The "other" loop

Bay Pelican said:

An additional concern with being on the St. Lawrence early is the level of the current on your upbound leg. In late June we were reduced to 2.5 kts upbound just downriver from Montreal. You need to determine whether the current will be faster in May.
Marty

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We did that leg last summer. You are only going against a really hard current for maybe 1/2 to 3/4 of a mile so 2.5 kts is no big deal. Or at least I didn't think so.
The rest of the upbound trip from Sorel to the Ottawa River I only lost maybe 1.5 knots at the most, usually only 1 knot.

jleonard said:

We did that leg last summer. You are only going against a really hard current for maybe 1/2 to 3/4 of a mile so 2.5 kts is no big deal. Or at least I didn't think so.
The rest of the upbound trip from Sorel to the Ottawa River I only lost maybe 1.5 knots at the most, usually only 1 knot.

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Agree with you as to summer. I took my trip in the beginning of July. My concern is whether this is different (worse) in May which could be spring runoff. Just don't know the answer.

Marty

I had planned on doing the Down East loop in 2014 but..... For 8 of the 10 locks on the Canadian side of Lake Champlain and all of the locks on the St. Lawrence you must have two people on board. I learned this the hard way while single handing the Great Loop this year.

Without crew I won't be going. Several of this years Loopers are planning the Down East loop and those who have done it really enjoyed it.

If I was going, I would go up through Lake Champlain and directly out the St. Lawrence. I would concentrate my time in The far northern part of the loop as that is the most difficult to reach and the least likely to revisit.

On a side note about charts for planning, if you have an ipad, try Garmin Bluechart Mobile. Free app and $50 for the charts covering all Us and Canada.

Have fun,
Arch

Bay Pelican said:

Agree with you as to summer. I took my trip in the beginning of July. My concern is whether this is different (worse) in May which could be spring runoff. Just don't know the answer.

Marty

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Well it was during the time when the Erie and Champlain canal were flooded, so was the Richelieu so the current should have been up more than normal. Just sayin'.
And after reading some cruisiing guides that said don't take that trip in a low powered boat (which I have) , well, everyone's experience is different.

Arch said:

If I was going, I would go up through Lake Champlain and directly out the St. Lawrence. I would concentrate my time in The far northern part of the loop as that is the most difficult to reach and the least likely to revisit.

On a side note about charts for planning, if you have an ipad, try Garmin Bluechart Mobile. Free app and $50 for the charts covering all Us and Canada.

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Arch, I'm looking at that route too. Odd that nobody talks about it. Everything I read focuses on the Erie route, which adds quite a bit. I'd rather spend that time in the Maritimes. I can drive to Montreal and Quebec by car.

I have two dedicated plotters, an older NavMan that takes C-Map cards, and a new Garmin that takes their BlueChart data. It looks like I can get just about all of Canada for $160 for the Garmin, and that includes the whole Northeastern US and Great Lakes. Anybody know if that one includes the Richelieu? It's g2 region CA015R.

Tom,
I think one of the reasons the Champlain route is less popular is you must be able to clear a 17 foot bridge.

I have a Garmin 5200 as my main chartplotter and the Canadian chart I bought covered everything including the Richiliue. I think it is the one you mentioned.

Bluechart mobile integrates active captain and is a great companion to the "big Garmin".

Arch

Arch said:

Tom,
I think one of the reasons the Champlain route is less popular is you must be able to clear a 17 foot bridge.

I have a Garmin 5200 as my main chartplotter and the Canadian chart I bought covered everything including the Richiliue. I think it is the one you mentioned.

Bluechart mobile integrates active captain and is a great companion to the "big Garmin".

Arch

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Yes, I've read that at "high pool" the Richelieu can have vertical clearances as low as 14', which is my absolute minimum with Bimini and mast down.

Glad to hear about the Bluechart coverage on the Richelieu. To get the same areas with the Canadian government charts would probably cost over $1200, and that doesn't even include the US portions.

I have the Garmin HomePort software on my laptop, so I can do my planning there, using the same charts and ActiveCaptain data. I'll probably pick up Bluechart mobile for our tablets, too.

CaptTom said:

Yes, I've read that at "high pool" the Richelieu can have vertical clearances as low as 14', which is my absolute minimum with Bimini and mast down.

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If you can get that low, you should put the entire Erie Canal on your list of "should do's". It wouldn't fit into a Down East trip because you'd be too pressured. But if you want a really wonderful, inexpensive place to cruise, go up the Hudson and across the entire Erie Canal to Buffalo and then return back. There are multiple routes to go back to the Hudson including just a retrace of the path back across the Erie Canal to Albany.

It would make a wonderful place to go for the summer with low mileage days, wonderful towns that are eager to have trawlers visit (most have free docks and many even have free electric), with a lot to do at every stop. Weather is never a factor because it is so protected. We were along the Erie Canal for 5 weeks in 2013 and our total dockage was something around $200 for the entire 5 weeks - and we were tied up every night. Our longest stay at one place was, I think, 5 days. We never waited a single day for weather - when we wanted to go, we woke up, and just left. That never happens when cruising in other places.

The only hiccup we experienced was early flooding that caused a delay with the lock opening - we were on the Hudson River. New York State caused some of that themselves this year and except for hurricane hits, it hasn't been a big problem.

Jeff is right, the Erie is a great destination. I think too many people try to race through it. We took a couple of weeks to explore the Eastern half before we had to turn around. We will be back, maybe as part of the "left" loop some day. Which is why I have no problem skipping that side trip when we do the Down East loop.

Hi Tom
Here's some comments on your great trip. Being from Quebec City and sailed these waters up to Rimouski many times:
- take the north channel route past Ile d'orlean (the Main channel).
- current is an important factor between trois-riviere and baie st-Paul. You will have 6hrs of day tide time that will help you. Past baie st-Paul, no tide issue
- cross over to the south side of the st-Laurent once past tadoussac.
- water temp in the summer is 36f
- you will be fine with language. Learn a few french phrase. Past Gaspe, English is back strong
- lots of whales in the beautiful Tadoussac area (got a stop there)

We plan to do a similar trip in a few years (leaving from Texas though...)
Bye

Tom,

What time of year is best to go and what time of year is best to avoid?

John

Francois, thanks, I've saved your advice for when I get Canadian charts to do the final route planning.

John, the big-picture weather trends are (1) fog in the Maritimes until mid summer, and (2) stronger winds in the Northeast in early fall. Both can slow you down quite a bit if they persist for many days, as they can do at these times.

the other loop

Hi to anyone planning cruise east of Quebec City to maritimes.After you round Gaspe peninsula heading east there are several lobster wharves and a few marinas on the south side of PEI.Also some on north side of NB and you are clear sailing east to the passage between Cape Breton and NS.There you can easily enter the lakes or turn right toward Halifax.Be sure to stop over in PEI,which is not like any other maritime province.