Newbie Questions-Fuel Consumption and Stabilizers

How do you mean?

GonzoF1 said:

I don't want to point out the elephant in the room, but does anyone else think that the idea of a FIRST boating experience being 70' to be a bit... umm... out there?

I suppose that if you have the money and can hire a crew and also be a "check writer" for all the regular maintenance than it is an option. However, I would see a 70' first yacht being a toy for a multimillionaire and not someone who wants to completely change their lifestyle to boating. The learning curve is just too steep and you could too quickly become overwhelmed with everything you need to learn about boating to live aboard with five kids and a grandmother.

Maybe it's just me, but I think you are setting yourself up for a major culture shock and certainly turning a large pile of money into a very small one in a VERY short period of time. Be ready for that... That's all I am saying.

Tom-

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Something isn't right with this whole euphoric idea.

Adelaide said:

Something isn't right with this whole euphoric idea.

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I see NOTHING wrong with the idea, assuming you can afford it, go into the project with your eyes wide open and are willing to learn. Sure you could spend a lot of money, but you can't take it with you when you die so starting out on a huge adventure now might just make sense. Some folks take baby steps and others just jump right in and have a great time. I say go for it, and look for a boat that already has stabilizers....Arctic Traveller

Gene said:

Keep it under 65 foot or else you are considered a ship with more requirements to meet.

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Which are very minimal and mostly related to sidelights, radio use, fire extinguishers, and other minor items that a "well found" vessel would ordinarily follow in any event. There is nothing that even approaches being considered a "show stopper."

"There is nothing that even approaches being considered a "show stopper.""

Except perhaps the skill set to operate the boat alone.

FF said:

"There is nothing that even approaches being considered a "show stopper.""

Except perhaps the skill set to operate the boat alone.

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I find larger vessels usually easier to operate...you aren't usually asked to tuck them into impossible places like the under 40 crowd is often asked to do.

There is some interesting reading with reguards to these guys trip around the world. Along with the design of the vessel etc. Not what you are looking for but some very real information. Ya after a few thousand miles and being placed on there side a couple of times they where in want of stabalizers.
Just some more info for you.

http://idlewildexpedition.ca/index.php


http://georgebuehler.com/Idelwild.html

RickB said:

Which are very minimal and mostly related to sidelights, radio use, fire extinguishers, and other minor items that a "well found" vessel would ordinarily follow in any event. There is nothing that even approaches being considered a "show stopper."

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My reply was appropriate for this thread, especially when you consider that the OP is completely new to boating. For experienced skippers the added requirements may not be much. For a newbie, it is a more to learn and more tasks to keep track of when underway. Especially while still trying to learn the very basic of basics. The OP can not walk yet and we are saying that "running hurdles in track is no big deal, you just gotta jump every so often. Go for it. You won't fall on your face."

For example: the OP doesn't even know how to use a VHF and yet somehow it is ok to start off having to monitor 16 and 13 with call signs and a radio log? It is not complicated, but if you have never even talked over a VHF it is more to learn while you already have so much else to learn.

The OP and others on the board are pretty quick to brush aside any extra complications as no big deal without taking into account that the OP has zero experience and even the most basic and simple things will be a learning experience, so piling on more and more becomes a big deal. There are so many facets to a newcomer looking at not just a play toy boat, but instead a really big, very complex, very heavy, live aboard, and long distance cruising vessel. Other than a merchant ship it doesn't get more complicated for a person with zero experience.

Just because the OP has patched drywall, repaired houses, and has a very optimistic way of posting doesn't mean the OP has the skills to operate large machinery in a very hostile environment effected by wind, current, obstacles, water depth, and other traffic. We don't know how well the OP judges distances, set/drift, turning radius, or stopping distance. And the OP has no real crew, just a bunch of very young kids and a mom, so would be very much single handling if not really distracted keeping kids in line.

Does the OP even know what "spring line" means?

By keeping below 20 meters, places like West Marine can help and answer questions. The information publications available everywhere for standard safety equipment and navigation cover 20 meters or less. Below 20 meters the OP could find relevant information just about anywhere, even from other boaters at the marina.

At most every marina and even here on this board most boaters are completely unaware that anything is different when you exceed 20 meters since not many owner operated boats are greater than that. Usually only paid Captains have any idea what I am talking about, owners do not.


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Gene :^)
Http://www.Strathbelle.com/

Gene

You had my ear until you said "West marine can help." Or exceed 20 meters and need a crew. Surely you jest.

That thought aside, Galaxy Girl is amongst a truckload of dreamers who are trying to escape from life's toils and foibles. These dreams exist in all of us, are the basis of things like TF and imbue the human spirit. Progress is best made by those who aren't smart enough to know something can't be done. Next thing you know someone will suggest GG attend Power Squadron courses with a bunch of old fogies. That could really scare her away and do some broker out of a commission!

Gene said:

Does the OP even know what "spring line" means?

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I do!! I do!!

It's the clothing they put on the racks the day after Christmas.

C'mon. Learning what a spring line is, or what a breast line is, is rather irrelevent, don't you think? There are lots of things we all know how to do, yet don't know the correct technical terminology used by professionals or the common terminology used by others, which might be different in different sections of the country or in different countries.

That said, we all have room to learn something no matter our skill level. As well, we all have something to teach to others no matter their skill level.

Living on board with....7 people was it?...is going to be a learning curve from hell, even for someone with 50 years on the water. But it's their call to go there or not. Words of advice, yes. Scare them off? I'm not going to do it. The best learning is by doing, and failure goes hand in hand with doing. Look at the bright side, they'll learn lots and lots of ways not to do something. Ways we've never thought of. And yet, they might find ways to do something. Ways no one has thought of yet.

Don’t get me wrong, I hope she comes back as I love to help other people realize their dream and SPEND THEIR money.

In many ways I can relate to her as we were green newbees that bought a boat way beyond our capability/needs, and we had our daughter and two grandchildren living with us. There are a few of us, who did not know better, no body told and we where approved, so we bought the big ugly trawler boat to be used as a dock condo. Shoot we did not know we were a live aboard until they started charged us a LAB fee. What is a LAB fee?

I remember sitting in the Engine rooms perplex and over whelmed with all the valves/knobs/switches and stuff? What asre we going to do with 1200 gallons of fuel? What do you mean we can only turn on the few electric items at one time? What is an amp? We ran out of water and what is the noise coming from the boats crawl space? We are out of hot water again, and I was only in the shower for 15 minutes? How do you flush the toilets? I wonder where the toilet stuff goes? What do you mean there is brown/smelly stuff running down the side of the boat? I turned the key and nothing? Battery switch and where is that located? What do you mean you have to bleed the air out of the fuel lines? The closets, draws, and storage are full and that not even ½ of our cloths/shoes/stuff? We where both sick to our stomachs and light headed the first week? Which side is port and which side is starboard? I hope/wonder if they have valet docking? Why does the boat only go to one side when backing up?

I mean the list goes on and on, but most of us forget?

some people can learn all they need to know to get started in 6 months or so...some people spend their whole lives on the water and still don't get it....

I think it's less "forget/forgot" than take for granted. In my office I can do things faster than I can tell someone what I want done. That wasn't always the case, and for other things in life I'm the one having to be "schooled" on how things get done.

But, as long as her and her family are safe. Let them live their dream.

psneeld: 6 months? I was looking for a 6 hour course that covers all I need to know from bow to stern, from keel to topmast.

Rambler said:

I think it's less "forget/forgot" than take for granted. In my office I can do things faster than I can tell someone what I want done. That wasn't always the case, and for other things in life I'm the one having to be "schooled" on how things get done.

But, as long as her and her family are safe. Let them live their dream.

psneeld: 6 months? I was looking for a 6 hour course that covers all I need to know from bow to stern, from keel to topmast.

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I had a guy who I taught to drive his boat when I worked for Marine Max...he bought a 42 Azimut as his first boat after boating as a kid with his dad but had not been on a boat for 20 years. He had made a ton of money in the dot coms and after a year, sold the Azimut and bought a 48 Sea Ray that he often single handed and took to Nantucket and beyond after his first year of boating. He could do anything with those boats and I felt his family was always safe...we had an understanding.

When I taught captain's licensing...there were guys 50+ YOA that had been boating their whole lives that I never thought should even get their six pack...just not captain material.

So yes...some people with the 6 hr course can get started even with a 65 footer and be better boaters than many with 25 foot boston whalers...why???

....because they are sponges for information and others are coral rocks.

psneeld said:

So yes...some people with the 6 hr course can get started even with a 65 footer and be better boaters than many with 25 foot boston whalers...why???

....because they are sponges for information and others are coral rocks.

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Very well put. Some folks are teachable, others not so much. Desire to learn is the key.

Gene said:

For example: the OP doesn't even know how to use a VHF and yet somehow it is ok to start off having to monitor 16 and 13 with call signs and a radio log? It is not complicated, but if you have never even talked over a VHF it is more to learn while you already have so much else to learn.

Gene :^)

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I'm with R/B on this one. I've run several family yachts over 60ft and never even noticed the difference in requirements. How hard is it to turn on the VHF and monitor 16? In all probability, there is another one tuned to 13 that just needs to be turned on. There are going to be so many things to learn that the very minor differences in regulations will be unnoticed. Again, I say go for it and learn as you go. Will she spend time with a professional captain? Highly likely, but most likely a lot of fun too. Life is short, then you die, go for the gold now.............Arctic Traveller

Phil Fill said:

we did not know we were a live aboard until they started charged us a LAB fee. What is a LAB fee?

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That would be for your dog. BruceK

BruceK said:

That would be for your dog. BruceK

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That is what we thought as we did have a Labador dog, but its really Live A Board fee. Some marinas charge an extra fee.

I would think that most marinas charge a live-aboard fee merely because someone on the boat 24/7 is using more marina services (power/water/trash, etc) than even someone who is taking the boat out daily, and surely more than someone who is using it weekly (or less often).

I've stayed at a few marinas with in slip pumpout, that is a real nice feature. You can pump out, bring a hose with spray nozzle, clean off the walls and corners of the holding tank, then pump it out again at your leisure. It can be done at a pumpout dock too, but not if they are busy.
If I remember right Marina Jack in Sarasota FL, and Legacy Marina in Ft Myers, FL have them.They have a large central vacuum station with PVC sewer lines running to the slips usually 2 spaces share one terminal. Some have a shared hose reel on wheels, some have a dock box with a 15-20' hose which is moved around by hand.

Steve W.

Marinas try to make money from the entire facility , not just selling slip space.

Liveaboards buy less fuel during the year , and create 10x the garbage .

A non moving boat requires no fresh bottom paint , so fewer haulouts.

Try this link http://www.uscgboating.org/assets/1/workflow_staging/Publications/420.PDF
it goes to 20 meters, or 65.5 feet. The rest you can find in the USCG CFR's. Specifically 33 CFR and 46 CFR. This stands for Code of Federal Regulations and is more than likely 1000 times more information than you need. Start at about 33CFR 88. Best of luck. You can also try the coast guard website at USCG National Maritime Center
There is a search engine on this site which helps a lot.

There is a boat called "Sugar" for sale in TX, it is a 62' Med Yacht offered by Jay Bettis Yacht Brokers. It sleeps 8 with a VIP suite for Mom.

If you are going to cruise long range stabilizers are sooo important! We finally put Trac Digital Active Fins on our trawler and it was amazing! $50,000 average cost including installation.

We finally put Trac Digital Active Fins on our trawler and it was amazing! $50,000 average cost including installation.

So what is the cost per mile to date?

Don't know

Sorry, don't know. Didn't seem to change much from before and even before it is hard to calculate with tanks of 1100 gallons diesel. The comfort factor is worth and extra fuel burn. Believe me, the ladies won't go at all if they are puking all day long.

Maverick said:

Sorry, don't know. Didn't seem to change much from before and even before it is hard to calculate with tanks of 1100 gallons diesel. The comfort factor is worth and extra fuel burn. Believe me, the ladies won't go at all if they are puking all day long.

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Having 1200 gallan fuel tank that was my though as to what to do with it and it would last us years, may a decade. I will probabe be dead before the 1200 gallson is used.

So where did GG go?


The pucker factor is a big reason I do not like to leave the dock! Is it worth it, usually not. Much rather curl up with my quilt, blanket, and take a nap!

Hi
Just noticed your request. gor a few years I owned a C & L 6o. Great boat with twin 350hp GM, It had 4 guest cabins all on suite etc. with 59ft+ LOA 19ft 9in Beam and 5ft 6in draft. The top deckl had a 45ft x 19ft area. We lived on board every summer in Bermuda. Frequently had 15-20 people on for the day and did not feel overcrowded. If you drop me a email martin.purser@gmail.com I will email you some pictures. I nw have a 50ft Tri cabin Cheoy Lee in Sint Maarten.

Martin

Martin J said:

Hi
Just noticed your request. gor a few years I owned a C & L 6o. Great boat with twin 350hp GM, It had 4 guest cabins all on suite etc. with 59ft+ LOA 19ft 9in Beam and 5ft 6in draft. The top deckl had a 45ft x 19ft area. We lived on board every summer in Bermuda. Frequently had 15-20 people on for the day and did not feel overcrowded. If you drop me a email martin.purser@gmail.com I will email you some pictures. I nw have a 50ft Tri cabin Cheoy Lee in Sint Maarten.

Martin

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Martin,
How many people did you have living aboard your 60' c & L?