SSB- single side band huh?

Mike Dilger said:

Benn I think this is what they are talking about XM

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Yep!

I am trying to understand my SSB Icom MC-710 and its too foreign for me so I will also check out the book.

I know you don't need a license to transmit if its for an emergency call, either yours or anothers emergency but yes a license is needed for general chit chat.

As my EPIRBS are registered do I need to do a separate form for the SSB.

Unless they've changed, US Federal Regulations require both a station license and an operator license for SSB transmissions, regardless whether you are a "voluntary" or commercial vessel. (Valid emergency traffic is of course exempted.) The station license will include your SSB, VHF, EPIRB, and RADAR gear if you list those on the appropriate forms. Forms and procedures are available on-line. Not sure of the web address, but if you Google FCC (Federal Communications Commission) the pathway should come up. As has been pointed out previously, these licenses are required for international voyages to signatory countries of the IMO (International Maritime Organization). Fortunately these days the process is simple and easy (no Morse code tests, etc.). Good luck.

Captain K said:

... these licenses are required for international voyages to signatory countries of the IMO (International Maritime Organization).

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The ITU (International Telecommunications Union) sets operating and licensing standards.

The IMO is concerned only with who must hold a radio license on a ship, and what radios a ship must carry.

RickB said:

The ITU (International Telecommunications Union) sets operating and licensing standards.

The IMO is concerned only with who must hold a radio license on a ship, and what radios a ship must carry.

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Thank you for setting me straight amigo!

BTW the website for forms and procedures in the US is www.wireless.fcc.gov/services/index.htm?job=licensing&id=ship_stations
Very simple stuff. No testing. Fill out the appropriate forms, mail them in with a check for the fee, retain the stub at the bottom of the form and you can operate legally with that while your application is being processed. Good luck!

>>>Oliver: When you start playing around with your radio, turn off all your onboard electronics which include you refrigeration, battery charger/inverter, florescent lights, etc. They will interferer with your reception.<<<

Just ran across this thread. The above quote is the most ridiculous thing I ever heard. If any of those interfere with reception you have a serious wiring problem. We used our SSB and Pactor modem for three years cruising to receive email and weather reports and the only interference was with the autopilot when transmitting.

Bob

I haven't done any serious cruising in over 10 years. Back then, most cruisers I knew and cruising networks were on the HAM bands. I don't know what it's like now.

For offshore weather forecasting and pulling up GRIB files I'm not sure Sirius/XM is the tool of choice. For near onshore/coastal work the marine VHF broadcasts when combined with Sirius/XM is a pretty good combination. In the far reaches of the PNW Sirius/XM sometimes cannot be received.

sunchaser said:

For offshore weather forecasting and pulling up GRIB files I'm not sure Sirius/XM is the tool of choice. For near onshore/coastal work the marine VHF broadcasts when combined with Sirius/XM is a pretty good combination. In the far reaches of the PNW Sirius/XM sometimes cannot be received.

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We got Sirius everywhere we went last year. Were not in the far north latitudes.

Bob. 19 out of 20 boats in the Eastern Caribbean have SSB/Ham radios and generally use them every day. There is a great deal of discussion on how to eliminate interference, and fortunately for me a great deal of expertise available.

You may not start off turning off all electrical appliances on the boat but it is the conventional way of testing for interference if you have interference. On Bay Pelican we had substantial interference from one of the inverters (Freedom 25 now replaced), the galley fluorescent light and a difficult one to figure out, the control panel for my water maker.

Unfortunately for trawlers our antennas are not as high as the mast stays used by the sailboats.

Marty

neworleansrich said:

......Try tuning to 14.300 MHZ for the Marine Mobile Service Net during daylight hours Maritime Mobile Service Network to get an idea of the wonderful free service these volunteers provide.

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The services provided free by volunteers on 14.300 (HAM frequency) is invaluable. If you have satcom and can receive the Weather Channnel on your TV then you probably wont have a need for their services. Otherwise, they are great folks. They will relay weather info to you from ships in your area, they will relay phone messages and whatever from your family and friends and if they have someone handy with a patch, they will patch a phone line through for you. They will also phone people for you. If you want, they will also add you onto shiptrac.org where they will post your position, course, eta, etc and any notes you would like posted. All your friends and family have to do is get on shiptrac.org and look up your call sign number and all that info will be available.
Came in handy one time during a gulf crossing. We hit a really bad storm and our antennas were down. We lost communications with everyone for a few days and we knew everyone on land would be worried. I strung up a wire when I could and got on 14.300 and left message. Hit storm, lost communications, everything and everyone is OK just lost radio for a few days. When everyone saw the message they were relieved. On that trip I was about 59 years old and I was the 'kid', so you could see the concern.
Last time I knew of, the maritime net on 14.300 was not on 24 hours a day, but were regularly scheduled throughout the day. Oh, and when we were one day out and knew our ETA they called family members to meet us - myself and 3 friends, one from St. Louis, one from Dallas and one from Slidell, La. I stayed with my boat in it's new home in Kemah, Tx.

Tony B said:

The services provided free by volunteers on 14.300 (HAM frequency) is invaluable. If you have satcom and can receive the Weather Channnel on your TV then you probably wont have a need for their services. Otherwise, they are great folks. They will relay weather info to you from ships in your area, they will relay phone messages and whatever from your family and friends and if they have someone handy with a patch, they will patch a phone line through for you. They will also phone people for you. If you want, they will also add you onto shiptrac.org where they will post your position, course, eta, etc and any notes you would like posted. All your friends and family have to do is get on shiptrac.org and look up your call sign number and all that info will be available. Came in handy one time during a gulf crossing. We hit a really bad storm and our antennas were down. We lost communications with everyone for a few days and we knew everyone on land would be worried. I strung up a wire when I could and got on 14.300 and left message. Hit storm, lost communications, everything and everyone is OK just lost radio for a few days. When everyone saw the message they were relieved. On that trip I was about 59 years old and I was the 'kid', so you could see the concern. Last time I knew of, the maritime net on 14.300 was not on 24 hours a day, but were regularly scheduled throughout the day. Oh, and when we were one day out and knew our ETA they called family members to meet us - myself and 3 friends, one from St. Louis, one from Dallas and one from Slidell, La. I stayed with my boat in it's new home in Kemah, Tx.

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Yes we are going to get Sat Tv. Who would've know the sat domes on N4712 were purely there for aesthetics (there both empty).

N4712 said:

Yes we are going to get Sat Tv. Who would've know the sat domes on N4712 were purely there for aesthetics (there both empty).

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If you are going past the Northern Bahamas, make sure you get a 24" antenna or larger. Also you will need to swap out the LNB once you leave the Bahamas. Latin American Directv (assume same for Dish) uses a different LNB.

Marty

Bay Pelican said:

If you are going past the Northern Bahamas, make sure you get a 24" antenna or larger. Also you will need to swap out the LNB once you leave the Bahamas. Latin American Directv (assume same for Dish) uses a different LNB. Marty

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Yes, I believe the M5 by KvH is 24" dish, I'll have to check.

But if you turn them all off before you start, you'll never which ones, if any, cause interference.

Bob

BobH said:

But if you turn them all off before you start, you'll never which ones, if any, cause interference.

Bob

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Bob

You are correct. The way that I have done this is to turn everything off, and then turn things on one by one. It took me two years to find my water maker display panel problem because I never thought to turn it off until a friend insisted that everything been turned off, and he meant everything.

Marty

Marty,
You are dead right, that is the standard procedure we use down here as well.
It can be surprising what may be causing the smallest amount of interference, eliminating them all from the start gives you a good base and an idea of how good your radio set up is.
Cheers
Benn

I still think that if you have interference on receive, you have a wiring problem, DC power and ground, antenna or ground plane. We had battery charger/inverter, battery monitor, DC fridge, fluorescent lights and never had a problem on receive. never had a problem with the Pactor modem receiving email, weather reports, GRIB files, etc. Only problem was on transmit driving the autopilot crazy.

Bob

Oh I failed to mention the boat came with a skymate have to check that out.

N4712 said:

Oh I failed to mention the boat came with a skymate have to check that out.

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it looks like you got all the good toys!!

Mike Dilger said:

it looks like you got all the good toys!!

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Yeah, I'm glad we weren't the people that put all the cool and perplexing toys in. anyone use a skymate before?

Dumb question alert.....Is the marine SSB the same as land based stuff? I.E. If I get a SSB/CB for my Jeep will it have the same capabilities (range not withstanding) as a marine version? Cobra makes a model that has both CB and SSB for not much more than I was looking at spending when I finish my latest and likely last Jeep project. I'm going all out and its getting all the goodies I've ever wanted Cummins diesel, 1 ton axles/driveline, lockers F/R, double beadlocked 37" tires, 1/2 cab, HD bumpers, Warn 8724 winch, etc. I was curious about the SSB so this is a timely thread for me-though my questions aren't marine based per se.

SSB is a mode of transmission. AM and FM are other modes of transmission that you have probably heard of. You can use any of these modes on any frequency.

For example, you may think of "FM radio" as those FM frequencies that the radio in your car can receive. But FM is just a mode, and can be used on any frequency. The marine VHF radios that we all use are FM radios. They do not transmit on the same frequencies as the radio in your car, but they use the same, FM mode for their transmissions.

SSB is the mode that is used on the marine HF (high frequency, as opposed to VHF--very high frequency) channels. As such, the radios that are made for transmitting and receiving on the marine HF channels are commonly called "SSB" radios.

"Normal" CB transmissions are done using the AM mode. The Cobra radio you are asking about transmits and receives on the CB frequencies, but is capable of using SSB mode as well as AM mode on those frequencies. These are NOT the same frequencies used by the marine SSB channels. Hence, no, your Cobra SSB will not work on the marine SSB channels.

I understand the dynamics of frequency and amplitude as means of specifying "channels" of communication waves. And UHF, VHF, and HF ranges. All I was asking was if the land based CB/SSB device operated in the same areas as marine SSB. Since Ham radio operation doesn't differentiate what's under your feet it seemed plausible that SSB communication wouldn't either as they are similar systems.
Thanks for clarifying that I couldn't use my CB/SSB transceiver to communicate with my boat or other boating buddies if using a marine SSB unit. That's too bad since SSB seems to be using such a small percentage of its potential why they won't allow the two systems to overlap. I'm sure they would self differentiate by channels just as VHF has for pleasure vs commercial vs emergency traffic.

Twisted;

Radios get nick-names like everything else. The nick-names just caught on just the same way nick-names stick to people. They are not the real names. CB being one of the exceptions. When I was kid, most HAM radios were either receivers (also called "short wave radios") or transmitters. Transceivers were not popular due to a lot of technical reasons as well as marketing.
The transmitters whether manufactured or home made had stringent requirements to make sure they didn't bleed into areas they were not allotted to use. Receivers didn't matter because they were not regulated. And so, everyone had their own band of frequencies they were allowed to use.
Eventually, along comes the popularity of transceivers. Since different licensing is required for different bands of frequencies, industry decided to make sure that there could be no mistakes made. Not sure but probably this was legislated. If you bought a HAM transceiver, you could receive everything within its wide range of frequencies.
This typically was very low frequencies which is below normal AM radio, all the way up to and slightly beyond CB frequencies. However, you could only transmit on HAM frequencies, and outside of that the other frequencies such as marine bands, CB normal AM radio and others were physically blocked from transmitting.
What we call marine band radios (other than VHF) could receives that same as most HAM radios could but only transmit on Marine frequencies with everything else blocked from transmitting. CB radios were cheap and made for CB only so not questions there. Since most Marine band frequencies are generally SSB, people refer to them as SSB radios when in fact they are Marine Band Radios. My HAM radio will transmit SSB, AM, FM and CW(carrier wave used for Morse Code) and I must use the appropriate form of transmission for the frequencies I transmit on.
Hope that almost explains it.

So essentially SSB is just another "range/level" within the same frequency band widths as the typically more popular comm devices in that realm?
Any idea what ship to shore radio used back in the day? That's how we got to call or get calls from home back when I worked offshore. It was an "open" channel and everyone could hear everyone else on that freq and everyone basically took turns using the airwaves. This was all over the Gulf of Mex not just my rig! People sure were more considerate back then-I couldn't imagine trying to do that now-a-days with the "kids" they'll have filling my shoes now!

I am not sure what your question is, but to simplify it - there is a great range of frequencies - everything from sound we hear with out ears right up to light rays and beyond. Somewhere in there are what we designated are radio frequencies. Initially, technology dictated what frequencies could be used and how. Then from there frequency ranges (bands) were allocated for various uses such as AM/FM radio, TV, Microwave RADAR, todays cell towers and all sorts of stuff. The type of signal such as SSB, AM, FM etc. has to do with efficiency and quality of sound at certain frequencies. As we run out of frequencies available, new technology tends to come up with more efficiency of transmission equipment. The gov. also looks at which frequencies get used the most and the least. The ones that get used the least get re-allocated for a different purpose. SSB is just a fairly efficient form of transmission at certain frequencies. When it comes to the frequencies that we commonly use for HAM and SSB Marine bands, the frequencies we choose to use have to do with the time of day. Long distance communications tend to collapse on the higher frequencies and improve on the lower frequencies as the sun goes down. Has to do with the ionosphere. Lower frequencies such as normal AM radio improve greatly during the evening. Different stations have allocated frequencies they can use so they don't step on top of each other otherwise all you hear would be static.
Communications are dependant of skip waves and the lower frequencies perform better. Anyway, because of this, marine SSB bands are in different places on the dial so you will always some communication with someone at a distance.

The only ship to shore I am familiar with in the Gulf of Mex is on the VHF frequencies. They were on some of the upper channels I believe. When I worked on boats. I would just swing off on ropes to a platform and use their phones all I wanted. The ship to shore VHF would cost several dollars a minute. I'm sure there were other lower frequencies in use I am just not aware of them.

Most of this is from memory which ain't all that great - lost too many brain cells in the 60's. So while I may not be technically correct, I'm still giving you the general idea - I think.

Are you now more confused than before? Sorry.

Regarding Sat TV, I have never seen a wind or wave forecast on ANY TV channel. Maybe you might get a glimpse of an approaching cold front in winter or a hurricane in summer, but anything in between, forget it. SAT TV IS NOT A SUBSTITUTE FOR REAL WEATHER INFO.

Assuming you are cruising the Bahamas and Caribbean the following are the best sources of relevant weather information. By relevant I mean a) is anything really nasty approaching, b) what is the wind direction and wave height tomorrow, and the next day.

a) XM Weather via a Garmin type receiver: Very convenient, low subscription fee, coverage down to lower Caribbean.

b) Weather via the internet (like Sailflow.com): Great when you can get on the internet in a marina or on shore, better if you have Sat Internet.

c) WEFAX via SSB: Takes some effort to get set up and get familiar with the schedule, but portable and no coverage limits.

The only weather source WORSE than the Weather Channel is the prognostication from the guy in the boat in the next slip.

LOL yep done more Tarzan imitations than I care to remember. I was a roughneck/roustabout and crane operator at various times. Shoulda stayed with it as I was on the track to be a rig/platform bo$$. Electronics are generally clear as mud to me anyway so it'd be hard to confuse me more! Airwaves are just an extension of the blur when talking about radios. Thankfully I can't screw up airwaves!

twiisted71 said:

........ Thankfully I can't screw up airwaves!

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Yeah, right! LOL

I just retired last year and thinking of going back out for a while. I actually miss some of it and it kept me in good shape. I had to keep up with men 1/2 my age. That's my cover story and I'm sticking to it. I am/was a protective coatings inspector. The $$ is very good and can't be spent until I hit the beach.

Basically, you can't screw up much - famous last words.
Just figure out what and who you want to talk to and what frequencies they are on and buy the radio accordingly. Turn the dial and the radio does most of the work.

When I was active about 10 years ago, most sailboat nets were on HAM frequencies. When in the Caribbean we would check in with each other almost every morning. If nothing else but to see that all was OK. Had fun chatting with other cruisers that I never met in person even though we all knew where the others were. If we had a bad blow at night we would check each other in the morning.

My HAM radio was modified to transmit on all frequencies including
marine bands. Technically illegal but I never used the marine bands anyway and nice to have in case of an emergency. Truth be known, in an emergency I would rather have 100 HAMs scattered around the world know where I am than just the CG. Lots of civilians can put pressure on the CG if need be.

The HAM radio tests are easy and Morse Code is no longer required. You can buy books from the ARRL which pretty much teach the test.

I don't know the demographics today but 10 years or so ago, most HAMs I talked to were old WW II radio operators and a lot of shut-ins. I think HAM is dying a slow death due to the internet and cell phones, but still fun.