

Break out the anchor with the motion of the boat , all the windlass lifts is the anchor gear and the muck stuck to it.

Al said:

FlyWright- Question: Are those two photos of the same boat? I ask as the first appears to be of some dingy hulk where as the second is spotless. The Lewmar is still on the table. Just have to deal with the mental challenge of reorganization of the deck area. Question # 2- What size and is it common, chain is recommended on a Lewmar? Based on our 27 foot 11,000# boat? I assume there is a table, just asking on the bet you have that knowledge,
Thanks, Al

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1. The first photo was taken on my garage floor. That's the nicest thing anyone has ever said about my garage.

2. My model is the Lewmar ProSeries 1000. It uses 5/16 chain and I wanted 8 plait Brait. The good folks at Defender advised my to upsize my Brait line to 9/16 to avoid slippage. Here's what I ordered with the windlass. I later added another 90 ft of chain for a total chain length of 120 ft. I've never had a problem with slippage or the chain-to-line transition. The couple of times it acted up was when the clutch loosened and I didn't notice. It's a simple 5-second adjustment with the Lewmar wrench.

As you can see in the photos below, I went with the self-launching bow roller. I am very satisfied with it and have no regrets (except for the split aft roller).

Feel free to PM me and I'd be happy to share challenges and solutions with you. Each boat is different and I had help from some pretty crafty airplane mechanics, but maybe my solutions can help you work through some of your challenges.

I have the 15 kg Lewmar Bruce look-alike claw anchor. It holds fine, but I wish I went with the 20 kg model. Although it was sized according to Lewmar's recommendations, it just looks undersized. I ordered the anchor a year before the windlass installation. The windlass will easily handle the 20 kg Bruce and I'd sleep even better on the hook.

I was on the boat today and took shots of my repaired anchor roller, so I thought I'd throw them in here. I used 2-inch wide industrial strength Rescue Tape to rejoin the 2 split roller halves while awaiting the replacement roller.

The deck mounted drums may be great for fishermen who pack a hold of fish, but all that chain weight lower down in a chain locker is a good concept for pleasure boaters.

FlyWright, That is a pretty installation.
You mention that you added an additional 90 feet of chain. How did you join the chain?

HopCar said:

FlyWright, That is a pretty installation.
You mention that you added an additional 90 feet of chain. How did you join the chain?

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Thanks, HC! I used one of these and I carry a spare.



I just checked out the link last weekend and it still looks great. It's been on there for about 3-4 years. The windlass never even notices the link.

FlyWright, A year ago I would have chastised you for putting a weak link in your chain and I would have told you it wouldn't go through your winch.

Now I'm thinking of doing it my self. You're the second experienced cruiser I know who has used that link with G4 chain without problems. Chuck on Trawler Beach House bought some chain from me about a year ago and did the same thing.

It is in fact a weak link in your chain and it isn't the same size as the rest of your chain, but I can't argue with success. I suspect you never come close to putting a breaking load on that link and it goes through your winch. I'd say your good.

Greetings,
Mr. H. Somewhere in the dim recesses of my brain I recall a report/statement where a link similar to what Mr. FW was not necessarily a weak link. I think this method of joining has been discussed on TF before.

HC, You wouldn't be the first to chastise me and, to be honest, I was a little skeptical at first, too. But I was careful with the installation and monitor it periodically.

I have my rode marked in 30 ft increments. My chain is marked with long wire ties at 30' (1 tie), 60' (2 ties) and this link at 90' (3 ties). Occasionally the tie warp tails break off and need to be replaced, like one did this past weekend. Since half the ties are on this one link, it gets regular (quarterly?) attention for tie wrap replacement which gives me a regular look at the link.

I'm not convinced it's not the weakest link. My chain has a working load limit of 3900 lbs. My connecting link WLL is 1950 lbs. The 9/16 8 plait line has a tensile strength of 7700 lbs. Of course, if the connecting link corrodes or degrades, its strength lessens. For me it works, but your mileage may vary.

Here are links to some of our earlier discussions:

http://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s42/bad-chain-link-10371.html

http://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s3/adding-chain-297.html

http://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/...-link-_-adding-chain-existing-chain-2127.html

http://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s42/adding-chain-w-o-weak-link-4570.html

Al, It seems we've already had this discussion. I think your use of that link just proves we tend to go much stronger than we really need to on chain and rope. I wouldn't have a problem with using 5/16 BBB or Proof Coil chain on your size boat and the link is about as strong as those.
I see I'm also starting to repeat my stories. I'm getting old.

Greetings,
Mr. HC. See post #53.

Just because Al has had this kinky link on his rode for awhile dosn't mean it's been tested. Most all the time we put extremely light loads on our ground tackle. Even if Al had anchored in a 50 knot gale last week it dosn't tell much as it could be that the load as a percentage of it's maximum was still low.

However w a reel winch Al would have a shackle as strong as his chain.

Tom wrote in post # 49;
"The deck mounted drums may be great for fishermen who pack a hold of fish, but all that chain weight lower down in a chain locker is a good concept for pleasure boaters."
Fishermen only have their holds full of fish for short periods of time.
People that are concerned about rode weight don't have all chain. And everybody should be concerned about rode weight.

RTF, That post 53 got me to looking at the links Al posted and made me realize I'm repeating myself, repeating myself.

I found the picture I took of your avatar back in 1969. I'll see if I can scan it and send it to you.

HopCar said:

Al, It seems we've already had this discussion.
I see I'm also starting to repeat my stories. I'm getting old.

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Lighten up, Parks. Just the other day, I forgot who Eric was. It wasn't until I saw his number of posts that I said "Oh Yeah".