Motor Sailers

Moonstruck said:

Here's one I thought was cool back in the 70s. It would be a great boat today

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Does anyone know the make of this boat? I think its great! I used to drool over one of these in Sippican Harbor when I was a teenager. I haven't seen one since.

Fisher 46. nice spacious pilothouse.

I think I saw this boat crossing Georgia Strait this summer. Cant be that many around.

A norhavn 56. yours for 1.1 mil usd

bligh said:

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Looks like a Fisher 46.

One for AusCan, a Wellington for sale $179K

The Wellington is interesting, lots of room and passive flotation; but I'm not that keen on a flybridge motorsailer. Too much lower sail area lost due to the flybridge resulting in a higher centre of force and more heeling. Fine for running downwind though.

AusCan said:

.... but I'm not that keen on a flybridge motorsailer. Too much lower sail area lost due to the flybridge resulting in a higher centre of force and more heeling.

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I also was never too keen on those ever higher flybridges pushing the whole sailplan upwards. But I've always appreciated a flybridge option.

On my mast aft (single-masted ketch) I located the 'flybridge' back under my wishbone shaped boom for the mizzen sail (note the boomless nature of the mizzen sail over the flybridge area):
Motor/Sailer Design Expedition Yacht

Also provided for a 'crow's nest' on the gamefishing version:
Gamefishing Design - a 65' mast-aft sailing catamaran.

The DynaRig version had a more complete flybridge arrangement, again located aft the major sail area, rather than directly below it:
DynaRig MotorSailer

brian eiland said:

BTW AusCan, I just had to place a cross-link reference to this other beautiful motorsailer you posted just recently

http://www.trawlerforum.com/forums/s3/im-love-another-woman-11115.html#post171632

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Should have put at least a few photos up with this link

brian eiland said:

Shoulkd have put at least a few photos up with this link

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mmmmmm- heart be still.

bligh said:

Does anyone know the make of this boat? I think its great! I used to drool over one of these in Sippican Harbor when I was a teenager. I haven't seen one since.

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She was called Bird of Passage, a custom one-off designed by Sparkman & Stephens and built in foam-cored glass. 48'5" LOA, 15'4" beam, and 5'0" draft, displacement about 22 tons and 600 sq ft of sail in a short ketch rig. Gardner 6LW midships under the cockpit and wheelhouse, private double cabin aft, and galley and dining in the foc'sl, a sailors arrangement with 3 full watertight bulkheads. The unprotected outside cockpit would be fine for the tropics or docking, but would see little use in a place like the PNW.

One of my local favorites is BURMA:

Burma is sweet. She has been for sale for a long time. Wooden boat mag did a story on her, several years ago.

One of the oldest photos in my archive of "desired boats" was this Willard 40 Staysail Ketch. No photoshop!

healhustler said:

One of the oldest photos in my archive of "desired boats" was this Willard 40 Staysail Ketch. No photoshop!
http://s675.photobucket.com/user/texflot/media/40willardstaysailketch.jpg.html

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Love it!

She needs tanbark sails.

The Willard 40 makes a great motor sailer with its efficient hull design. I love the semi-flybridge on the aft deck, offering a great open view and access to rigging, without the need to lift up the sail area.
With a proper mainsail it would sail fairly well, although with loose footed sails like this, it would be tough to point into the wind. Still great for steadying the roll of a round hulled boat such as the Willard.

brian eiland said:

Now you have hit upon a subject near and dear to my heart. I suspect if you googled my name along with the word motorsailer you would find many discussions and my website, ie:
Motor/Sailer Design Expedition Yacht

Motor Sailers by Philip Rhodes & John Alden - YachtForums.Com

There are two monohull motorsailers I am particularly fond of, an Alden 57' & a Rhodes 44'.

Here is that Rhodes 44.

(Turns out there were only 2 of this particular design ever built back in the days of heavy single-shin fiberglass. I have in mind redesigning her with steel hull, and lt-weight cored superstructure, and 3 rig options, and a single 6 engine)

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To my eye this Rhodes 44 I posted back in #24 is a much more appealing design. Tad Roberts actually found this old mag clipping illustration several years ago.

According to the Willard history page they only built one of the Hale Field 40s. They called it a "sail-steadied powerboat"....Which seems pretty much to the point. The interior is really chopped up and the tiny galley would not find much favor. An alternative arrangement would have a good sized L-galley in the aft cabin with a nice big seat/berth in the pilothouse over the galley counter. A 40' only needs one head and the space forward is perfect for it.

Thanks to Tad Roberts for those spec's, I find the boat absolutely intriguing. 15'9" beam, 7.5 KW genset, 30 X 20 prop, electric range, and the odd layout are all things that I'd never had figured. I thought that this type of raised cockpit was the invention of Island Packet, but there is is. The tiny galley is a bit puzzling for market appeal.

The big hassle with the MS they are SAILBOATS!!!!

1 Which even with the window shade sail rigs one needs not only to know how to sail , and in most cases live like a sailor
( down in the hull not up with big air and windows), multihulls excepted .

Of course most multihulls are stable inverted which is not good news to most offshore sailors.

2 The boat will have a sailboat displacement style hull , so 3 stories with oxygen tent and multiple dinks on deck is out.
Usually no toy garage under the aft deck either.

Except for a few boats displacement speeds are the rule .

For true ocean work I believe they are the best compromise , although in most cases to be comfortable about 50 ft is required for 4 folks.

The engine is usually selected from rational sized industrial or truck sources.

With dual centerboards the draft can be kept to rational proportions on a big boat .

Mr H. used to believe the keel needed to be 1/7 the LWL so even a 50 fter would require boards for inshore cruising .

Today it is quite easy to create a 90/90 .

A true 100% sailboat that only suffers a -10% for its engine and larger fuel tanks .

A 100% displacement that only suffers from the weight of the rig and its air drag, so -10%.

Voila , a 90/90 .

Sadly this style boat only is of interest to the offshore cruising folks , 1-100 1-1000 ?

This is a Schucker 430. 40'x14' and drawing 3'2". 62 hp Yanmar.
Our liveaboard summer home in Southeastern Alaska.

Funny you should mention Schucker. It is my favorite space per ft. in a motor sailor, and I love the pilothouse sailors too. I'd bet they're not racers though.

freshalaska said:

This is a Schucker 430. 40'x14' and drawing 3'2". 62 hp Yanmar.
Our liveaboard summer home in Southeastern Alaska.

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Thats a nice boat. How many can it sleep? If I remeber correctly, there is a dinette to starboard and a setee to port that must be some sort of storage or tank in the main salon.

FF said:

The big hassle with the MS they are SAILBOATS!!!!

1 Which even with the window shade sail rigs one needs not only to know how to sail ,
Generally, motorsailers are much easier to sail than the average sailboat, as they tend to have more limited sail area and therefore more foregiving. My teenage kids learned how to sail my boat in one weekend.
and in most cases live like a sailor
( down in the hull not up with big air and windows), multihulls excepted .
Motorsailers generally have a large pilothouse, offering full view protected navigation/cooking/and relaxing. Usually only the sleeping berths and head are down below, similar to the standard trawler.

2 The boat will have a sailboat displacement style hull , so 3 stories with oxygen tent and multiple dinks on deck is out.
Is the 3 story oxygen tent ever a good idea?
I have room for a dink on the foredeck and one on davits on my 30 footer (if I ever saw the need for two).
Usually no toy garage under the aft deck either.
I can fit my surfboards, fishing and snorkelling gear, but no Jetski. Oh well, we can't have it all.

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One thing I have noticed in my small marina. The sail boats lie idle when their is no wind. The powered cruisers lie idle when its blowing. (Many lie idle all the time) There is myself and two other motorsaillers. These three boats probably get used more often than any other boats in the marina. I think that says something about the usefulness and fllexibility of the design.