Advice regarding soft spot on flybridge

I think the problems stem from simply drilling screw holes into the core and never sealing the holes. On my wood boat I through bolt after I drill a hole and then seal all the wood with epoxy. 2 coats. It seems to be working good for me too. This way I'm not relying on a sealant that can wear away or dry out to do the sealing.

Jason,

Two years ago we walked on a Mainship 40 with the same problem. Water started running out of the flybridge overhang after the boat was launched. Boat had been on the hard for over a year. We put on new zinks and painted the bottom after it passed the first part of the survey.

There were some problems with the batteries and turbo the owner was willing to fix but not the leak or repairing the soggy core. We walked. Best $1,000.00 I ever spent.

Rob

p.s. That was here in Mystic!

Interesting that the broker would have 10 surveyors in his pocket.

ALWAYS best to avoid a surveyor suggested by any broker.

Jason, just to bring things back into real world focus a bit, one of the things I had to accept if I was ever to enjoy my 1975 vintage boat, which was what I could afford without financing, is that she would never be perfect. No matter what I did.

Having accepted that, I then tried to approach it along the lines of what had to be done to function properly and for seaworthiness.
After that came improving the looks, but in a way where it did not cost a disproportionate amount to achieve something which did not add much to function or safety. Having the hull two-packed was one example, it improved the looks hugely. Another was the new extended cockpit and side deck canopy, another. See avatar. I completely redid the interior and repainted top sides myself.

Then there was stuff I had to accept I could not justify doing, because it would just cost too much, with virtually no gain in function or seaworthiness.
Two examples of this were the hull blisters, which are quite a number but only ten to twenty cent sized, and have been left alone, and have not altered over the 12 years I have owned her.
The other was a patch of slightly soft deck on the rear part of the fly bridge just where all the traffic lands when when folks go up the ladder to that area. The PO had had the old teak decks stripped off, reinforced, and rebuilt with fibreglass nonskid. However they, like me, accepted this soft spot because there was no leak into the ceiling below, and it had not enlarged over time, nor has it in the time I have owned it. To repair it, would require ripping out a lot of the ceiling inside, or similar area of fibreglass deck above, possibly both, and to achieve what..? A firmer area to step on, and the knowledge it had been done. Cost effective...I doubt it.

To a prospective buyer my response will be if you want a 34 foot boat which works well, does all you would want, and looks pretty ok, this is $X.
If you want one which does the same thing, but newer and nearer perfection, (only nearer, none are perfect), then you will find one, but it will be $4X at least. That's my take on it. If I had wanted a near perfect boat, I'd still be waiting. I have already enjoyed 12 years of boating/cruising by aiming lower, avoiding debt to service, doing a lot myself, getting a pro to do it when that really mattered, and accepting less than perfect.

FYI that amount of soft core is no big deal to fix. I repaired most of the flybridge on my ex a 1978 Mainship. The rot around the hatch similar to yours was actually the easiest spot to repair. In actuality you're talking a weekend's work if you are at all handy. Maybe a third day to buff out the gelcoat.
While I would still do some negotiating, I wouldn't let this be a deal breaker.
By the way I boated out of Gwenmor in Mystic for 20 + years. Now I am "mobile" during the summer.
I have a power point with a few slides of my core repair if you are interested. e mail me at leonaj99@yahoo.com if you want to see what I did.

We did end up walking away from the boat. The soft spot was only one of the issues, but combined with the other items the surveyor found we just found ourselves not willing to go through with the deal. The broker was great about it all and we have nothing but nice things to say about him.

JLeonard, we spoke with Gwenmor many times during this process, and may still end up there if we find something. Great spot and loved the people that work there!

Datenight are you over there in Spicers? We've spoken to Johny Mac many times during our quest to find a boat.

Well - hopefully my wife and I will be joining you all in the Mystic waters soon.

JasonF said:

We did end up walking away from the boat. The soft spot was only one of the issues, but combined with the other items the surveyor found we just found ourselves not willing to go through with the deal.

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IMO, damn good decision and evidence that "although you loved the boat", logic prevailed in the end. This process will serve you well in your trawlering days ahead.

Jason-sounds like you made a good, thoughtful decision. Sometimes not so easy to do when it comes to boats or women!

May "your boat" be at the end of the next dock you walk down!

so he did not buy the boat...from this thread ( I think there was only one who did not feel rot was an issue)and his decision I would say that soft spot was indeed a deal breaker. the value of the boat is directtly affected by it. Rot grows...you have to stop it or one day your guests are going to step right through that soft spot and the damage will be far greater after all the time it has been neglected. I am going to be able to prove to any prospective buyer that the problem has been corrected and hope to at least maintain the value in the boat. Also I could not in good conscience sell it to anyone in that condition.

Jason,

We winter at Seaport Marine (launched today!) and keep the boat at Shennecossett Yacht Club in Groton in the summer. I have two friends who have had slips at Gwenmore for over 25 years and love it there. One of my brothers is on the dock building/dredging crew there.

Datenight is making the trip to Shenny tomorrow afternoon or Sunday. Let me know if you would like a ride.

Rob

Tangler said:

I have a Europa with the same problems you describe...dont trust the survey results as the hammer and moisture meter only point out the worst spots. see my thread "dissasembly of flying bridge-experience anyone?" describing the whole thing..I note the deck has been coated on your boat...sometimes they coat the deck trying to avoid repairing the damage properly. that never works..wood rot grows even when dry..unless fixed it will proceed to eat your boat. you would have to start at the bridge and work your way back. I found all round the hatch, accross the stern and all four corners were bad but repairable. It will be better than new when I am done. your choice is - do you want to spend time fixing...or cruising? I think of it in terms of how much fuel that money would have bought...

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We have a Puget Trawler 1977 Europa that had the same issues and our surveyor was not as thorough as yours! So we had the upper deck resurfaced and $13,000 later have a nice upper deck. Being new to trawlers, this was an expensive mistake on our part. Apparently the Taiwan trawlers used cheap plywood that tends to delaminate over time. Especially when exposed to water. It is the weakness of these boats. Ive been told by numerous folks, keep it under cover or else it will deteriorate quickly. So we spend extra for covered moorage. That has been the best money spent for us, keeps the boat dry and protected, and nice when we are ready to go cruising.
Patrick

I have a 1978 Mainship, it has a similar flybridge that extends to form a roof over the cockpit. I suspected there was moisture, even though there are no soft spots. Realistically, any boat that old with plywood core fiberglass is going to have some intrusion. So one day last year I drilled a hole up into the ceiling but not all the way through. As I expected there was some dampness. I believe I caught it in time, before rotting set in to cause any soft spots. So I decided to ventilate the core and drilled a few holes, 1 inch diameter into the ceiling, in various places. Some were bone dry, some showed moisture. A year later I occasionally check the holes for moisture in the core and there is none.

I don't believe wood should be fully encased, and I recall from Chapman's that it's bad to paint all sides of wood since it needs some places to allow the moisture to escape. I pushed little aluminum louvered vent caps into holes and they look fine. I think it should be standard practice to provide ventilation to wooden cores.

It's simply impossible to keep all moisture out of the plywood for decades, especially with surfaces that expand in the sun or flex under stress. I suppose it's possible if the lamination is perfect and there are no screws or fasteners but that's not feasible either.

I hope my next boat has full synthetic cores.

"I suppose it's possible if the lamination is perfect and there are no screws or fasteners but that's not feasible either."

The problem is most folks do NOT want to believe that sealants do not last forever , and rebedding every item at least every decade is required ..

So the water gets in and the house grade plywood rots.

the intrusion point which is a loose railing

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For future reference any boat that has a loose railing has not been well maintained IMO. This is a required upkeep item on boats and a minor job that if not addressed causes the big problems you found

well its been a while since I reviewed my posts...upper deck is finished...removed all the teak deck and sealed the main culprit...the flying bridge itself !...to the deck...the fb was originally a separate piece and assembled in USA after being shipped from Taiwan. It was sealed very badly and probably leaked from the start . As mentioned I torn out several sections of the upper deck..it wasn't that difficult but a lot of time...I now have a new fiberglass deck and have installed pontoon boat seating and a hardtop...working on a 3/4 full canvas enclosure now. ...whew ! retirement is busy!!

Our seller is fixing most of the surveyors 'critical' items and the blistered bottom. We offered several options, inherent in which was our walking away, and including a reduced price. Have your seller fix that deck or be prepared to walk away.

My guess, from your descriptions, is that the core is wet as far out as the yellow line and that it is getting on towards rotten all around the hatch, probably quite rotten at the leak and where the edge is cracked. Our surveyor said that cracks in surfaces which were covering the joint between two different layups of 'glass were failures of the joint or the filler and gelcoat used to make it pretty - not so important where there's no wood. Cracks around your hatch, where the deck 'glass meets the ceiling below's 'glass seem problematical to me because of the core.